i can have the same as like the right to present. do you have any news on instagram? no, follow up, the israel admitted kenning 7 for an aid workers in gaza. that'd be in hopes that the humanitarian situation, my ease, and the desperately need of food can begin to reach the hundreds of thousands of risk of funding for how realistic of those hopes, my guess is yeah, mega and head of them. the wage and refugee council, for decades of experience in the humanitarian field. he's also a former, diplomatically, was personally involved with the last piece told between israel and the palestinians in the 1990. how does he think this savage was connected? and 6 months the war must be old, but i hope it's over in, in a week,

really. and, and that we sped for the blood boss in rough dig around, says the power of the rising of garza now. right. so i'm, i'm the worst assault from any civilian population in our time a day. why was the power on the stop it before so many was killed? yeah, very welcome to come pick. so thank you very much. after the killing of the 7, the aid workers in gaza by israeli troops as being new hope that's the so the 8 situation might improve on the ground to some meaningful degree. do you think that hope is justified? yeah, the hope is justified. i i, we desperately need it. we haven't seen much proof of it, perhaps a little bit more trucks coming over the hair game. shun them on board the crossing in the south. i haven't seen trucks coming through the northern border crossings

yet. and this then i left of restrictions on in terms of movement inside the south. that is red controls completely. now, except for rough, i in the south with the military troops. you mentioned rough. uh, if they uh on the slot, if they advance is rarely advised, goes ahead and rafa what would the situation be there then? i mean, they would be terrific beyond belief. was there my cell 5? 056 weeks ago. it's a, it's a place like nowhere else in the one it's, it's in effect, the largest refuge account on us. 1.4000000 people crammed to get that in an area which is like once happens, all the municipality of last row,

where i live. these people have fled to 34, or 5 times. most of them, they have nowhere else to go because they are not free, and 2 is red from with their ancestors pain. nor can they go into the chip. so the trap that a cook, they go no. the ups, they could be knows what would meet them. there would be a heap of ruins. it's it's, it's a horrific thing. it will be a black box to go into wrap up. that's why we're fight thing this very idea. it's and it's going to humanity to have a war in a refuge account. but even without rough or the statistics are pretty horrendous. are they those from the un office for the code, the nation of humanitarian to fast released on april 6, 1100000 people in gaza experiencing catastrophic food in security. there are no quick fixes to that of the know very quick ones the,

except that this is, there are hundreds, thousands of trucks that could go across the board across things in the north, to the common stricken north tomorrow. i mean they that it but times can easily go in and out from is right. why couldn't 8 trucks go go in and out. this is the, i'm at manmade fireman from a to that it's, it's, it's not the, the, the, the drought of somalia. and that's where this is, simon made by it was and made by a brocade that is rather has some post on the in us and does the sense that they not to the launched the, to the 99 percent not to participate in the horace of the 7th of october, britton's father,

the secretary david cameron said last week what we were told was previously impossible event by the israelis suddenly became possible. i started port and the iris crossing will soon reopen water will be turned back on. more aid will flow through care of shuttle. um, um you see right. uh, do you see movement that would tell you that this is now happening, but this be the change of heart on the as riley side when i think finally the united states, britain, even germany to some extent, is accepting the pressure on, on these really war machine to be paid according to, to the last, a war that we didn't see, and that's in the 1st 5 months at, or we're seeing some of that now. and then comes to promise is that the port stop would open the border crossings would open. they haven't so far. it has been more

trucks coming over care rim shut on in the very south. yes. but it's been very hard to get enough trucks going north to that, or where fix it you haitian, where hundreds of thousands of people are in effect in, in them. and so what i hope is that those should provide the choose for this. the odds for this, the bombs oh, this indiscriminate assault on gossip. and they are the united states, germany and to a lesser extent, the u. k. and not the western countries they need need to really accept some really pressure and, and also stop providing arms to something which is on thought that they indiscriminate. we prove that from the 1st week in the response from is read off to different griffith attacks. on the 7th of october,

you seem to be citing the western countries which are on the one that i'm supplying . i'm selling on the other hand, cooling for then to the, the 530 or at least a humanitarian pause. hypocritical is, is that to view? uh, yeah, yeah. they uh, it, it, they all seem as super critical by the world but, but that's more than anything that the occupation and, and, and, and, and, and the plumbing of apartment houses and the turning or for electricity and water is that really bad in ukraine as we will on agree, but it's some how order up or what is well as doing the same, that's what the one sees as industrial, the scale it progress. see, what i would say is that they have been on this problem thing lee, and put that in the pro the save yourself a is from they they must have seen because we provided the evidence for that that

