on ukraine we know that the empire is returning one way or another any consultation of the authorities whether good by the russians in er-e quotes or bad by the russians it means the continuation of the war either immediately or after some very small interval these scenarios are bad for ukraine they are bad for europe and water and you are bad for the russians because they will continue to be killed and they will continue to suffer, they say that democracy is possible in russia after the death of putin, where will democracy for democracy come from? i'm sorry ms. myroslava our dear viewers, the questions are needed, the democrats did not bring anything to russia this time, just like last time, there are no traditions, no institutions, uh, there is nothing that could support fair elections, even if tomorrow some pink unicorns from the planet mars occupy russia with a single the goal is to hold free elections there anyway. he is someone. in these elections, the party that

will offer what the majority of the population likes, and what the majority of the population likes, revanchism, resentment and desire will win. take revenge on ukraine, europe and the west in general and the free world in general, that is, in your opinion, it will most likely be a non-democracy, rather, the chekist regime will replace the military regime, or it could be the regime, you know, the russians, from all the fantastic books of the dystopia genre, are trying to make uh, the reality is what they did, they partially developed orwell's reality, they practically embodied all the fuel, and i won't be surprised if the next uh, step will be the de-stalinization of russia, uh, about which you are talking about, for example, the ionization of russia, uh the establishment of such a fundamentalist er religious regime is well described by the russian er writer sorokin in his story where the enemy is um nam yes we laugh

because it er seems impossible but in fact it seems to me that this is exactly what today's literary critics they call magical realism, er, such a lie, which is more true than the truth itself, this is exactly what can happen in russia . the so-called towers of the kremlin and we see there a huge number of various independent or semi -independent players, they are certainly not independent , they all leave putin, but as long as putin is there, when putin dies, when he is killed or when he becomes weak, what when he becomes incapable of being an arbiter and all to balance, the war for power begins, and kella has already missed, we can see that they miss on the hunt once, the first and the last, and so far he is holding on due to the fact that he removed from his environment all the people who they can threaten him, but sooner or later they

will start a war for power, and in addition to the system players, we see those who have e-e shoulder straps from the russian state e-e from the russian army, the fsb, the federal security service, a bunch of the national guard, a bunch of other law enforcement agencies, we also see private armies . we see prigozhin with his private army, we see kadyrov with a private army. i think that the number of people will increase and they do not just have some infantrymen, they are already system armies with heavy weapons. why is all this necessary in order to fight for power now? to occupy the best place with money flows around putin and very very soon in order to decide and who will be the next putin and this uh dispute this war may accompany it with violence and may not be quick it may be long and deep violence that is, this is what has you know the analogues in russian history. in general, i am a supporter of the so -called concept of so-called path dependence,

that is, what has already happened once, what has already happened twice will continue to happen, and i will give you an example: in ukraine there have already been seven times competitive fair enough prices fair enough but competitive and transparent enough elections in russia wise men but there is no third tradition where it can be taken from nowhere but in russia there have been coup d'états a huge number of times with the murder of, for example, the ruler, there were some collective such a clash when one group is against another group. well, for example, there and then someone defeats all the other shooters and impeaches them, and then one of those who defeats the investigator is impeached. at least he squeezes out the power of others there was turmoil, this is also turmoil, this is also russian, i specifically use the russian word. they do not want to translate it into ukrainian. because this is a specific

russian phenomenon, which in russian history is chaos . listen to the following letters. is it important to us or not? i will stop at this point. now i remembered that you said no about path dependence and about repetition and i remembered how the russian religious philosopher vasyl rozanov wrote in the 17th year about how russia disappeared in 3 days, do you remember he wrote the apocalypse - the apocalypse of our time and he says no, there was nothing left, neither the church nor the army of the working class, but one vile people remained, and for some reason i remembered and he then says where is dostoevsky alpatych tolstoy and war and there is nothing left of peace , the russians disappeared in 3 days, and this is because the so-called russian culture, which is still admired by a certain

number of intellectuals in the west, it does not penetrate into russian society, eh, everything that they know, eh, and all schools remember russians from dostoevsky - this the fact that someone over there killed an old woman about this time and that's all, that is, not only the russians and not only what kind of investigation we know that all western intellectuals are proud of the fact that they read dostoevsky tolstoy, but they obviously did not finish it or read it very selectively as we can see now from certain events ah so otherwise russian culture did not penetrate it did not penetrate well this is the answer to the question you asked russian culture does not penetrate deeply i can't remember a book yet, i would suggest it to those who want to understand the essence of the russian turmoil. it's still a modern novel. the novel aristonomy, by boris akunin, shows very well how all

