audi and he already reproduces his vision in his vision of how his community is perceived and that is why we are now faced with what you understand people in order to understand why it is inappropriate for us a-a why do we have the right to purge it from ourselves what they may have considered part of their identity and uh, it's just very difficult, it seems, but here's just another such moment when you know the physical, you don't live the war in us, just like you, both of us have such an experience when uh, near kyiv, it's very, very close - there were occupying troops, that is, even now in fact, you are always under the threat of a missile

missile strike, and here you are very clearly aware on a physical level. and what is war and this is a very important awareness , i know it myself. with olena styazhkina. i approached her and said that until i was in march, at the beginning of march, i did not sit on the packed suitcases and did not prepare for evacuation because i did not understand, uh, we will survive, we will not survive, our house will be hit or not. i never, i always sympathized with you that you lost your home but having experienced this, i could never imagine the horror of losing my home only when you are actually inside it and experience it yourself, only then you can understand it, but for example about the letter kat above the house so it is never possible to describe and imagine why we mostly communicate with people

who have such book and cinematographic experience, and they mostly have no personal experience, even when you talk to military correspondents, and in different countries, it happened in different ways. and this all the same, you come to another country, you research the material, and even more so, you analyze the night , you live, you understand, and that’s why it’s just necessary to explain and not be afraid to be frank, you know, well , it seems to me that emotionality, that is, like frankness. it can be of different intonation, it can be different words and what i really don't like, ah, i don't like shouting, i understand why it happens when a person wants to read, but when you talk to people who don't even imagine there, i don't

know, well, the seventh part is what everyone is going through our country and shouting is not a very good communication tool, you need to calm yourself down in some way, but at the same time not to deprive yourself of humanity, not to deprive yourself of the value of a-a and to be absolutely sincere even about your experiences and i think it helps a lot larisa, the next question will be uh, will be, will be about shouting because ah, very recently, i remember your wonderful interview on babel, which was even called your phrase, you said, you discussed how to comment, how to tell the world about about war crimes about the disasters that are happening here and you said that you can't shout because they will stop listening to you, they will stop hearing you, and here

we actually came to the topic of the great scandal that arose and exploded in ukrainian society, the day before yesterday, ukrainian pravda, a publication that everyone reads, published its own investigation about the fact that former ombudsman lyudmila denisova, while in office, told unconfirmed stories about the rape of ukrainian children by the occupiers, so ukrainian pravda wrote, in particular, that during interrogations to the prosecutor's office, denisova told the law enforcement officers that she allegedly heard these stories from her friend oleksandra kvitkoi, who headed or was in charge of the yuniseville hotline for psychological help, and that denisova explained that she made these scary stories and details public because she wants to win e victory in the war for ukraine first in in ukrainian pravda,

there was a headline that contained a mention of fictional stories, it was said that way, then the name was changed, but a very loud scandal broke out in society and society so, one part perceives the main message of the article that it seems that the majority of sexual crimes by russians are fabrications and fakes, denis, you are right , this is playing along, of course, russian propaganda, the other part of society took it as a message that unconfirmed stories discredit ukraine , discredit our own testimonies in the future. there were no more such illiterate officials. such statements were not confirmed. what do you think about this story and what could be the consequences of this story? i see this is a very broad question. i will allow myself to focus on a few points, and the first is the communication that concerns one of the

most brutal war crimes, which is sexual violence, in my firm belief, should not be turned into a scoreboard. the yellow press is built on that and on detailing on physiology on processes in order to inflame in order to laugh and for that actually if to gossip do you understand this is a certain language the language of the scoreboard and how are you the journalist is excellent. you understand what i am talking about, and our audience may eventually be interested. and what is this phenomenon, why is communication about one of the most serious anastasia -horror crimes unequivocally?

