it is, that is, they actually started it and we understand it very well, but in the end they wanted a new molotov-ribbentrop pact, the german chancellor told us directly that putin wants to draw a line with a pencil in europe to divide this is mine and this is conditionally yours and that's how we'll live. and it doesn't work either, well, we've never agreed with the people, history is already in the 21st century, not even in the 20th , although russia lives at most in the 20th. we perfectly understand what ideology is based on this empire was built not before the empire, which did not take place and there are no other options, but what they say is that nato guarantees are not guarantees, but for us, yes, and for the world, they are

actually leading a war against us, not this one. the whole logic is already in the west, so uh, it doesn’t come before, at first, the west was very worried, very often afraid, projected for the future, and now it understands us , it should really understand the value of this regime, they really understand the value of the armed forces, they understand that there are such people as ukrainians and that things played an important role. if you want a role in changing the position of the west, if there are ukrainians who are ready to fight for themselves, for their homeland, for their values, for their families, for their way of life, for the further path to europe. well, why can't the west look at us like a mirror in hdrez? and not to understand that the west must stop making another

compromise with russia for the sake of a compromise, and another compromise can be destructive for the west itself. that's why these are actually medvedev's interviews. i know for sure that they don't visit medvedev in the west. they asked and this is another preparation, we understand very well, voice it again, voice it out that they are ready for negotiations, they really, really want to conduct these negotiations, they go out there to the west through various secret channels . i know, but a large part of the russian elite understood that it will not be possible to win against ukraine, a loss means the destruction of the russian regime, a win is really theoretical, the same means destruction, since capturing more territory that it will not be possible to get tens of millions of ukrainians

who will fight to the end, this means a loss, and the russian regime, which started this war, realized that it is in a situation and there is money here, a loss, and they will seek to secure some new agreement with the west somewhere the status quo and therefore medvedev's interview - this is another passive event of the west, and the west is not afraid and responds today. in the european union, there will finally be a simplification of the visa regime and all christians will be filtered, not banned yet, but filtered , that is, there will be a clear filtering of who to give to whom not to give how much to consider the application yes, as much as we want

, as much as we are considering the documents, replenishing all of you, we are monitoring you in the european union, it already sounds more serious therefore, in fact, no one in moscow will be able to scare the west, and the fact that medvedev was involved in it and putin did not do it well, in fact and he really says, i don’t know if this is a function zhirynovsky, but this is definitely not the function of the one who makes the decisions of today's moscow , mr. pavlo, you mentioned this informal meeting of the ministers of foreign affairs of the european union, which is to be held in prague, and about the restriction of visas or the suspension of the agreement on the simplified visa regime with russia, a part of the countries of the european union categorically insists on this, it is the baltic countries , the scandinavian countries and poland, including but not

all the same, there are countries that say well, no, it is not necessary . yes, with the russians. we must somehow, er, with them in a humane way because it is impossible to bite everyone under the same comb, what do you think? will this temporary restriction or suspension of the agreement or the selective granting of these temporary visas for russians tourist visas affect the internal situation in russia or will it make them think about the what is the result of russia's war in ukraine, it will have no effect, it will have an effect on a narrow stratum, where even now there are fewer and fewer buses, once there were four or so millions, now there are hundreds of thousands, those who drive are mainly people who earn in russian

regime, the world snakes bypassed the photo in helsinki sweat, where is the bentley, what else do they have there, i don't even remember, porsche well, it 's difficult to explain something to these people, although it's clear to hit them it is possible and worth it, the european union has its own logic, and this logic is also right, they say. well, let's start to strictly filter who we want, and this is now a responsibility and a challenge for national security, but that's where all these earphones came, well, let's sort of look at they bathed the cathedral, but in fact, what to poison the violinist and yes, by all by all, the hairstyle is clear. but at the same time, the european union is also a good start to the discussion about the future of russia, after the regime of russia,

