position, but now this issue is on the agenda, and therefore it is possible that if ukraine comes out with its proposals, i always insist that ukraine should now take the initiative into its own hands and propose its strategy to the european security system, to lay down a certain new matrix of the security system, then just e- based on macron's proposal, a good alliance could be formed in order to lay certain bricks of a new security system in europe. de france can really play a key role, but on the other hand, it is still necessary yes, we are now in such a historical period. when we have to give up competition. yes, and a certain kind of competitive attitude towards the united states, and yet it is recognized that they are a partner in the first place, that partnership relations must be maintained and even if this european army is created it is necessary to understand that it costs a lot, that these are

colossal resources, and against the backdrop of the precedent-setting economic crisis, the creation of a european army is also possible. the possibility of creating a powerful security system. well, i i simply do not imagine how it can be done without the partnership of the united states, that is, it is possible that this doctrine of sovereignty should be changed a little, which was laid back in the times of the layer of aedegol at that time before charles de gaulle , but that was after all 60 years ago, and now the situation is the geopolitical dimensions are also changing. therefore, from this effort to be independent from the states, perhaps it is worth talking about an alliance of cooperation between the states in order to ensure the modern security system in the context of recent events, oksano, as you now see prospects for the creation of a european army and in what perspective is it in the medium and

long term and maybe short term, you know, in my opinion, analytical, it should be a short term perspective. i think that you know, the army is also changing, we can see with our own eyes. i am not a specialist in military affairs, but it seems to me that you and i are now witnesses to the creation of just such an army, and tomorrow, in my opinion, it will be some kind of historical event. we will be watching very carefully for what will happen, but if we talk about strategies, then i think that this is a short , short perspective, well, just in case, i clarified, you mean the meeting in the rammstein format. of course, of course. just in case, returning to the meeting between the prime minister of spain petrusanches and the president of france according to the results of the signing of all the documents

that you talked about, observers from spain and france are trying to strengthen their positions in the european union and further, macron wants to imagine himself as a leading politician of the continent after the departure of the chancellor of germany , angela merkel. do you share this opinion , and the most important question is whether it goes to macron. i would say that he does not aspire, he just imagines . and by the way, yes, he does . a traditional meeting without words of france of the diplomatic corps of france with the president, at which he was very upset that france seems to be losing leadership in his eyes, he is trying to catch up with this leadership, but there are a lot of forces in france that

of course, macron receives a lot of comments regarding his statements regarding ukraine , and we often don't like being reminded that leadership is primarily certain steps that must be taken, and leadership should be characterized by actions, not activity, and that is, action, not words, but you you know, you have to give him his due, that after all, being the same age as our president zelensky, he is one of the youngest leaders in europe and he is really trying very hard, but his political class is much older than him, so he is fighting for leadership on two fronts, both at the geopolitical level and not at the domestic level, that is, he is a person who nevertheless represents a new generation of politicians, he is more similar to the hijacking of our president, but these are all the old political elites of europe, they know a little bit. they are older people, as they say, so one gets the impression

you and i are currently suffering not only from the war between democracy and russian tyranny, but this is also a war between the older generation and the younger generation, which longs for the future, so i think that, you know, we don't have to, we don't have to be angry on macron, if he takes some steps that we don't really like, will he be here on the spot? i see that he is trying very hard and he needs him. i think that external support is because he has very good intentions, and if he makes some statements that we don't like to the ukrainians, he is doing this with good intentions, but to me it is a conjecture, as they say, because of ignorance and we simply have to talk about ukraine even more here in france. give more arguments why it has to be the way mach wants to do. ukraine, i would see it, i would like to to see even more initiatives on the part of ukraine in

terms of strategic planning as well as the security of europe and to provide more arguments that ukraine is not a problem and is a solution to many problematic issues in europe, regarding transitional energy, regarding the food program, well, first of all, returning again to european security , ms. oksana regarding macron's statement. he spoke again about peace with russia after the war. and before that, he spoke about the guarantee of security for the russian federation. well, before putin's full-scale invasion of ukraine, he constantly called the kremlin leader and they constantly talked about something, but it is known that these conversations did not lead to anything, and he was unable to convince putin not to attack ukraine, so whether macron will refuse dialogue with putin in the future, you know, uh, he uh- eh de