the assault was indiscriminate from october. the 20th the last yeah they, they know that we went not allowed access to to gossip as we stood as human at terry. and i want them my sons and let this to the us administration and to be you in mid october. that if they allowed is from which is a lick your rent yet to controlling the port, the crossings on politically with the military stop, it would never work in terms of your minutes aeronautics so they knew all of this and the did very electric, but they continued to pride offs or all of us, what was their response when you gave them this morning? what will, to some extent, we didn't even get an onset, but when we got tons this, they said when we take it for granted, that this reality is, is following the,

the rules of who a war human is having a low of on conflict. we are asking them to provide humanitarian access. we will tell them again to provide humanitarian access. we are telling them to, to achieve the civilian population. and then we told up, but you must see your stuff that i'm not listening and upset sometimes to me it's like putting your fingerprints on over time. see if you provide 2000 pound bumps to place where one apartment house 1000000000 for the families is coming off to the other. how would you not have complicity in what's happening? how do you explain this? get to the magic and impotence as you call it from the west of nations. yeah, we didn't. yeah, i still have problems and understanding it because i think that was strategic

mistake of enormous proportions in the beginning uh that they didn't understand and learn from 911 in the united states where the phone went, went from having or sympathy with united states. everybody. and then licked the ballot. people saw that there was water boarding and black sites and, and, and, and the, the, the us trust it's more of how i ground and it became some kind of mud wrestling match with the. so rick, pick the organizations the same thing, they must have all seen when they went to as well. and so what we order for that thing was to grow some, a mazda attack on the, on the is radius of bindham population. and, and i, i have come then those who say no,

this was an operation in guest of to patient. this was the little chip, the mid that it costs or what all that is renaissance. it was not, it was killing a women children concert. go go was um a st capabilities. it was horrific and come down about it. but, but then to, to go the insight. what behind whatever you do that was, but basically the message then that then the sort came and then it's very odd to say, oh oh, stop. what we like to start. as the was going on, many countries have continued to repeat to the mantra that israel has every right to defend itself because it suffered a run this casualties on october. the 7th. when you look at the statistics of this complex, particularly those relating to palestinian children nearly $26000.00 killed or injured sofa according to save the children. is that in your view defense?

can it be described as defenders or no, no. is poppy on legitimate self defense and, and of course is right as a right of self defense. that's what on, on, on those western lead to pride and get on sites. it's legitimate subject that and what the us even said from, from a relative really well on was for, they've been targeted operations against the how much i this what they decided to do was, and they made the list visa, then that then you all government the most extreme in the history of this right of by the way, with ministers who have set things that, that are from them. but really they said, we will make basically gusta on livable. we will change casa completely,

we will not let in food. we will not let in electricity, we will not let in, in water. that's what they sent. early on. many, many minutes or so. all could have become a surprise when they saw what happened. you've seen plenty of conflict over the years, but you wrote in february to stand in the ruins of gaza is to be overwhelmed by the object failure of the international community. for, for decades. my work has taken me to many was out, but i've never be confronted by anything like this. what. what was the vase that confronted you and left such an abiding impression on you? yeah, i'm glad your your, your, your putting that question because there are some very unique features around garza and then there are some that are not boucher need. i've also been

a relate to the shot to don for that and met the 10s of thousands of people up for let the abject or us of who ensued don mass of sexual it violence massive amounts of mass that goes and know 8 to speak of. and i, with the beyond belief and minimal people live that kind of a reality in the should done. now, ben garza, so what's unique about casa is number one, there is no escape. there is no chunk o 4 o opponent or let been for the palestinians trapped inside it, densely populated area. and that's the other one. i mean, this has been split up related without escape. sadly, it's a more inc,

ends on bought, meant in this smart place, then in, in the place and, and, and recent memory. and then the lack of adequate access. would you meant it, terrance, to assist them? not because of lack of resources. because the, the, the border crossings are controlled with a belligerent that is not allowing it to go in. and then finally, what's that unique is that a general has don't us that high bus in ukraine and then shoot on and, and, and then so many other places the western countries are, are actually playing a very negative role here because they have that provide the tools or the attack, so we are at, out with the, with the governments that you, we are usually aligned with. but even without that to being

aligned with is riley policy. even without that, you say they could have done much more when it comes to delivering a to gosh, or you said, i would say to the countries like the u. k. and us, why haven't they organized their own con, voice into gaza? they come on the international law, how companies rel, is allowed to control. oh, going in, even at the egyptian gods. the border international law says you have to enable enforced release to people who are stopping. if there was a belligerent who was denying it, they could of some pizza and up at the border with the aid and all that good lied spears writers to, to let them in or going across the different border. with that, when in, in, in, in cooperation with, with the, with egypt and set, hey eh, is read, are you going to bump this us, you take german con void that is going with fruit and other humanitarian

relief that we friends of his friend a monitor ourselves of course they wouldn't have done that. so a give you another example of them in, in syria there is an area controlled by, by armed opposition groups. some of them of that. are you of a character? perhaps that would be i'm us. it maybe. yeah, it is slamming the groups. uh yeah, one of them fledged the legions too. i tied up some yes. back to that area, the convoys go over from turkey and there is a un security resolution enabling that and it's monitored by you and monitors. and it the, the, the, the, the a pro se very well, and it's not like they are asking us that big the, the syrian government in,