reading these messages with so much detail in the telegrams of lyudmila denisova in particular or in the columns of various online and not only publications, you can even visualize it and you already know it will happen , you yourself visualize it as pictures second moment, and i, accordingly, am not a prosecutor who conducts an official investigation or is generally interested in a-a question and i do not have the appropriate tools to check uh-uh how much uh-uh these are stories uh-uh hyperbolized invented or it's just bad uh-uh poor remote communication yes i i hope that this will be given a proper evaluation a-a but it seems to me that a-a if there is a certain percentage of water a-a i suspect

that this information is either interpreted a-a from unconfirmed facts or it was presented very incorrectly from the beginning i will explain that i mean the ukrainian truth made a very correct step and in order to raise this issue, because otherwise this issue could have been raised at completely different levels, and in any case, the answer to a-a remains on and when the national media within the framework of freedom of speech a-a which rooting for those survivors of sexual violence who were forced to go through it to survive and that their feelings were not devalued, that their stories were not

crossed out, that the international criminal a-a court or actually in the tribunal or in the national in the courts and the person himself felt confident and the prosecutor's office felt confident and the defense felt confident, so it is necessary to proceed from the fact that we respect people who had the courage to declare this, now i want to take a little step back and explain in why could there be a problem here, do you understand the lines, i’m a hotline, any of them. it often a-a hmm, it assumes anonymity, anonymity of messages, anonymity of messages. and in general, it also deserves respect, because first of all, if there were such calls, although i saw the difference in the number of which is especially useful to me, because

it already gives me reason to doubt its veracity , unfortunately, but it is necessary to explain, please, explain what is being said about the fact that oleksandra kvitko and uh and lyudmila denisova they uh-uh they uh-uh from the beginning they stated about a much larger number of calls that they received, allegedly yes, this number seems to have been 10 times more than the actual number of calls to the psychological help hotline. and you are absolutely right. therefore, it was necessary to mention that it anonymous reports, we sent some of them to the police, we sent them to the prosecutor's office, but what we heard gives us reasons, for example , to trust people and to claim that in the liberation from the

occupiers of the territory there were not isolated cases of sexual violence you understand both adults and children, in my opinion, in fact , to make a story of the rape of a child. and a detailed story of how it goes, it all happened, it’s at least a bad tone, and believe me, it’s just that if it’s about, let’s say, -and diplomacy at the level of the ministry of foreign affairs or the ministry of defense of other countries this is not well perceived as it is perceived by people because in democracies people are very dependent on the position of governments and in fact it is the people it terrifies us, of course, how

someone stops it. it's all simple to read, but you know, it hurts me a lot because of the excessive detailing, it would tell me that it's simple rape. well, there's nothing interesting here, it's possible even on this not to focus, but to focus. that's it and this is very harmful and unfair to people who were evaluated after such a crime and evaluated after the occupation, because i constantly emphasize that violence during the occupation is actually double violence and double torture , because a person is in total despair and a group is growing many times, please tell larisa a-a i understand correctly that er-e the hotline could

really er-e receive such testimonies and er-e the ombudsman er-e no psychologists who receive calls do not have the right to disclose not only details but the rape continues until there is no evidence, the evidence base is not collected, or they could talk about it, but just in a different way, and again , the interesting situation here is that as far as i understood, there were five people working on the hotline we only know oleksandra kvitko, who is very public and she is a psychologist, all other documents appear as operators. you just take the call you you fix it, you understand. you just make a fix a-a.

if a person er wants to trust you further, you can simply direct him er to the number from the police phone to the psychologist helpline phone to the legal helpline phone and actually support the information or security mother if it is a witness who wants to anonymously testify to the story and pass it on to the prosecutor's office, this is a big ethical challenge , how much is the person who collects information does not have the appropriate specialty, does not see the person, if it is an anonymous call, and in an instant, for something, he puts it in telegram channel, and not even my own, but actually that of an official who is responsible for the protection of human rights and is her human rights representative and the parliament, that is,