logu from putin because he wants to somehow get to his heart there, he uh just says that he needs to keep his finger on the pulse, he explains it like this here on an internal date in front of his listeners here in front of his voters he says that we have so he says that when he says that we need to keep a dialogue, well, it means this is such a diplomatic old french tactic, they maintain a dialogue with everyone, even with those whom they hate, for example , charles degonia charles de gaulle, he hated the soviet union, but he was in a constant relationship with the soviet union just to control what was going on the same thing happens in the heads and macron, but macron is also a young man and he is very flexible, that is, he changes under the influence of his conversations with our president, i want to tell you that he, i can say this, that zelensky influences macron even in the first days of the war, macron

dressed like zelenskyi didn't even shave, he wanted to be on the same wavelength with him, so i'd say i'm not too worried about what macron says, sometimes it's just his public er game er, so you know he, as the president of his country, must ensure the security of his country, and they are all very afraid here. i really liked it. by the way, today mykhailo podolyak said that we should stop being afraid of putin's path, yes. and we need to take a decisive step. the french need to be reminded of this more often, because they always think that they have a politician in front of them who can be convinced when they think about putin, but we have already proved to them in 10 months that we are not the only ones here. yes, i mean.

with a hooligan with a revolution in st. petersburg yes, who did not study in those schools where french politicians studied and that this person understands only the language of the weapons of my power, but in the french mentality it is very difficult to imagine that a person who occupies such a high the position, she does not understand anything in public administration, that is, what democracy is, the french had to prove like a schoolboy that the choice is that putin’s dimension is different in general, so that putin does not seek peace, well, that is, it is such a very, very long, patient work in order to explain all this to them here and they understand over time. by the way, in all these loud statements, the macaron had to make a lot of excuses. i would also like to say to reassure our ukrainian viewers

that the press is french, it supports ukraine so much that when only a macaron is something this is what he says. the frenzied attacks on him immediately begin, and then two or three days later he is justifying himself in front of everyone. well, you know, this is not exactly what i wanted. you misunderstood me, that's why i want to assure you that france is absolutely on our side in macron here. keeps repeating that we will be with ukraine until the end, that ukraine will receive all the help we promise to provide, i also want to remind you that france has supported ukraine since the first days of the war , it is not customary for the french to talk about military aid in the public sphere mass media, but they help a lot, especially with technologies, and the fact that, by the way, the french were the first to give us these tanks, in europe it was perceived even with envy, and the first questions are about ukraine,

at least as of now, i understand , we have heard it more than once relevant statements, if you recall the policy of the states regarding thawing, they have the name of such strategic uncertainty in two words , please literally describe the policy of france in relation to russia, summarizing everything that has been said, it is difficult to abandon your habit of seeing in russia, a great country, the french are now simply reformatting their vision and understanding of russia, they say, they ask themselves how could we be so wrong. thank you very much . oksana melnychuk, candidate of political sciences at the university of paris. denny diderot explained to us the nuances of french policy

and the movement of patriots to poland to protect polish critical infrastructure and humanitarian military aid unloading point on the border with ukraine, and today the lower house of the dutch parliament also supported the transfer of the patriot marina systems to us smolova will tell how long it takes for our military to learn to work with the patriot and when the batteries will arrive in ukraine, let's see. on january 14, russia hit a high-rise building in dnipro with an x22 cruise missile. the russian military fired it from a bomber over the kursk region near the border with ukraine. the impact killed almost fifty people in the summer . this is exactly the kind of russian missile that hit the shopping center in kremenchuk. it also killed dozens of people. at the beginning of the military aggression

