well, people, as always, that is, there was a trick, that is, it was asking for everything, that is, i can say, but a fight, that is, all this is asking. америке быты какзать yes, i looked, he says that when in america well, that's the end, it's important, it's a senior melody, that i asked him against my economic interests, against my salary, and i'll vote for and what's on the login because i hear the flags so and so nezdevych schools i yearn for that is что big avrat face этот день what is the roulette really important and that you will not defend forever or act somehow из этого верит and this is completely different is it true that now, in addition to the fact that the economic situation of taxation divides in a certain way people who want to vote for the program proposed by the republicans and, accordingly, the

opposite one proposed by the democrats, an important issue is women's right to abortion, this is a very controversial topic in american society. we have one of the most unpopular laws on introduction and it also depends, which means the state has the right to solve this question itself and not long ago it changed, that is, a-a would mucho that how we send to new york, and california, the idea was that it was possible to get or have an abortion for 9 months even and on a bone day pregnancy, it is possible to still have an abortion without problems, alegon, and well, i think a lot that you hear a lot, it’s not how you know it’s illegal , uh, they stole it, like in europe, and out of it, a lot of people wanted to change it, and our supreme sudder, what can i read? he has the right to change it . the law and because of this owns 40 democratic parties of leonika by name, this is a

very important topic, and i think that quite a few of them came and came for the day, chose and voted against, will communicate against the party of categories and against constipation and voted voted for democratic parties that they took and after looking here, legal or everything or one more task, i still want you to understand it, if you like. here you are talking about this history of the cathedral, but it even divides people now, not by republicans, but by democrats, already completely by the second lines, don't republicans risk when they support similar decisions, then they turn out to be cut off from part of their own electors ? well, i'm sorry to explain. here's how we've always considered it a great achievement of donald trump that he was able to change the composition of the supreme court. yes, this is almost the main achievement of the presidency, the second composition of the supreme court the advantages of conservative judges

, this court now makes a serious decision that pleases the republican language, and many voters perceive these decisions as wine as a result, there are those who believe that for the first three months this should be the law of the americans, that is, for what is being done by 70% of the americans, something too . maybe 20%. and then i have all the christian ideas that depend on the situation, it depends on how it happened. the stupidity of the people in america, what did you decide, yes

, exactly, what did you decide wrong? well, anyway, we see that they have already scored, so well done , they will choose what, that is, this is the sky. всё републикации и назад well, when the election was better, it was time to choose who to vote for. the majority of people voted for their personal economic interests. thank you very much, mr. jason. jason, an american political technologist, was from we talked directly about the results of the midterm elections in the united states of america and we are moving further towards the economic bloc, we will have serhiy fursa on the call now, investment banquet, congratulations mr. serhiy, congratulations, congratulations, and we have to talk with you in detail about this alienation of the enterprise i don't know why it can be called

nationalization because they can be returned after the war, but what is happening in principle and why is such a large number of nationalized enterprises ? you can’t say anything except that lawyers will be able to figure out why such a big bankrupt cannot work and the state decided with such a simple solution to just make him work part-time and take it out. in this way, i will become bankrupt. yes, although i don’t know, you issue the same thing . you can work, at the same time the russians are attacking our energy infrastructure and transformers are needed, the company is bankrupt, it can’t work, the state comes and says everyone to the garden, i’ll take it, and there’s still a plus

grigoriysha, the owner, who is russian, has a double problem, motor sich, the problem of boguslaev, ukrnafta and ukrtatnafta, fedko, who apparently does not play a very clean game, even during the war, there were rumors that he, uh, because of his activities, received a lot of funds, and the state decided to create a vertically integrated company where ukrnafta has licenses and there is an oil field ukrtetnafta there is a kremenchug oil refinery what is the truth of the conversation and ukrnafta also has a gas station diesel is very necessary for the armed forces it is necessary for the army and the state have decided that we will create a vertically integrated integrated campaign, we will start the process, we will surely rebuild the kremenchug oil refinery and in some way, we will also protect it from russian missiles and we will be happy, mr. serhiy. can

we also call this partly deoligarization, well , again, i don't like that one the name geologization is used in ukraine because it is an imitation of the fight against the oligarchs, it is real for recreation - this is the rule of law, in fact , the fight against corruption and then the oligarchs they simply turn into a big business that operates according to the law and then there are no problems with them. therefore, these are unpleasant decisions for the oligarchs. let's do it, but i called it de-oligarchization. are you sure that the government, which begins to manage enterprises, manages them more effectively than the owners? you mentioned about paint says, as far as i remember, in 2022 it already started to produce some trucks, machines began to be used in the military industry, how much is there a guarantee that all this will happen again, it continues now, always look at the state the owner is bad, this is a priori, but now when we

