29 minutes almost half past five well, we still have time to talk about the important adoption of the initiative within the walls of the ukrainian parliament, they call it european integration, we are talking about the law on the media , and there were misunderstandings that were not taken into account, so the opposition believes, now let's talk about what is changing for the functioning of the ukrainian media market with diana dutsyk, executive director of the ukrainian institute of media and communication, a teacher at the mogilian school of journalism and a member of the commission on journalistic ethics, welcome mrs. diana 7 and we are joined by oleksiy mustafin media expert television manager oleksiy congratulations glory to ukraine say be kind explain to our tv viewers this new european integration so-called media law how close it is or how far it

is from that ideal because we understand that our legislators can always adjust any good or good initiative oleksiy, well , actually, the fact that we do not see and do not have the final text of the law that was adopted yesterday and the amendments were caught literally at the knee, then this already characterizes the quality of the legislative work, because hmm in principle, society is not a military secret that we have to keep, but a law that defines the activities of the media and the military military beach, but society practically did not see the text that the deputies voted for, and in principle, i suspect that many deputies do not see it, that is , we do not know bought a cat in a bag okay, it's clear

, let's talk about what was among the caveats e there are certain nuances and caveats that uh, it's one thing the european integration of the law in the name, and another thing is the real compliance with european norms uh of this law. let's talk, for example, about the rada tv channel. what and how does the functioning of this media resource change after the adoption of the actual law diana. if i may, i will say a few general words first. i will say because i would not, well, i do not is so radically critical of this law. i observed the process of work on the law of the middle to some extent and it was a very long work and indeed there was an examination and experts of the council of europe which was important and a very large number of lawyers from media organizations and colleagues were involved i respect and i don't think that they wanted to do something

bad or were involved when they worked on this document, that's another matter. what really, as oleksiy said, we don't see. i didn't see the final text of the law, i saw the previous version even before they were 2,000 or more have been made, there are a number of changes that have already been considered in the second reading, so really in order to evaluate well, yes, where well, you need to study this law, read it, see and ultimately understand how it will work, also in reality, but there are a number of caveats, which we talked about during the process and work on this law, uh, this is, in particular , uh, well, such rather large powers of the national council for television and radio broadcasting, uh, and that's what i heard now that part of the to the electoral legislation here, i want to say as

a person who has been doing media monitoring during the election process for many years, i think it is not a very good story to remove this part and because we have a very large number of inconsistent moments in the legislation that concern regulation of the media during the elections, and this is, in fact , we still need to regulate this area in one way or another, and we need to return to this issue, if not within the framework of the law on media, then perhaps within the framework of the law on elections, this must be done and there was a statement from a number of public organizations, including the support of whose experts were involved in the development of these norms, specifically in the part of the electoral history of the media, this is a very important story, we need to work with it anyway, well, if we are talking about the tv channel i have a council in general here, you know this question about

what we will have when the war ends, so because we have two different situations. in the conditions of a state of war, we have one situation in the conditions of a state when this well, when we will go to a peaceful er to a peaceful state i still hope it will happen. well, maybe not tomorrow, but sometime in the near future. that is, ms. diagno's task is to make sure that it does not happen, as in that anecdote. you know how many in the soviet union did not collect microscopes. we are adopting laws, an extremely positive process continues. so we still haven't returned to normal broadcasting, in particular, we are talking about tv channels direct fifth, of course, espresso tv channels, but if we go back to the history of reactions, in particular, legislators and media, let's listen now to the synchronization of our colleague, a former journalist, now a people's deputy, mykola knyechko well, in percentage

terms, these are normal laws, indeed nikita indulges, all the members of our committee did a lot to make him normal volodya petrovych submitted good ones amendments, we defended the rights of speech, there are some problems with this law, and the first is that it is really a rada channel in all of europe, there is a dual system of television where there is public broadcasting and commercial broadcasting . all the same, state broadcasting, which, contrary to the constitution, must necessarily be in the universal program service on every tv. that is, it is unfair competition of state broadcasting with everything else, well, according to oleksiyya, i would like to ask you to comment on mykola knyazhyska's statement now, we understand that the story with the channel is necessary - it's not just like that, and we understand that everyone says that elections will happen somewhere someday, but already

as if there are certain such at the individual level yes such trends in kyiv are already so so so so so yes, just a whole section of the court which, well, at least yes, which concerns the elections well, that’s in general well, that shows the quality of the work, you know, when you reach a compromise, remember i want time in the constitution, we still have a big coat of arms because it was necessary a communist for concessions that they voted for that from another place, let's be right here, that is, you know here like in the old soviet interview here, you play here, don't play fish here, and in principle, er, the very approach er, we we say that we need to pass this law urgently , because we want europe with european integration to withdraw from it. we need to have time for a new one. let's