after putin's russia, although it is not the same thing, and of course after the regime and after putin, let's do it by name, let's say again that they want to work with the russians, well, they say that and if there is a future for russia, who will we work with there now on the territory of russia? ago in fact, the european union thinks that someone should be let in, and someone is running all the versions, and thank god , since they are beating, i understand who it is in the main, but it will not be so easy to control them all, and tomorrow the european union will still have to accept. yes, he is too weak, he is late. everything is absolutely clear. but nevertheless, the progress is that the european union maintains

its e-e solidarity, and on the eve of the cold there, on the eve of autumn, and putin so hoped that he would rattle all the topics that there will be no gas and the european union adopts new sanctions, therefore, in fact, this a good opportunity to show that we are not afraid and left and went somewhere further away, therefore the story is actually positive so it is not enough yes, again, we would like to have it earlier but nevertheless it is positive and we have to push it further by the way, about the sanctions and the fact that they absolutely to sneeze at the sanctions, dmitry medvedev said again, forgive me for apologizing to you. there is so much medvedev in our conversation, but since he took on the role of zhirynovsky, we in ukraine quite often underestimated what

zhirynovsky said. i remember he came 15 years ago to kyiv i was at his press conference, he was simply unsurpassed as a master of the conversational genre, he could well have performed somewhere in stand-up because, well, what he said was funny, but then when certain periods and certain situations were no longer funny it was actually like that, here is what medvedev says about sanctions and what to spit on these sanctions, we will hear the position of president putin and we are their comrades, we are citizens of russia, we serve russia . what are we doing in ukraine, this right? yes, it is because they feel their impunity, that what

they do is impunity, or are they trying to demonstrate in some way that what they are doing is, well, do something else to us, and we will be there even more er kill ukrainians and in general we will turn the east and south of ukraine into ruins and what else? well, if you can somehow explain what he wants to say by this, that they don't care about sanctions, well, this is a standard position inside russia for someone uh it is standard for someone it goes inside we are cool here on the island of russia in the middle of the civilized world, it's interesting what medvedev, who was

the president, says, even to putin, he says we serve, and right there, we serve, which means that their russia is equal to putin, that is, we serve putin, that's all how did the middle ages serve and how did people serve, how do they serve, that's all you need to know about the mentality, the mentality of today's russia, and the sanctions, someone expected that the western sanctions would work harder on russia, i expected that they would work, but certain the time is mostly medium-term, because in russia they have turned on the handle of capital control, and in particular the central bank is strictly controlling capital flows, it seems that formally balanced the macroeconomics, but in fact we also understand what is happening, they

are trying to do different things there so-called parallel imports , but hmm, you can of course play with the economy , you can play with the military potential, what are they doing, but technologically, they will go into the 20th century. well, what can they do, actually? nothing, the future is technology and the urban people are running after russia, not all of them, but a large part of them are running , uh, technologies, but uh, putin said, let's develop our own. well, what can russia do with the potential of 100 or something million people, and the number of people there is decreasing, and now they are dragging our citizens and, most importantly, our children, you know how, in ancient times , some nomadic hordes came there and captured women and children, and they do the same thing. what is the difference with the horde, and their mentality

has remained post-tradent, and they do everything like this that's all, and the case that went around our social networks when one of the russian militants is holding there or rp says that it's like zazovstali, it's a shard, it's all about the mentality, it's not the west, the east, it's a total horde, and as it should be considered, and the sanctions they all the same, they will sharpen like scumbags. no one will stop them. nothing will really work for them . all logic will not work. they will return to the middle ages in mentality, they will return in the state system, they will return gradually. well, not to the middle ages, but to the last century and in the sense technologies, and therefore i am absolutely sure that this is nowhere empire that did not have a chance and in general there is no right to

exist in the xxi century. by the way, you mentioned this story with a stand-up so-called stand-up. ukraine has already appealed to the united nations through a video with what appears to be the remains of a defender of azovstal because it is not completely clear whether this is a true story or not, but what they did on this stand-up with the skull, which was in the hands of the russian mercenary igor mangushev, this igor mangushev is the founder of a private e-e military company in the footage that was previously circulated on social networks, he claimed that this skull is the remains of a killed ukrainian army and stated that russia is waging a war with the idea of ​​ukraine

