always wins very well that a little bit a little bit let’s probably give mr. viktor a-ah and then we will also find out the same to mr. yaroslav and your opinion is so obvious in a slightly different context because actually zelensky here is talking about the reform of the institution and we are aware of the fact that many, including european institutions, must be reformed, i do not rule out that just as after the second world war the league of nations was reformed and the un was created, in the same way, a lot of processes around it concerns the organization. by the way of the european union, you see that they are already ready to create new principles of work because they are already discussing that

it is not necessary to make a consensus decision when all 27 countries make a decision and it can cost one of them hmmm rejection of this or that decision, that is, many countries. i think that there are many institutions that manifested themselves in different ways during the russian-ukrainian or ukraine -russian war, they will be forced to reform , and i think that is too much now, i really apologize er, it demonstrates just that dignity, it seemed like it was lost a year ago, mr. yaroslav. i am sure that you have something to add. we are indeed witnesses of the great

capacity of the european union and the big seven and nato and other democratic international institutions that have now united to help ukraine , if only these are the reforms of these institutions that president zelenskyy had in mind. well, now we will hear from other heads of our ministries and agencies about what reforms we would like to see in these structures, first of all, i would say that ukraine to me now she looks like an applicant who has so far passed the entrance exams to some good european university, let's say there, if now oxford or cambridge, well, we won't take it because this is great britain, it has already ceased to be a member of the european union, let's say she passed the exams to the sorbonne, but you still need to study in this, uh,

paris, so the university needs to take exams , you need to conduct these seven non-reforms and seven packages, what is important, with a preferential quota, well, relatively speaking , they did some heroic deed and we were told ok the score is a bit wrong well, we take it like that, you have to study, you have to take the tests and really become a candidate for a full member of the eu, and by the way, it's not bad that we have such a competitor and allies as moldova, you can check your reforms in this country check at what pace we are going, what are we doing there, if for us there are seven reform packages, then they have done for moldova what have they put forward nine reform packages for georgia 12 and in the meantime they have not even made it a candidate eu member therefore, we have a huge road ahead of us, and we will not talk about that how much time will it take finland, which was

the most prepared to join the european union it took three years for it to become a full member after applying turkey has been a candidate for membership since 1999 and until now well, not much therefore it changes as we do. at what pace and with what help and with what tenacity, because it depends on us first of all. we will take it from the players of the reform. fish - fishermen a a fishing rod so that he can catch this fish, what exactly is the last thing? then i would like to ask, actually two somewhat contradictory things were heard : when ursula von derlianska said that the european union has a plan for the recovery of ukraine, and

president zelensky said that ukraine has a plan for the recovery of ukraine where is he invited to join , hmm, how to interpret it, is it here, is it about one plan, are they talking about one plan, or are they talking about two different ones, or is it a question of who will, relatively speaking, decide how, who, where, and with reforms or without, or did not happen here, this kind of thing happened covertly. so , just as the word reform was used, they say reform, you are now, not us, is it here, or did i interpret it incorrectly because, well, i feel such and such a certain one, you know, this one, vivi- from the echo you know, teach to live, help financially. the fact is that there is really a struggle here for who will distribute the funds. we understand very well that the people who will give the funds will claim to control and possibly give some advice as

it is better to use them, it is clear that the ukrainian authorities want them to be the receiver of these funds and the party that will distribute these funds. i think that they will not allow this to be done in the country because there is really a big myth about our corruption and even if we admit that we have much less of it than in some countries of the european union. it is this myth that will not allow us to hand over all management of the reconstruction of ukraine to the hands of the ukrainian authorities. i think that some kind of consortium will be created anyway. some other site, it is absolutely not obvious that it could be luhan, by the way, luhano is

such a town that loves very much, well, how can i say the wife of vladimir putin kabayev, she says that she even lived there even during the war. and i think that there will be a lot of such platforms where the principles of providing funds will be discussed, but where exactly decisions will be made about which ones to distribute, what to distribute them to, and in which directions they should be directed. i think that it could really be ukraine, but under a watchful eye. which donors they will give us these funds, i'm going to go very briefly, but yaroslav, please react in the same way, well, it must be the agreement of both parties, because the european union cannot, for example, impose such conditions on us that cannot be the same for ukraine

ukraine, for its part, knows better its resources, the capabilities of its specialists, and, meanwhile, its priorities, and you can see now, before the beginning of the conference, there was a statement by representatives of civil society, and it was very clearly stated on what basis it should be this reconstruction is there must be economic freedom, there will be macro-financial stabilization, there must be economic democracy, there must be absolutely transparent schemes and the involvement of society, not only specialists who think they know better because they, for example, belong to a pro-government party. therefore, it will be joint work, as it has always been relations the consent of both parties is required. that's what i'm counting on. yaroslav. thank you. i explained voitko