vote for the law. trends, but in the law itself, in the text, in a state place. well, thank god, not everything, although practice now shows that it is possible to capture everything else, but at least it is with that television channel of the council , that is, again, it is still wonderful, the name is wonderful, the motivation is that we need to be eurographed, but uh, we push it inside what is what the authorities want. it seems to me that even at one time these demands when ukraine received membership, there were seven demands that were put forward if it should be turned off before the start of negotiations on membership. it was necessary to push through this law. it seems to me that this is exactly the approach, without even delving into the specific wording of the law, it is already

flawed by itself. i can agree with mr. and one percent is such that it spoils everything. well, how about my anecdotes, if we add one spoonful of one aromatic substance to a three-liter jar, we will get not 3 liters of jam at the output, but even the opposite, well, the key question here is to adequately analyze this law when will appear appropriate opportunity drunk and don't you sometimes have the feeling that we somehow have too much money that goes to support our formally independent tv products, tv projects, there's a telethon, they cut millions, the tv channel rada cut into it, it ca n't somehow consolidate the whole thing, if we already understand, well, the government needs its own platforms i do

not approve of this matter, but there is also the logic of the government, as if i understand it, but it’s too bold. we live in a time of war, well, look, i want to extend a little what oleksiy said, because in fact the issue of denationalization of the mass media is indeed, it is our obligation to the council of europe, and we have adopted a law on denationalization in recent years, even though it is possible that the authorities there did not really want it, but nevertheless, this denationalization took place, and the reform progressed, and so did we in fact, we have come to the point that we, uh, well, in fact, media have ceased to exist except for the rada channel, which was founded by state authorities, and what we see today in the conditions of martial law, the situation is returning, we see the creation of new tv channels by the state, it is not only about the rada tv channel, but it is about information, about foreign broadcasting, about other channels, and that’s on the

one hand, we understand that it is important in the conditions of war, ukraine is to conduct its own propaganda, so to speak, and to tell its position both within the country and to the world to other countries, preferably in their languages, yes, that is. but nevertheless, there is a certain contradiction here and we should clearly define ourselves. that is, i do not hear this. we will do as soon as martial law ends 1 2 3 5 steps in order to return and fulfill this commitment to denationalize the media , because we cannot stay we cannot keep a large number of media on which the state will have influence because we will look undemocratic in the eyes of europe, where we aspire to where are we going and it is necessary to remember this, but

there is one point that everyone is talking about. this is the economic factor. the problem is that we do not have a market. it is destroyed. the advertising market is destroyed. the business is destroyed and we need to we must be aware that the media will not take any resources in order to recover in the first years of the war, and here there are two possible ways of financing, these are international donors or the state, and you know, we need to have a serious discussion about this. i don't know the answer to the question of how it should be. but i know for sure that we need to talk about it now, we need to discuss these topics with civil society, with the media, with international experts, in order to work out some kind of compromise for the first years after the war, because the media of the media market his it will have to be restored from scratch, in fact, it is now lying there is no thank you, of

course, we do not forget about the importance of television as such, but we must be honest and note that the main source of information for ukrainians now, according to various surveys, is the online media and as luck would have it online media, in fact, many people were very worried in the context of the decision of the verkhovna rada, mr. oleksiy, is there really a risk that without a substantive court decision, there is an opportunity to block online media, and one of the initiator of the bill on media actually directly says that the law does not provide for such a pressure on the online media

. removed, well , you know, again, we are discussing the taste of a dish, which we do not see, you know. that is, we do not know the text of the law, it is possible that these spurs have been removed from it, but maybe they will not be removed, and we cannot trust what, what that person said or another deputy even that he is the author of the law, do you remember in his time written laws were a great progress because they were put up for public viewing in the square in ancient times or a law that exists only for the chosen ones and they can interpret it to their advantage he uh he is not ours in essence a law for everyone, so let's wait for this law, and we, as journalists, must assume that politicians have an owner and they are interested in the monopolization

of power and in increasing the tools of influence on the mass media, and therefore, from time to time, it is desirable to give regularly, it is necessary to give at this time of year, now the situation is definitely not the best for him, taking into account that we all have much more important things to do, but the question is that some people take advantage of this situation in their personal enterprises, in principle, it is called, maybe not literally, but it is a political regimeist before that i would not like to allow, therefore, it is necessary to conduct a discussion of the subject around the specific wording of the laws. at one time, they tried to introduce the subject into the discussion, in particular, when it turned out that the espresso tv channel was unable to be broadcasted on the normal t2 network, that’s how it happened. and then it took off, you understand. kafka’s kingdom is

