really help those released from captivity, then her conversation with andriy degtyarenko, you can talk to them , tell him about the rules of law, but who cares about these rules of law? well, in essence, russia itself and you, it is a country that violates all the norms of international law and is similar to russia we really believe only in the armed forces of ukraine, question i want to ask you from the very beginning about the history of the public organization blue bird , because this story is quite dramatic and let the audience learn about it, please, i am from luhansk after the event on the maidan, i returned to luhansk. luhansk was just when the first attempts at occupation began, which then led to the

subsequent occupation of the city. i understood that there is a need for people to understand what to do when their loved ones are captured. it occurred to you that people after captivity have a need to get some kind of support in moving to new cities, legal support, psychological support. in fact, i was inside this problem and all these questions. i felt at first that i had them, and i really wanted to help others, well, with my example. you felt then that luga was certainly a prisoner. this is a loss of control and a loss

of control not only over the events of your life, but over your life in general. well, when you don't even have a choice to live or die, and well, it's hard. it's hard to feel that everything depends on other people. in fact, somehow it was so good. and you moved to kyiv and had this idea to create a public organization. what did you do, to be honest, it wasn’t even any where, it was rather a flow, well, that is, there was no idea of ​​creating a public organization, rather, it was because of my experience, because of my active attitude towards me people simply applied, and at some point, well, relatives of prisoners, people who survived captivity, and since at that time, well, in fact, there was no unified center under the sbu, which will be created only in september 2014, and hmm, in essence, russian

the aggression began in april 14th. yes, that is, six months. yes, when people were taken prisoner, when people were tortured, but there was no state mechanism, no appeals, no rehabilitation, therefore, in fact, there was simply nowhere to turn to, and people called wherever they could, yes, that is, there was a lot well, at that moment, it wasn't even a public organization. it was rather a reaction to the fact that there was a huge problem. there were already hundreds of people at that moment, and we were the ones who put out the fires at first. and when it became clear that it was a hundred people then there was a need to create a migration firefighting system, to create some kind of team yes, which will already work and within the framework of, er, somehow advocating these processes of creating rehabilitation, the process of

creating a-a legislation, a rule-making base at the state level, and also providing support to people well, but how team and not how it was at the beginning such volunteer initiatives, but in fact it has been in existence for 8 years. this organization has been in existence for 8 years, unfortunately, ukrainians continue to be captured and held against their will, and the situation with exchanges with the it is developing, constantly changing, you can name the main differences in how the release from captivity as a matter of rehabilitation of former prisoners was decided at the beginning of the armed aggression . of the mechanism before the creation of a unified center, the situation was a little terrible because then there were, um,

individual negotiators, some of them were decent, some not so well. well, you know how much we know about some of them that they were definitely dishonest. there were cases when they took money from people and did not release people. that is, it was a situation of chaos , in fact, if relatives, e.e., before september 14, applied somewhere for release, it did not guarantee anything at all, whether they paid money or not, it did not even guarantee that about they will not be forgotten since september 14, when the joint center of e-e was created on the basis of the security service of ukraine . people applied to the united center, it is not a photo of such a person that tomorrow they will forget about this person. in other words, it will not be lost in any case, yes, it already meant that, in principle, this application will be taken into account and the

state will talk about the person in order to change him... now if you know honestly, you would like to tell me that i fully understand as of now, but i do not understand, that is, despite the fact that we communicate with various participants and negotiators of the process, including despite the fact that i still have no doubts about the effectiveness of the work of the united center and they as were, uh, directly, this is a working tool that prepares the exchange, and they are, but to say, for example, is the negotiation process now as before, we knew, well, which negotiators, who goes to minsk today, in the conditions of martial law, this and the process is not open for everyone and constantly there are certain changes that are not what you know. i don't know how to react. i don't

understand whether it's important to react to them at all, because in principle, it seems important to me that the center that knows how to work and prepares exchanges, how did he work in the 14th year, uh, that’s how he works now, but i know for sure about anya’s personality, unfortunately, from my own experience . captive during these eight years and during the next great aggravation, they were captured again and ended up in the occupied territory, and i know that you are exactly the person who can tell you how to act correctly if your relatives, friends, and acquaintances were captured in the first place generally necessary contact the national information bureau - this is 1648 and the joint center with the coordination of search and release at the sbu, this is the main contact a-a moreover, you can contact even the purchased

