our underground gas storages are very active, especially in the 20th year, less than in the 21st year, at high prices, they were used to store gas for the winter period, precisely by our european partners, if uh, let's say due to one reason or another, uh it will be difficult to use these underground storage facilities, then this will be a sign for the countries of central europe, which companies used our gas storage facilities, therefore, in this case, we are talking about the complex consideration of protection problems infrastructure as with based on the interests of ukraine yes, the interests of the countries of the eastern periphery of the eu or the eastern flank of nato because

it will, so to speak, hit their interests and in this case we see that if in connection with the accession of ukraine to the european power system system, we have additional insurance to compensate for a possible shortage of electricity e. there in the winter period. the earlier we used these were russian and or belarusian supplies, they are quite naturally impossible now, but we opened so talk about the gateways with europe when we can transfer our excess electricity to the countries of the european union and vice versa take from there when we don't have enough, that is, these gateways should be preserved as well, because it is as if in

an integrated united energy system well, actually speaking, those consultations that are going on, first of all, with our american partners, well, if they are aimed at, because it is called preparing the sled in the summer and not waiting there in the winter, or how much in general is it for us as for people eh perceive these storage facilities where gas is stored, are they protected, unprotected, how vulnerable are they, because i myself have no idea what these objects are ? well, actually speaking, well, the reserve is a natural reservoir, gas has been mined there for a long time, this field is exhausted, and now it is used, on the contrary, for

pumping gas and pumping it out in the winter , well, hit something at a depth of 1.5 km if so this gas tank, which is the customs clearance of the car , but there is no doubt that there are questions related to the fact that it is necessary to cover the damage to the infrastructure located on the surface . for oil, in view of this vulnerable moment of the destruction of part of the critical infrastructure , what do we need to do and what can we do in a short period of time? complexes of some kind of restoration and repair works eh talk about some eh there are some long-term

plans now when hostilities are going on eh well you can say that but it is quite clear that no one will come from investors no matter which domestic or foreign eh to spend money make multi-billion-dollar investments in projects that are at risk of damage, well, actually, let's remember where we started with this, let's finish the story with the development of offshore gas fields in the black sea just in the spring of 2012-13 and 2014 to be signed a large-scale agreement on the development of the scythian field on the deep-sea shelf with the participation of leading companies such as mobil shell and if it was a threat to russian

state companies that a colossal additional resource of gas would appear there competitor lviv, then they worked, so to speak or the crimean operation to pre-empt the liquidation - having created unacceptable military and political risks, investors went to p mykhailo thank you for this interesting conversation, i think we will return to this topic of our not-closest programs, and i would like to remind our viewers that our interlocutor would be mykhailo gonchar, president of the strategy 21 center for global studies, my name is serhiy zgurets, i am the director of the defense express company, and watch our future episodes on the espresso channel. good evening. my name is myroslava barchuk, and this is an online project of the ukrainian plan called own names of the project is implemented with the

support of the swedish foam . let's talk about it with oleksandr rudomanov, a journalist, blogger and decommunization activist oleksandr is one of the co-founders of the decommunization project ukraine oleksandr greetings good evening hello oleksandr i don't hear you well eh i hope so well i hear i hear you already good evening my first question eh which was exactly what was tormenting for the first time well, not the first time, not the first year, this is a question of patience or, i don’t know, indifference, maybe there are some other explanations for this ukrainian society, here we are, in principle, 30 years, we already understand deep down that tolstoy

chepushki appeared in the toponymy of ukraine not because they are the number one writers in the world, this is absolutely not true. they appeared because the russians marked the conquered territory in our country, and now we had nothing for decades of independence against russian names, who is german in ukrainian cities, villages, central leo tolstoy metro station, leo tolstoy square in kyiv, hundreds of pushkin monuments, you know, i am silent about the streets of tereshkova with whom you fought ah and hm those people those people who they talked about decommunization, de-russification. they were called extremists, radicals, and the russians, on the contrary , russian troops only enter the city and immediately knock down our symbols, signs, monuments, destroy ukrainian literature from textbook libraries, and so on. this is why, in your opinion, there was such a terrible resistance to decommunization before the war, sometimes we recall

the courts in kharkiv against er against grigorenko avenue attempts to return the name of er zhukov, we recall the er huge resistance to russification and so on, why were rockets and genocide needed for so that the ukrainians actually began imperialization well, let's say so, if we take kyiv so in our country, as far as i think 10-12% voted for pro-russian facts these are those who were well and pronounced supporters of the russians, in fact, yes, a very large part of the russian idea people, unfortunately, these are amorphous people who well, as long as you don't kick them, they won't do anything, especially this applies to the size .

