this is done we understood how the russians behave, we are not, at least i did not find anything new in their behavior and the behavior is very simple and you know i once studied on my own specifically because i was a bad student at the university but i was interested in the second world war and i have every such story, mr. dmytro now said, and many other interlocutors during the war, everything changes quite seriously in my understanding of the war, the understanding of the second world war, into the understanding of how the soviets fought during the so-called great the understanding of the patriotic war is the psychology of russian officers, the psychology of soviet generals, the psychology of soldiers, ordinary soldiers, and so on, and so on, and similar in principle. and that’s how the heroization of this heroism somehow stood in my head less and less and less, and the horror is increasing because i

already understand such concrete examples today that this is absolutely anti-lyun behavior of the russians, just as there was anti-lyun behavior of the soviet soldiers, i do not, this does not mean that there was pro-human behavior of the sesivites or germans or fascists, but you can definitely say that these two forces are in mine, at least, but they are very similar in such and such in such cannibalism and such bloodiness that more and more the thought that pulsates in the head is the same that all terrorists, all tyrants, they are basically the same no it can be said that this ram is better than that hitler is absolutely suitable for stalin and the behavior of hitler and the behavior of stalin during the second world war is the

behavior of two tyrants who behaved absolutely identically and there are no special heroisms er, there was no local heroism, that is, there must have been some heroism, but this is the kind of heroism that should have led to cannibalism. yes, if the germans took some or some height, as it is very popular, it means that they will shoot people further in the neighboring villages if the reds took some the height means that in these neighboring villages they are just shooting without any necessity, that's why i have a kapchak engraved like this volodymyr, a military expert, the head of the south caucasian branch of the center for research of the army, conversion, disarmament, from tbilisi good health, mr. volodymyr. my greetings , colleagues, mykola, the audience. how can you hear me? yes, it's great

to hear now. it's great. so, we'll talk about your opinion. how long have you been a military expert and a leader? and what should be your next goal? industrious and would say, listen, i read your thoughts about our offensive, so you would tell me crimea or donbas, well, if i received such a call, i would like it to be a prankster calling me, if i'm being serious, then from combat of the tbilisi sofa suddenly, because i had the opportunity, i would only bow low to my mother and listen carefully to him. if he wanted to tell me something , he would not do it and probably would have done the right thing, so eh, in logic, in logic, i

have no answer what are these questions, the only thing i want to emphasize repeatedly is that the liberation of kherson, the elimination of kherson became possible, including and perhaps primarily thanks to the fact that our military heroically held all the defense forces for the defense line, in particular on the bakhmut in the direction of luhansk region, donetsk region, this is why, in this regard, i would not expect any fast, sharp, on the side of the defense forces of ukraine . will take place inside the russian federation, unfortunately for the latter, i am a pessimist here in the near future that this will

fundamentally change the war or the attitude of the russians to the war in our favor . i heard against wounds and so on. but now the situation is such that russian society in general is normally and calmly interested in such behavior of collective putin, that is why these conversations that putin is a tyrant, change him and everything will be over, in my opinion, they give way to simplistic approaches , because it was putin who was created by those russians and that russian society that we are now contemplating. probably everyone has seen several videos about the discontent there. the message is not about why we, why are we

going to kill ukrainians in principle, it is about the fact that there are no pads, no socks, poorly worn, and how is it, you didn’t hand us over immediately, they threw something or other in this sense this rain is for a long time as i see it in my opinion, it is definitely significant in terms of information that the russians were knocked out of kherson, it hit the kremlin. they are basically collected by different waves of the people cannon fodder if you want, you can collect as much as you want, they will have problems feeding them and so on, but they, including through the center, nationalizing the war for their own benefit, will try to close this issue, and it is

in this logic that they now it is absolutely necessary to have any negotiations, any freeze, any transfer of the war, or a format so that, let's say, we have a certain pause of two or three months and fix not only fix the currently occupied territories, but also go to certain auctions and, in parallel, preparing until further notice the onset of war. this is how i see the situation in general. no, i will not argue with you here. on the contrary, i think that putin treats all russians internally as they should be treated. if they surrender, why not exploit them? imagine some tyrant who will be a humanitarian and will say oh i feel sorry for the people oh and you and how come they are not warmed oh how come they are not fed i think he is giving the order to mobilize there there is no resistance he says oh yes they are