territories e-e of the joint center there are viber telegram whatsapp phones, they are from a questionnaire that can be sent them or by messengers or by mail. that is, it is not essential. if there is an opportunity, it is preferable to contact the police here. well, here is such a nuance that the police in general until march of this year was a mandatory step, you had to write a statement that a person disappeared, it was necessary to write a statement even when a person was captured in order to be included in the lists for exchange, and from the 18th year, the beginning of the 17th year, until march of this year, the 22nd. first, it was necessary to file a statement with the police, get an extract from the single register for a certain time that is, it could last until the month and only then, er, the person was already added to the lists by the united center. to date, since march of this year, the police have been made an optional

step, this is not because they are not needed in this process, but because ukraine was eh tasks of survival and use the maximum resources for the defense of the country and, accordingly, the police was sufficiently loaded and working with subversive groups and the protection of the country , because they would still understand what the load would be with prisoners, to load it with this issue. well, i suspect so, i would do the procedure and the main thing to be it would be a long enough step to wait for this entry of the case into the unified register by protocol, it could be a month ago. in fact, it was done as an optional step. i think for a limited time, and as far as i know, today even in the united center still advises people to report to the police, that is, it is worth reporting to the police. there are certain nuances that people may encounter

when they need to contact the police in the future. well, for example, if your relatives call you from the occupied territories, that is it is necessary to submit information directly to the investigative body, which, at least, have opportunities yes, there are legal opportunities according to the law, yes, there are certain investigative actions to find out where the call will come from, such and other , directly, the united center itself is not an investigator body, i.e. they are not being investigated, that is why it is necessary to contact the police in order to report additional information about which investigative actions may be carried out. and no, i know that over time, again, the profile of your organization has changed a little. you are now focusing on psychological support for those who were captured. i understand that the relatives of those people who cannot now be reunited with their own friends, parents, brothers, sisters who are currently

fighting in captivity, well, for the most part, we have psychological and legal support, because here it is very it is very difficult to separate these concepts to provide psychological support to people after captivity if they have a lot of unresolved legal issues because they have unknown documents, they cannot apply for certain compensations from the state and well, it is clear that we actually have such a complex psychological support legal and, if necessary , socially, that is, medicines, but at least what we can definitely note is that in comparison with the 14th year, when people were not provided with any kind of medical care after captivity yes b in principle, no help was given to us, and there were cases of people with open fractures without documents , in which we simply had them. well, we figured out how to provide them with this help in general. in 17th year, at least

the first medical examination and the first emergency medical care were taken over by the state through a professional exchange . or here, too, i clarify that fortunately there are people who are fired and not because of exchanges but unfortunately, they are still very chaotic, sometimes they receive medical assistance from the state, sometimes they do not. of the situations in which ukrainians find themselves in the occupied territories, the so-called filtering camps of people were added this year before they were given free travel outside the territory and occupied territories of the russian federation, they are checked and received for a very long time there, people turned to you after the filtering camps, maybe you also have some advice for them how should you introduce yourself, and what kind of help can they receive, in fact, if people were

detained, if people could not leave the territory, then in fact they should also apply to aid for polonyny, that is, well, in fact, it was received as hostages, because there cannot be filtration camps in the territory of ukraine, so it is desirable that these people give evidence to the prosecutor's office of ukraine, ah, because, to date, a mechanism for submitting to international courts has been created and this is an international criminal, this is a war crime, therefore, first of all, from a patriotic point of view, it is desirable to give evidence to ukrainian law enforcement agencies. well, secondly, people can be presented in the same way as prisoners, that is, after giving such evidence, they can in the future, it should be applied to the commission for the application of those integrations, or well, we expect that

from october it seems that the law on prisoners will no longer work. well, here our lawyers can tell us more about it, but as far as i remember, we are waiting for sometime in october the fact that he has a calm appeal to international organizations. and it seems to me now that it is already a fact that in ukraine there is a real crisis of confidence in many international organizations that worked in ukraine. does it make sense to talk about the number of crimes? now it seems to us that this information is very in many ways. what is the point? why do this? i completely separate somewhere from the other side and working for 8 years. i understand that the representatives of the international committee of the red cross are monitored by the monitor monitoring zion and are also threatened in the

