it is unnecessary to talk about the fact that this is the beginning of the end. putin turned to him that you started this war of aggressive, huge knowledge with victims and it turns out. therefore, in this situation, he already understood that the concept did not work, he was disoriented, strategically believed his phobias, there are ambitions there is everything else. so, not even my electrical advisors, but the service was working, so i went to get out somehow, but i tried to set my conditions. at the moment, we are talking about the end of march. when our side was already talking about security guarantees are possible without direct accession to nato , i.e. at that time, this option could also be available, but we felt that this would be a pause for putin, we will see which crimes he does not want to eat, it is clear that we received signals from both the usa and britain that there will be active and effective support the construction of aggression completely and not partially so that in this situation other prerequisites arise not just to stop at some stage

on putin's terms, for example, i even planned to return on february 24, although that could not be the case. i am already occupying the territory of the south. in this situation, we could not go to such negotiations, he was already ready for that period, but when the question of liberating the territories became tough, it is clear that putin's rhetoric and readiness changed regarding the agreement that was foreseen there, you are already conducting negotiations, uh, on the site of verdogan and the rokans there and chally, others went there and there was even rhetoric. we will not ask questions about nato today or ask questions about security guarantees, but this has been dropped because we can see that putin is only forming it for the sake of some kind of break, and then the whole works accordingly the scenario of the full program, we went with the option of liberating our state with the enterprise of our powerful partners, and it worked, so there was already no chance of concluding an agreement, what the cossack said later . because putin made his choice of an aggressive

policy . the aggressor, but really throw him out of our territories and, er, work with the allies so that putin is no one anymore . of a successful counteroffensive by the armed forces of ukraine in the kharkiv region, russia approached the officials of ukraine with a proposal to hold talks about this, in an interview with franz 24, deputy prime minister for european and euro-atlantic integration olga stefanishyna said, and i quote, there were indeed public and non-public attempts from various groups of russian officials, ukraine has never retreated from negotiations, but in view of the gravity of the crimes that russia has committed on our land and continues to commit every month, the levers for negotiations are different from those who were in february, said stefanyshina, and she

believes that the russians are now proposing negotiations to stop the advance of the armed forces. are negotiations between russia and ukraine needed today? general, and if so , what should become the subject of such negotiations and theoretical agreements? today, negotiations are needed not only with putin, but also with by our partners regarding the complete liberation of the territory of our state, such negotiations require compensation for ukraine for causing damages, the return of all and damage to our prisoners and people which they actually took, and especially children, to ukraine. that is the working out of international low -level legal mechanisms for ensuring global security, including ukraine, and preventing the future aggressive positions of the russian federation. such negotiations are necessary, but then it will not work because, in fact, this the end of this regime , he does not recognize himself as guilty, according to the fact that he

lost here and because in this situation it will be the fall of his regime and even his russian entourage will actually move him from this position, therefore at the moment the main argument for him to adopt some acts, we are already saying that the truth about the liberation of the territory is the powerful actions of the armed forces of ukraine in the sectors of the south-east of other directions , these are prerequisites for russia not only to withdraw from our lands, but in the future to change the regime and concluded an agreement regarding the future of the russian federation as a whole, the formation of a new, more democratic system. perhaps on other principles of state law. that is, this is the perspective of the content for us. we can only leave when indeed, today the russian leadership, even including putin, will have made a clear decision that they will liberate the territory completely in accordance with the norms of international law, and this is expected to be in the period of august of 1991. this format

works. i think that in this situation we will go this way. complies with all legal norms, including the great agreement between ukraine and russia, which was signed by the russian leadership, there is no contradiction here, there is a real fact of aggression, there is a real offense, there are no norms, we must do it all to update the plans, to maintain the dialogue - this is the address of what territories he will leave somewhere, what conditions he will give us, especially the deliberation was literally yesterday. what is russia's position to go to negotiations only under those conditions when you fulfill some of moscow 's demands ? about the internal situation in the country, what exactly will he focus on the internal situation in russia later, or can he just leave like that, he still needs some kind of victory? well, explain to the russian society what actually happened

over the past few days, we have seen public speeches by deputies of various municipal councils or dumas, as they are called in russia, in st. petersburg, in other cities of russia, where people write that putin, after the failure of the special operation, simply put, lost the war in ukraine you should leave your seat as a person who for a long time dealt with issues of national security and defense and is still dealing with them, but at a professional level, what do you say, this is not an informational and psychological special operation of the russian federation, what are they? throwing in that there seems to be some kind of dissatisfaction within the state and to demonstrate to the whole world that there are, as it were, any prospects for putin's displacement, or is it really the way things are going in russia, why am i asking this because, well

