to fight and risk hmm the lives of your soldiers but nevertheless, you know this is a popular story and it is often talked about on many broadcasts , having that experience of the war that already exists when ukrainians use ukrainian weapons and the weapons of our western partners they can absolutely knock out the russians and liberate whole cities, large cities such as kherson, in your opinion, as a person interested in military history, we know about this uh, so that it would happen if nato dared to enter in some way in a confrontation with the russians let them on the territory of ukraine with their troops with their troops some kind of modulation of what can happen that the north atlantic alliance in itself is not just a defense-military organization, it is a

defense-political military-political organization if we return to the realities in which uh, this the alliance was being created, we understand that instead of the war ending in 1945, solving all issues, in fact the confrontation between the soviet union and the western world only intensified and it was so critical that there was no other way out the countries of western civilization did not have the ability to ensure security by their own forces, and i want to remind you that the nato charter consists of 14 articles, and today we talked about why the fifth article is not being applied, which actually reflects the principle of complementarity, which consists in the fact that the article states that countries in the event of an attack on one of its members, they will come to the defense of this member until the organization of the united nations as a single worldwide system for ensuring

peace and order cannot take adequate measures to maintain peace and security, i.e. nato, after all, under the first, second, third, and fourth articles provides for the communication component of the negotiations, after all, giving the opportunity in the most critical situation to use diplomacy, to use negotiations, but you know, uh, you remembered the shelling of the yavoriv training ground when you were in zheshov, in fact , the rocket that fell near the border, it fell at a distance of 7 km, this time it fell at a distance of five or six kilometers there, but on the other hand, you and i are talking about what the reaction was in nato, how did our politicians react, but we miss the reaction in the environment of our adversary, in particular, in the environment of the military. i would

like to tell you that the russians are promoting the leadership. it is certain that the lower echelons actually felt the stress , and this can be seen from the information in the publics that are being discussed, some of them were already ready to give up because they understood what threats they were facing. shelling of ukraine when i am in kyiv representatives of the pontiff shelling of kyiv when the un secretary general is in ukraine shelling of kyiv and ukraine when the president of germany is hiding in bomb shelters shelling of kyiv when higher officials of various countries of the world are here shows only one thing sooner or later the

quantitative arrogance of the russians will turn into a high-quality confrontation, and we simply find on the way to this gap the opportunities that nato, the western world of civilization, has developed for discussion in order to find points of contact, he in fact, it is emerging, that is, education is already breaking in , patience and it cannot last long, because in fact we can already understand with you that after bali a certain parity has been achieved in the interests of the western world and the eastern world, in particular, the elections in the united states are over, it is already clear what the internal politics will be, the elections are over, the company meeting is over china's synthepius was re-elected. it has a certain internal political stability and the world is beginning to solve more global issues. but they are of an economic and social nature. i will remind you that we we stand on the threshold of the three biggest global crises

, this is the first and challenges. planet in 1952 the population of the earth was two and a half billion in 70 years it actually became four times more these people want to eat consume products there are relevant issues of energy conservation and so on we understand that financial and credit system, a currency system that was only really created in the post-war world, it lacks perfection, it cannot provide for all those needs and respond adequately to the challenges of the modern world and the energy that exists today and resources, it is also limited in terms of population growth as growth in accordance with the amount of consumption the development of alternative sources of energy directly finding new ways and forms of ensuring economic sustainable development is an even greater

challenge than even military actions because if we will look at the calculations carried out by the united nations organization, we understand that it is possible that somewhere in 35 years, 40 glaciers will part and our planet will simply become a question of water consumption and this conflict introduced by russia to the civilized world it is delaying the ability of countries to solve those questions that are much more important or the ambitions of an individual man who set himself the goal of aggrandizing himself or going down in history medieval ambitions i believe that what we know now and understand the information that we will receive military environment this missile fell on poland, this is the crack that very quickly, we would appreciate as a witness in the near future, will destroy russia from the middle, because they realized that both nato and the fact that the