there are obvious violations. but again, you know, i would like the relevant authorities to deal with this i'm just a lawyer. that is, this is my expertise. i can tell you that i don't like it here, but i'm not conducting this investigation, and i hope that we get more clear answers to our question . speak and you said that correctly very popularized by people who, er, read the material, in fact, by the way, i advise you to read er, there was a column by the chief editor of ukrainian pravda, serhii musaeva, in my opinion , it goes even further and more clearly answers the questions why is this happening and what is the danger of such and suspicions, in particular, regarding the not too

virtuous behavior of this or that official , but there are two moments when people were very angry at the fact that this is a stretch of russian propaganda that they did it. but russian propaganda was already at that time 10 times more capable stories about the fact that we are lying, that is, it does not change anything in the picture of their world, but look, for example, i perceived this information as information from an official source, i did not spread it because, well, actually, this is not the language that i speak i would like to talk about sexual violence, but i could direct foreign journalists to talk to the office, and i could just pay attention to these data. a lot of people were scared, horrified, and

very angry, and they ignored these messages. now they have such a moment, people can deny it to me, but i feel this way that they partly feel they are also accomplices and liars, you understand when on various forums you prove a-a different russian audience to trolls or objectively to real people that your army men are your fighters and officers and the soldiers are preparing our women and babies, do you feel now that uh, when they said that you are lying so that you are not right? now you actually feel that your spine has woken up, it is a very bad feeling, and that is the danger of such stories. you understand, you are talking about another point that danylo mokrykh is talking about, which applies not only to

those people who talk about it like this in an international audience, but here is a point that concerns the victims of war crimes, and here danylo mokryk writes about the fact that the denial of russian war crimes even in the format there, denisova invented it. this is a continuation of the abuse of those who survived these crimes, because the victims of such crimes are so uh and so reluctant to report because it is very stigmatized and it is very difficult for them. well, no i have to tell you how hard it is for people to open up. and even after this story, uh, people can completely shut up and not talk about it, uh, look, uh, well, it seems to me that danyla is a little confused about cause and effect, and because uh, much in

my opinion, it's worse to talk about such serious crimes in the language of the newspaper bulvar a-a it's much worse and it actually turns you into a heroine of a very er horrible er hmm tabloid thursday and you just read it and believe me well i just know what i 'm talking about people don't want to associate themselves with posts ah, ms. export of music, it’s very difficult to perceive yourself through these messages, and since actually uh, one way or another, uh, ms. lyudmila didn’t call uh, and didn’t say the names of the white people if uh, there were appeals and these appeals were recorded and were then handed over to the prosecutor's office, a person

can in principle feel protected, although there were several moments and messages that, ah, well, in my opinion, already contained a violation of security rules and a violation of private life and private data of a person actually trust yourself - this is an opportunity to turn to e-e legal aid to turn to the state, and we are not talking about that, and actually the article in ukrainian pravda says that the ukrainian authorities do not engage in sexual violence, do not engage in war crimes, it seems to me that this is precisely what the state needs regards his obligations a regarding compliance with safety rules regarding the understanding of a-a person who dares to

speak about it regarding the fact that these crimes are being investigated and well as i just want to emphasize because the crimes are being investigated, that is, it is impossible to talk about the fact that this phenomenon does not exist, and currently we have a culture of investigation, we have literally one minute left, and i want to ask you and you have already started talking about it, i want to ask about this here you are you actually work in this very difficult field, i read dozens of stories about rape on various sites on various western media, in particular, how many stories are there that are already supported by such an evidence base, so are you ready to go to the international court of justice, how many such cases are there on which evidence has already been collected and look er, well , first of all, we can talk about national

er national justice, and currently the prosecutor's office has 19 if i'm not mistaken , they are already preparing er for the transfer to take place in court, now the case is being considered in court, it is quite high-profile, it is the case of the savior and sex offender and war criminal romanov. it will be heard behind closed doors and in absentia. ukraine will treat the preparation of materials for the court, the indictment, and the quality of justice