, considering the regime that exists in russia, i don't think so that it is quite simple for some deputies there to speak openly, and even more so to call on the president of russia to resign, well, first of all, we appealed to the municipal deputy of st. petersburg and moscow already in 18 e-e districts, as it were indeed, putin is wrongly pursuing the policy of protecting the interests of russia, that is, they are not supporters of a democratic system, for example, or the prevention of any aggressive action, they blame putin, as it were, for the fact that he is not active, does not effectively protect russia, that he actually allowed nato, that ukraine actually conducts a very successful operations, and therefore, in this situation, there may be a prospect of putin’s resignation . i will simply say that these are various groups of influence, often special services, which are focused on presenting putin with just such an alternative, and the idea is to put pressure on

but it seems that because of some public organizations, the deputy e-corps of such a third level, that is, of the municipal level, that's exactly where the game is going, as i'll tell you, but as a rule, a high level of the special services is welcome here, one e-e mood in the current situation . on the one hand, it seems that this is the format of condemning putin and mobilizing for some more decisive actions to protect the interests of russia, on the other hand, it is the prospect of possible alternative movements, they predict that putin may lose the prospect and in this situation, of course, the influential people in putin's entourage form exactly the basis for which the position of individual deputies, politicians, and some of the military are already being expressed. we are already talking. voices what is economically advantageous, but precisely those

who influence the rocketry, the special services, politicians and oligarchs, that is, gradually, but as if under the pretext of protecting the interests of russia, an alternative position is being formed, it is very careful expert, well, you can talk about some losses there, but not criticize, because the line between criticism and crime is very small, that's why they are playing on the edge of lviv, but they are forming an opposition , as it were, and patriotic pressure on putin, what do you say, let 's work more actively there, and then we will move on the other hand, in case of his loss, it is clear that this is the opposition that should be at the head of the respective movements. when the regime is already weakened and it is clear that it will already claim both central and municipal power. thank you, mr. generals to you for participating in the program. this was an army general. former head of the foreign intelligence service

of ukraine. in the years 2004-2020, captain of the first rank, mr. andrii, i congratulate you. good health. thank you for joining our conversation. good day, mr. andrii. yesterday, a package of recommendations for security guarantees for ukraine was presented, which it was worked out by yermak's group once. well, the price is... what should, in principle, explain or create a security model that will suit ukraine and our partners? let's hear what president zelensky said about this. we have the result of our

work on security guarantees for our state. group under the leadership of andriy yermak and anders folgrafny, these recommendations should form the basis of the future system of security agreements that will give ukrainians peace of mind and will be able to guarantee the prevention of any war against ukraine, we are working to ensure that the strongest subjects of the free world become the guarantors of the security of our state, so that at a much more external and bilateral level it is determined in detail who should react, how and when, if there is any threat to the state security of ukraine, to respond with sanctions the supply of weapons, all the necessary material and financial support, the main thing is clear and legally binding steps, concrete and timely actions, in particular, preventive actions aimed at avoiding war and cooling the intentions of the aggressor, i.e., everything that our country did not have before, and because of which russia was under the

illusion that it could get away with the war against ukraine, we have already built, together with our partners, a powerful anti-war coalition, which includes dozens of different states. and now we are working to the most powerful states that are already helping us become a coalition of peace that will last forever. it is quite obvious to andrii that the security system that existed in the world until february 24, 2022 no longer exists and does not work. it is clear that it was the budapest memorandum, which also does not work according to yours. who and how can ensure the security guarantees of ukraine, or ukraine, after all, should take care of these security guarantees for its future, a secure future is with its own forces, in particular with the armed forces of ukraine, well, first of all, we actually have the power to do this. i think well, it just won't work because well, if you

take and compare our capabilities with, well, with the russian federation, let's say there with eh, with similar, similar and smoke these eh, well, eh, potency eh, even in case of ending means hostilities under the best conditions for ukraine. well , you can predict that russia will pose a threat to ukraine, but economically, economically, we simply will not be able to cope with the russian federation one-on-one. this is obvious and, in general, there are experiments. i don't think it's necessary to carry out . well, as far as i'm concerned, another option would be participation in the north atlantic alliance , because it's already such a guaranteed mechanism. yes, there is indeed a certain

