until this year, when the russians wanted to stay in kazakhstan for a long time as part of the odkb, and then the chinese said no no no no, let's get out quickly, it still doesn't work without us, without our consent, china is actually increasing its influence very consistently in the countries of central asia, kazakhstan perfectly understands that the sanctions imposed on russia, the unprecedented support of the west, is unprecedented for ukraine in the fight against russia and to bet on russia. there will not be china will maneuver will maneuver intelligent, such an intelligent person, in kazakhstan, a national and state-oriented elite is gradually appearing, and quite quickly there is someone to talk to, and it will continue to be so, so i

would not talk now about the collapse of the odkb, but i would about the separate and completely independent position of kazakhstan, kazakhstan is strong enough to say this, and i am sure that this is the case, and i have discussed this position with other key players, including the chinese, and will have the support of the chinese. they have fundamental interests in kazakhstan and in terms of resources and geopolitics, they will not really stop supporting kazakhstan, that is, if russia wants to start an economic war with kazakhstan, and we see the first signs that it is related to oil and not yet to the reception of kazakh oil and many such small stories related to bilateral relations between kazakhstan and russia friends, china supports kazakhstan in this matter and will not allow russia

to do something like that, which uh, russia uh, causes damage there in ukraine with a certain limit. yes, i know that in russia there are still plans uh provocations and seizure of significant cossack territories, this has existed for a long time, and it is about the west and the north, well, actually, putin would really like this, and the russian elites would also like this very much, but if the chinese do not, then there will be no steps forward, the cat word of china for russia, it is now more than the law, as you know, as pakhan said conditionally in some clan, and here russia is less of a partner compared to kazakhstan, specifically with

china, and there will be no e-e steps in the direction of significant e-e, at least during putin's time. what will be then we will watch, mr. pavlo, on the embers of this, we will see how it unfolds another story of lithuania and kaliningrad, a part of the russian federation that is separated from the mainland of the russian federation, lithuania has limited the rail transit of goods to kaliningrad, and in addition, from august 10th, restrictions are expected that concern the supply of oil products, the lithuanian side at the same time refers to european sanctions and says that they do not go beyond the scope of these sanctions, while the russian side says that if if the european union does not correct the situation with the transport blockade of kaliningrad, then moscow will have free hands to solve the problem by any

means we choose , andriy klimov, the head of the ratfed commission for the protection of state sovereignty of the russian federation, stated this. what does this mean? this means that russia is already openly threatening lithuania with war . so she threatens everyone and lithuania, poland will now threaten everyone, but this is nato and they currently have neither the courage nor the resources to fight with nato, and this is perfectly understandable er. if you want my opinion, then all this territory er. well, let's conditionally call it the expanded königsberg or kaliningrad, as it is called in russia, it will pass anyway from er. there in russia to another control, it

may be quasi-independence, it may be quasi-independence autonomy, it is an enclave, it is now spied on by various russian weapons, but in fact the topic has its own fundamental problems, there is a slightly different mentality, people see europe around them, they see lithuania, they see poland, there are their own movements, by the way, that do not want to stay in russia, and here is mine premonition that this entire territory will not remain part of russia for whatever perspective russia may have. by the way, even the self-proclaimed president of belarus is talking about the possible redistribution of the world or the redistribution of the world. let's let the poles cut off western ukraine there, we'll fight who we don't understand why lukashenko has

to fight for western ukraine is also really unclear, but let's listen to lukashenko's rhetoric because, well, in principle, we need to understand that, as they say, what does a sober person have what's on the mind of a drunk lukashenka when he's drunk i don't know what's on his mind let's hear what's on the mind of a sober lukashenko well at least he looks sober what he's talking about redistributing education yes you can ask me well how about you you talk to putin there every day, we will meet in the near future and we will talk about the economy and security. everything only begins with what is happening in ukraine, this is the beginning, this is one of the elements of the major redistribution of the world. they will break, paint, and you know, crack, they will first of all be small, medium-sized states, such as the

czech republic, austria, switzerland, they. to be honest, i don't know if it's possible to comment on it. comment, because sometimes these synchronicities don't even need any comments. well, unless some psychotherapists. it reminds me so much of the ussr when they came there to perform at soviet productions, i don’t know whether there is a society of knowledge there or some kind of party committee there or regional committee, what did they have there? but in my opinion, these faces are absolutely parallel to what he says, sorry, what the hell, and actually, what is he carrying? he says that he already wants to hand over the czech republic, austria, switzerland, the czech republic is a

nato country, there are two neutral ones, respectively, and well of course, there will be transformations in the future, but i think that these transformations will definitely affect belarus 100%. there will be no belarus under lukashenka's regime in the future. there is simply no chance . yes, there is a different mentality than in ukraine, but also a different mentality than in russia. well, look belarus does not support any war against us. well, how will lukashenko fight? well, let's see, he will take off very quickly if he starts any military operations. i think that he will keep his nose in the air, and if russia has at least some success, then there will be a chance. but i i think that, first of all, there will be no success in russia and, accordingly, my father will be there in minsk to try to gather people again