. to other anti-ukrainian people. today he said that ukraine should be ukrainized, all those who consider themselves ukrainians will be destroyed, and in the general context of the future of the court, i understand that russia has not given up on this, they they are building cages, they are creating these cages in mariupol, the philharmonic orchestra, they want to hold a show trial against the azovstal fighters in russia, azov is already recognized as a terrorist organization, this court is my understanding, will the so-called trial be conducted by the panel of some court of the so-called dpr, well , that is, they will be completely it is illegal to carry out this scene, a demonstration scene, the condemnation of the fighters of azov, how can ukraine

react in this situation? who can ukraine ask for help to prevent this from happening, because in the dpr, the so-called dpr and the lpr can also be sentenced to the death penalty. they are outside any law. i think that here we should act together with our allies and everyone, even if indirectly, who has something to do with the law enforcement agencies, be it russia or donetsk luhansk e- eh, everyone needs to be put on the wanted list and clearly understand that you are going somewhere there, the responsibility will come anyway, and secondly, i think that it is necessary to sit down with our allies and say if you start another block of sanctions, if you continue to advance, that is, for each

they should get a step forward so that they feel it, and this is the best option. of course, i support formal appeals to the un and so on, but i believe that action is necessary here . they give others the political and moral right to fight to the end and one way or another it is like world writing it will all come back to you but first there must be a clear strategy of action together with the measure of what they get for each next step volodymyr zelenskyi on the eve of this court, or at least the announced court, stated that if this court takes place, then

the final path to any negotiations between him and the ukrainian state under the russian federation with putin will be closed, we know that 10 days ago they met in lviv the secretary general of the united nations welcomed the president of turkey, erdogan, to zelensky, and then the turkish press wrote, citing their sources , that mr. rajap and ip erdoğan would offer zelensky to meet with putin after erdoğan also flew to putin in sochi, there was some kind of conversation, the results of this conversation are not known for sure, but it is obvious, hmm, the president of turkey still does not give up hope of arranging a meeting between zelensky and putin either in ankara or in

istanbul, can it happen ? this meeting and is this meeting necessary now with zelenskiy in the situation in which we are now, well, talk with putin and the russian regime, we need first together from the west and from a position of strength if we feel that we can talk like that and this will show the situation on areas of hostilities on the fronts, then it is one story if we will have the option of delaying, then it is another story if we see the readiness of the west to raise the stakes. this is the third story. therefore, now we should deal with uh-uh predicted because it depends on many factors uh-uh, it is not that this kind

of thing is ungrateful. it's just not worth it from the point of view of emotions and what's happening with turkey. well, it's really not a secret. they want to organize a meeting. they want to be an intermediary between the west and putin. they think that they today there is only one possibility, they feel the desire, i don’t know about putin, but definitely part of the russian elite and medvedev . to conduct emotional negotiations with the russian regime when rockets fall there, when we see what is happening in donetsk well, who will lead? no one

will lead, but such measures of emotional pressure will be actively applied by russia . that everything that comes from moscow is directed, and that is why i currently do not see what we can talk about with russia, a peace agreement with these regimes. i do not see it at all, i do not imagine it in principle, i assume that the war may be there with pauses with cease- fires with some conversations there, but it will go to the moment as long as this regime exists, because it wants to destroy us, what will happen to a future russia when it will be, that is another story, but this regime is determined that we will not exist, there will be no country, no nation was not ours the history of the language and nothing blinks, you just quoted it and the entire ideology of this empire is built on the fact that we are not there and we are and we have proven that we are and

we are fighting for what we are and we will be because we are looking to the future and they look at the past and they will not stop any attempts to destroy us and they understand that they do not get completely er in any way, not that victory, they do not get what can be presented as a victory, and this is exactly what part of our western partners fear, they fear exactly escalation on the part of putin, but you see that it is less and less. by the way, vladimir putin no longer trusts sergei shoigu, at least that's what british intelligence says, recently independent russian media reported that due to the problems russia is facing with its relatives against ukraine, the russian minister of defense sergey pucku is now suspended from the