discuss the painting of kraz, the bankruptcy procedure and that is why it does not work as it should work, judging by everything, have problems arisen with this in the state, which during the war needs a lot of equipment, and that is why they came to kraz due to the fact that this company is currently under bankruptcy proceedings, mr. serhiy, some economic experts write that after the transfer of ukrnafta and ukrtatnafta to the state , the value of naftogaz's assets may decrease by uah 15 billion. do you agree with this at all? i don't see, look, ukrnafta is actually the property of naftogaz. it's a fact, yes, that is, 50% of ukrnafta was owned by naftogaz. this is the only ukrnafta and naftogaz. if now ukrnafta is taken out of naftogaz and fully subordinated to some

ministry, for example, it is purely mathematical. naftogaz will become smaller or ukrnaft will be withdrawn from it, there is a separate story , that is, if the nationalization of all is 100%. and if it turned out that naftogaz shares were felt, well, if the state takes away state companies, if it happened, well, mathematically yes, but you are there and the state and there is the state, what do you think will happen to the ukrainian infrastructure? in principle, now, to what extent we can prevent this russian plan to completely destroy it, this is a billion- dollar question, no one has an answer. this is a competition you know how this is a socialist competition of its time in russian rockets on one side and on the other side of our energy that restores and air defense that tries to cover it up so who will win in this competition we have understood which team we are rooting for but predicting who will win, i don’t know, i just

don’t know how many missiles, for example, the russians have left and how many missiles they are ready to spend on destroying our infrastructure, and here it depends whether it will be 50 missiles or 150. and we don’t know that, so what about the slowdown inflation, serhiy, the national bank has such a forecast, i don’t know whether you will call it comforting or not. however, up to 2025, which will reduce the inflation level to 5%. do you think there are any more optimistic options in ukraine this year and next year, inflation will be high will not grow significantly and somehow there is no magic wand to keep us from normal inflation, it is not only the war that affects it, it also affects the general world inflation, which is a record now in the world and this year you are in the east and next year will also be high and we will sell or inflation plus, one way or another

, due to the war there is a certain devaluation of the hryvnia, this also affects prices. and even the fact that the russians are destroying our energy infrastructure, the fact that we have a blackout, this also leads to additional price growth is therefore clear. the 22nd and 23rd years will be years with a high inflation rate of 30%. it will be unpleasant , it lowers our standard of living, of course, but to cope with it. well, they are difficult to prevent. what will happen next depends on many factors, including how long it will last. moreover, the economy can generally exist in such a period. well, i would said the political military uncertainty but thanks to the state and that even now we see a very significant flexibility of the ukrainian dinner there is a drop of 39% this month but in general this year and eyes -35 - 30%. and this fall has already happened, of course here a lot now depends

on whether or not we will have electricity because as a proper enterprise what can they work for but if we remain at the same level of destruction of the energy infrastructure as it is now until next year even we can expect economic growth sergey, do we currently have options to somehow support the average small business there, is it at all impossible in the conditions of war to consume you go to a restaurant you go to a store you go to i had a small coffee shop, you consume, you buy what ukrainian business produces, this is how you support it. this is the only possible way for us now to support business. we have always said that there is certain pressure on business from the state. now, during a full-scale war, it has decreased. how do you observe? no, well. it has not decreased. and i, in principle, evaluate the possibilities. if you want to create new jobs, the situation. yes, because this is also during the war, they will be able to create new

jobs because jobs arise as a result of investments, someone invests as a result something begins to be produced for this, jobs are created while the war continues, by and large no one will invest in ukraine, of course there are certain exceptions that apply to some, you know, i’m such a joke what should not happen in the country, there is always someone who will grow up for sale, but this exception is still ongoing war, no one will risk investing , which means that we cannot talk about creating new jobs. well, what about people who are now abroad and how can they return home in such a situation. if you don't have a place to work here, it's difficult. well if you ask if i have a prescription no, i don't have a prescription now it helps a lot that many people can work remotely and wherever a person is and in today's economy very often she can work on a conditional basis ecuador to the united states to france this remote work is now very

helps and by the way, the pandemic prepared us for war because a lot of poor people learned to work in a decentralized manner, they learned to work, so they gave away ukrainians who are now unemployed and it will be difficult in ukraine to find a job before it ends is the best solution, well, it’s something both ukrainians and those ukrainians both in ukraine and those in poland and the czech republic can find the only recipe so effective is remote work, but the government, you know, mr. serhiy, calls for the opposite people to return, but perhaps it is not very right in such conditions when no jobs are offered, eh, look, for us after the war, the biggest problem will be the population, the biggest problem. we will have a lack of people, and therefore the problem of the war, the longer it lasts, the more people will stay abroad because they will simply arrange their lives and they will not want to return, that is the