at some enterprises. i do not believe in any steps on the part of belarus as an independent state. putin said in his speech in st. there sovereign states and there are colonies, but belarus is a classic colony today, but it is classic if you say who putin meant. he meant belarus, so lukashenko he kicked there, i don't know. tell everyone what he talks to putin every day, well, let him continue to tell. in fact, i think that everything did not end well for lukashenka, by the way, you mentioned putin and his speech at this economic forum in jupiter. he said about partial sovereignty, that a state can be independent, but it cannot be independent if

it has partial sovereignty, well. obviously, in this situation, both lukashenko and putin are promoting this thesis. look, ukraine is not run by the ukrainian leadership, but by the united states of america and great britain, all actions of ukraine depend on this. by the way , lukashenko also spoke about this publicly, let's listen to a small fragment of the self-proclaimed president of belarus. i was drawn to him by the collar of them here is possible say that they left why is the american no negotiation and the british rule there, the americans through the polyakovs are in many ways because they want to get angry and be near the owner's feet and

get something from it, this is also a dangerous element , they are already dreaming of western ukraine, this is here for us we will have to react because we cannot allow the poles to surround us at all . it turns out that belarus wants to surround the poles. and lukashenko does not see the fact that russia is absorbing this independent republic for the time being. well, when he talks about negotiations lukashenko, he completely forgets to remind that the negotiations between ukraine and russia stopped after it became known about mass murders and mass rapes, including in the kyiv and chernihiv regions, about the mass murders in mariupol , and the picture that lukashenko paints it is directed at the domestic consumer, of course, you are talking about the fact that belarusians

are different from, er, russians, er, how long can belarusians tolerate the self-proclaimed president lukashenka, of course, two years ago they did not succeed assert one's right to free choice and to choose the president of belarus after all well, it's like in the soviet union everyone watched what brezhnev said from the rostrum of the kremlin palace of congresses and everyone understood what was happening and discussed what was happening in the real country stan and i i think that in fact there is no chance for this belarusian reality under lukashenko to move forward and again, as putin said, it is a vassal country. and lukashenko, when he talks about negotiations, he really likes the idea that we begin to surrender to russia and become the same a vassal country would be a blessing for him, well , it's easier when you're not the only slave walking there, but some

group of slaves, then somehow it seems that it's already like some other state eh, you look around there and don't think that you're alone there, only eh on a leash and we don't want to be on a leash and so let him calm down and no one will give up well, as for the external management, this is a song, it entertains me, in fact, well, if you sing higher, it will go to someone else and i don't sing and millions of ukrainians don't sing, we let's fight for us for ukraine, ani and we are fighting for the fact that ukraine in the future was not just a territory of land for the ukrainian nation, for and for ukrainians, and no one will stop at this,

and even if there are some agreements there. there were people who would never have accepted them and would have fought on. and this is the 21st century and you can fight in any way, so lukashenko should calm down and think about what he should do there, i don't know why he didn't like the czech republic, austria and switzerland, but let him think about about myself is another mr. pavel's absentee discussion took place these days between david marakhami and dmitry medvedev, because davydo arkhamiya, the head of the presidential faction, the servant of the people, is the only one of the negotiators who in april initiated negotiations with the russian federation and announced that negotiations with russia could resume at the end of august after counteroffensives of the armed forces of ukraine, they say that ukraine will have a stronger position

and will already conduct negotiations with russia from a position of strength. instead, the deputy chairman of the security council of the russian federation, dmitry medvedev, said about that is possible and so the question is whether there will be something to talk about and with whom when medvedev says it is unknown the question is whether there will be something to talk about and with whom he probably meant ukraine, but we perceived russia and the question is when medvedev says the question is whether there will be anything to talk about and with whom it is perceived, whether it will be russia, whether putin will be there, and in general, whether there will be anyone to negotiate with. what do you think about these negotiations announced by arahamia and which are so critical and in such a mocking style medvedev comments. i believe that the statement of hamia is complete i understand, well, it would be nice if he said why the end of august, but in fact it is related to

the fact that autumn is approaching there, uh, the situation will be completely different in the energy and food markets, and there may be some changes there, including tectonic changes, but that that he says that we need to use the summer to strengthen our position and this is absolutely absolutely correct as for medvedev, he wants to be again after putin and for this his pr people will write him any bet so that he looks uh cool on his background is russian, but he, er, is all in quotation marks, er, with his coolness, i don’t know how to better say this word, it’s still similar to zhirynovsky, that is, they found slutsky in the place of zhirynovsky, but in fact, in my opinion, in the