people who live are completely losing their humanity. on the territory of that, except for a very small number of those who really somehow hold this small lamp of culture and mostly most of them do not know anything about culture . because culture. normalizes the daily behavior of millions of people, and what regulates the daily behavior of russians, we know, uh, it's tv and it's vodka, and a few more things. let's take a look at the turmoil. many ukrainians, as i see on social networks, would be very happy about a civil war, bloody civil war so in russia it is because they believe that in this way the russians are reducing the number of themselves and we need to deal with them less and they deal with internal

problems and do not come to us, but i am categorically against the fact that there is such turmoil in russia will mean a huge threat, first of all, to ukraine, ukraine will take the first strike, the first risk is big - it is the spread of nuclear weapons. now we have one putin, unpredictably. it is controlled by who will press the button that can come to us, the second huge threat here is the refugees, somewhere it will be the biggest refugee crisis in the history of the world over time, at least 20 ml , as experts say, it can be simply if they they will run and run through ukraine, then there will simply not be a single body left here, and a huge threat to everyone, to europe, ukraine will not hold them back, and it is also a threat to europe, the order on weapons is a threat to everyone, to the whole world, to america, to everyone, the third threat - this is radical islamism . when everything collapses, new systems emerge, and obviously at this moment, we will see the penetration of

the most radical and most forms of various religions. and finally, this means the incredible strengthening of china, that is, the collapse is not like that. and destroyed russia is exactly what the children long for. it has long sought not only to take back the territories it lost 150 years ago when it was weak, and not only to resettle hundreds of millions of its people who do not really have land on neighboring russian territories. territories where practically no one lives, huge territories where tens of millions of people can live and feed themselves, millions live there now , and it is not known whether this is true a-a china is of course interested in the wealth of russia and er-er er-er in the current war takes we see such a very constant ambivalent position, on the one hand he condemns the war, on the other hand, he does not condemn russian aggression, on the one

hand, he does not want russia to use nuclear weapons, on the other hand, he supplies russia with the necessary materials, on the third hand, he performs all western sanctions, and on the fourth hand, he constantly complains that the west does not respect his interests and, of course, in his newspapers condemns the permanent ukraine for the fact that ukraine is in this war , and this position of china is connected precisely with the fact that for it doesn't matter to us, in principle, because we are used to taking care of such a big empire there. for us, it is very bad for the west, for the free world, for america, for europe, because they do not want such a strengthening of china. such a greatly strengthened china will create a problem for the whole world. will be more insolent and er will assert its rights to more things than now, well, the chinese chinese strategy it is always er explained by an ancient proverb: a wise monkey sits on a tree and waits for a tiger and a leopard to sort themselves out

actually, the scenario of chaos and merciless russian rebellion is also a dangerous group of scenarios for us. so there remains an even more dangerous one. i would say more dangerous because we are in a situation of conventional war, which is going on now, ukraine is bleeding, but at least we understand what is happening war situation everything against everyone uh, we will simply not understand what is happening and the crocodiles will not save the organization and let 's talk about actually about these scenarios that are for us a-ah i already said and uh that the russian population consists largely of non-russian peoples. and those people who registered as russians, they are usually in such a situation when the empire falls apart, they will very quickly remember who they really are, and even those

people who have never thought about who they really are, there are a lot of such people in russia, they will look for something for themselves, i remember i understand this process, it happened er and er in the late 80s and early 90s, now you will essentially have a very good picture similar to what happened in the late 80s and early 90s with a schedule of the soviet union, and i will remind you the soviet union very quickly ceased to exist, the empire is always on my desk, there is a book that i want to recommend to all of our er viewers, er, this is the last book empire, er, by the outstanding ukrainian historian serhii plakhi, who works at harvard, er, it covers one year of history in the beginning of the 91st year when the russian e-e when the soviet union was a powerful empire sat at the same table with the united states of america determined determined the politics of half the world and until december of this 91st year when the soviet union ceased to exist lowered its flag forever and its only

president resigned that's how fast everything happens in those times when the empire is already weak so look what happens er when the empire doesn't hold together it starts to fall apart uncontrolled disintegration as we already talked er it is very threatening but controlled disintegration such as happened in 1991, this is exactly what is needed, let's first remember our old ukrainian slogan, i remember it from the second half of the 80s, yaroslav, i am sure that you also hold it in the heart for our freedom and yours, this is an old one. i would say a ukrainian-polish-lithuanian slogan that says that no nation can be completely free when there is trouble, disaster and other unfree peoples in russia around it. 21 national republics in russia e- there is a huge number of smaller peoples, there are 130 nationalities, and all of them

are currently in a colonized state . means the impossibility of a normal education system and so on. and so on. listen, we knew all this. ukrainians were an oppressed people in the russian empire for centuries, and we were also banned from speaking, banned from culture, banned from everything, and in the same way, our garnerian and paralyzing wars were driven by millions in our country, and this is exactly what is happening now. it happens with tatars, skins, buryats, carpets, and dozens and dozens of others. let's understand, let's ask a little , for example, it begins, let's believe in what begins, centrifugal movements. so, who is at this time is in power, how does this scenario of controlled disintegration work, who is in power in russia, look here, what is the situation, uh, and there is uh, we will be frank with our viewers with questions, there are two categories of people, there is a category of people and the current

