families rushed to prisons liberated by rebel forces in the hope of finding their loved ones. the brutal methods used by the regime to torture and kill. and the extent of it are now coming to light for syrians at home and abroad. the issue of justice is an important part of serious transformation. but how will the country's new leadership deal with the task of seeking both justice and containing harmony in syria on pop up on the us in britain? this is the day the officer, the also there, seem that the roots here to help with some people, the 4 years credit into 43 sir. i know faces. hold your. yeah. the problem was that i saw it as a work criminal who should be brought to justice for this theory and people he has to be held accountable. there is no the possibility of accessing evidence of the

highest level of regime in allied crimes be unloaded. there's no words to express, we've been through, but thank god, we've reached the day where we can see the light once again. the also coming up the russian general killed by a bomb in the heart of moscow. ukraine says it's special forces token out. most of this was a really filigreed job. i don't know how else to say to ensure i take my head off towards special forces, will accomplish this task section to meet you. but it's no secret that we have a fairly extensive network in russia to our viewers on p b. s in the united states and all around the world. welcome. as we begin the day in syria where the united nation says it expects around 1000000 refugees who fled the outside regime to return to their homeland over the next 6 months. do you ends on

void to syria is cooling on the international community to support serious new leaders and, and the sanctions put in place against damascus. that way the country can speed up reconstruction efforts and the chief stability. now, many syrians, both inside the country and those climbing to return, will be hoping for a measure of justice following the downfall of the outside regime. the lens, syrian boy girl peterson, toward a damascus prison where the regime child tortured and killed thousands of his opponents. he said the atrocities committed there should never be allowed to happen again in syria or anywhere else. b, as in chester. and i think the last 4 books about what time i have know the total for some of the prisoners, some of the attendees. some of their families. so the grand children's adults are big changes here. we have seen some who survive. i think it's been on the speak

about the hard stuff they went through. when it isn't just family members descending on serious prisons, hoping to find loved ones or find out what happened to them. former prisoners are also going back to where they were locked up and tortured for weeks. in this unassuming building in damascus, a notorious prison where people disappeared and were tortured. now relatives are searching for their loved ones. going to documents, scattered inside and outside the building. so they do it even. this is fatty and he says he was one of the lucky ones with the lose with a lot of the people without money spent 5 to 9 years in audra. prisons need be either over the summer and they still have to pay a fine at the end. is body the nonsense line? now the guards are gone, but it will take a long time to piece together what happens to other prisoners, the unlucky ones who are still missing. the un body setup to investigate

international crimes during syria. civil war is cooling on the countries new leaders to secure evidence related to those atrocities. the agencies leader, former canadian prosecutor, robert petty, says he and his team are hoping to travel to syria in the coming days to see the situation firsthand and to gather evidence. it's a very delicate and fluid situation. there is however, the potential in this now accessible crime scene, or maybe i should say, interlocking series of crime scenes. they are now the possibility. there is no the possibility of accessing evidence of the highest level when you're talking about a government, the state providers who for, for 14 years use every aspect of that up right is to commit crimes. you will have a massive amount of documentation left behind. for more, we're joined by dr. stephanie bulk and expert in international criminal law and

a professor of germany's marburg university. she also is executive director of the international research and documentation center for war crimes trials which focuses on documenting or crimes trials. dr. bach, welcome to dw, great to have you on the show. so what do you think the chances are that charlotte aside, could ever face prosecution and what would the charges be drawn and so what the charges would be, they would probably relate to crimes against humanity and walk crimes, in particular, was a view to torture. it's not popular, not to cause a question how to get him, but take it out because he is no flipped to russia and rush over to tech to him from the persecution. okay, well then what about other members of the aside regime? who could still actually remain in syria. we have different

possibilities. we have already seen tribes on the basis of universal euro sections and so called to a states. so for example, we had drives concerning state torture in syria, in germany and france and of in the united states. this, this efforts can be continued now and of costs. and as a new government, syria may itself side to deal with those tribes and to bring justice to the wisdom . and this even is a possibility that the new government will assign the rooms that you'd have to international criminal court. and if this court, the opportunity to do you with crimes committed in serial or well, explain a little bit more if you could, the role of the international criminal court and what it could be syria never ratified the treaty and is not covered by itc jurisdiction. oh yes,

it's true. the international criminal court was this seat in the heck as a permanent to chusen who has the power to prosecute genocide farms against him, unattainable crumbson's, crime of progression. but as a basic rule, only 2 parties. so was a view to the state parties who a friend followed the statute and syria. so far has never joined the sea. but the new government might make a new decision and ready for us to stay cute and even accept the jurisdiction of the international crowds for crimes which has been committed into post. okay, well what about germany? i'm in berlin. you're in a marber and so it's a country that recognizes universal jurisdiction for some international crimes. and so what could happen in, in the case of germany or germany would surely continue his faults to

