institutions must speak with one voice, this means that based on this thesis and logically continuing this chain, we come to the conclusion that the council of europe should say so, otherwise there will be a problem of the interaction of these key bodies of the european union , that is, the european commission as an executive the body and the council of heads of state, well, actually, as the head, they should go, so to speak, in the same direction and stick to the same position, but unfortunately, we have, at least as of today, big uncertainty regarding individual countries of the european union, which er, well, or from the accompaniment

of er, moscow, as it is in the case of hungary. although she said that she would not object, or er, based on purely er, formal things that are not included in strategy, that is, yes, if we talk about, well, certain formal points, then you can find a lot of them and say that you know . so on, that is, you can always find 1,000 reasons to say technologically above is not there. and that all the european countries that joined were even 100% there. well, let's remember romania and bulgaria, in which even the europeans themselves later admitted that they accepted an advance, so this advance was made to them so there was some

reason for this, there was political will, well, we appeal to this same political will, which must manifest itself, because today it is about this, many european politicians are talking about the perspective of the european union however, will he rise to the level of understanding the development strategy, and not deal with the paragraph of provisions and measure with a ruler how many centimeters we have not yet fulfilled this or that paragraph. so it is now about this and tomorrow ukraine will not join the european union this is just a candidate and if the european e-e commission and then the european council give us this candidate status - it will only mean that we will start to advance towards this process, it can be.

it turns out that in 2008 we flew to join nato, but we wanted to get an action plan for membership, that is, a preparatory plan, which can be removed and in some cases took 5, 6 or seven years, so in fact, there should be a decision here not technically a legal one. in my opinion, a should be really political. and it seems to me that in the event that a strategic view of the situation takes hold, it will be in our favor if this technological line prevails, but it was not done above if they didn't make it, then we get it uh, a candidate for candidates, that is, well, it's somewhere something, uh, how once in the ussr there was a candidate for numerous political positions there or in the central committee and so on, well, this

seems to me to be a bad practice, uh, volodymyr, this week in an interview with the british newspaper telegraph the prime minister of estonia, who as a colossus said one very interesting thing. let us first listen to her, then i will ask a question. our own history teaches us if we don't we will know, we can all pay the expensive price , we must always remember that gas can be expensive, but freedom is priceless, mr. volodymyr, look. you can hear such statements very often from the leaders there, for example, in estonia , latvia, lithuania, poland, well, less so in slovakia , the czech republic, but they are not there, but practically you will never hear there from the leaders of more

western countries. please tell me, these are the eastern european countries and the leaders of these countries with such statements. can they become something or are they not what they can become? are they some kind of engine that can somehow push the west harder and fight against russian aggression, well, mr. yuryu , and i will explain why, because these countries have a common history with russia and know that it is unfortunately, there is no france, or is there a conditional italy or spain there and so on, they have it all in theory, they are, yes, germany was occupied, but thanks to the western allies, it quickly drew the conclusions of its fascist nazi of the past and

started the movement towards democracy, but here is everyone these countries that you have listed were under the soviet military boot for 50 years and understand very well what the charms of socialism and communism are and understand perfectly how it ends, and it is precisely ukraine that can very seriously influence the position of the rest countries of the old democracies, so to speak, which, unfortunately, plunged into the corruption brought to them by the russian federation, and let no one tell us that we are not worthy of being in the eu because we have corruption look at the fionn shredder cases eh of the former minister of foreign affairs of austria and many other people, by the way, if

i had the information recently that some media outlets are preparing a list of more than 600 canned goods that are sitting in various offices or have held very high positions in the european union and who actually worked for russia. yes, it is. by the way, it is possible that there is financial corruption. and there is political corruption. and what makes it better than the other is absolutely nothing. therefore, i think that these countries bear a special responsibility, and these are all the excuses that we hear, why can’t we be given weapons? why uh russia must be respected, why can’t putin be allowed to lose face, it’s all from the same category, unfortunately, it’s what they call