, the russian military released it on the territory ukraine has more than two hundred missiles of this type, the armed forces of ukraine do not have firepower capable of shooting down this type of missiles, only anti-aircraft missile systems, which in the future can be provided to ukraine by western partners, we are talking about such systems as the patriot paktra or sampti, capable of intercepting these air targets, the commander of the air forces of the armed forces ukrainian lieutenant general mykola voloshchuk announced during the meeting that ukraine will receive the first air defense system during the full-scale offensive of petriv volodymyr zelenskyi and joe balden, at the end of december, the ppu entered washington's new package of military aid to kyiv , after that germany joined the usa, which also announced that it would hand over one battery to the patriots, although according to spiegel , germany is already transferring three batteries to poland , where the patriots will guard an important dominant

station where loads humanitarian aid and military equipment for ukraine, later announced its decision to hand over the patriot battery, and the netherlands may eventually significantly strengthen our necessary defense, in addition to what we have, has already been adopted and arrested, and in fact, more anti-aircraft-relevant for ukraine are special kinetic interceptors that simply crash into a ballistic missile, the combat unit itself is destroyed, and this, well, more than importantly, is the only effective means of dealing with it intercepted ballistic missiles of patriots, it is the patriots who intercepted at the time still quite serious soviet sr-17 complexes according to the strict classification of scat according to the russian

classification of elbrus or 9k-72, and the waiter was quite successful in shooting down these of ballistic targets and this is a ballistic missile within 80%. the main advantages of this complex are the high speed of bringing it into combat readiness and the ability to fire at several targets simultaneously with one battery of the patriot system. and these eight launchers can be deployed in less than an hour, we have the s300 and with a range of 40 and, accordingly, 75 km, it has cutters there on 40 km also ago, petriv is more capable, more capacity is high, the biggest disadvantage of this air defense system, according to the information of the center for strategic and international studies, is the new patriot complex is worth more than a billion us dollars, therefore, among experts there is an opinion that shooting down drones with a

patriot is impractical, a patriot can easily destroy martyrs there, and this is not a question at all; destroying a cruise missile is not a question, but he is the only one who can intercept ballistic missiles in order not to waste all the missiles which are supposed to shoot down ballistic targets in order to shoot down 30 shaheds there, conditionally speaking , and then three football rockets fly by there. a drone into objects, a child, then how can you even compare this cost, i do not share the opinion if i refused, it is shooting at mosquitoes , because human life, especially children's life , is priceless before receiving the ukrainian military service. about 100 of our defenders have already arrived in the united states in at the anti-aircraft artillery school of the us army, they will master the operation of service and support of patriots, in particular, training will take place on training simulators for

anti-aircraft missile troops in the state of oklahoma in the united states of america, which will undergo training, well, it is clear that it will be as short as possible ukrainian military will train for several months, while the standard program is designed for a three-month course, so it can be completed by the end of april, and the deployment of patriots in ukraine can take place even before the beginning of summer marina smolovamy ukraine marathon is the only news and the european parliament calls for the urgent creation of a special court for russia and belarus. of robert's institutions, we are convinced that war criminals must appear before the court . president

of ukraine volodymyr zelenskyi has already reacted to such a decision. he called on all partners to join the creation of the tribunal . he summarized the quote. justice must prevail. end of quote oleksandr pavlichenko , executive director of the ukrainian helsinki human rights association, joins our conversation . mr. oleksandr, we welcome you good night good night, mr. oleksandr, we know that the resolution is a document that is not necessarily of a recommendatory nature and until implementation and we also know that in april the couple called for the creation of such a tribunal , and the parliamentary assemblies of the osce and nato also advocated for the creation of a tribunal for putin, and at the moment, after such another number of these documents, it is this resolution that has practical significance there is a-a certain summarization of previous lessons and a-a

actually a-e confirmation of the political level of a political decision a-a european e-e regarding the creation of an international or on issues of research of aggression e-e in the south of the european union and there was when e-e to speak about how much it should be a-a er-e international he should be given a corresponding mandate er-e no this mandate should take place earlier mr. alexander mr. alexander we apologize there are problems er-e with the sound er-e we will now try to redial you because the answers to these questions are the interpretation of such a step of our

european partners, partners well, it requires absolutely clear hearing, as they say, oleksandr pavlichenko, the executive director of the ukrainian helsinki union for human rights, it is with him that we communicate on the topic of the fact that the european parliament called for the creation of a special tribunal for russia and belarus is there a connection mr. oleksandr, we welcome you again what do you mean by this step of the european parliament regarding the creation of a special tribunal for russia and belarus by oleksandr pavlichenko, and in fact the issue is very important because for all the crimes committed