question. but the north atlantic alliance - this is an organization in which all the internal mechanisms related to the provision of military protection to one of the members of this organization have already been worked out. in principle, everything is clear enough. i want to remind you that the good budget of the north atlantic alliance is more than one trillion contracts, which is 16 times exceeds the budget of the russian federation, and our budget is exactly 16 times less than that of the russian federation, that is there is an option that the most developed military technologies in the west are precisely in the countries that are members of the alliance. well, secondly, the alliance is not only a military bloc, but especially, the introduction

of this side involves many internal transformations. in the country of the candidates, this is economic, political and legislative, and so on. and i think that for ukraine it was the most useful option because of this in general. the whole the state system that works in russia would have completely shown its incapacity, and now in these conditions, which we are now converging on, well, this option is really being worked out, in which the provision of guarantees is really here, i agree that it is necessary to rely first of all and on which they have their own e- military, political, diplomatic, economic potential, that is, for us, it is primarily the united states of america - it is great britain, and it is the countries of europe, and it is

also important to enlist the support of turkey here, because we see now that it is a sea our weak spot was actually from the first hours of the war, and the northwestern part of the black sea was blocked and we did not receive any help due to the vmont convention, but it helped us a little in that the russian ships, which were concentrated in the global sea, also did not enter and did not were able to strengthen the group that the black sea fleet gathered here, but in conclusion, i want to say that these should be those states that have such a serious political , military, diplomatic and economic weight and because, well, the budapest memorandum was a good one. well, a good agreement, but there are a lot of comments about it, and we will say the weight of we and so

on, but she did not give us such direct obligations regarding the provision of military aid to ukraine . you mentioned mr. andriy about the group that is in the black sea of ​​the russian federation, the black sea fleet of the russian federation, and now some of these ships have moved to novorossiysk. if i am not mistaken, in the last broadcast you mentioned the number of 80 e units of e-e ships and vessels, which boats are there of the black sea fleet of the russian federation, eh, now in this situation, it is clear, eh, the number of eh units of our fleet, they cannot in any way, in any proportion, even be placed there, eh, to russian ships and boats, eh, we are now observing a counteroffensive in kharkiv oblast and the beginning

counter-offensive in the kherson region and one way or another we are discussing the future of the future action of the armed forces of ukraine on the territory of the occupied annexed crimea, even if we are theoretically speaking now we are practically implementing the return of all these lands to in the future, there is a year two or three in mind, and the crimean peninsula is also meant. what do we need to do on the southern border, the sea border, considering our rather sad efforts compared to the ships of the russian fleet there, which will always be a threat to us because they will have a base in that new russia and this threat will not go anywhere, well , first of all, i want to say that now, in the plans for the construction of the defense, there are capabilities

, that is, no, no, the platform and the capabilities are indeed in the russian federation, there are 80 ships, boats and ships now, but what kind of ships can really launch a missile strike there and land amphibious assaults on our ships. unfortunately, there are much fewer boats, and some of them were destroyed or captured by the enemy in the sea of ​​azov, but here i want to say that in terms of capabilities, we were capable of them to build up thanks to the help of partners and thanks to the arrival of these anti-ship missile systems, we developed such a capability, which in nato is called sydinailki billety, that is, in my opinion, it is pushing the enemy’s prevention to a certain border or to a certain area, and now the area that we do not allow the enemy to face is the threat of a missile attack, this is the northwestern part of the black sea, he simply does not enter there, if he goes there, we

can strike and the ships will be destroyed, that is , and really because of this threat, and part of the ships was transferred to novorossiysk, and the headquarters of the photo was partially transferred to novorossiysk, but if in mostopol, which we see now on the video , then we really need to ensure that, again, these two classic military capabilities of the naval forces, this is called self-control, that is, control of the sea area of ​​the sea waters of the exclusively maritime economic zone . security and er, well , and shipping, see now, they have blocked everything and everything has stopped, and 75% of the economy of ukraine

is exactly what it is, well, it moves at the expense of water transport at the expense of the sea and these maritime communications must be guarded. well, secondly, it is sydinal, that is, preventing the enemy from entering the border, it is basically classically decided by archangel missiles. and if we have a missile with a range of 200 km, this means that the enemy will be very, very wary of approaching the distance is closer if this is not available he will simply come and seize this territory, but again, the missiles must be placed on coastal systems and on ship systems and on aircraft, and here it is also very important, again , he looks at resources because resources are well the equipment itself is the people, their preparation, their maintenance, this is the repair, this is the infrastructure, and so on. and in

principle, i can say that now even our budget allows us to increase these capabilities to a certain extent, well, for the naval forces, and because, well, well, well, well at the beginning of the war, our budget was about three billion hryvnias per year, if we compare it with what it was, let's say 20 years ago, it is almost 100 times more, but we just need to use this resource competently and rationally, the rule of building maritime security we know that the development of medium-term and long-term documents is being carried out in the commands of the navy of ukraine. this technique should be mastered now. it is simple. it is necessary to implement it and to attract the most capable technological models of weapons that realize these capabilities and to master the