cynicism in foreign policy. - the minister of defense of great britain, nine richard - this is in an interview with the same british publication telegraph said that in the west there is a strategy for russia, but his quote is a strategy called let's see how things will turn out in other words - it's not at all strategy sir volodymyr and what do you think? unfortunately, this is the truth and uh, this strategy uh, well, it's real. it couldn't be more true. well, you can say it in a different way. a democratic country, let's persuade it , let's involve them in all possible and impossible international institutions, let's send a bunch of our experts there to train them, let's take them in so that there are four of them in place, let's help them so that they don't die of hunger, well, that's how it actually started further and so on. well, what do we have? in the end, we have: in the end, what... the cursed pods

must burn together with the nazis in ukraine . well, and such other vagrants and nonsense that they carry for at least 20 years of their tvs. well, but you see, in the west, unfortunately, there are still those who want to save the least, and i will tell you honestly, with some trepidation, i am thinking about the next visit of the three virgins to ukraine, which will take place this thursday already er and i'm afraid that er and macron er and scholz and the drags will engage in political er-e cynicism in practice. i mean that in exchange for er-e candidacy or candidacy for candidacy, they will demand from us that we agree to er-e conditions of moscow and actually

capitulate. and i think that the ukrainian authorities you will have to be very careful and very decisive, because one thing is not sold for another. and as you reminded the words of the estonian prime minister , candidacy for the eu is also very good, but freedom and independence and independence from the russian aggressor are much more that is, you expect that in a few days, during the visit of this, as you called the trinity, there may be such a thing. well, if you can call it a soft blackmail of ukraine, yes, i am more than convinced of this, because these are these countries and the three leaders of which every time they put forward some fantastic plans, well, at the very least, dear, well, not dear, but his un minister

actually proposed a plan that means capitulation to russia. well, macron, you see , constantly says that you cannot humiliate russia because you will have to negotiate with her probably at the expense of ukraine well, something is just silent, he promises to give something in order to protect himself from these barbarians, but apart from promises , the matter does not go further, because i repeat once again, to my great regret, cynicism and so-called pragmatism and this real-politician about which all the time there is a daldunya in the west, they didn’t go anywhere and, unfortunately, very often money decides much more than values ​​and morals, mr. volodymyr, let’s say a few words about the statement of the president of the united states of america, joe biden, which he said a few days ago and he, well, he said that american intelligence had warned ukraine, but that

russia was going to start aggression against our country, but the ukrainian leadership and many others. how did he say it? reprimanding the president of the united states of america to the president of ukraine so that the president of ukraine would think about something, well , mr. yuriy, i will answer like this, uh, if uh, our leaders, uh, and uh, the current ones, and by the way, the previous uh, thought more about our uh security, we would not be standing with our hands outstretched today and not asking for armored personnel carriers, tanks, howitzers, and salvo fire systems, planes, etc. we would probably have it all if it

were in our actions. they gilded it, they will gild it, we will give the feeling of an aggressor, not after taking it, hundreds of ukrainian heroes will die every day at the front, but actually, this is the answer to whether they heard or not, and the main thing is whether they thought so what if we thought about a picnic in may, he didn't come, the barbecue didn't come out, and we should have talked about it much earlier . russia that in the 14th year so it was necessary to introduce a sanction against russia that in 2008 all this did not

happen because it again won together well, but today when he has already entered, as they say , it is the russian aggressor too far well, now they are starting, they are finally starting steps which we have been waiting for for a very long time. but now you see, we waited to prepare. well, unfortunately, today we pay such a huge price, well, unfortunately. thank you, mr. volodymyr, for being with me today in the world during the war. thank you for your professional answers . to those questions that i wanted to ask you in order for you to explain to me and our viewers. this was volodymyr ogrysko - a diplomat, the minister of foreign affairs of ukraine from december 2007 to march 2009, the extraordinary and plenipotentiary ambassador of ukraine. but as you understand, we still have enough time for the new guest to answer my new