games immediately ended, the negotiations ended, the falsifications ended, and the fakes of today's court verdict in the netherlands ended is quite significant. i would like to emphasize to you that this is not the hague court. in the sense of the un court, this is not an international criminal court, which is also located in gaza, this is also a local court, which is by agreement the appropriate international procedure based on the activities of a joint group of investigators conducted an exhaustive study involving all possible means of proving the involvement of the russian federation in the mass murder of citizens on a civilian aircraft and not in this case it does not matter whether they are shelling a civilian object in kyiv plane in the sky 8 years ago confirms the only thing that russia is a threat, its activity is the management of one village, the

consequences are not foreseeable why because any system it characterized by the processes that take place in it, and these processes can be of only two types , the world did not invent another one, there are managed processes and unmanaged processes, and what is happening with the russian federation implies that this country lacks stability and predictability of its own internal development, and it is actually dangerous itself on my own, i will tell you that somehow it is so if we look at the news exactly five years ago in sochi, putin met with the al-basher president of sudan, for which the international criminal court in the same asia twice issued an arrest warrant and this sudanese president is now in prison, russia shot down the mh17 plane with its own forces, just like gaddafi, who was also issued an arrest warrant by the international criminal court, was involved in the terrorist attack in losbury when a

boeing was shot down over the english sky and foreign people were also killed citizens, how did gaddafi graduate, how did albeyshir, who is currently in prison, the same is waiting not only for the head of the russian federation, but for the entire military leadership why because during this time what has passed since the second world war the war after the nurban process, after what happened in roland in yugoslavia, the world developed a huge number of tools for bringing to justice high-ranking officials of the state , the top military leadership of these countries for committing crimes against humanity, for committing crimes of genocide, for committing crimes of a military nature, and most importantly, for committing crimes of aggression and ukraine today initiates the creation of a tribunal regarding the aggression committed by the russian federation, i will remind you that already on february 26, 22 ukraine appealed to the international court of justice of the united nations with an appeal to initiate a case on the commission of

genocide, and the international court of justice of the united nations made a preliminary decision. it appealed to the russian federation through the means of diplomatic communication to refrain from the use of weapons by the military on civilian objects, the use of weapons on civilians, but we see that even at the level of this institution, which proactively applies to the russian federation in advance, we have bucha, we have irpin, we have those atrocities that are currently being investigated on the territory that has been released that is, russia does not listen to the rights, russia does not listen to the best practices and provide opportunities for joint development, and according to another option, i will put it in its place and reach the moment when it will be pacified . that the world is already developing the principles of russia's pacification, which will include the first definition of the international legal status. it is certain that the elimination and

betrayal of un security, because it does not give the opportunity to vote on key issues. the second establishment clear control over the nuclear potential of the russian federation. by the way, i have a reservation about the fact that you have 6,000 charges, what are they, they cannot be identified, they are identified, modern means of control make it possible to track the number of rounds fired by each soldier per square kilometer, so the time for the russians to come to their senses has already begun to move in the reverse direction and it is their question to decide now in what context their country will develop. thank you. pancharnyk probably spoke about this, i wonder if this is really the case. the fear that would have existed during the collapse of the soviet union, that many countries, many governments will have these nuclear warheads under their control. well, in the end, they were not in kazakhstan, right, on the territory of ukraine, in belarus and

it was not right for kazakhstan not to confuse, not to confuse nuclear strategic weapons, well, these are strategies, that is, to attack, because its warheads and projectiles are different things, where from russia they are, no one knows, i am the nuclear triad , it is so active, it intervenes first, even researched now well, it may be there somewhere, who should answer here, please, the nuclear triad is what you launch from the air and mines, this is nuclear land and from underground this is the nuclear triad, this is a strategic weapon, emphasizes the strategic, let's say h 101, which fired at us there there can be a nuclear warhead of different kilo-tonnage - this is a strategic weapon. and there is an artillery complex, two f7 pion d20 and 2s5g hyacinth, but three, three guns can fire nuclear ammunition, and there are also two s-4 tulip actively reactive mortars, it can also stand nuclear

