in a 100 years cost to us, most likely yes. because what kafka describes is something deeply human and that will remain in the early hours of february 24th just over 2 years ago. are you kidding you enjoy listing care hub, be unmistakable sound. the russian miss, i'll talk you thing. he says he really believe that he to be lying in a fit with a russian bullet in his head. but it didn't happen instead, any upon the money and co woke up went out and began reporting in real time. how you can use access full of full on the daily hourly basis. his new book, cold, i will show you how it was found. the 1st 3 months of most goes invasion and his remarkable new love affair with his own country. india upon the muddy, and co welcome to come fix on. hello. thank you for having me. your new book shots

the 1st month. so most goes without invasion on ukraine. in 2022, a story you said about so many people doing incredible things. and discovering a lot of incredible things about themselves. like got um you know, war a, such as a function of making people reveal for they truly are to reveal the interest self. so many regular people just like your me just like anyone you know, appear to be capable of incredible things like making a moral choice of standing or what was rights against all the odds with a little to no chance to when, when the entire world, the be great and alive, yet regular people objected driver's radio host. and the military people made decisions to stand up making moral choice and fights as many

people for not to truly believe in the ukraine. so my book is about very rigor. what people do it for roy, things when the darkest on time games you've often said the hope all was once another chance, but then how close have you come to losing. busy for over these last 2 years, and i'm gonna say that's the darkest. it's in this regard was the 1st day of being based on 1st hour something vacation because what was happening was k us was, may have was extremely dog environment in terms of, you know, in time of world, given us, i mean, the drain ends in inc. and gave one to 2 to 72 hours. and the 1st hours were telling us very little about, you know, the future and about the chances of this country to survive and to go on living and

fight in and survive. and but same time with 1st victories of your clients, such as the very southern victory of the grand forces, said the custom lawyer fields, which is the air field just outside key of which was attacked by russians with 1st . fortunately, the failures spectacular failures and such a sudden and unexpected move taylor's, there appeared to be a dream of hope and a very sudden understanding that's what can make it. we can do it while she is failing. so the beer is over the darkest hours. very, very quickly shipped to home and to, you know, the motivation to move forward. that's your 1st thought was we were going to die. you said we were under no illusions as to what would happen. we would end up in a pit with a bullet in our head. how. how long did that sort stay with you? i think it's 24 hours. let's go this way from the evening before the invasion from

the night before, the invasion through this night's alphabets as a base and ends to the 1st symbolic victory will be kind of force us and the custom no air feel that we haven't already discussed the moment um, you know, initially we really had no illusions about our chances, but some still as hold always fun to try to find the weight. we were thinking about really a war a very long ago with the war that is unwinnable for russia in the ends. so we, we knew that that's going to be a car that, that will work with lots of casualties, lots of heavy um, the consequences of this country by the same time in dm's and you gain the best for you greenville overcome this. but when they 1st picture, so we kind of soldiers defeat in russia, russian air born jobs, and the cost only our fields, which was supposed to be a quick jump on ok if they appear to be home. and i don't understand and that's

what against against the again, so your expectations, if you and your colleagues decided you were going to report this war in real time, not just the fighting, but what do you want, other people so and felt. and in 5 days you went from 10000 follows on x to over a 1000000. how do you explain that? was it that you were holding up a, a mirror for people and say look into it. there's some good news, the pathologist, the result in the invasion of a of has been stopped in its tracks. was it back on? i think it's more about the unique nature of the situation, but we're, and i mean the phone scale or to style more an invasion in the middle of our day and time in general. just all the twenty's um that was in general of the whole situation going around your grade level in general, the home for the new grade was so distorted, really rare black and whites so full of emotions. so full of things that touch upon

the most basic uh and the best things about human nature that it's resonated with so many people around the world because most people are good people, no matter whether you're left in the world, how far that's how, what people's emotions during that period, and it was very much about emotions because um, like i said, there was such a black and white situation and such a terrible feeling all the doomsday coming up on the entire nation. that was in a sense that never deserved this. and we were born of those who claim the, as i mentioned many, also many 4 of us who supported us, who felt this way. they were outrages. they were in a scream and from inside the souls and social media. so naturally that gains a lot of attention because of the unique situation that we were in useful people on the streets. you saw people in an air ride shelters. you must have had some extraordinary conversations. was that one in particular that stuck in your mind. uh, i have a moment that i really remember and i will call it almost every single day about