, a diplomat and an international expert. shlinchak, head of the board of the institute of world politics. thank you. they talked about er, about themselves, about the conference in lugano, a little about the creative situation , and more. and the voice that joins us has not been there for a long time , the homeland oh my god, i should have said it, yes, i apologize, it has not been there for a very long time. but you see what a and this association remains, and the fat is where. well, yulia tymoshenko is still present in the faction, it is determined motherland and all your heroes yes, yes, i think we will continue the topic that was discussed, continue discussing, let's once again return to the topic of corruption. i already said about it today that it would be a really nice gesture if

this whole not bad, cool speech, a wonderful speech of president zelenskyi also ended well, by the way, we are not just a large delegation. and in this delegation, we also have, for example, a new leader, mr. klimenko, and here he is, mr. klymenko, come on stage. applause him, what is stopping you from finally doing something like this it seems to me that it would be a good demonstration not only of intentions but also of actions already in the direction of fighting corruption in order to dispel these common myths about the fact that money cannot be given in ukraine without control because they will steal it and first distribute it between their own and so on. well, we know how it goes, let's start with you, mr. yaroslav, then you are a very relevant topic. well, today the voice faction actually turned to the president and the faction of the majority of the people's servants with a call to speed up the appointment procedure the head of the specialized anti-corruption

prosecutor's office and finally start a competition for the selection of a full-fledged director of the national anti-corruption bureau because you already know it, as they say, the pause was extremely long, what can be done within five minutes, the competition has been held, the winner is known to everyone, the only thing that is not the commission for the selection of the head of the specialized anti-corruption prosecutor’s office did it, it didn’t announce the winner who had already won the battle and the like, and why isn’t this done unfortunately, because purely personal, let's say some ambitions of fear, we are few people know that detective klymenko , who won the competition, is known for having opened a criminal case on the alleged involvement in corruption of mr. tatarov, the deputy

head of the president's office. it is because of this, well, if today the president was not able to really demonstrate what the ukrainian parliament demonstrated that a demonstrated ukrainian society - this is the change of aspirations because, of course, primarily for the sake of the integration of the european union so that in ukraine, which pays a very high price every day at the front, social standards and economic standards have risen to the level of the european union itself, and the fact that there are enough professionals in ukraine who can provide such a level if corruption is eliminated as a phenomenon, well, it is no secret that the situation is similar in principle with the competition the head of the national anti-corruption bureau was appointed by a commission of the cabinet of ministers, but since the cabinet of ministers went beyond the scope of its powers and decided that one of the members of the commission

in addition, he is a member of the commission for the selection of the head of the specialized anti-corruption prosecutor's office. there are actually many such illegal actions, for example, in the energy sector or in the housing sector. because, in principle, they simply do not want to live according to the laws , they do not want to establish such rules that will , in principle, be useful for everything, but go beyond the limits of their powers create some additional obstacles, which we then solemnly and tediously overcome, but here there is no other way out by the end of the year, we have to finish the competition for the head of the specialized anti-corruption agency, we have to start and finish the competition for the head of the national anti-corruption bureau - this is quite realistic

to do and war there is no obstacle here. and unless it can be used by individual representatives of the government, i am simply trying to do something instead of doing it, we will do it anyway and we can do it now without gaining shame or pulling pulling pulling pulling in the final version anyway, but as it often happens with the ukrainian authorities, gaining criticism of shame and the like so i will add that the appointment of the heads of sapinab and this is a requirement of the european union, without which we will not be able to start the process of joining the eu and we often talk about the anti-corruption component of this process, about decentralization, and about the cleansing of power, but the same is true of kucherenko's polls, about the economy and energy, how far are we? from the european union in this field, we are big, very big,

i will tell you frankly, and i well, first of all, my colleague and i can fully support, you know, a few days ago, in the hall of the verkhovna rada, there was such a split, uh, because our president was speaking, excellent speech 20 times, the monocoalition stood up there, the european union, the fight against corruption, european standards, fast, very fast , 115 days. where fonderlyan is the president of the european union, she spoke about the problem of corruption as one of the main factors, if i'm not mistaken, three or four times in her speech. you understand, because at every summit in one way or another it is heard. and here i am