in order to start the process of russification , decommunization, well, decommunization, okay, where is the russification of ukrainian streets, although, for example, if it hasn’t changed since 90, even in the third year, the first decommunization was carried out in kyiv, when there were different streets, certain streets were renamed to new names that still exist and so a full-scale war began on february 24 of this year, and in kyiv there was such a colossal demand for russification there , sociology shows that 76% want it so much that the kyiv council on april 15 introduced the so-called a special procedure for renaming the streets of other objects in the city of kyiv and

literally anyone could propose ideas for new names, they say that a total of 12,000 proposals came to the city council, in particular, regarding the renaming of more than three three hundred streets , and here it is in 5 days of kyiv in the application digital kyiv voted for all the positions on each street, there were up to 10-12 options, they say, and the people of kyiv voted, they chose their option on each street, in the end they drowned among the many options, and in the end somewhere , this russification is successful, they say. what it is absolute absolute chaos what do you think behind this blitz where the russification of kyiv in two months uh actually there are two well two two first aspects which i

think is correct we are now renaming all russian streets as long as there is a request from civil society and while politicians feel it i'm renaming all the streets that are connected with russians and russian culture to neutral names or ukrainian names and then we'll see, maybe some still need to be renamed, maybe they renamed it badly, well, whatever it sounded yes, it is possible for some more moments. that is, when two or three streets in the country can be named after one and the same person. yes, now or one and the same phenomenon, well, this is not quite correct , it is all the same, all these streets will pass by the commission of deputies commission and they will select this one. well, i suspect they will respond. repeat and it is quite possible that there will be another separate vote in the spaces. well, but this is clear from the records. here i am, uh, i'm just an insult to myself on the issue of

renaming the kyiv city council, timish martynenko koshlyanskyi wrote the following: he appealed back in april, when this story actually began, and when people began to submit their options, and it was a shaft in the absolute version, he wrote, he appealed to the mayor of the city of kyiv and the secretary. he says that the current process of renaming streets of other objects of kyiv has turned into a farce, crazy and will result in a cultural catastrophe, it is necessary to stop the catastrophe and insult to the cultural environment of kyiv, normalize the process of economic changes, direct it to a civilized channel and ensure an expert discussion so as not to distort the symbolic environment of the capital, and this is when you say that when there is some mistake, it can be renamed. well, but it will no longer be possible

to transfer it, that is, when it is already wrong. is it somehow unscientific, as the member of the renaming commission says if it is not scientifically assigned. so, some street or square, some name invented by a fictional person, say, or by people without education and without special training. it will already be very problematic. then roll it back, well rolling back is possible and problematic, but nothing prevents you from re -tying the street, that is, there will be another one, not a special trick, that is, most likely it will be a procedure, what was it then? if i remember correctly, the collection of signatures is conditional, then the selection shows public discussion on this very street, that is, not like now. kyivans, i vote for everything, yes, for all streets, there will probably be a vote for this street, which is where people live and they can

propose another new name. the people of kyiv voted, this is a very interesting vote, here we know, for example, that all thousands of people voted for the fact that volgogradska street became roman town hall street. it's just like that, well, in the largest er, almost 30,000, yes, the largest number of people proposed to name bilomorska street as the street to kill the activists of kateryna handzyuk yes zholudeva street is proposed to become oleksandr makhova street, and the street of the fallen journalist and soldier gagarin avenue is proposed to be renamed leonid kadenyuk avenue heroes of brest to chernobaiv pushkina leo tolstoy's nachekalenka to the street ukrainian heroes moskovskaya to the princes ostro-e to the princes ostrozky viterska to the london one i saw you wrote that the kyivans' vote will play in kyiv now there will be a toponym in honor of scriabin and in honor of the soldiers of the