modern system of the kremlin, er, zhirynovsky’s place is more and more takes bears is it somehow agreed with putin there or not? well, you could have asked putin in st. petersburg, but no one asked, that's why, in fact, i wouldn't listen to medvedev's words, well , you have to read him like that to understand . moreover, it is not medvedev who is making decisions in the kremlin and whose people are listening to putin . the border of the luhansk region now the

situation around severodonetsk is quite tense, the occupiers are literally leveling lysychansk with the ground, the situation there is very serious, at the same time we see how the world supports ukraine and the meeting in the format of rammstein the third the meeting confirmed that no one is going to give in to putin and everyone demonstrated that the defense ministers of 40 countries, more than 40 countries, came out in support of ukraine, we see this support from great britain and boris johnson during his last visit to kyiv as well he said that it is very important to defeat the russian federation. how do you predict whether russia will stop at some arbitrary point? well, there at the administrative border of the luhansk and donetsk

regions they will say that they have completed the task the so-called special military operations protected the interests of the so-called dpr and lpr and freezes this conflict, thus suspending the entire ukraine in the mode of waiting for new missile strikes, does putin still intend to move further into ukraine if he succeeds and if the ukrainian army does not will now receive the heavy weapons he is counting on. no, he will not stop now. they have changed their tactics and want to, er, bite off our land with small or not small pieces. they invest to the maximum without sparing people. they never spared them. in fact, i believe that putin will stop only when we stop him, there are no other options

. i do not believe that sanctions, at least the sanctions that exist today, will stop putin. he has in his head the desire to enter the history books in some russia that will never exist at all. parts of europe, he also talked about it there in st. petersburg. is collapsing, but now putin has it in his head to create a foreign world, all the enemies are there, well, except for the chinese, someone is there. well, the west is definitely an enemy, and we will hold on to the last, let's build some

fronts there, that is, this logic is political, it's definitely in his head that's why he won't stop, only we will stop him. and as for the west, it is of course important help, it is important that the west also provides us with armed training, since training is no less important logistically, support, intelligence support, eh, at the same time, i see that we get weapons so that we definitely do not lose under any circumstances, and this is currently the fundamental consensus of the west. putin should not win in ukraine. likewise, i see the fundamental consensus of the west is that putin , if he does not win, it is already his defeat and a strategic defeat that will lead to the collapse of his system or his personal because the system can

remain putin can change but i also see that the west provides weapons carefully so as not to lead to a massive escalation and possible use of weapons of mass destruction as far as i understand uh go talks about whether russia will or will not use nuclear weapons, i understand that now they say that they will not, although who believes them at all, they have already really lied about everything that is possible and not possible well, of course, it could be chemistry because chemistry is always they had it, they didn’t destroy it in accordance with the convention, they actively use all these cases, remember only the violinists and so on. and this or that bulgaria. that is , it will continue further, that is, the west is trying to uh consistently but at the same time, it is careful to conduct

mr. pavla, at the end of our conversation, i would like to ask: why does china support russia ? what is the interest of the chinese in this confrontation? well, it is clear that ukraine is supported by the united states of america, it is possible that this is how the chinese demonstrate confrontation with washington, well, god knows. well, you can explain why china is on the side of russia. yes, of course, china also needs a critical putin, i will explain it to russia. is needed as a junior partner in the future opposition to the measures, but the logic of china is completely

different. china wants confrontation within the system and then tries to jump out of the world system and china is really fighting with the hands of russia against the west because it is fighting, well, this is not quite right, it is testing the red lines of the west and at the same time watching how it is projected on the english region in taiwan and much more in the greater asian region and china also understands that putin has nowhere to go. he will always be china's junior partner and here are some other leaders of russia. although he will not remain an imperial and an ivanshita leader , he may try to cooperate with the west according to a different model, therefore, a direct defeat of putin's russia is not profitable for china today. it is profitable for china to

de-escalate china, it is profitable for china to reduce food prices and energy carriers in the fall of this year, they will eat the congress of the party always passes on such waves of stabilization of progress and stability. this is very, very important for them for their confucian mentality, so i think that in fact china is not is completely on the side of putin's russia, but it will not completely withdraw its support, although it will not actively support it, well, china will not support ukraine . this is also true in this confrontation in this war . but we have our own game with china. well, we simply will not for sure today's idea is to talk about it in detail. thank you for the conversation, mr. pavla. i will remind our viewers that it was pavlo

klimkin, the minister of foreign affairs of ukraine in 2014-2019, a politician-diplomat. thank you for the conversation. i don't know. friends, see you again. i would like to remind viewers that you can subscribe to our resources in social groups and on social resources, we are almost everywhere on youtube, facebook, telegram, instagram, read our news also on the espresso tv website, i will say goodbye to you until tomorrow at 1:00 p.m. military expert valentyn batrak will be a guest, let's talk with him about the situation on the eastern and southern fronts of ukraine , that's all for today i wish you good health take care of yourself and your loved ones goodbye , watch espresso news and

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