in the muskets spoke for permission. there was a lot of presidents that could have done this according to international role. and they didn't, and when you asked them about this, what was the response that the know we have to cooperate with this rug and the israel is interesting to control every single zillow that goes across the board even from, from egypt. so so, well i'm so type really we wait where we're impotent, they admitted that that meant that i mean that, that's i bought by it by also by, by that the, i mean, i mean not a single. the truck goes from egypt into direction to gus that without its having been monitored by you is rarely pulses in the, in the, your own. on the as really side of the board that it's a, there we have a you should go and see it said lying to come in the line to come in the

queue to be monitored and, and fled to go back and into the no man's land to be reloaded in local trucks to go to to, to the starving children of the of golf site. it says it said it has been a different system from day one. yeah, i'm very glad. where do you see? oh, this is another 6 months, more violence most suffering. i. i really think them it will. it, we, we, we will not have this is short or right, but it's 6 months. the war must be old, but i hope it's over in, in a week. really. and, and that we are sped for the blood off and rough, but then we may have less attention and the ruling casa,

that needs on how to become live up, or what the people who may still be trucked there. most people with, well, i think want to leave that. that's what they told me when i was there this the fight this, the find the own of these walls has made us believe this is no future for our children. we. we tried to go to new york, we will try to go west, but so i think that would be an extra this. i think that will be to let the resources for the rebuilding my organization. we serve refuge account, so has been charged by, by leading beats plus double gonna station responsible for that. hosting. you're like, there are $400000.00 plus homes destroyed with that much one. but oh sion more than that. it's, it's,

it's beyond belief and that needs to be rebuilt. and 6 months from now, one people will still be living at best and tense. do you think many of the palestinians will get pushed into the sign either being rubers or egypt has actually been huddling over the price for accepting them? do you believe those rules or what i have? what i understand is that the extremist in is really politics and it's rarely cabinet. you want to estimate clicked lens, people out of goss on, in to see night from where they would not necessarily have the right to return to a rebuild. gosh, saw that, that may now even be, be colonized by this plus or celebrate thing in this run the, that what is happening and there, and hopefully a steaming up of the land from the,

from the policy. and so all of this we have to fight where it's, none of this is a given on of this can be reversed and i hope. but it's well that needs to have recognition, needs to be living in security. it needs to not be attacked by extremists as that. where on the 7th of october, i hope that is what would come to the census. i hope that the united states u. k. germany and this will on this time that it is out to productive for us, right? what has been done in the last few months? if they, if we want desperate to live in security and peace and in recognition being recognized by the neighbors, that has to be a completely different uh, product policy problem is front. you were closely involved with the p stokes that lead to the alls level codes between israel and the palestinians, and 1993,

a quotes which ultimately failed to bring a lasting peace settlement. but you have said, but the leaders who are now in key positions don't have the same stature onto the same color, but they were in 1993. the populace on both sides. what can you expect from those populace as you call the? yeah i, i'd say it's a, it's a complete lack of a believe the ship. of course, an extreme is to happen that positions and is run and uh, and then on the policy and decide they all split and from mos shorted this route on the 7th of october and 10th hundreds of billions. uh, the published in administration is very weak. and old, and so what i, what i hope is that the is,

is randy or elliptical establishment will recognize that their ways had been counter productive for the future of his ride. i hope that on the policy in that side, there is a recognition that we need to be unite thing and we need to have a new we need to cooperate as palestinians for a future that that would be new, need the ships on both sides and mo, most importantly, we need the united states, we need the european union and we need the gulf congress and en, eh, and egypt and jordan, the 2 most important neighboring countries to cooperate in, in plus string for a solution. because i think a loan is ready to spell as it is. would it be in take the burden and unwilling to find a common church? are you getting any sleep these days?

is there any kind of realistic hope that your managing to cling to? i wonder whether if that is on you, of all the suffering that you've seen close up what i, i uh, i've seen that this has been one of the west periods of my hope to. yes, i said you were monitoring what good because the needs of growing so exponentially the resources available for us solid their a t. s level adults or gone down an international politics. oh, it's nice relations on not constructive, nor expected, nor efficient. and by the way, not keeping up pope yeah. big like we have to leave with that. thank you so much for big and complex. i appreciate your time. thank you. the

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this is the don't even use live from berlin. israel under direct attack by around, around 100 thrones on to me. so i was are in slice, but they could take several hours to reach their targets. is there any media say many have already been shot time around has repeatedly threat. retaliation for a presumed is riley air strike on it's con, selection in syria. the i'm pablo sonya yes, welcome to the program. we begin this hour with some breaking news.