russian leadership, then british military intelligence says that commanders fighting in ukraine directly report to vladimir putin, putin does not trust anyone and believes that the stable is also losing its position in the armed forces of the russian federation. everyone understands that one way or another everything boils down to a few people in russia who are trying to continue waging war against ukraine, whether mr. pavla will come the moment when the west will understand that for the future of the world, for the future of the nations of the whole world, it will be easier to remove putin from power than to fight with these numerous sanctions and do something that is still ignored

by the leadership of the russian federation. i am talking about the extreme can go hmm the world, but uh, well, if a person terrorizes uh, the whole world and threatens with nuclear weapons or a nuclear explosion on the territory of another state, when he brazenly ignores all international norms, well, isn't it easier to just do that, like what happened to bin laden himself first of all i don't think that everything boils down to putin or to a few people in putin's circle. well, look at the polls. look at how the russian elites work. we see that even those who initially hesitated said why they still want a war . they still want victories.

to earn money in this axis, these are people of a completely different mentality, you and i were just talking - this is a horde, this is such a postardinian mentality, it even mixes it there with the byzantine one . they think this is how they feel and the whole world because of that. well, no, putin will be someone else. and why do we think that he or she will be better? and if there are several people removed from this solitaire game, well, they will be replaced by something else, so for today i don't i see no possibilities er personal there is somehow to cope with this regime this regime must be rebooted into what

form we read it will not disintegrate or russia will collapse or it will be a new form of the federation or a confederation or something else at all non-trivial it may be all all possibilities are actually available er and therefore, to talk about the fact that it will be possible to solve this issue there by somehow removing putin, i absolutely do not believe in this, we need to fight systematically, we need to fight against this regime, which will always threaten us and as long as this regime exists danger, if there is danger, it will be very difficult to ensure the development of the economy, a free, calm , safe life for us and our families, the nation is ukrainian, and therefore our only one, medvedev sang about the guarantee of security, and our guarantee of security

is full integration into the west, complete, i emphasize, and fast, why not ? it was not worth it if it is even necessary to break the last remnants of the post-soviet mentality there. this must be done now. much has changed for many ukrainians. they see what the real russian regime is. they they see the price of our efforts, our struggle, we have not only to enter esenati quickly, we have to become an integral part of the event, and let them stay where they are, but well, they have to reload, there are no other options. and no matter who we talk to there, how much should speculated about possible successors named there . but putin will 100% try to make it unexpected for everyone, anyway, this regime is a

collective animal that wants to eat ukraine, and this animal cannot exist at the same time so that we feel safe and independent, because you did not say before that carthage must be destroyed , therefore this nedo empire must also be destroyed. well , at the end of our program, mr. pavla, i wanted to ask you about the coming winter, because now we see how the price of russian gas on the european exchanges is rising will the europeans have enough patience and the ability to survive this winter in order not to concede to russia in some fundamental issues?

in the end squeezed all of europe and what is the russian regime look at its economic power demographic everything that is and what is europe and if putin is able to squeeze europe so what is this europe really worth that we will have many challenges that there will be many some difficult er tasks well, some social unrest is also possible, but putin will not be able to reset the political elite of the west about what he once said we have speeches in st. petersburg and this and litera will definitely reset him er because this russia na today it is a fundamental danger for everyone, but the key point of departure is december, when there will be sanctions on pan-nafta, when putin will lose

a significant part of the income. of course, there will be other export options, they want it now because of the wounds, if there is an agreement on iran, they want it because of other countries, but it just won't work out for them, so it will last. i believe in it. on this optimistic note, we will complete our program. thank you, mr. pavlo, for participating in the program. this was pavlo klimkin, minister of foreign affairs of ukraine in 2014-2019 politician and diplomat this was the verdict program about her serhii rudenko i bid you farewell until tomorrow until 1:00 p.m. tomorrow i will be visiting the former foreign intelligence service of ukraine mykola malamush as well as sbu colonels people's deputy of ukraine roman kostenko who is fighting on the southern front let's talk about the southern front and the situation in kherson oblast and mykolaiv oblast goodbye