personnel training system to recruit the most qualified . specialists and to ensure that they remain in ani’s service, gain knowledge , some skills and leave the service in order to work in commercial structures or somewhere in elsewhere, p. andrii, the ukrainian government proposes to spend half of the budget for 2023 on defense and security, which is more than four times more than was included in the budget for this year. at the same time, information appeared that the united states of america is preparing another package of military aid and this military aid will be about this military aid will be announced literally in a few days , john kirby informed about this and said that we are in close contact with the ukrainians, we talk to them every day in real time, there are discussions about what

their military needs preliminarily say that another 600 million dollars will be allocated for ukraine's military needs. we know that last week the armed forces of ukraine received aid, or rather ukraine received aid in the amount of 700 million from the united states of america. i know that for a very long time you have been a military the naval forces of ukraine do not . still, could there be such a situation when we will have, as you said, missiles with a range of 300 km, maybe 500 km, maybe even 3,000 km, and in this way we will be able to defend our territorial waters in the black sea which, in principle , are now completely dominated by the russian federation , does ukraine still need to have a

naval development program that has already been updated, taking into account the challenges that we now have and the challenges that we have seen in the last six months before the situation that developed on february 24 requires a review of the concept that was in place before the start of the war, because any development program involves an assessment of the environment and the environment is very a serious change, no, in our favor, uh, and other parameters have changed, for example, now the assistance of partners has been greatly increased, but you said that the budget for next year is really over one trillion hryvnias. and no one has ever received such an amount in the history of

ukraine, but in any case it is less than what, for example, the united states of america provides. for a year in the form of weapons, training and so on, that is, you see. well, the help is very serious , so the conceptor or it is definitely necessary to revise a-a if for now he is the only one if the navy is based in odesa and if the question is about if we return crimea to us after the return of crimea, it is necessary to review because there will be other geographical parameters, they can be fundamentally the same, but the same necessary capabilities their implementation, the ways and methods may be different, but again, uh, well, it is very important here that, and this is the classic managerial triangle, tasks, capabilities, resources, it was balanced, and uh, well, and costs, costs, and they

should be planned for the future, and not planned while there is some kind of uh, well, let's say a current need, that is, they need to be programmed, and because of this, precisely the program-target method, it should become the basis of military budgeting for both the navy and all armed forces ukraine, because now the budget is built according to the functional principle, that is, there. we need so much fuel there, and so on. well, this is a very specific question, mr. andriy, at the very end of our program, i will ask you a question that i have long wanted to formulate and i will now try very precisely speak up until 2014 ukraine did not consider russia as a potential enemy and as a potential danger and why well, i think that it was mainly

because of uh, because of political uh, political vision, i myself served in the naval forces of the armed forces of ukraine and i can say what i remember is the beginning of ukraine's independence, this is the first half of the 90s , and there was such a feeling of possible countermeasures . russian before opening fire, ot well, for example, well it was in the early 1990s, again, we remember how odessa, the city's naval base in odessa in april 1994 was taken under control , military forces were used there, there were no casualties, but the force was used

but i think that the main thing is that russia was not considered as a potential enemy, and it was considered with such a rather neutral neutral state, it was a political attitude, a political assumption. i remember that in the 10th year, for example, when yanukovych came to power er, well, that's it she became more and more like that, and yes, because by the 10th year, from the fifth to the tenth version of the scenario , well, aggression from the side of ukraine, it was from the side of russia to ukraine, it was but in the 10th year, he was excluded from o, so what uh this is a political issue and i, well, russia, we know that it acted in a hybrid way, and that's why it was precisely the political leadership that was also in the e-e, let's say in the sphere of e-e in the sphere of influence e-e contacts

and so on, that's why this was the situation thank you thank you mr. andrii, thank you for participating in the conversation. this was andrii ryzhenko, an expert at the center for defense strategies deputy chief of staff of the ukrainian navy in 2004-2020, friends, this was a program verdict on her serhiy rudenko we will meet tomorrow at 1:00 p.m. tomorrow i will have valentin nalyvaichenko on the air twice head of the security service of ukraine and people's deputy of ukraine colonel sbu roman kostenko, who is fighting in the mykolaiv oblast, thank you all for your attention and say goodbye. see you tomorrow. goodbye. watch espresso news and euro espresso programs for ukrainian refugees in europe on the air.