management of the league. - a little risking the name of them, yes, in quotation marks, kravchuks, yes , those people who were personally selected by putin, loyal putinites eh, put in place eh and eh, those who control today all these regions are the second category eh, very much again taking a risk to depict someone, i will call them scumbags, also in quotation marks, these are new charismatic national leaders who , er, lead national liberation movements to victory, that i, the kravchuks, they have all the money, the power of the security forces , managerial experience, good education, understanding of the economy. why don't they have a picture of the future, remember ? you see, we said that russia is a country without a future. and they don't have a picture of the future . putinism today has nothing to offer the people, just as communism could not offer them anything in 1990, and what is it that its blackmailers and they have a picture of the future resource, they don't have

followers, they have relatively few followers, let's be honest, their understanding of the economy is not so good, but they have a picture of the future for their people, remember we said that ukraine is fighting for the future and russia is fighting for the past and why and because two things because ukraine has two fantastic beacons nationalism and europe we have always been europeans we wanted to be in europe we want to be in europe we feel like europe and russia has always opposed itself to europe in me europe in me as they said, we are definitely not of europe, and the second is nationalism. ukraine has nationalism, which is a beacon that leads us to the future, and russia does not have it, because russia is an empire of empires, it cannot have nationalism. it only has imperial chauvinism. we should have more, more in was described before fighting . so, all these peoples there are now waking up . of course, this is nationalism, and i want to remind you that almost all russian republics in 1990 and 1991 declared their sovereignty, and even more

tatarstan and ichkeria went even further in history we know tatarstan well in 1992. in 1992, two-thirds of the population voted in favor of final independence, and now these movements are beginning. look at what we have today . e declared the desire for independence and the course towards an independent state e-e the congress of the soviet people is the people living in the republic of maroon declared the impossibility of the people staying in the russian federation and the need to create their own state design literally yesterday, the leaders of the national liberation movement of tatarstan appealed to the president of ukraine with a request to recognize the independence of tatarstan on the basis of the declaration on the independence of tatarstan , they made a decision 30 years ago and a referendum was held then, and now it will be like a domino effect, everyone

will run ahead of them who hasn't done it yet will be watching and wondering why everyone did it to me, but then there is a very tricky river uh, then actually the main one, we remember who dismantled the soviet union, it was dismantled kravchuks, you dismantled the old administration wanting to preserve your fortunes, positions of power, influence, and also look here, but i will tell you that this will happen not only in national regions, not only tatarstan, your kartostan, er, burgundy , beets, and so on, not only ingushetia a-a and er er er and let’s say mariel yes a well of course and of course the chechen republic of ichkiria er the actually occupied nature of which was recognized by the ukrainian parliament this is a very strong step of the ukrainian parliament let me remind you that the ukrainian parliament has already made three very strong political steps recognizing the right of the russian peoples to

self-determination in accordance with the basic statutory documents of the organization of associations recognizing the territory occupied by russia as the territory belonging to japan in the far east and recognizing the occupied territory as the occupation of the chechen republic and the skin i am sure that the chechen the people will take power into their own hands, but there is another territory where people live who have always spoken russian, such as siberia, for example, there will be not only national movements here, there will also be such regional movements, people in siberia today how do the majority of russians feel about the stones , and many of them who signed up to correspond with siberians were forbidden to do so? by the way, many of them today dream of siberia being an independent territory, and they look at siberia and spend parallels, for example , with australia, who settled in australia, convicts

and adventurers, and who settled siberia with the same people, too good to be true, please tell me, credit is where russian revanchism takes place, resortment, and all this, all this, what we are afraid of after their defeat because it is for the deep russian people of course it feels like a defeat, obviously, but let's look at the situation now, let's remember what a victory is for ukraine when russia never threatens ukraine again, and let's imagine that a certain number of different new of national works, not all of them will be democratic at once, there is no tradition of democracy, they will develop slowly for many of them, the ideal is also a model, let's say kazakhstan, a country that provided enough rigid power, but at the same time they built steel and

capable state institutions, attracted a huge amount of foreign investment and provided a good standard of living for its citizens, much better than, for example, the last one today, although without protons, the republic has just as much for various resources, or tatarstan or yakutia, give yakutia sakha - this example, there are incredibly many republics with which moscow pumps out absolutely everything. but the territory that will essentially remain in what we call muscovy, well, it will be small a country roughly the size of ukraine with a territorial and post-population e-e and such a country e-e will no longer definitely threaten ukraine e when all the peoples of the russian federation become free and they will definitely become free because it is based on the founding documents of the organization 19 on the right of peoples to self-determination, which is described in detail, how it is implemented, then the country that