prosecute state crimes committed in syria. if already seen cases concerning torture in copeland and at the moment there is case before the original copy of a friend foot or 2 concerning state torture in syria. so germany will continue to prosecute this crime these crimes. but the problem, of course, is the gemini can only prosecute perpetrators who have fled to germany. so it's a very limited approach the gemini has, or i talked to us a little about a landmark trial here in germany, the, our team trial. and it will be interesting for you to explain a little bit about that. i'm what list, what lessons were learned from that process. this was unimportant drive because it was the 1st time ever that criminal court dealt was state to torture in

syria. and the twos accused has been sanctioned 4 times against humanity, in particular torture in a prison in prison something. and so the most challenging part of this try probably was the difficult situation for victims and witnesses when this trial took place. the subject of a mind was still in power and exercise, pressure on wisdom, send witnesses to where to testify in copeland and even act as against their families which will impart still in ontario and not a problem. this cost of the evidence is far away from the place of the card. so was there a challenging for german court to prosecute and learn about crimes which has been committed to far away from the court and to transfer the evidence from

syria to gemini. and to evaluate this evidence here in additional context. all right, we'll leave it there. a very interesting speaking to doctor stephanie buck, professor of international criminal. thanks for joining us at today on data. thank you very much. durham and diplomats were in damascus on tuesday for talks with representatives of the is the mrs. group page, the switch over through bosher, outside the regime. last week, the talks focused on the political transition process and the protection of minorities and women's rights dw, spoke earlier to be un high commissioner for human rights, folk rhetoric, and asked him if he believed the promises made by hedge to us to protect minorities . mean it's what we hear, it's important that the statements are made and they, it's important that there is commitment. but the proof is in the pudding. we have to see how it plays out in practice. and we need to make sure that the commitments

that the state has, including the transitional government, they are actually realized and they become reality. well, many syrians are unsure about the rebel groups that i've stood aside, and that's especially true for the countries religious minorities dw, some how much right to spend time with a syrian christian. he's trying to figure out his future in the new syria. sullen comes here for conflicts, a local trash near his home in central damascus. deep wants it to continue being a safe space. continue still young and leave it that there is a new group that will rule the country and the next change go about if they how i'm not sure how it will be, come up and cut off unless you need. and it's still unclear, honestly, and i can't predict it, i can't say will be negative and b,

but also i can be reassured, point of dealing with someone like many of serious minority groups, cushions are eager to find a place under serious new government right from the those stuff, the see signs of the change already on the way the flag a few. we under a sites who is being erased. i'm the dental, i'll be on. we're painting it like made bring us white and prosperous days. that says, we were forced to paint the flag on our doors all of us, but now we're free to painted and light. so by so many asylums friends have long since left the country to escape the turban and political situation over the past decades. and he worries that now things might get worse, and daughter sees a people or q him for bread and but the bakery in there.

but despite the form of the regime, he says very little has changed so far. hello. see why he's in the self and the only thing that has changed here, that'd be nice about is that this building of the air force intelligence is empty it out to 0. we. uh huh. hello. it was always surrounded by arm soldiers. no, no, i don't see them. i thought it was seen otherwise, it's all the same when about you must have a lot of highlight. the air force intelligence spending is a prominent feature of a central noun for exclusive detention center. the base is now applied by serial position flights as they show us what the regime agents left behind. this is the interrogation room. and again,

these are the prison cells. and these were the close of its trainings instead of these chairs were used for torture. after seeing the prison sunday and starts believing that any future might be possible in celia newman saw and see what he said, he, i'm optimistic that there will be changing the to an area on us on my the to be exact will be more relax, companies will no longer be complicating the price of the community about good. how about what worries me the most is the chaos in this transitional period. i kind of a in the told the live it's going to be this is what i'm scared of. you can have an idea on the feel listening about going it's time for southern, but i have left question about his relationship with the most. i lot see the most my relationship with them ask us. might have a headboard just like when you fight with your lover?

you know, typically in the clearly sweet and the internet went up and that's how my relationship with damascus is the most p a heck. hello. met a complex relationship and a complexity where he hopes to find the reassuring future. the ukraine has admitted to killing a senior russian general in moscow. lieutenant general eguard kerry last was the chief of russia's nuclear. biological and chemical protection forces can read off and his assistant were killed when a bomb hidden inside an electric scooter exploded. outside an apartment building in the capital, russian investigators are treating the attack as a terrorist act. dash cam footage shows the moment an explosive device killed general igor kiera loss and his assistant outside of moscow apartment building

the investigators are searching for clues to piece together the circumstances of what appears to be the targeted killing of one of russia's top military leaders by ukraine the bomb was so powerful that it shattered several windows and damaged the front door. shortly after the attack, the ukrainian official said keeps security service was behind it. and this was a really filigreed job. i don't know how else to say to ensure i take my head off towards special forces with accomplish this task function to meet you. but it's no secret that we have a fairly extensive network in russia, which is coordinated by the security service of ukraine, which is the main intelligence director, quote. and the special operations forces of the for an intelligent service. because it can you feel a much bit technical for our teeth, which we solve the issue of the russian authorities said the explosive device was planted inside an electric scooter and was detonated remotely. the deputy