things like moms telling favorite tales to a little kids in the underground shelters as if there is no more just you know, laying there. you know, your monthly and the kids don't sleep really late in the nights out on the floor on the country for on subway station that use that. what used to be like a bare bump sheller. so tell us the table from old u a. b, and you know, the floor and making they are, so somebody will come from for the children. so it's very tales in the middle for, for kids that do not deserve this. you said the biggest difference between pre war ukraine and now is the sense of unity in the country and sense of, of becoming a nation, a nation that wants to be dependent, that appreciate it's being independent. how does that manifest itself?

where, where do you see that it's, it's about so many little things that happened in this country. it's about so many things that you know, appear in the minds of people such as far as those, despite the war, despite the, you know, the terrible situation that we're in. we have and a spectacular outbreak of declining, of culture like truly unique ukrainian culture in the more weight sounds, music. even the stand up comedy stand up. comedy is just having the renaissance, given your grain with young's media, is having tours and uh, you know, having a performance as an air bomb shelters. and so again, in gain and a lot of audience and, you know, go with the money for the military to it's about the increasingly large use of ukraine, your language, most of may russian speakers switch to training language. yes, because of the principal, just because the doctor wants to have anything in common with russia a culturally and was sickly to it's about so many things that really

make create the united to creating a nation as it will be both from degree in southeast and the frame grants west finally have a really large story and into common and you wouldn't expect any of this. you didn't expect the government to be there was no to the outbreak of this without war . i must say that i this exactly what i expected because 0 in the time a brief and the doctor's time, especially when it comes to such a resilience. and it's a very viable nation that you're buying it is uh, people tend to find the cold. do you know, gets united states across the street on something on the idea of surviving? so it's a very nature whole thing and in many ways it's, it's continuous since the beginning of the conflict and frustrated from 6 as dictates. so the training from 2013 is super different from what you're paying this . and i must say that i like ukraine of today, much more. let's,

let's talk about the west. the extravagant promises to stay with you all the way to victory. and then the, the delays before, during the weapons that web given over given late the invitations that keep being sent to join the nato. but they don't have any data on them. have you lost face with the west along the way? i don't think so. i don't think i have lost faith. i'm for both of you ladies have cost huge numbers of you currently live. suddenly the delays and getting the weapons for you. i mean, as you know, that's it just so that they, that entire story of the brain persuade and beg, in the west into, you know, change of the attitude change and the position towards which russia is changing the entire political backgrounds, entire mindsets. and i'm begging it every single step with every single website that gets a complicated story. it's a hard story, it's a story. so do people feel let down by that? it's not the full it's bread situational. you know, you're going to say,

it's certainly emotional. it's a very vibrant culture with very little bodily public opinion. so one seconds you could be say, and things like the way the west has to be trained on. but the same time what something positive happens, the same person will tell you that the west is still with us. you know, we finally made and we persuade on this, but no hands on hearts. honestly speaking, you know, given all the, you know, as we look at the general situation, i've never seen that happen or even a over the last 2 and a half years. it's impossible not to say that the west has really changed. it's not changing as fast, and this as the nomic last. we want that as it, as it's necessary for the sounds vicks it will be bringing in the free world in this we're but what's the change of west has done and much more that we could realistically expect knowing what the west used to be 2 years ago. would you trust the wife anymore or any less? if donald trump becomes president again, i think we still have hold. even if donald trump becomes the president again,

we still have hope. and one of the things that we learned from this war is that there's always a way if you are not given up, if you are ready to go on solving and fighting, working, there is always a way to go. because we have overcome so many nevers about so many things about um the in this what you know to survive the many times you a written off. people didn't trust you. people didn't have faith in you. and i don't think that that ever happens because it's of been them in the process of you know, it's very painful, very steady evolution towards enforcing something with the west persuade. and the end of working with people it's, it's a work it's, but it's the same time. i know it's something to work with. so that's why we're not those and hopefully always find it and wait. as you says, you said, you think the, the wall could go on another couple of years. what do you think would have happened