. they are preparing for the fact that they will be heard in national courts, and the international criminal court works according to its own procedure, and there are already the same plus more cases that will be filed and given for consideration by the international criminal court and ah about it is possible to talk to the people who record these testimonies specifically for the international criminal court . and separately, the center for civil liberties deals with this, in particular, lawyers, lawyers oleksandr matviychuk, etc. that is, it is a completely different story, because we go through several corridors, which is a small corridor of the universal which jurisdictions a-a i think the amali-kui fund will be involved in particular and this means that a-a for example vlad her er-e can

hear the case itself on a-a sexual violence and i know that the experts and great-grandchildren of the fund they were and they will go to ukraine and they will select cases related to war crimes, in particular , a focus on sexual crimes, that is, dear ones , girls, boys, men, and women. to the police to the prosecutor's office and i am telling the story not out of disrespect to you, because it is actually evidence of a terrible crime, but if you actually feel these things in yourself, please do it. and i want to say that the state at all levels is trying

to make your testimony easier to think about your safety and in particular the lawyers of the free legal aid system and my organization and i personally will just help you go through this legal path with the least psychological costs thank you larisa thank you it was larisa denysenko human rights defender, writer, lawyer, larisa is engaged in helping women victims of sexual violence in the framework of the work of the association of women lawyers jurfem i thank you larisa thank you to everyone he watched us today, we'll see each other in a few weeks, for now, we say goodbye to you and wish you to be safe.

17-year-old iryna butova disappeared in the border region of luhansk region. to contact ira's mother and she told me the details that can help in the search for her daughter. could to help her daughter, ira butova remained in the frontier with her father and grandmother, she lived in the city with her father-in -law butov in the day of valeevich and

babushkoy khoruzhenko lyubov nikolaevna, and there is no connection with them either , there were very strong battles in the frontier, the city was almost completely destroyed, but despite such terrible conditions, at first there was no contact with the daughter, the mother of the girl says that the last time they spoke by telegram was on march 9. already on the 10th, it was not possible to call ira, although there is information that really inspires hope that the girl is alive. it turns out that after a while at the time, the grandmother who was with her and her father did get in touch a month later. the mother-in-law contacted her sister. i live in kharkov, and literally for two minutes she managed to call and say that she is talking. eh when they shoot a lot we live in the basement with a little bit of connection charged the phone for big money s allows only charge the phone someone has to if he charges he asks

and pays big money here she only called for two minutes and everything and everything else no one nothing sister does not even know his mother-in-law i don't know, i can't contact her, so far this is all the information we have about iryna butova. and the circumstances of her disappearance, but even the smallest details are important in the search, so if you know at least something about iryna butova, please call our hotline 116 000 000 calls from all mobile operators are free, you can apply 24 hours a day and on any day, also write to the chat bot of the child tracing service in telegram and the following story will be somewhat unusual and now i will explain why we cannot show you a photo of a girl about we will not mention her last name. we can only say that her name is anastasia and she is 17 years old and she lived in the city of izyum, kharkiv region. the thing is that her friend, who is now forced to go abroad, is looking for a nation. we talked to her on

skype and she told some details, but at the same time, according to the law, we do not have the right to publish the child's personal data if she is not officially wanted by the police or her immediate relatives have not contacted us, and since, according to nastya's friend, she disappeared together with her relatives, in fact, it is possible to write a statement to the police just to no one. however, katya is a friend of the missing girl, she does not lose hope, it really touches the depths of her soul . very much asks us to show this appeal to nastya if i really hope that you see this message i am very worried about you because it is already the fourth month without you and i am very worried about you and your family and sashka so please just if you if you can talk to me, i'll tell you that you're alive. that

you have food, drinking water, clothes, and a roof over your head. what's going on with you? please just tell me that you're alive and i'll be the happiest since the beginning of the war we have received thousands of reports about missing children, please go to the website of the child search service, here you can view all the information and photos of children who are currently wanted, maybe you will recognize someone and help find them we must understand the truth of the information but samoe the main thing is that the positivity of ukrainians will not be broken ukraine will not be broken and our armed forces prove this from time to time and what needs to be done