head of russia security council vowed revenge one solution. but the law enforcement agencies must find the killers in russia, and everything must be done to destroy their pay masters in key each total. it was like a sugar paymasters, are also known. they are the military and political leadership of ukraine. go was great to see how it looks as well as your carrie law was the head of the russian military's chemical, biological and radiological weapons unit. he was also considered a key figure why you've been russia's war against the cranes with other to lose just the day before he was killed. so she knew that cara love was charged up, sent to you by ukrainian court for russia's use of band chemical weapons in ukraine, and he had also been sanctioned by britain for using chemical weapons on the battlefield. washington. well, joining us now from vilnius is our russian affairs,

unless to constantine edward constantine could see again. so is this a huge cause for concern for president vladimir approved or perhaps even a humiliation? well, it is accumulation, although i must remind you, pablo that russian is not a democracy. so there is a process putting, being censored by parliament or some kind of opposition, relatives arriving of the of the gates of the kremlin boss. of course, if you look at it from the perspective of russian official, uh, an event like that's on the 10th to mountains us from moscow. oh, sorry from the drum and the ease of pools. basically demonstrating weakness and put things in the ability to control his own capital. so i would say internally, it definitely is a blow a little again, nothing is will not change anything politic. constantine, what's the reaction being to the killing in russia and russian media is,

is it being covered extensively as well. stage media discover, attended, gave all the necessary statements by. ready the prosecute as the policeman say, and we will find the comforts of home. what. what else do we expect in such circumstances? if you're looking for us on social media and relatively independent bloggers that you have there is a lot about. it's in a social media, it is use of the day in the restroom that actually 1st photos in 1st video from the c p a. the on a on independent media channels are relatively independent media channels on telegram and other social media. yes, i think it did kids, this news did kids the politically active pulse called the rational side to both those who post whatever those could support him. because of course it's not every day that they have left and the generals blown up. just if you do love,

it goes away from the running. so of course it is news of the day and i think then lots of people are saying that this is a hole in buddhist, but it's supposedly impregnable security. all right, when they get there, they don't use konstantin, egret. joining us from the lithuanian capital vilios court in finland has become the 1st in the world to try to force the criminal to pay off a legal debt to ukraine. sum 34000000 euro is worth of russian own real estate throughout the country has been seized with the aim of handling it over to ukraine's national gas company, which when a case against moscow in the hague. last year, terry schultz explains why finland's long border with russia doesn't deterred from making potentially risky decisions. oh, just marked a 107 years of independence from russia. the more aggressively moscow behaves on each side of the 1300 kilometers border. the more

assertive becomes a recent example, helsinki judges ordered the seizure of russian government owned properties, worth 34000000 euros. they're honoring and international legal judgment. the found moscow guilty of stealing billions of bureaus worth of assets from ukraine's national gas company, natural gas, in the 2014 illegal antics ation of crimea. the company has identified russian owned properties like these in several countries, asking local courts to seize them. but so far, only finland has done it. i don't know whether in some countries or they are thinking about wait a minute, we have a state on the opposing side and each the rest the state should be i should be not . you know, render an an award unsure of how russia may react. the attorneys who filed the case for natural gas and inland won't appear on camera as a security precaution, but they don't tied the reason. they took the case for free to use our skills,

our profession, to help you create defense minister on the hacking and notes this decision taking money out of moscow's pockets helps finland to. we have to deal the measure what we can to kind of put down that russian war economy for his part hacked in, in, has blocked new sales of property to russians and said, a near total band is coming soon to better prevent malign actors access to critical infrastructure and supply chains. now we have seen that there's a of the several cases where suspicious actions behind these equations. friends are famous for keeping cool heads when making decisions against which moscow may retaliate and for maintaining their preparedness to a very high level. or in this case, a low level tens know that some 90 percent of the population can be housed in these underground bunkers. if something bad happens up there, most of finland's,

underground shelters, used for leisure during piece time to even sustain a nuclear attack, adding to officials confidence. the fundamental lesson is, if you've taken care of your own society, it's resilience. it's easier to be somewhat more proactive up early at the independence day ceremony with her grandfather, even 11 year old elona offers a reflection on this less than what they used on our new people had been working hard to build the handle. she says, all right, and that's why it's a great country now. why the finally tonight christmas is just over a week away. and chances are, you might have heard one of the modern evergreen songs over and over already. it's been 40 years since britain's pop to a one debut their last christmas finds have been flocking to the swiss ski resort.

assess, say, where they are. iconic video was filmed and reenacting some of the clips of memorable scenes. billboard magazine says that that seems nice. ready for laughing christmas as being played more than 3600000000 times on us radio stations along very happen. i'm sure we'll be hearing of plenty over the next that days and weeks . all right, that's the show for today. follow our team on social media. i don't even use and if it's the latest headlines you're looking for, there's always our website dw, dot com for now from the entire team on to day. thanks for spending part of your day with this. take care the the the

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