occupied territories. they were present there - these are people, unfortunately, not superheroes well, unfortunately, they are just people, people actually very often behave like superheroes, but the story about which you also know that for example, representatives of the osce, the osce, who worked in the occupied territories, they they turned the mission over and the people who worked there are now arriving in captivity and i am not sure what the organization is doing to get them out of there. i don't know anything about it. unfortunately, i don't know. although i know people in ukraine who are engaged in this, the organization, as far as i know, applies to various institutions, including the un commissioner, the osce organization itself for all its employees. the question is who can do what, well, that is, and here is the question

. this guy who is to blame for these rules of law? well, in essence, russia behaves like this. and it is really a democratic world, all these institutions, they are not working very well now, because we are dealing with such a scumbag . this is a country that violates all the norms of international humanitarian law, that openly threatens nuclear mines there. well, that is, in fact, on the one hand, it seems that there is no point in appealing, but here the question is what kind of world do we want to be in and what kind of world do we want to live in and transform into? same gopnik, exactly as you mean, and on the one hand , price institutions really do not work now. the question is what kind of world will we build in which they will

still try to resuscitate them and still believe that someday, yes, similar to russia, it will not work , similar to russia, we really believe only the armed forces of ukraine, but i have no doubts that sooner or later we will win and then i still want to return to those agreements of these international foundations that were well for me it would be important for me as well as important what he had on today ukraine collects crimes, they are simply a huge number of war crimes, but you and i collect them after the second world war, there were a huge number of war crimes and they were collected for ten years, and we need to talk about them and we need to hold these trials for centuries because otherwise, what else in general, we should return to the people after all this, after the victory, do you want to return to your native luhansk or not? i don't know

why, on the one hand, to this day, despite 8 years, i'm still a luhansk woman, i'm enough in principle, i do not get a residence permit, my identity is important to me, on the other hand, i am very tired of vinnytsia, very tired, i really want to after the victory , after we rebuild certain rehabilitation institutions there, we will do it. i want to go to the forest to the river and i want not to be afraid to step on nina because it will be important for me to come to luhansk, that's for sure , it wasn't a farewell, i don't even pack my things, there are children's books left there,

some kind of work there that was done. my child is important to me to come, it's important for me to feel and rather i will not stay there, but it will be important for me to come and make a decision, that is, whether to stay or leave. well, thank you very much for the interview. thank you, and i am sure that you and i will have such an opportunity . ugh, look at the project to find my kateryna osadchoi from the search for the missing that monday at 21:30 during the spring of the peoples of ukraine for the first time used the colors of the principality of galicia-volyn during the time of the ukrainian people's republic this flag is gaining national significance today yellow-blue has become a symbol of freedom for

the whole world from small steps big things begin matters, the next step is two states - it's us to divorce, it is known, they drink in unpopulated areas in broad daylight, they spy on the holy ukrainian land with deadly iron mines. but instead of fear and despair, they will see only their own death in our eyes. hell, and my comrades from the state emergency service, rescuers, fire fighters , pyrotechnics, day and night, will help demining, dismantle rubble, bring cities and towns back to life, regardless of shelling or tiredness and gloom will die, we will win and fast in the middle of the free world. new, prosperous, happy and

invincible ukraine, we are warriors, deledars, not liars, and our cause is righteous, holy, because who is for what? character hardened in the sacred fire this is my story cool sweat and hot tears about a heart that remains alive a soul that was born a free story of my earth where a new destiny of an unbreakable

country is forged metal in my hands and in the bodies of my enemies in voices that promise us victory, together we make this world stronger, ukrainians, a nation of steel men , we prevail, we will pass, we will win together, we are strong, well, today he wanted to do programming, he did it. at first, he wanted to be a ballant there, yes, there was jurassic park, he liked it very much, he read books there, collected there are all kinds of dinosaur figurines and i knew their names there, then when i grew up there, this lyceum was magnificent, a very nice lyceum, i really liked everything. it had very good teachers, they were really good there, yes, that is, they were for him we were very busy. well, we were at home, that is, on the 24th. yes, i was