doing everything right everyone well they went to the front they died on the front on the new ones went to the front and so on and so on and so forth. i just don't have any illusions and i always said that putin behaves as the russian people allow him to behave and there is no other way. if the russian people came out tomorrow they would tell me we will go to the front then they would not have gone to the front if there were a lot of such people and when there were 20 30 40 50 people, but my question is different , volodymyr. look, there are many russians in tbilisi now. those who are not they want to fight, they run away and so on and so on, how much are they irradiated by putin, do they already understand something, being on friendly georgian land, or do they not understand anything,

please ? undergo metamorphosis because there was emigration for various reasons, for example, until 14th year there was a wave of emigration until 24.02 of this year, and then there was emigration, how do they call themselves refugees in quotes ways they happen when there is such a thing, i hear the so-called февраля well, now they are already in february, they are telling about september there, i am not kidding, in the last , the last wave of september, then these are the so-called beglitsi, well , february, then they are the beglitsi, because they were deprived of the crunch of the french bun, i call it in fact, they didn’t call, they were afraid of it, but since september, they were really afraid of it, well, i personally heard how they

say, why are you so upset with us, eh? would it be better if we went to kill in ukraine, then it’s traveling, but i’m just not ready for it there is no this one either really, really, really, there is a loophole, the so -called opposition loophole, those who tried to fight inside the russian federation, but it is so minimal, let's say, that it only emphasizes the rule that we already talked about in georgia, the situation is quite sad with different official figures say that this influx of russians is actually an existential threat to georgia , because i look at it as a quiet or soft, i don't even know the occupation, because, for example, well, i'll give only one example in the studio right now, a single country in the world, it is georgia and where russians are visa-free for 365 days, so imagine how it is for ukrainians, for example

, that is, absolutely and economic reasons, everything is shaky here and other issues, that is, this problem will one day shoot out, and the main question is that in its approach in its approaches, the official tbilisi let's call these approaches so as not to tease moscow, then he is now faced with the fact that such a mass of people is already banal for the contour intelligence body to check them is already difficult simply banal even if there the manager of the middle fold of the relevant services such a task they will technically not be able to do it. now it has fallen a little bit. they are actively socializing here, there are joint co-vortings later under the subsidiary and others. well, the situation is quite like this. well, it is unpleasant for me personally, but for georgia. i find the names so interesting, interesting, and how the the georgians will leave, well, it won't be painless. let's just say, what are the moods among the georgian population, this is how i

understand it, and the establishment is letting it in. it gives 365 days, it says we will not quarrel with moscow, and the people themselves, how do people divide, well, look at a few layers, well, you know how i forgot that realtors and taxi drivers all over the world have no nationality , they all have one size only, and they can differ, and that’s all one issue of growth, valuable rental housing, and for example, when there are cases in the city of rustavi under already in tbilisi, when the georgians were evicting georgian students, it was semi-singles, there were grandmothers in order to raise the price there because the russians or someone else came there, the attitude of the georgians is definitely, despite all their objective hospitality of the nation and so on, that's definitely it. well, wary before that, people gradually understand it, but do you understand all this

business, mmm, in georgia, it’s very interesting, the situation here is such that there is internal political water distribution to the government, in the question there, for example, saakashvili is behind bars, support for the government is falling, but the joint opposition is so impotent that the government calmly solves its problems, er, even flirting with moscow, but in my opinion, the spring is compressed. and the factor of the influx of russians, sooner or later, he will shoot because, well, it's banal, it's obvious, that is, the basis for banal provocations have already been created despite different motivations. those who came, let's say, hope that georgia will become for them an airfield for pickpockets. well, a lot. by the way, someone moves to turkey, it is more comfortable there from an economic point of view, but the size of georgia is 3, 5 million of ukraine at the most, when