intertwined with orwell’s, and at the exit, everyone says that the hands are here. and the broadcast has not been restored. accordingly, we understand. so , well, the story can also be about online media so, when these or other complaints will be filed, respectively, these or that people are already locked into making the right decision in quotation marks, of course they will make it and make it, well, finger-pointing very often affects the methodology of the decision of many processes well, unfortunately oleksiy of course, that's what you're talking about, that's why it seems to me that you can't decide such things by mistake and in the dark, you know, because in the dark you can make a mistake, uh, very, very easily, of course there will be benefits from this. but if we are talking about the interests of society, it should be open because again, this is the story with the fact that three channels were thrown off the air, in fact, you didn't even find

a person who is responsible for this, everyone throws up their hands and says, well, it's not us, but there are no channels. knyazhytskyi sofia fedyn oleg synyutka traveled and found responsible, but so to speak , the measures taken by the higher authorities did not have a proper plan, well , that is, we understand the motivation of ms. diana. how do you see the situation, because if such powers really appear, they can be applied different, so to speak, not very pleasant mechanisms, then we can remain without good online media, so to speak, so to speak, there is no comilfo, see here a double-edged sword, yes, because on the one hand, i also spoke about the fact that the risk is certain there is an increase in the powers of the national council in this part , and perhaps when there were discussions regarding the development

of this law, some suggested that these functions be given to a separate body and not to the national council, yes, but we have come to what we have already come to as it is, therefore, in my opinion , public control should be very strong reinforced in this part and we have to monitor well, so to speak, over the years and send signals loudly if we will see that something is wrong, but on the other side of this coin, here this law can also help in the fight against russian pro-russian sites, because until now we did not have tools that allowed us to legally suspend, terminate, i do not know how to block the activity of pro-russian and russian sites in ukraine, and if you remember the 15th and 16th years, there were many, well , conventionally speaking, scandals when the sbu sent out letters and recommended the providers to block some resources because they found violations there, such frank calls against ukraine, and so on, the

providers said and on what basis, i’m sorry, we have to do this, we won’t do it because you you are oppressing us because there is no such law, but you understand the logic of ms. diana, the methodology of the definition, by which final signs can one recognize this or that mass media, for example, about the crimea or there with some russian narratives, so it will be here, well , that is, again, we need to see this law, but in ideals. and this methodology should be worked out together with media public organizations and the media and the supreme council, that is, it goes there in the law, there is a question of co-settlement and i do not know how what is left there? practice was consulted, well, some representatives of the specialized committee came there and said, advise us, be kind, no, friends. well, the mohyla school of journalists has a different mission and functions. it does

not work on the creation of laws. those who work in public organizations understand this. well, i personally did not participate in the development, but as i said, i followed the process, but my colleagues, for example, are from the digital security laboratory uh, that is, media lawyers from these organizations, they were involved in the development of this law. and it is very important, so important, that is, that this law was written not just by deputies, this law was written by experts who belong to the public sector and are divided into the part in which they well, in which did they work? but of course politics interferes and even what they wrote. they may now. when they open this law, not everything will recognize what came out. today we had the honor to

talk with one of the authors of the sad or of the already infamous draft law that allows developers, if not everything, then almost everything . he did not even vote for the final version of the law that was voted in the council yesterday, he explained this matter to us why. well, unfortunately , we now have to pass the floor. thank you diana dutsyk, you are the executive director of the ukrainian institute of media and communication, oleksiy mustafin, a person who has been working with the media for many years and has the opportunity to literally send several messages to the ambassadors of the member countries of the group of indomitable points and noted the efforts of the ukrainian authorities and providing people with heat and everything necessary , the wind and the group of seven ambassadors of the seven visited the point of invincibility and saw the impressive efforts of the authorities to provide heat, electricity and basic services to those who suffered from russia's inhuman and brutal attacks on civilian infrastructure, these attacks are a war crime of the said message, and i only i will add that

everyone is working on points of invincibility, involving volunteers and local self-government bodies and everyone who can take care of each other . we have points of invincibility like that, that's all we have next project collaborators list of miklushka and antinno-burkovsky thank you for your attention we will continue our work see you soon dear tv viewers

i had a lot of energy a very strong desire to help in any way after leaving the occupation i stayed there for 4 months and could not do anything just because that there is no contact or familiar friends anya left the occupied energodar in june, now she is the coordinator of volunteers from the initiative to restore boldly we help local residents who suffered as a result of the russian occupation of their houses and you are destroyed by the russians. we help them to enlarge and dismantle the debris. we form a group on the weekend. these are two large buses. and we have