mine is two and a half kilotons, and here i do not share the opinion of my colleagues. what is known is not known because it is hidden so so hidden that the big question is how to take it under control in the strategic part, i agree 100%, it is not difficult, it is not difficult, but here these projectiles of problems, you are rude, i am correct. sorry, maybe this is where there is not enough competence in this matter. but for that, we invite you to our broadcasts that after the conditional collapse of the russian federation, a situation may arise that in the territory that will be there conditionally under the control of ramzan kadyrov there will be tactical nuclear warheads, it is possible, it is possible , the risk is to understand nuclear munitions, because if everything is absolutely clear in terms of nuclear strategic warheads, that is, in terms of projectiles, the question is because projectiles in a combat position were not used

anywhere, and in the end nuclear weapons were used fully once hiroshima and nagasaki and by the way, two times because there is also the so-called training under the goat name of snowball in 1954 a little-known phenomenon at the orenburg training ground blew up a full-fledged nuclear 37 kiloton seems warhead and zhukov sent almost 40,000 people here and there to the zone by and large, this is the use of nuclear weapons, there is still no complete information on what actually happened there . place, but we can, any person, including the subjective factor , be wrong. and actually, this is what issues a warning. i think that, in principle, according to modern methods and means of control of identification and monitoring according to various types of weapons, and nuclear ones, in particular, they are a

priority for the life of control measures, these weapons are tactical and strategic, they are subject to identification, the most difficult thing is to take into account this human factor, and under the condition that the probability of uncontrollability of any economic, social, and environmental processes in russia is very high, therefore that actually active management and a significant level of corruption led russia to the point where it is collapsing from the middle and this is the biggest threat to the world and in particular to us as we are the closest neighbors for this state because yes let's talk a little and agree on the fact that we need to keep russia asleep well, but i understand mr. stetsky, the question you have is not what to keep. i understand that the west can have a strategy in this context, understanding that no one knows where all those nuclear warheads are are tactical, what do they need for this, even if they want to destroy russia, then for this they need a

transitional e-e leader. which well, together with him, they will do this audit, well, in simple words, and only after that it can fall apart. but i think what would really be the simplest thing would be well, to understand the logic, let's assume that the united states of america weakens russia and turns it into a slightly different state than the one it is now . the same as replacing putin with another figure. i don’t think how to do it, i don’t know how the americans themselves, firstly, there is no figure , secondly, how to put this figure in putin’s place without a military defeat of russia, there is also no answer to this, but i also agree that the americans are acting that there bashtep well, they are a pragmatic nation, theirs is pragmatic, the circumstances did not work out, we act as we act, if other circumstances agree, we will act in a different way. so, i am simply starting from

what is the strategic interest of ukraine. and it is in destroying russia and the fact that the circumstances are not like this now does not mean that we should not talk about it. well, for example, let's see how it is possible to control the current russia in this form. russia, led by putin, would be impossible to control much easier to control what is divided into russia, then the european part, relatively speaking, as a watchdog controls the militarily strong ukraine and the turkic-speaking world looks to the south. and the question arises of what to do in the urals , and what to do there. for the americans, it is like death to imagine that, for example, it falls under the control of china. well, it is a disaster for them, but if you look at it, i don't know about geopolitics, do you remember the coincidence of zinsky and his big chessboard?

in a different form he did not write like that but if the united states of america comes to an agreement with china try the polar world russia will inevitably become a geopolitical crisis inevitably in what form is another question but russia becomes a prize for both of them and then you have to well well now really imagine the combination but it seems to me that the ukrainians as a nation are most interested from the point of view of their security in the fact that russia is not just weakened, it will then become stronger, but if it is divided, it should be promoted at all levels, from the president of ukraine to civil society native to the disintegration and disintegration and controlled disintegration of russia, this is in our interest. we must say this, and we have allies there, we have allies of the united states of america, we have allies of great britain, they are not many now , because the argument against the disintegration of russia now outweighs the arguments in favor of its disintegration. this is how it is