just, well, some kind of split listening to the speeches of our politicians. everything is fine with us. i will remind you of the quote ukraine is in first place in the world in terms of the number of anti-corruption institutions. excuse me, with all due respect to our president, well, this is some kind of kindergarten. well, institutions can be created as much as we want. country, believe me, it was 30 years ago 20 years ago 10 years ago 5 and now the same is the first person in the country who, for the sake of his dominance in the political space, all security e-e heads of law enforcement structures receive such

the secret command is everything. and the law is for enemies, opponents, opponents - it was in force 2,000 years ago. you understand this principle 1,000 years ago, and in ukraine it is simply flourishing, and we, in the superficial council, today see how many blatant facts of corruption precisely among the private coalition of officials and deputies, who are essentially nothing end, you understand. and now there are absolutely objective, enormous difficulties about energy, but i want to say right away that i do not want to scare ukrainians because the main problem is not in the energy complex, it is definitely the threat of troops is military. you understand that missile attacks are another tercilit to expect definitely. unfortunately, missile strikes and so on our

infrastructure facilities are the first factor. the scenario is absolutely real, and here we have an unconditional air defense system and a system for the protection of our infrastructure facilities - this is generation - this is our station, this is coal mining, this is another object, it is unconditional, and if there is zero pressure, that is, no there will be transit at all the most important thing here is how much gas will be stored in the storages, how will our outstanding mining companies, both state and private, work to provide us with gas and coal. i want to say once again that there are vocal risks. i understand. but the main thing that we are not worried about is corruption, first of all, for me. well, this is you. well, the untruth regarding the fight against corruption in the polygo is that we have such a hyper-monopolist

nak naftogaz. first of all, we have others monopoly but for today it is a monster that in fact today is just crumbling at the very top and think about it for a second today we are blackmailing everyone naftogaz and the leaders of the obitrenka blackmailing the government and the president give me uah 264 billion from the budget - that's a quarter of the budget understand the budget member and me or if you don't give me, then you can be left without gas and heat. this is absolutely. i believe that this is a state crime. a sufficient expert professional audit of the situation with gas production will finally look at the gas balance to understand that we have enough gas from our own production. to understand what this blackmail is. today, it is obvious that one question arises. it also helps the shop window to blackmail you and our partners

. i see here because there are huge risks, this is for me a sample of the difference between slogans and dilenes, it is written here that we can not now know the word vitrenko, but we have completely given your opinion, there are still other questions, i will allow myself to note that there is quite a contradiction the thing is that they will actually be compensated in the same place, how many billions of debt are there, which companies are owned by the oligarchs , and that is, they will be compensated correctly, again, these are the debts that will be gassed today, owned by naftogaz, and you really influenced them because it's teplokomunenergo's debts and it's the debts of the state operator. it's really 76 billion debts that need to be paid off. i'm the only

one who will answer the question. and who will answer for this struggle ? i wrote, you can hear me nodding my head, mr. yaroslav , so let me someone, i will name the members of the verkhovna rada, the specific names and institutions responsible for these 76 billion debts, which will be the next to be written off from the budget and here are the answers to the main question and let there be five window displays, do you understand five children or 10 uh, these people don't even need to do anything to them. you just temporarily take a ticket for a train and forcibly take them abroad to the european union. that all of them under criminal cases, ok, mr. oleksiy, i'm just talking about something else. if you ask, it's very good. valery pekar wrote, talking about the reconstruction itself, to the father that there are certain very controversial things, so, first of all, president zelenskyy talks about his

plan in words, the fund holds, he talks about his plan, but the question is that here it is necessary to rebuild on the one hand, and on the other hand, conventionally speaking, to modernize, how to combine it all together so that in our country it is not reconstruction reconstruction, that is, we have come to war to war with a country that is almost the worst reformed in the region, which has very big problems, the infrastructure there is outdated and so on and so on and so when we talk about reconstruction , maybe we need them to rebuild and rather modernize the country on the other hand, in order to modernize it, we need people who know how to do this and give them authority, i don’t know from abroad how to invite or find those people who are here and gather a team of good professionals, but are they all personal like mr. tatarov, for example , we are personally friends with zelenskyi, yes, yes