by russia in ukraine, all war criminals must be held responsible, and the first is the kremlin the leader and all the team of the top military leadership, they all have to answer for their actions, mr. oleksandr, there is a connection again, so we are listening , and that is, about this document, about this resolution, what it gives now and what steps should be followed after it. look at one of the er, important issues are er, the creation of political er, significance er and, accordingly , the establishment of a mandate by which er, this body of perception to responsibility for the crime of aggression er can deprive immunity, for example, of high-ranking officials of the state of the functional immunity granted to

today, putin and the higher military and political leadership of the russian federation are actually talking about this step at the political level, since the next steps will already confirm the very legal formalization of this special tribunal, this is a political decision at the european level at the highest level e-e summit at the summit at the highest level at the european e-e and at the level of the european union and took place yesterday, that is, in fact, the approval of this previous e-e let's say so e-e the situation with the solution e-e level of other structures is the parliamentary assembly of the council of europe is the parliamentary assembly of nato, which in fact contributed to the consolidation of this

political decision. in fact, it was confirmed at the level of the european union, and at the same time, it is actually from the force of the united nations organization, which can now and it is likely that this decision will be considered by a similar panel at the level of the un general assembly, respectively, when deciding on the possible mandate of such a judicial instrument, a criminal prosecution tribunal aggression, or this decision will be implemented in the practical plane already in the legal plane at the level of the european union, and let me remind you that these resolutions are precisely the european parliament, and the european parliament immediately decided that it will immediately start work on the establishment of this tribunal,

in fact, by its decision, it also stimulates the further work on the creation of a special tribunal at the level of the organization of the united nations and at the same time he declares the initial work on the creation of this tribunal at the level of europe and it can be a european tribunal that will actually be is endowed with such a mandate at the level of the european states, and this is actually the practical meaning of this decision. more effective in your opinion, eh, there may be development along eh, two directions, and but the most eh, let's say this

level seems realistic. months ago and uh, one model is actually the approval of the mandate of this tribunal at the level of the united nations organization, the second is just the second model, uh, it is the creation of a european tribunal through the approval of this at the level of the highest european structures , and actually this took place yesterday and the third the option is when an interstate tribunal will be created , that is, when several states in their decision create such a tribunal, and this is the weakest mandate of such a tribunal, but actually we already have the second, middle option, which was the most realistic and it is currently actually taking place this procedure of creation already in the translation of the practical plane

regarding the e-e development of the corresponding and the initiation of the e-documentary base of the creation of the statute of the regulation of joint documents of this court, but in fact it has yet to be determined whether it will be exclusively a european tribunal or it will a tribunal with a mandate that will first be the united nations, mr. oleksandr. and how long will it actually take to bring putin to court? this question , of course, depends on many modalities and now today we are in what is probably the hottest phase of the war that the russians unleashed in ukraine and it is probably a unique case when, by the way, it is emphasized in many documents of the european union that it is unprecedented and reliable on the territory of europe and it needs

unprecedented decisions and when we talk about uh, accordingly, the possibility of practical prosecution of military relations of the same putin contribute to the end of this war, we are talking about the fact that this tribunal will not make a decision tomorrow or in a month, it is a long process, and accordingly, it will create conditions that will contribute to the fact that war criminals should end up on the bench, as defendants, and then in the cells of those brought to justice and such punishment is taking place mr. oleksandr we thank you very much for the answers, of course we hope that the guilty

russians, the military-political leadership will be brought to justice as soon as possible well but we also have to understand that the process is not fast oleksandr pavlichenko, the executive director of the ukrainian helsinki union of human affairs, was with us just now friends on this we say goodbye to you and the telethon the only news continues and will be continued by our colleagues maria skyba and maksym sikora good night take care to meet the world with a smile smile sweetly in a dream imprint your uniqueness understand the words of teachers forget to erase yesterday find among the ruins tomorrow

laugh again in the morning sing again in the evening to fall asleep peacefully at night to live again thanks to the courage of ukrainians to live in peace and harmony thanks to you, thank you when the light goes out everywhere they continue to fight for life every day every day every second during the war and hospitals became fortresses of light where they heal not only the body but also the soul due to fatigue and pain, they

continue to protect the light of hope, their reward, our smiles and hugs, their joy , another saved person they know this not everyone has a life, so they protect the light inside us, we are grateful to the doctors who continue save people despite the darkness outside the window thank you left home evacuated from dangerous regions potre