government's call. i think they are working because of this, i have not heard such calls at first. by the way, but if they exist, they have a long-term perspective, because people are the main thing, and in fact, after the end of the war the state will face a very significant challenge to regulate migration and ensure that migrants go to ukraine in the first place, for example simplify the right to obtain a work permit in ukraine for foreigners, it is very difficult to obtain legally and many other things, the depopulation will be significant for our country in the economic sense for the next 10 years. and we, the people who will be abroad , they can bring some extremes to the economy of countries in which they will not live. well, that's how it was. by the way, the family used to help sending money here, investing here, this is an important foreign investor, a person who works abroad, but how is it that now it works both ways, on the one hand,

wage earners send money to ukraine as before, and on the other hand, many ukrainians who live for at the border, they spend money that they either earn in ukraine or receive a pension in ukraine or are used to saving in ukraine, and this leads to the washing out of our economy about 2 billion dollars each month, that is, people no longer keep money in their own accounts, relatively speaking, people just live, for example in existence have a card of a ukrainian bank have money in a ukrainian bank and spend it in spain this is a capital outflow , in essence, this is what even the money that comes out of the ukrainian economy goes, for example, to the spanish yes well, they don't even have other opportunities because they don't have other savings except those that are in ukraine, that's right, yes, we're not blaming, we're not saying that they don't understand the reality objectively. i understand that such tools have always fueled the economy like government bonds , all this does not work now. why do i applications have never

fueled the economy, bonds were a tool borrowed for the government, now it's just that if the government borrowed through a bond, well, first of all, not to the foreign market, no one gave, no one would lend now in ukraine it is simply impossible to get foreign money because of military risks and in ukraine the ministry of finance also does not know a lot of money and therefore now it is quite logical that they borrow from official creditors or take grants from the americans as if they do not have to be returned or they take money from the european union where there is a loan for 30 years under 0%. and in this way the same budget deficit is financed, this is how money goes into ukraine, mr. serhiy, thank you very much for your answers, as always professional serhiy fursa and the investment banker were with us directly in connection with this, we will take a short break in a few moments and return to eten with mr. vitaly portnikov. let's see how people

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. we continue the program of the saturday political club with you. vitaly portnikov, let's move on to our topics, where mr. vitaliy will already answer my question, let's start with the topic of another attempt dogan wants to persuade zelenskyi from the dough to the table of talks with putin p vitaliy we every time in the saturday political club we discuss some new initiatives of rzhep and the president of turkey this time, what do they lead to in your opinion? time to maintain his reputation as a person who is between the warring parties, but today when he was flying from uzbekistan, he managed to make sensational statements to turkish journalists about how america and other western countries are attacking russia and

are defending themselves and everyone is now commenting on it. you see , erdoğan supported putin, speaks slogans in russian, shows propaganda, on the one hand, shows on the other hand, everyone scores where it was. this conversation is the board of a plane flying to samarkand, this is the summit of the organization of the country's ecclesiastical resz, that is, in fact, the former soviet republics, where the enormous influence of russia and of course, russia does not like it very much when the head of the people's republic of china or the president of turkey, erdogan, essentially oust them from what they call their traditional sphere influence that if you say exactly how the kremlin says it, the soft underbelly of central asia is the soft underbelly, i don’t even know how to translate it, you have to think about it. and for me, this is an established expression, and that means the cardigan came directly to this underbelly to teach people e- it is life, moreover, they announced that the turkish republic of northern

cyprus, which is recognized only by ankara, is now an observer, all organizations, russia perceives all this painfully. well, what to calm them down, it's a sure measure. you know such a painkiller. well, of course, we want you here. move, but here we will say that you are generally quite right when you have relations with america here, calm down, you know how a wife, when she takes money from her husband, says oh, you are beautiful today, you look so beautiful, your clothes are all and in general, he played football so well that everything is fine, but there is no salary. and these are known family conflicts, and that’s it. in essence, erdogan plays such a game with putin all the time. why is it profitable for us to receive the money of russian oligarchs and russian officials now ? we will be in such a special position with putin. quarrel but at the same time, his interests are not interests , he starts with many points with him, they are just rivals, this is syria, this is central asia, this is ultimately ukraine, because we must remember that the issue of crimea for erdogan is generally