that everything coincides, all the stars and friends are competent and ulya and lyalya and the pala, let's master the money, this seems to me to be a million-dollar question, how can we understand your thoughts here, mr. yaroslav, for 500 trillion, oh 500 billion, more precisely, the question is already 750, soon it will be a trillion, and you are quite hello. here it is very important not to confuse the concept we do not have the right to rebuild, we cannot rebuild the post-soviet ukraine with an inefficient system of government with corruption schemes on the roads with censorship in the media. that is, we have unequivocally to modernize and develop, and are there enough professionals in ukraine for this, more than enough , in fact, here the question is whether the

president’s team is ready to give way, we usually allow only our own, and in fact, to attract professionals regardless of their political affiliation or affiliation with some business spheres and the like is simply really necessary, and a team of professionals who know what to do, how to do it, and so on, from the side of the europeans, the most logical thing would be to provide funds, but under the condition of clear mechanisms of control. well , naftogaz can't, on the one hand, let's say, demand huge sums of money, and at the same time carry out procurement and purchase armored vehicles not for the needs of the front, as it would be liked, but for its own needs, at the same time at a time when

, in fact, the budget is forced, that is, the financial situation in the country is not so complicated that the most important things are distinguished in principle, but the state company, whatever it calls itself there, it is still state-owned, but it prioritizes to save funds and invest in what is most critically needed, that is, the main function is to provide the population with energy, and i, well, in fact, things that are not critical for its activity, therefore, on the part of the europeans, effective control mechanisms are needed, that is, and it is not only on the part of the european on the part of our international partners, it is a tactic of our government, give us money because we have a war and do not look at how we will use it, it will definitely not pass from the other side. i would like to say that in reality, not everything is in ukraine as bad as we are used to saying, and in comparison with

our neighbors, it is even with countries that at one time, such as poland, bulgaria, romania, started their european path. ukraine is sufficiently integrated into european markets . the same, for example, the third energy package, but at the same time we try as much as possible, let's say yes, and creatively approach there to take what we want and not take what we don't want. i mean from the side of the government and so many directions therefore, does ukraine have enough human assets and potential? working in various fields, i know such people. i have seen the question of the authorities’ willingness to involve them. there we have good examples, for example , in the field of digital democracy. when professionals were involved, they became part of the team.

and now, in principle, they show good results in different areas. another issue is that people often these professionals are not in the closest circle of the president and i clearly do not have the same influence as the pva , and the second is from our partners - they are effective mechanisms of control over the resources they provide, and again, ukraine is most interested in offering such mechanisms so that the united states of great britain and the european union country can explain to their taxpayers or for the funds from their taxpayers and what they are going to. where are these funds going? i doubt that a british person, an american, a frenchman, a bulgarian, anyone is interested in restoring the destroyed roads in ukraine, they are much more interested in ukraine being connected to the west by these roads, the western world becoming part of the developed

to the world, yes, actually, let's pass it on to oleksiy, we still have three minutes, yes, two, two and a half, then pass the word to radio svoboda , so the question is, how will these projects be implemented? i'll tell you frankly, i was included , i quickly say i was included in some working group of prime minister energy for the development of these projects, i accepted, looked there for 10 minutes online at the level of experts. by the way, 2,500 experts were involved, you understand that this is about absolutely nothing. no, it cannot be at all. never in the stomach 2,500 experts well, this is a delusion, it’s just a delusion, it’s just to show off, because such programs should be worked on by very experienced people, and their number is limited in general, so that there is a ready product that will be accepted by western financiers. let's

measure with yaroslav hristov, for example, a 4-kilogram book was published a year ago the president of the united states of america and somewhere someone somewhere there where did such a thing come from, what points does it weigh 300 billion dollars i am a precise person, a deputy, i made a request to the president's office, what kind of program is it, where can you watch it? they answered, they say, we don't have it, we don't have such a document, you understand , no, it's not included. in memory, you understand , it's institutional, so we'll live and see . vadym said correctly, a colleague that there will be dozens of such lugana. but we have to understand. well, let's be frank, we're not going to dictate, you understand , please, maybe it can be for the better, oleksiy. thank you , i advise him very much in this situation. you need less

the main thing is that today the president has 10 seconds of mp oleksandr kucherenko, yaroslav yurchyshyn, and there are characters who have not been in ukraine for four months. he says to come back. thank you very much, dear deputies, for participating in the program . then a word to our colleague from radio svoboda, the armed forces of ukraine have left lysychansk, which means the full occupation of luhansk region , explosions in russian belgorod and kursk