at home with my wife and my son. then, if people started driving. yes, we saw that there were traffic jams. we did nothing when we saw that our traffic jams were sleeping . i also visited my parents in kyiv , a village where my parents were cooks, this is vyshgorod's ivankiv district, the woman took her son and she drove them away very calmly, then there were no problems there and she returned. well, it was hoped that the village would not be needed by anyone there, but it is -e on the bank this is a river teterev and teteriv from that side, far from

kyiv and not far from the belarusian border and the border, that's how the village was, well, how the front turned out. well, they were hiding in their basements. well, on the 28th, they called maryna, she was a doctor, an anesthesiologist, worked in i don't know who called us, marina already called. what was there in the blue that wounded us with a shrapnel, uh, well, they said the details, but we got together quickly, and at first i thought of going with one car, then we decided that we need two. marina said that you are going with us, we drove to okhmatdit, that was on the morning of the 28th, they took her and gave her a bag there for first aid, and we left. of course, they didn't stop there, they checked, but maryna had

a document that she explained to the doctor. where are we going? he was still alive when we left, but in borodyanka she called that he had died. maybe if she had cooked there earlier, we got to the bridge, we left the cars on the bridge, there were russian armored personnel carriers standing in the corner there, they found a good place, moved on, undressed, moved on, came home, well, they cried there, the woman says i don't want to bury him here, let's collect him, took the clam shell licked i, tatyana's father, marina, took him to the cabin and took him to the river. they took him to the river with

his mother. they took such an inflatable boat. mother took him and brought him. they tied a rope from one side to the other. father crossed over. in the opposite direction, my son was put in tatiana's car because it was a little bigger, and we had to drive through the forest again because the roads were closed and when we were driving through the forest, she saw something like that. she is quietly praying something there. well, i understand that it's scary and well, i think we need to somehow distract her and talk to her, and i say there's a tiger. i'm sorry, marina is sincere, we knew that he would die there, that's why, of course , they wouldn't have taken you there. and she tells me, listen, what kind of doctor would i be if i couldn't be mine?

not even to help myshaev kozintsi khmilna mykolaivka and then buzova well, they left for buzova so they turned well and we see tanks standing with these letters well they stopped i opened the window unbuckled and stuck out my hand i wanted to go out to talk well marina says that they are shooting i didn't even hear at first well there was a single shot we want them, they started to search there. well, i

immediately saw that marina was turned back. i look, she is no longer moving and the blood of malice is flowing from her head, and my second thought was that i think there are articles behind us . there they ran away like that leave leave well here they will see the sky, i don't know, they started beating again i sped up there and there jumped over this barrier there there such a tall tall this shaft eh of this road surface they lay down there shoot then they crawl like that they shoot again well they crawl there they shoot i lie down they don’t shoot they crawl there well they crawl i don’t know how many meters there 50 we can run away there was some building behind it i hid i called the woman she

picked up the phone there she was hysterical of course the shot was fired at that place e- e where the car turns around, marina was killed by a sniper's bullet . vitaliy ran away with the car and penance, and tanya was driving behind. she engaged the reverse gear and drove. as much as she could, they also shot through the windshield, they shot at the roof, well, they did not hit her, the radiator was beaten and vitaliy got to her through the bushes, he had a lot of wounds, the windshield was all cut and beaten, and a sniper shot at him and fired from a machine gun, but they did not hit, and these bushes saved him, and he got there to tanya, so it was not the first time he saw the turn and went to the forest is quite a strong woman, she

says, well, i knew that i had to bury her, so i drove her, she drives very well, and she reverses and jumped back there, when we got there, i realized then that i have a permanent knee, well , the biggest wound was the knee, but miraculously, not the bone hit and here their car had already stopped , it boiled and when he saw that we were standing and we came out of the forest from here and he ran, let's run to us with an eggplant, his blood was flowing all over he was wounded and there were splinters in it well, we drove into the forest, there was no one , nothing, everything krum is busy because they are going where to go what to do the car stopped you understand there sister became dead here in