remains has a chance to move somewhere little by little, you know, sometimes they say that the russian federation is too big for democracy. and here you can to argue er whether it is true or not and whether huge countries really have to be empires or autocracies but this is not a television format, i will only say that huge countries can be democracies when they gather from below from stable er small er communities er- i would like to offer two examples here: the united states of america, which was formed from states, and india, which was formed from a territory where there were very strong traditions of local self-government for thousands of years, the likes of which, for example, russia has never had. at the moment, russia has a chance for democracy, for a slow, kind of development, and i am sure that there i will find all the forces that want it. if not, if it will be a country like that, what will they want

? i have a very important question, we don't have much time left, i want to have time to talk with you about the conscious forces that will want to, what do you think about the fact that the russian liberals who left for the word seem to me i have such a suspicion that putin deliberately released these hundreds of thousands of people, the middle class of the most educated people who left now countries it seems to me that he didn't let everyone leave just like that, what do you think about the fact that they are russian liberals, intellectuals, they call themselves the news jews of europe, they are now proving that they are the same victims of putin's regime that ukrainians talk about their problems, but i don't i see in them a readiness for rethinking, for taking responsibility, and for working with this, actually, with that, and with that,

what are we talking about when we talk about jaspers, about his concept of collective guilt, moral guilt by the war crimes they committed in ukraine need to be reconsidered. i don't see it. you see it in these people. this is the potential. i think that the so-called russian liberal position, in its essence, does not give russia its liberal or opposition, because those people do not think about the best life for their people and they are thinking about themselves now, and i would put an end to the conversation about them, they somehow uh who will do this democratization, which must be through rethinking and because of taking responsibility for what their the country was concentration camp then where where what forces are there in russia you mean when you say that what they are yes and for the democrats for democratization i am not saying that they are

strong i am not saying that they will win it is obvious that such forces exist because there are many people who they want to return to russia and direct it to the path of modernization to the path of modern creation of a modern country, but it seems to me that rather here history will go along the path of creating small states that will have more eh more chances eh i think you heard about the project, the ingredient project is small states in the north-east of russia, with the capital st. petersburg, where it is possible to create a normal democratic russia and, most likely, democratic russians will gather there and somehow fight off those who will be able to sit down from moscow, what will happen in moscow if muscovy is within the borders of the to be honest, i don't care about the moscow ring road if they are there, let them do whatever they want, but they don't have the resources to attack ukraine and europe, that's why i finally want to emphasize the letter how little time we have

left is an important thing for our viewers viewers, i want to say that the leaders of the national liberation movements of the enslaved peoples of russia adopted a declaration on decolonization, which contains very important principles that i want to share. and there will be many of them because stalin specially drew the borders in such a way that they created and mixed all peoples within the framework of the republics, that is, a little. people of your citizens, compatriots, live outside the republic, and some of the foreigners live inside the republic in order to actually prevent any independent attempts, and the protection of human rights, regardless of nationality, is also very important for us ukrainians, the principle

of joint responsibility er, for the damage caused to ukraine and, by the way, to georgia, to other neighboring countries that suffered from russian aggression, and the principle is that all war criminals must be punished , regardless of their nationality. that is, this means that if a beet committed a war crime on the territory of ukraine, the buryats will not defend him or demand his punishment in order to prove his loyalty to the ideal of human rights and the ideal of peace . there are certain questions and there is some skepticism about the possibility of such optimistic scenarios, but let's end it and see and see in fact in

which direction we will move with your permission. i would say that the permission. thus, there is nothing special optimism, why did you and i speak in this system so that ukrainian women clearly understood what is a ukrainian victory, what is acceptable for us, and what is not acceptable for us, and everything else - those peoples will already decide, they themselves will decide their fate it is important for us to understand what is good for us and what is bad for us. yes, it is true. i thank you very much valery valery baker teacher in khmelnytskyi and lviv business school was our guest today i thank our guest i thank you as always to all our viewers and i thank the armed forces of ukraine for the fact that this this conversation this broadcast was possible at all thank you glory to ukraine see you next week russian peace

invades ukraine destroys ukrainians in order to survive we must defeat the inhumans all together throughout the country mykolaiv teenagers from the public association of dreams junior together with espresso tv channel announced fundraising for the purchase of 200 silencers for weapons for ukrainian fighters, in turn our polish friends from the counter-pol enterprise volunteered to invest 50% of this project for for every hryvnia you send, they will give their mufflers and fire extinguishers will be handed over to the frontline soldiers who defend ukraine on the front line of fire, let's get closer to victory together glory to ukraine , no matter what ukrainians think about, no matter what they talk

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