250-300 thousand russians do not come, this is normal . the factor is that they are concentrated primarily in two cities around tbilisi and in batumi, and it will be a problem in any way. of course, i have no doubts that the georgians are the issue will decide, but because of the short debt, not in my opinion, the internal policy of the georgian government for 10 plus years of occupation of the territory, or rather the absence of such a policy - it will not be painless, i repeat . the parties that support saakashvili won the elections. would those who are in power still win anyway? no, if it wasn't for leza, the government won tomorrow, and without options, because it would have gained something from it, there is a nuclear electorate of the so-called to hold on to

hatred, what do you want misha to return, nothing can be done with them well, such water distribution, you know how education is trumpists, not trumpists, that’s what we have there, uh, vova petya, well, it’s clear to everyone in armenia, never against robert, it’s the same everywhere, in fact, the government would win now it is precisely because of the absolute disunity and absolute incompetence of the opposition, which cannot even unite around the figure of saakashvili, if he were not to be treated, but the stay in prison of the third president of georgia without a relative, well, it is a shame for the authorities and for georgia in general is what i call the government. the only problem now is that it is objectively just taking time, it is not ready to get out of prison. saakashvili is in that or god forbid another way, well, this is objective joy. thank you very much volodymyr hopchak, military expert, head of the south -caucasian

center branch of the center for the study of army conversion and disarmament from tbilisi informed us that the mood in friendly georgia and the mood there are different and not so favorable for ukraine, let's say so. vitaly kulyk, political scientist, director of the center for the study of civil society problems, we are on the phone with us, we can see him and now we can hear him, but we can see his photo, but not his life , if i may say so, if i offended mr. vitaly, i'm sorry, you know that i treat you with deep respect, nothing it is connected with the internet, i understand, well, let's look at it as usual, broadly, broadly, as you know how to do

it . it is this lack that these days of such super populism of the various trumpian headquarters. and as we have seen for a very long time in italy, such sentiments were in france, in july they were kept in suspense. does this mean that the world is returning to such more or less traditional politics after all please panelka no, i don’t think so, as for me, this trembian trend, which was set by him, continues in many countries of central and western europe, we are observing the strengthening of similar sentiments, they are also in the countries in latin america, south asia, in general, it can be

said that the time of traditional politics is passing and the traditional institutions on which the predictable political actions of the parties that performed their functions were based are also passing . are oriented to er such a style of political behavior as trump, they cultivate similar unpredictability er the ability to make 180° turns the ability to speak in black and white rather than keep agreements er to balance on background levels are allowed to use techniques, all this is now popular in many countries, from a couple

to brazil to canada to great britain to the scandinavian countries, that is, in fact, today, the traditional policy that we remember in the zeros there until the 14th year, it is increasingly moving away to the past because of trumpism will now sprout in new qualities in new new colors and in new forms a p italy see but usually the establishment of any country adapts, so to speak, is appointed to new challenges and changes its design and if he developed - he sees that the population does not like this and because trump comes and criticizes as if on behalf of the population and the establishment and the stem that begins to change in me and say ok, we have

found out the mistakes here, we see that we are wrong let's introduce ourselves a little, a little differently, and already in the next term, we can already see. well, they are behaving differently , uh, baba, they want to please the population, they respond to the challenges posed by the question posed by the population. will continue until then thrombism, as you aptly called it, about the fact that there is a cartoon of trump in different countries. no, i am talking about what is bet on populists bet on such politicians, uh, when hyperlinks, so to speak , or instagram parties, contacts and tik current when hype videos make political but there are big headquarters, traditional campaigning, work with the electorate , meetings, etc., that is, now i am talking about

the methods of trump companies, they are now adopting the league rules. actually, the changes that are taking place in the american party, they clearly illustrate this. people who were and entered politics got positions for trump and from the hands of trump, acting as his direct , continuing his supporters are now distancing themselves from him, using his same methods, but they are already are yours, you are moderates, they are not those old-school trumpists or there are altmas who remained around trump, the same paratroopers who won the florida governorship, which is considered as a likely candidate for the presidency, competing, that is

yes, they change historically, but the style of work and your behavior do not preserve one more question. i think it is very important. i always ask it and i will ask you too, mr. vitaly. what do you think? i know that you have traveled a lot, seen a lot, studied a lot in different parts of the globe, is it on your side? the idea of ​​​​understanding the danger - the existential danger of russia, which is really threatened by unpredictability in the whole world, and it is as if a huge problem is not that they are bad, but the problem is that they are unpredictable, and you and i are fine we understand. i think that the majority of our viewers also think that north korea or iran or

venezuela are not bad because they behave the way they behave, because we can name many countries where everything is not in order either, they say nothing about human rights and democracy and so further, but they are predictable, we understand what they do, how they do it, when they can do it, what to do so that they don't do it, and so on, but these countries have joined them, nuclear russia, we don't know. he says one thing tomorrow, the third after the day after tomorrow tenth, and this does not give the world the opportunity to exist, there is an understanding that something must be done about this in the part of the political elite of the west, such extraordinary world elites have such an understanding, i will not say that it is a general consensus that the majority of the political elite thinks so but in some thinking, thinking parts of the