72nd brigade which defended kyiv, but there will not be many such, many such things, renaming, which is proposals that you do not like, there are moments, for example, there was a street where uh, into which almost everyone was squeezed, let's say yes, uh, chechen forces which have no relation to russia. that is, there is a street - in my opinion, it was an ichkeria and it could have been called dudayev, and it could have been something else, i don't remember who, but i won't beg. in fact, not to create a competitor to each other , that is, it turns out that instead of us having dzhokhar dudayev street there, we had another street, they cannot be at the same time now, well, as of now, because we somehow decided on the other side i understand that we have a big pile

streets of sadova, for example, it's there in osokorki. well, i think that there are many such streets there, which in principle can be renamed in the process, as well, for example, we really won't have a street, nor the 72nd brigade, nor black zaporozhians on the street. well, because it's even in my time, as far as i understand, the brigade would like to name the subway station in honor of the brigade, well, here, for example, hmm, the historian writes the watchmen on the piano. and he says that in kyiv there could be a street of genius, like that of a great artist from gnizdov, so there will be a street chemical axis for example, people voted for chemical street without knowing who yakiv hnizdovsky is, and let's say, as well as hnizdovsky, he is in third place or second place. can the renaming commission of the kyiv city council disagree with the people's choice, and

on the other hand, you want it to be let's say it's yakov gnizdovsky street, well, look at the special procedure. i don't know what can be there at all, well , that is, in this. well, i'm not ready to answer. maybe you can't, it's all possible, it's also the taste, the problem is that i'll tell you that even if people knew after whom they wanted to name the street, yes, as a rule, as a rule, the residents voted equally for the court streets of hrusheva. yabluneva dzhorzhynova is there, in short, if you take ukraine, for example, in general, ukraine is simple, you know. not decommunization. and i don't know. -e renaming of streets in this garden names vyshneva, i would have asked the song i will walk along the apricot grove

to vynogradnaya. it became possible to name the streets there in honor of, including public figures and historical figures who were not worth it, let me say yes, not in the capital with this devastation and syphilis, just dig in, i know that the mayor of the city of odesa is fucked, he also opposes the street well, he is now. it was his interview in the universe. it seems that he was talking about what he is against. well, i am not talking about the fact that there is a discussion about preserving the name of this street. we invite you. i did not hear. well, he is in favor of preserving the name of this street. if he doesn't mind renaming the streets, well, besides i am also saying that there is a debate in odessa about whether

to clean the monument to catherine the second or not , and the actual question that i see very often on the network on facebook is how the monument in odessa differs from the monument that they want put the occupiers in the occupied kherson. how do you answer this question, er, in i read quite such a good opinion, with which i agree, so that the monument to catherine in odessa does not offend anyone, it is necessary to take the monument of the horse from shchors and deliver it to catherine . if you calculate if serious and not there are certain historical values ​​that need to be understood right away and the differences between russian toponyms, russian monuments in temporarily occupied territories, ukrainian territories, russian territories, there is no difference, these are occupation stamps, there is nothing commemorating pushkin in ukraine, it is no

different from a monument to pushkin in russia, both for its ideological color and for its wholeness, it was put in the same way, the monument to suvorov in the conditional nemyrov seems to be izmail and somewhere in russia, well, it is one and the same, this monument to suvorov is monument to the russian voivodship and this monument carries the same messages. the same symbols as alexander . to kyivan and other concerned citizens, but still, it is possible that people do not have enough historical knowledge, or some other knowledge, maybe this is not a matter for citizens, but after all, for experts, scientists, historians, what do you think about the fact

that this is how it is solved in a large measure e uh, hands in hands, places, uh, look, uh, i think it's good. why, because i'm very well, at one time, i always worked in one structure, and there you know, when you come to make an offer, it won't be an employee of this department yes, you were looked at as an employee by employees, like, yes, what do you know , women are actually officials and, in my subjective opinion, maybe even some, let's say so, cultural figures, yes, those who are responsible for this look at ordinary citizens, like, why are you filming women, but in fact, citizens who do not care but which are not within this culture, well, within this village, what kind of officials do they have? well, i believe that they have good ideas, and often these ideas

are not worse, if not better than what they offer . i can't help but ask you about the kyiv conservatory. there will be several teachers there. literally several teachers of the pyotr tchaikovsky kyiv conservatory advocated not to change the name of pyotr tchaikovsky, to keep the name of pyotr tchaikovsky. so in the name of the academy, they addressed the president to the government of the verkhovna rada, they say that this is manipulation of tchaikovsky's name with an imperial narrative, they are spoiling the protection of tchaikovsky's heritage from being used by the aggressor as a tool for the destruction of the ukrainian ukrainian essence. yes, i know that there is already an answer from the ministry of culture and state affairs, which is that the presentation of the father,

what did the academy do, what did it not valid due to violation of procedures, but after all, there was such a submission and there is still such a position, what do you think about it, i will say that if at one time this academy was named honor, i don't know, well, let's assume chikatilo and she was an ocia, those who, well, the employees worked under this name yes, there for 40 years, as they probably now work under the name of tchaikovsky, they would ask not to change , please, today because people are getting used to it, people are again a vivid example of me i will give a small analogy. yes. at one time, they wanted to rename the railway, well, there was such an idea, because in our country, the southern, western, southern, e-e collectives were against everything. why are the collectives against the fact that we will do that here, the same story would be the same if not