now, but water sharpens the stone. i once said that no one believed in the fall of the berlin wall a month before it fell, and valensa had told, but the revolutionaries thought differently and she took it and fell. therefore, anything can happen. we simply have to look for arguments at different levels that play in favor of the fact that the controlled disintegration of russia is in the interests of both ukraine and the western world, and we must look for it, because look what is happening. america does not want disintegration and rapid the defeat of russia for one reason, but china also does not want the rapid fall of russia. this is because he believes that in this case the west and the united states will become very strong. so, the two main players are not thinking as we would like, let's fix it well on today and we are moving on now oksana yurynets president volodymyr zelenskyi announced this in indonesia at a ball at this meeting or 20 as he

said g19 ah the ukrainian formula for peace consists of 10 points let's look at them one way or another on the summary of our broadcast everything- anyway, let's talk about what zelensky was talking about, radiation and nuclear safety, next point, food security, energy security, the release of all prisoners and deportees , the implementation of the un charter and the restoration of the territorial integrity of ukraine and the world the procedure for the withdrawal of russian troops and the cessation of hostilities, justice, ecocide, the need for immediate protection of nature, the prevention of escalation and the fixation of the end of the war, somehow it must happen, and the president also added that these points can be fulfilled very quickly, for some, as he said, it can take several months, and some can already directly

immediately in a few days to implement it and here when you pan-stetsky said that russia at the beginning of the broadcast that russia will go to the end and now it is going to the end before the broadcast our main we talked with ostap drozdov, and he analyzed somewhere, including what he stated, zelenskyi said that this is how it looks like ukraine is going to the end, that is, now we are in this process that we are going to the end and we will not give in to anything. the question is how we will be inclined by what actions will not lead to something i don't know let's sum up somewhere and share your thoughts oksana yurynets when we say and what will we do, how will we do if we get down to such a simple field and today is international student day and it is important because our today's youth is very special, in addition to studying. today, sacrificing their lives, they are also fighting in the east of the country, protecting

our future today, and i will tell you frankly that those who have knowledge and skills are important for us, and there are people here who have also joined during the last three months and this is every year from year to year, and we are planning such a simulation of the nato parliamentary assembly, we are talking about euro-atlantic integration , we are also preparing as specialists, mr. petro also took part in this, giving his knowledge, these are different people from different parts of the world who prepare our youth, and thanks to the support of the agent of the social interest protection network of the lviv regional council on saturday, it will take place in lviv. it was in kyiv , now it will be in lviv with the support of our and the government and parliamentarians and our friends from abroad, and young people will talk about the problems that have happened now and about shelling and about reparations and about confiscation and about the adoption of a resolution at the un actually about a-a what will happen, for example, to the russian assets of the bank center, what will the congress do i.e. today

it is necessary to train replacements for people who will deal with the collapse of russia, including because it is a long process. and this break, which we may have for the sake of victory, is precisely the time when it is necessary to train new people, a new elite who will be able to fight and defend why it is so important because you need to have certain knowledge of history, you need to understand not tactics on strategy, and you need to understand that we should already have this in our country, we talk a lot about how much we can be stronger, so we should understand well all these processes, it was once difficult for me to explain what the parliamentary assembly of nata was when he appeared. everything was understood immediately, and i will tell you frankly that it is very important that today hm. many young people are very conscious. choose regardless of the profession they have chosen, whether they are historians, internationalists, or economists. they are very clearly aware of their mission in the state , they understand that they have to learn medical skills

, medical tactical assistance, military skills if they want to have a high-quality successful career, and i will tell you frankly that this is important because that ukraine is a country that can teach today, and i will tell you that with all the support of the documentation center, i will have a business trip then on the 28th and until the second of december at the nato headquarters, together with the lviv vectors universities of ukraine, where it is precisely about euro-atlantic education for our youth as an integral component of preparing this elite of those people who will be conscious and will change and will build future countries is very important , therefore, at the moment, we need to understand and develop different scenarios, this tree solutions is a different approaches and do not exclude the fact that something must be done afterwards, these are parallel processes that must be engaged in constantly, and it is necessary to be very well aware of each what, what are you doing today, every evening, ask yourself what i did today for