political elite such an understanding exists. therefore, the scenario of the deconstruction of the russian federation is one of the working scenarios for after the war, that is, russia must be deconstructed, there must be a space of new independent states of such and such an opinion that before such the opinion belonged to a small part of the city , such an extreme right-wing conservative, anti-former anti-communist, and now, in a good sense, a russophobe, at the moment this trend has gone beyond the scope of such ghetto russophobia and has become very, very widespread, and it has taken over the liberal and even the left and an intellectual party. that is, it has already become widespread, and there are many who consider themselves real politicians. those who think of the categories of real politics are already saying that without a final military-political defeat

we are a threat from russia. it will only increase. regardless of what territory it will control in ukraine or somewhere else, this is the understanding and awareness. in my opinion, it has now gone beyond some narrow group and has become. well, not dominant yet. but it is quite widespread and it understanding, it pushes the leadership of many countries, including the countries of the g7 and possibly partly the g20, to take more clear steps to deconstruct russia's restrictions on the fact that they are now saying that they do not want a caraway trial anyway brazil, but even these countries are careful enough in their relations with russia and are not in a hurry to act as a clear ally of putin's muscovites, understanding all the toxicity and what

happened with the russians, they will also have problems with the challenges that come from russia. have a global character and not a geopolitical one, this is a matter of security for all mankind and not the fate of military-political blocs or because of dominance, because russia is just a terrorist, and a terrorist who plays with nuclear weapons, he threatens them with weapons, they actually mine the track and of course, it is necessary to make a decision from russia, taking into account that it is a terrorist country, with a terrorist country, it is necessary to act through isolation and maximum reconstruction, then one more important question is inexorably looming, a meeting at the ball of 20 countries with the most efficient economy, let's say so, although maybe not here, not in efficiency, but in the specific gravity of this economy, and there

will be a meeting between biden and xi jinping, that is, the leader of the united states and the leader of china. what do you think they are going to talk about and will they talk about russia, and will we be able to somehow move the rather neutral position of sydzenpin to his side ap biden, please remember, at least he is counting, biden believes that he will be able to make sure all the calls increase the pressure on russia to go for more cooperation with the west on the issue of the localization of barriers that go with russia, i think that this is a little exaggerated idea of ​​​​the corridor of maneuver for china symbinna, this is unlikely to work, the only thing that i hope for is certain prerequisites to talk about this, this is what both biden and xi jinping will do at least sit down once again he will emphasize once again uh no

uh, a significant remark about the impossibility of using nuclear sbu weapons in military conflicts and this will already be said clearly and unambiguously as a message for russia, that is, there are things that putin will not be allowed to play with this is the first position the second position of course they started talking about russia, but in china the point is that the states are the owners if you say take 100%. all the negotiations between china and the rest of the states that er the negotiations of the biden sizinginia will be shared thus 20% about russia and ukraine and 80% of taiwan about the economy about global light order about global deterrence about the future configuration of the non

-proliferation of nuclear weapons in the world, etc. that's what they will talk about and it worries china and washington too, and russia - that's right, it's an irritant, it's a threat but this is the fact that it is only a part of the overall picture. yes, i understand it, but it’s just that i understand all the calls. i kind of understand, or so i hope that i understand his politics, but i have the impression that he is drifting, that he is drifting, that he still drifts a little bit. in biden's side. but do you believe it now? i'm going on a speculative note, and for a minute we literally started talking about an ultimatum to putin, about the fact that he was already told that by november 15, the policy must be changed, something must be done with ukraine, putin is looking for peace, and so on and so forth.

that's why you believe all these speculations, because none of us have held a candle to putin, we don't know what's in his head, but you believe that there are arranged negotiations that are so underground and that putin is inclined to actually end the war on the in western conditions, in the west, in the western dash, in ukrainian conditions. i think that such attempts are really taking place. he receives similar messages from his visavi from the west, from the countries of the third world , and tries to be mediators with the vatikas from qatar or from hutsul arabia, a cockroach, but these are not those arguments or are not these e-e messages to which he will listen to putin's policies