called not called this academy those who are old-timers who have worked there for a very, very, very long time worked there they will you see and you previously said that you can give people hands these are such things uh in such decisions here are there, see in the 20s , 1920s 20th century music academy this is what the conservatory of music academy is now: it was the lysenko music and drama institute, and as oksana zabuzhko rightly reminded yesterday, this music academy was founded in kyiv by none other than mykola vitaliyovych lysenko with the last money because at that time the ukrainian community collected some funds for his 35th anniversary of creative activity, large funds, a solid amount, so that he could buy a house, and he took the funds and founded this music drama school, from which the present conservatory grew, from which the theater institute grew eh and

only in the 34th year actually the theater court splinters the conservatory split off and already became two eh two two higher and suddenly the cyclo name of tchaikovsky that is actually russified this name i think in these all the people who enter eh actually in these the management of the music academy has now appealed to the president to keep tchaikovsky's name, they don't know these facts well, i think they know let's say it's not important, they know it today or not, well, you understand that they protect eh on gas not because he is an outstanding person or something else, yes, but because they are so used to it, if the academy used to be called, well, let it be short, i want to convey the idea that they know more than anything that they know it all, but the key thing is, if the fact that they do not want to change anything is a very big thing

the problem is renaming because people don't care about the principle of decommunization and deracialization. that is, it's a monument, for example, people don't want to change anything because, well, in mine, for example, it's fuel. the yak somehow sent a request and it turned out that khrushchev was a deputy of the ussr, no less than dubkovetsky, and in addition, he fought against the ukrainian people's republic in the 20s, well, that is, he threw up under the influence of the law of decommunization, so why? yes, i left, let's dismantle it, and they write me good day in the ass because we are against it, you start asking why we are against it and they say well, we talked to people here, they had children and they kissed here, they spent their youth here, how can we dismantle something, something, uh, in other countries, uh,

what luckier, other societies are luckier, here i am in front of me is a post by the musician pavlo gintov, who wrote yesterday about the names of the conservatories of the world, and he says that in warsaw, the music university is named after chopin the pole, just like in helsinki the jan sibelius academy of music, yes, in budapest, the academy of music, named after the hungarian fernsalist , yes, in milan, there are conservatories named after giuseppe verdi, also an italian. well, that is, in all people in canada, there is a school of music named after elena gulta, a canadian genius pianist, but in moscow, the tchaikovsky conservatory and in kyiv the national medical academy and the tchaikovsky federation of the outstanding russian composer, that is, i just hope i hope that actually this story with the conservatory cannot but develop and after involving the public discussion, it will be

familiarization and breaking, because she, well, now the society is against, yes, the renaming against russian passports will pass if they can. i think that they may have a tactic. it's not relevant, it's not relevant. do you think it could happen? what do you think will happen? it was suddenly relevant. it will cease to be relevant after everything you've done. you understand. excuse me, let's send it. let's take it. of documents, that is, you think well of people, i apologize, of course but you speak very well, oleksandr serhiyevich, you told me five minutes ago that you need to listen to people, remember, i am asking you, i am asking you, look, you need to listen to people, but you need to push and show

the direction let me give you a vivid example again, decommunization, well, this is my favorite, so until last year, last year, we still had the streets of frunze eleni, but it was in villages, yes, it was possible in small towns, but it was still, lord, in the 14th year was the annexation of crimea, while i was there, someone told me something. i took a look at the streets of tereshkov , in principle, no one was involved, i will say more at the beginning, in my opinion, there were 230 streets, as of now, until now, in the fourth month of a full-scale war. and what a year there, the eighth year the annexation of crimea, for which kryshkov voted, we still have at least 80 streets named after her in all regions, so there was resistance from the people, so as not to sneer at this, see that the resistance was not dependent on the graphic, as if the location of this name and khmelnytskyi would say

that it's not tereshkova, but tereshok. and who else is there? vinnytsia said that it's not tereshkova, but tereshki, in short, well, there were a lot of options . that he is a descendant of the cossack family and he had musical er an allusion to ukrainian music so er there are 5 minutes left and i still want to ask you about metro stations in kyiv er there is also a draft decision of the kyiv city council about to rename five stations of the kyiv metro i do i understand that this is exactly how it all started, and according to what was published on the website, it means that it is proposed to rename the station beresteyska