ukraine, for victory, and for the armed forces and then it seems to me that the answer will be completely different, and none of us will do our work, and it must be untied gordian knot, but we must understand that our participation a-a is mandatory and actually counterinformative, that is, as of today as a large ukrainian team, and each of us must work on this, and we are entrepreneurs in our places, paying taxes, looking for new markets, ukrainian buckwheat through lithuania costs six times cheaper than directly from ukraine when it goes to the united states. until now, through belarus or we have to understand russia that today the mission of parallel processes of protecting our national interests and seeking this ukrainian interest is very important, that is, as of today, knowledge of skills in that field in those directions that needed to strengthen the state must work and of course, thanks to the armed forces of ukraine, they do their work so effectively that it should inspire this courage and maybe

inspire our partners to help ukraine even more so that the formula is victorious so that we have the opportunity to meet our spring as he said, eh, victor, after all, let there be this victory, let there be this victoria, let us have this victory. because in fact, we really need it, we really need a quick victory because we are getting exhausted because because a lot of people suffer. we don't know a lot about all these fates that exist in those liberated territories. it's terribly scary, but do you understand what injuries we receive, and all together we are in a conditionally safe lviv , even after the art shelling, we still have some security here and conditionally, we still have more plans and opportunities, so unity will be the strength of the whole country. when we all unite and work for the victory of our country, this is a true word to you, especially in the context of those proposals from president zelensky, conditions of peace ukrainian i'm sure somewhere here it

sounded a lot and respectable people, i also blame that prime minister of israel golda mayer for this, who said that we have one main disagreement as enemies, they want our death instead we want peace we want to live and accordingly it can be 10 positions can be 20 positions can be a million positions, in the end the russian leadership has already stated in all its and suppliers that the conditions of ukraine are impossible and fantastic, they will not agree to these conditions, this is a position for negotiations - this is a position for presentation of russia also ask russia on february 24 also put forward some positions about some kind of denazification and militarization, but in the end russia itself delivered tanks from weapons to ukraine in the form of trophies much more than these western countries put together, therefore the victory of ukraine and guarantees of peace in ukraine will take place only on the field battle and not as a result of an offer of 10 or 20 or

something else, this is my firm belief, in the end, the realities prove that the only guarantee of peace for ukraine will be victory over the polyba, you know. we are many today discussed and indeed the events are unfolding enough when somewhere crowded but what is important it is important that in all this there should be our ukrainian interest and the first ukrainian interest - this is really the support of the armed forces of ukraine, this is the most important ukrainian interest to which every second ukrainian interest - this is really confessing and acting in accordance with the standards of the community to which we aspire, the european union and nato, and this is once again freedom of speech, and this is once again the rule of law, and this is once again the punishment of those who today collaboration, and sometime today a petition is being collected on the president's website and in one day

18,000 signatures have been collected out of the required 25,000. i call on everyone to put signatures on the eventual expulsion of the mps of the communist party not only from the verkhovna rada for treason at all levels and at the same time on a single marathon , who supports and who today is the voice of the state, the great outstanding volunteer hryhoriy surkis talks about his actions. something is definitely wrong. and another outstanding patriot, nestor shufrych, is re-elected as a member of the national olympic committee, so this something is definitely not right. i do not want and cannot and will not agree to this because it does not meet ukrainian interests because it does not meet the standards of the civilized world and it is definitely not the unity of ukrainian society therefore in everything there must be honesty and truth and everything must be in the ukrainian interest and in the interest of ukraine, the collaborators

must be held accountable according to the law and they will not be in the country, they will not be in the country. vasyl pavlyuk eh. today we carry ukraine, we carry a historic mission. we must really revive the turusya ukraine, which was once, and the fact that today we have partners of our poles, first of all, and lithuanians, is that once we were together historically, you all know and were very strong, and we really once fought moscow and others, and i hope that it will continue to be so, but we must clean up. i fully support him. he is right . he looks ashamed when collaborators are released under some conditional terms. good people die because of them. our soldiers die because of them, and their judges let them go. there must be an end to this or not, congratulations. olga palamaryuk is working in the studio on bbc news ukraine live from london, and today we are talking about the following