questions, and i am ready to introduce this guest, he is already in direct skype contact. this is yevhen magda, director of the institute of world politics, mr. yevhen. i congratulate you, mr. yuriy glory to ukraine, glory to the heroes, you were not in my program for a long time, but in the international program, free time, you were in the international review program with yuri fizr, and you will return, i think very soon, because we will win. well, for now, you and i will be in the program under in the name of the world during the war, to discuss military topics related to ukraine and the world in order not to take time from our viewers , because i really want to ask you a lot, mr. yevhen, last night at the east german economic forum in batzar, olafsholtz admitted germany's mistake in that germany for too long considered russia a reliable economic partner well, but now it is clear

that we need to become energy-independent of russia as soon as possible, scholz said this, plus information that appeared this morning from a finnish analytical center about that in the first 100 days of the war, russia earned 93 billion dollars from the export of energy resources . going back to the statement of scholtsev, the statement of scholtsev against this background is not just words, or is it just words, no, i think it is not just words. and i would say that we have there is a certain specificity of perception, we expect from the germans that they will hate the russians as much as we do, but this is actually impossible, the simple reason is that they do not fight against russia and, in principle, they really have common economic interests . gas supply remains the supply of oil for the next six months

remains to be said that the german establishment is completely russified, forgive me. i would not because the russian agents of influence, and not only with gerhard schröder, worked there very intensively . stereotyped actions and many things, they remain, i would say maybe alarming for us, but normal for our partners. that is , we need to learn pragmatism in relations with our european and american partners, and this is by and large not a secret for anyone, that is, that ukraine is currently waging a difficult, tiring, and sometimes terrible war

against russia, this is true, but it is being waged by ukraine , the european union and the countries of the european union and nato countries are helping us, but of their own good will there are no binding documents for this in nature at the moment, you said about pragmatism with partners, what is it, what is this pragmatism, what does it include, exactly, pragmatism cannot be demanded from a german burgher to donate to ukrainian armed forces for 100 euros a day, you can't ask chancellor schulz to think about the ukrainian economy more than the german one, he swore when he took the post of german chancellor, just like merkel, he swore otherwise that he would worry about the german

economy you can't ask emmanuel macron to think exclusively about ukraine, you can't say that mario draghi is an italian prime minister, he's such a radish and if he says, if there are any italian proposals regarding ending the war, let's not forget that dialogue with any partner is the basis of european identity, and to change it even in the last 110 days of the biggest war in europe during the last 70-odd years is simply technically impossible. it works so fast and you need to understand it, you need to be aware of it. and we, uh, have a flower delivery of statements by advisers of various officials, for example , today mykhailo podolyak rolled out such a

list, you know, and the question arises, uh, the requirements of the adviser to the head of the president's office in the western establishment may naturally raise questions. and who are they? well, yes, but, let's not forget, we are knocking on the door of the european union and somehow, well, not very briskly, we are knocking on the door of nato. well, i would say without enthusiasm. lately, i understand for what reasons but now i won't talk about it, we are knocking on their door, not they on ours, you understand the laws of human coexistence, we are knocking, we have to be well, more balanced, more adequate, eh, i understand, but let's see, i still have a question and if we return to scholz to the fact that he was chosen for the

german people, he thinks about the german people. but the gentleman promised us something that he would give us how many leopard tanks there, and then there is something. we can gently knock and gently remind him that mr. scholz you promised leopards now we won't get these leopards and as far as i understand we won't get them for a long time i think here er scholz i er was in berlin once in 2010 a year ago, i have a hard time suspecting a german agent. i think he is a hostage of his own political position and social sentiments, that is, germany as a whole supports ukraine, well, that is, the german community. yesterday i took part in an event with a tent from ukraine with representatives of ukrainian cultural circles the event was very interesting, even though it was a virtual discussion, but

it was very interesting, we just have to, for example , understand that when, well, if we have an argumentation in style. of soviet propaganda regarding the united states in order not to offend our european partners, we will not get more, we will not get better, believe me. that is, we have to speak with the european with the all the more ment in his language, placing accents we have a very active ambassador in germany, he has already called offended by the liver sausage, i don't think we can say anything more. after that, as for the leopards, there are nuances here. poland provided us with more than 200 t-72 tanks.