by the end to end it? mutual exhaustion on both sides, running out of i munition, what we are thinking about and what many analysts solve. so notes that's, russians have been fighting this. where is that? there is no tomorrow. i mean big or their sources are large. i bumped on there. so that legacy is extremely abundant by the same time they were fighting the war. so in such a wasteful weight, that's in all the that they cannot come to save their losses when they open duction and as many analyst node it and we see it too from for me inside your training. and if i'm able to reach you, they only cover like 20 percent of the, of their losses. so in the next year, in the next 2 years, that may come, the situation in which russia will have to, um, rely on its own production only without any bug or less soviet supplies anymore. so

which means russia be in less capable of large scale operations, which means russia having to narrow down their goals on the brain, which means i have an opportunity to strike a deal to negotiate. because as good as you are not capable of crushing your brain and, and doing so, as you think this will end up and it goes to the aging table, not on the battlefield. all. hopefully that's going to be a strong position for you. train them for the, for the world to negotiate and talk as simple it is just the praise guys. so you're not capable of the doing this any again, week or so. let's stop this before it's too late. because you are getting quicker, but the same time, which i don't deny, that's the problem is not the ration. although this where they're not thinking about, you know, ration will positive things, the knots, a goodwill and disregard. so it's, it's good could be an option that no matter what the situation of a rush it appears to be in, they can go on and on and on what the score,

because war as such as an idea, the perpetual war on the west. but you go to it when you create and extension of ukraine is the like a bed of the update of his team and they are all controlled and role of russia. so do you did sign the agreement with them? would you have any expectation that they'd stick to it? no, absolutely, no. the only possible reason for them to stick to the payment is to enforce and all that sort of a piece deal of them. they will never observe that these new that is not in force unless they have to, unless they are forced to do this. so there is no good will. there's no, there's no trust in any sort of agreement unless they absolutely have to do this unless they are not capable and disabled and denied from their ability to go and fight in this way. this is the only, unfortunately, wait. and you don't see any possibility of a living peacefully permanently beside each other after this at least will

foreseeable future. yeah, the only possible way to, to do so that is to disabled russia from having a large scale offensive operations about a against the crane ends, which is, which is even more important. ukraine be in a way to strong in the weight, so dangerous as a potential um, which amount of the, of, and other attack. so be way to strong is the only possible way to prevent, in other words, and to go on living without, without more entity going prevents. and they've gotten a little more. so the date with her still to start stop will be at the beginning of the periods. of extremely hard work from inside the train and from outside your client's here to prevent another work by making your grand astronomy as it, as it possibly can be reached the front of the co. you live now in butcher 25 kilometers west of kiff. the area, so a massive, brutal occupation by russian forces in march 2022, which left hundreds dead,

many appear to have been executed in cold blood with the hands tied. how is that what you're now? is it one of the hopeful signs that you spoke about? yes, i must say that i moved uh to butcher shortly after the liberation from russia. and i bought my 1st apartments um, shortly before the beginning of the full scale invasion. and uh, when i originally sent a bunch of following the police folder in the military as the alongside with so many trying to listen to the picture was terrible. you know, it's, it's really hard to describe the picture of ma'am. all is the smell of death and the touch of evil. that was in the end, the year following the withdrawal of russians. and i remember many colleagues saying that's up to her, everything that was seen in there up to all the mass graves of the, all the dead bodies that we saw in the bushes course forever is going to be across

the land. but it never happens really. the spring time came, people return to the city, months, get it, got eligible, they babies and barks. no, the son came in all the life prevailed. so ever since then, we'll check is one of the best places to live in here. many of the places were resurrect, it's a lot of people moved in there to, to live, you know, so anyways, i'm really happy that i moved to bush and i lived here and i enjoyed living here because in many ways what's happened, simple change the sign of hope is, this is every single day i walk through the streets and i see it. i even, i remind myself of the fact that life always fails in all the lights prevails over the darkness. and this is exactly what happens with the small town. comes aid down in the woods, just outside key of life prevailed. no matter what's reporting on this conflict, you came across that russian soldiers,

one of them you were able to identify from the name patch on his uniform and an online search. who was he and how did it make you feel seeing photos of the place he lived and the family and the imagining what his life might have been like now, do you have the terms to live it? yes, i am deep ended to find one of the russian soldiers to be precise. he was an officer, a young guy, 24 years old, the young officer um, with the military education. um the guy is from uh, ethnic body as pain was born, 7000 kilometers away from k of and i'm in the russian range. i'm really close to him. go in boomer. i'm healthy. i'm good looking guy. big fan of football of activities. and i really from, i only got to batch name and i a bill i was able to with