an internal political principle. well, that's why he is all the time the slogan of negotiations is put forward so that, first of all, the turkish voter sees that his president is a global player, but we can see what the press secretary of the president of the russian federation, dmytro piskov, said this week. he said that the goals of special operations can be achieved at the table victory, but this means that ukraine can, in principle , capitulate if it wants to. i believe that every time these people talk about the goals of special operations , they deny any possibility of a diplomatic solution to the problems of nuclear weapons - you also see this perfectly more than you and i. because he has such statements put on the table an hour after they speak, but he will talk about the possibility of negotiations until the very end, why, in principle, he can hope that guys from the moment putin matures to the need a diplomatic solution, and then he will really need some mediator of people who can

be mediators between russia and ukraine, even between russia, ukraine and the west, there really are almost none of them, you see that everyone is now claiming this role for the future, because it is clear that these are two different camps, well, china cannot be a mediator, firstly, the son will never agree to the united states, so it is only then to china, too big a player to be a mediator, so he is already excluded lukashenka, who in principle could be the mediator, by the way, he became the aggressor, he wasted all his real chances for the future , so it remains who is erdoğan, the waldogans , in a month others will appear a competitor, this is a vanilla tariff, when he becomes the prime minister of israel, i think that the first thing i will think about is the foreign policy tariff that he can act in such a role again, playing his game in the

middle east, relations with russia, relations with ukraine, relations and states, he also knows how to play on such chessboards, compete, they will begin to compete because they are also there, in principle, where to compete, but so far, the other day, there is none, and it is not known how much he will succeed. do you remember that mediation in general did not start at all, but with naftalibenne, the prime minister of israel, who was in the office at the time the war began, also understands this. he watches it carefully because it is clear that they are throwing around natalie bened, he is what is called a political top- ranking person, he will be forced to fight for this role, you may have recently . at some point when a mediator will be needed , a meeting place, there are not many of them, but istanbul, maybe jerusalem again, if you don’t lose

it, the vatican will be able to balance to a lesser extent, because you see that pope francisco cannot balance as well as dogan, it is strange, but it is not very strange, but it is one way or another so, in principle , all this is completely understandable to me, and i will therefore say yes, i have never been fascinated as a nagan cardan rigid, i said a politician who, on the one hand, runs an electoral country where there is a choice where there is competition in the media and where there are opposition parties on the other hand in this country traditional power structures are stronger than democracies on the one hand you can write an article to the newspaper that you don't like all this on the other hand i will come tomorrow and put you in prison for 15 years absolutely legal accusation and nobody gave you a million cases in turkey now for the letter of the opposition to kemal, but according to journalists, even according to

the chief sanitary doctor of turkey, who wanted to understand whether the turkish army uses chemical weapons in syria. they say all this, these people can't. what can't be washed away, there are tribunes , there is an opportunity. - scholz, he is much less limited in his capabilities, which you need to see soberly, you need to understand that erdagan is still with an ally of the russians, with an ally, he will never be an ally of ukraine, he can be to a greater extent but you are not to the end, he will always play his game and ordigans have the idea that he is, after all, the heir of imperial policy and not just the policy of such an average country in eurasia. no, he is looking at

turkey, and it is not located on a small territory, especially after its economic turnaround , which was so strong that it was not a country that 100 years ago was one from such main forces of this whole world concert and he wants to play the first violin in this concert i always rely on turkey at least the issue of the release of our prisoners because turkey throughout the war it also helps the azov people in ours, and thanks to turkey, including them, they were. well, i say well, this is the effect of this intermediary role , because in any situation there should always be someone as a platform, you can talk even about unpleasant things, by the way, switzerland is neutral although now it is no longer so neutral, it is true that it has become sufficiently powerful on the side of ukraine, at least in accepting our refugees and with help there, it can not be such a country in the history of switzerland

, some strange political reversal took place again it was during this war, which again showed how the world has changed, switzerland really managed to maintain neutrality during quite serious bloody wars, and during the second world war, but switzerland is forced, why is it behaving like this now, it is forced to weigh its reputational risks associated with the consequences of the second world war when, in principle, it became obvious somewhere there, you know directly after 20-30 years, there 40 after the second world war, that the swiss economic success is largely connected with the money of depositors of jewish origin from many countries who were simply killed, they kept their savings in swiss banks precisely because it was a neutral country and the swiss state managed not only to keep this money, but also to put it at the

service of the swiss economy, but it was not their money, they took advantage of this situation, this is not very the porter looks beautiful - they know very well that it has not been simplified. yes, you have not started any payments there, look for relatives, some payments from the state of israel, but here it is. the feeling that it is not quite neutrality is a taste, it has remained and the swiss, who are proud of their democracy and their traditions, do not want to be such a nation, that's what the current president of switzerland said. that's why they introduced all the sanctions introduced by the european union, they don't supply weapons, but sanctions against russia. what are the sanctions introduced by switzerland, sometimes more a disaster for many serious people, so-called between all the sanctions of the european union and great britain