several dozen tanks were handed over to the czech republic. and slovakia, that is, i think that the question is not hmm in the manifestations of solidarity. i am for the fact that we should not step on the throat in our own song, but also appreciate the fact about february 24. the very idea is to give ukraine something that can shoot in german from steplishmantis causing panic now it's real. we got anti-tank grenade launchers there. we got some small arms. we'll eventually get leopards so that there won't be any because the pressure of german society will exist for one simple reason in the european union and nato politicians depend on what their

citizens think, and public opinion in these countries is beyond any doubt on the side of ukraine, and that is good, mr. yevhen, about your topic, which you know very well about all topics, but you know poland very well, after all, and duda during tour of western countries called on the leaders of european countries, next quote to atone for their guilt towards ukraine, obviously andrzej duda understands this, do other western countries even have the concept of any guilt towards ukraine, obviously they don't, i don't think so well, let's go too let's be frank that politicians in every country have their own in their closets, the truth is that our skeleton can be called big construction, big nepotism, big, there is something else, everything is big with us, and they have it, uh,

something fresh, fresh help, fresh concern, something else, that is but uh, we uh, in principle, we have to be aware of other things as well. well, let's say, uh, poland can be considered and in this context, it acts completely differently than the right-wing justice party proposed when it came to power, really, well, in principle the law and justice of the environment from which andrzej duda spoke about the fact that we will restore historical memory and we will establish the day of remembrance of the victims of the volyn tragedy, this has been done for several years, as well as in july, despite all the sympathy for ukraine. i think it will not be canceled, but poland there is a certain pragmatism, and polish

politicians should not shy away from this pragmatism, and poland accepted the most ukrainian refugees, at least 2.5 million. they know that the ukrainian issue will exist during the parliamentary campaign next year, and they are not reacting to it, and they acting accordingly, polish politicians understand that two-thirds of their population is alarmed by the prospect of receiving a caliber or eskander on polish territory, and they also react accordingly. like any other state, they can afford the luxury of taking political steps, although poland is nowhere. the truth is that children are, in my

opinion, the most consistent and most active partner of ours today and are our if you want a logistical hub, the question of receiving military aid and, again, the tanks and portable anti-aircraft missile complexes isaua krab and many other things, we received all this from poland not only from her, but she is objectively one of the leaders together with united states and great britain, but the united states and great britain also have their own logic in supporting ukraine and ignoring it. this fact means living in certain illusions because we are not in illusions, we are in a state of war, but systemically thinking european politicians, for example, are not against granting ukraine the status of a candidate for

membership in the european union, realizing that tomorrow we will not acquire full membership, but they think for decades, let's say ahead and pretend to themselves. 30 million people, how they will interact, how it will be economically, how it will be politically. we cannot predict this today, but some countries of old europe - this is already worrying today, i will say directly who, for example, germany and us again, we return to the position of olaf the show well, of course, mr. yevhen, ah, unfortunately , it closed, and it would be good if from this circle, so that at some point it will open up this circle and in our direction, we will find out this week, literally, i think that we are getting the status of a candidate for joining the

european union, but this is only an engagement, a political marriage between ukraine and the european union will take place in the foreseeable future , but not this year, not next year, and hardly in 2024, this should be realized and if in ukraine's politicians and the public think that everyone owes something to us and everyone is guilty of something, then this is not so. turkey has also had the status of a candidate since the end of the 80s of the 20th century. in fact, mr. yevhen, look this month, at the end of this month, two such significant major events will take place at once. well , the meeting of the big seven and the nato summit for the west are significant for europe. it will obviously be a big event . should we expect anything? because

they will be talking about ukraine. but is this what you think? we express our solidarity, support, or can we expect something more disruptive, you know, mr. yu, in relations with nato more aggressively. if our government, since the beginning of march , somehow pushed the issue of integration into nato to the background, i think you will not deny that it is integration into nato has somehow disappeared from the public discourse, as if we should not talk about it to the eu. we have it wrong and it doesn't help and well, i want to immediately emphasize for our viewers that