several locations in several settlements. projectiles, what are these things, a towed rocket under rockets, this is it precisely due to this dart, it is controlled here, the high-explosive part of the debris from it is already going, the house was built with its scars, the family death and no options today's parade of liquidated collaborators i'll start with askar laishev video how a car with a traitor on the move explodes it just blew up the network in the comments they often write like he burned up at work teleported to kobzon did the industrious incarnate with a cigarette butt while you enjoy watching you can come up with your signature for this video and leave it in

laikshev's comments, they were liquidated in occupied starobilsk , in the luhansk region, where a former policeman headed the local so-called mreo, forever shame on him and the land with glass wool and this is what the car of the deputy manager looks like now gives occupied berdyansk shrapnel from an explosive device was found oleksandr kolesnikov was simply a stolen krusok luckily death did not come to his ugly soul instantly the collaborator still suffered on the way to the hospital the last minutes of ivan's life were very similar in zaporizhzhia, an explosive device was placed under the seat of his car, which perfectly coped with the task, which is interesting

to hell, after drying, he immediately went like this called mykhailivka police chief andriy ryzhkov, a former ukrainian border guard who himself went to the occupiers to offer himself as a prostitute found hanged, an explosive device went off and the occupiers appointed ihor telegin as the deputy head of the department of internal policy of the kherson region. it is very difficult to know that good people from - but i am sure that legen and the company well realized what payment awaits them for treason instead of 30 pieces of silver for a pass in the kingdom of hades i received my favorite collaborator, a member of the verkhovna rada, from the servant of the people, oleksiy kovalev, at first he pretended to be a volunteer for being sold, saying that he was taking care of

avoiding a humanitarian crisis in the occupied kherson region, then it was found out that the collaborator organized the export of salt and grain through the crimea to russia and publicly supported the occupiers, which earned him the position of deputy the chairman of the pseudo-government of the kherson region was not even deprived of his parliamentary mandate in kyiv for this, only excluded from the faction of servants at the end of june judas of kherson was blown up soon kovalev from his hospital bed gave an interview on this matter i lived healthy i plan to start my direct functional obligations from monday my enemies who planned this sabotage don't wait for this they waited kovalev was killed in his own house in bare prystan near kherson the liquidation of this collaborator is not just revenge for treason, it is a marker as a signal, a clear and unambiguous

signal to all other, especially kherson traitors , sooner or later it and the unexpected will come to you they will catch you no matter where you are hiding, no matter what kind of orc army you have surrounded yourself with, by the way, this signal was understood by kirill v strimuusov, who was appointed by the invaders as the deputy head of the occupation administration of kherson and who has already fled to russia. this is what he says about his liquidated fellow traitors, our colleagues give life for justice for the triumph of truth and for our family, your colleagues give their lives because it is taken away from them for treason, and they record their posthumous odes to liquidated colleagues with a strimuus in a hotel room marriot in russian voronezh, as a matter of fact, kherson was still a russian city, that all offensives are useless. it is easy to talk about the mood in kherson and the failure of the counteroffensives of the armed forces of ukraine, after they had turned on their

heels for a whole thousand kilometers while staying in a five-star hotel; moreover, the collaborator also promises chernihiv will soon be liberated. come, my dear, you are very welcome here . and if you are thinking of spending the rest of the war somewhere in the rush , then know that there is no safe place for you on this planet, except at a depth of 2 m between the boards in in a society of worms, there lived in energodar in zaporizhzhia a certain andriy shevchyk, a native of russia, to whom ukraine gave citizenship to work as the chief engineer of a division at a nuclear plant and other benefits of a civilized country. shevchyk got so used to energodar that he was even twice a deputy, but the russian spirit, or rather the devil, did not leave the shoemaker. the language especially thank god that the russian federation freed and etogo breda will no longer be from the occupying forces

as a seller was appointed the head of the city and for a short time one explosive planted in the gauleiter's entrance brought more benefit than 30 years of gentle ukrainization, the collaborator survived and never appeared in public again. and this traitor gave the occupiers information about ato participants, members of their families, and employees of the local administration with pro-ukrainian views in the novoaidar district of the luhansk region his name was pavlo from sharograd, a well-shot shot precisely in the head deprived pavlov of foolish thoughts about further cooperation with the occupiers, also in luhansk region these two ihor sviatets and oleksandr melnyk were destroyed served in a terrorist organization, the second army corps fighting on the russian side, both received the rank of captain from the katsaps, the first was a platoon commander, the second commanded a tank battalion as