a couple of things and that to construct the entire life. she's finally, his sister. his mom is a teacher, his town is or invested to you. it's still far away from the crane and to me, of this experience, this very event them experience, i must say, was one of the payments on almost for the entire of mine. so a life appointment i talked to earlier because i realize how absurd, though, that was the essence of the easiest to get in that sort of the, of this work. this young guy could have a family this, the guy because have could be like a local coach for this football team is so far away from bush. he could be a, i don't know, a level deputy and work on making his life and the life of his peers better so far away from the train. yes, he died from nothing he burns in the tank from nothing. 7000 kilometers away from home, from age you all take more. that is just and more which is even more terrible for me until further, you know, for, for everybody else has that so many good people. young go guys and girls from your

grand pets of di to stop him and the likes of him and the yogic more for the me go manage today or since his wishes. and this is one of the most tragic and terrible things about 4 to 2 years on how normal does it feel to still be in the middle of this? well, how much of pre war life has survived over the last 2 years when it comes to most of the grand territory like gifts of the many of the cities even of this uh, lives is as close to being low as it is as it can possibly be because um, what is the thing about human nature and what that people can people tend to be striving to normalcy as much as they can. so business work in restaurants, work in shopping malls and spied power outages. by the way, people use technology is to stay online to stay working bates access to but spend

economy. so you know, go places, enjoy life and go to seats side by the budget and say among people that they don't put things off. um, you know, if they were thinking about getting married, where they go to do it rather than weight because of level um yeah, they've changed people's attitudes in that way. for instance, that's interesting thing that happens to you to my society and what people do not spirits in food and beautiful things besides in the middle of work. if you want to get married, what is the best time to do this? because who knows what happens tomorrow? the same things about, you know, change them. they are of human lives, you know, doing something beautiful and this, you know, many people in the, many of my friends, they have kids despite you know, having a war because this is the attitudes. so they're camden and they may be know, tomorrow, so today is today, life is now. so, and this is the,

and i would say that it's, it's, it, it, it might sound weird, but it's one of the beautiful things that have them to be built in war. so people live lives and they've defied the darkness. they defy the, in the life killing force that's, you know, covers this country and the state and the same time, it's a sort of a defiance towards what's russia, what's what um, what's the chief issue going on living as ukrainians. um, you know, you enjoyed your credit and culture, new kind of language and you can join the kind of life trying to make this country still a better place. and it's, you know, to find the, find the death and don't want to live in is one of the, in a ways to combat the floor. it's on the right. it sounds almost as if in the middle level of this conflict, you've fallen in love with your country again and again this, yes, i'm gonna say that's, you know, again, it's a very interesting thing about, you know, she wants that goal to change that. the ones you are about to lose something you

start really appreciate and something and it's, um, it's what it's on the personal level for us. that's my love to key. if okay is i always loved the key of renaissance. it's in the city gave me so much about that in my life, but the same time when you're about to lose, that's your thought to really appreciate. and so i didn't, it gave my days when i'm not off work to and i'll start in history of the key of to know, walking the streets and the adult knowing every single detail about this ancient and beautiful city. and whether it's extremely wes. so ization of significance, the same goes to bell g cream or 2, no history, no of the train. and it's, it's once on the site it too because people really discover ukraine for themselves . people. so i appreciate and many people. so i appreciate what they have and the people in general, over the decades of this work, people started c and the beauty that they have of having the independent country,

proud country of country. oh, they own that is about them so, so it's really works this way. we love the great and as as much as never before on so many personal levels. a problem i are going to be very good to have you on coverage. so thank you very much. sir, is the the

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guardians of trees, julian, his sons, and the dark secrets of war, starts july 27th on d, w. the . this is dw news, and these are our top stories. us vice president campbell, a harris has helped talks with his riley prime minister benjamin netanyahu at the white house. the talks of inc, closely watched for changes in time between harris, the presumptive democratic nominee for president and the comments job board. and after the talks, harris asks for americans not to view the as well how much conflict as a question, binary issue, the fast moving while fi has consumed to much of the popular to.