[000:00:00;00] so, in principle, this is a variable activity. if i sat for half an hour, i would have to wait 5 minutes. if i spoke for half an hour, i would start to be silent for 5 minutes , that is, rest consists in changing the activity of our entire system. then we will be able to work for a long time and be effective, that is, believe -а смотреть и е те те реальные объективные things that speak of victory, by the way. it's good to wake up in the morning and say five things of gratitude. the sun is shining. thank you for the fact that i have relatives around me for the fact that i have something to eat now. well, like religious people before they eat, they pray, and thanks to this , it

is a great practice. again things today for the course of the day in the morning we start with five gratitudes and adjust the day to positivity and in the evening we say five uh, well , we train these actual moments that we had , bitch, somehow they say positivity uh, that's in us support, we also train the muscle of positivity, but we also don't forget that we need to walk on the ground with two feet and not dream about something there and then be very disappointed that our dreams did not come true. thank you ms. natalya natalya this motivation. by the way, when natalya shestak, a psychotherapist, was with us. listen, now we will take a short , short, literally, pause like this, and immediately after that we will talk about the heroes. cool, what is the significance of this date today, how

do we to the new we actually see what was then was happening and about how, in principle, it suddenly became clear that ukrainian independence began in 1991 and not in 1990 , it even began in 2000, or in 1918, and maybe even for many viewers it is still not something like that what it goes without saying because ukrainian history was hushed up and rewritten for a long time, and it was hammered into the heads of ukrainians that if it were not for lenin there would be no ukraine and that we should be grateful to him that he created ukraine, it was like an invisible and second ukraine for some people they existed as two parallel ukraines, and now many people discover only for themselves this second ukraine, but the truth is that in fact there is only one ukraine and the second and not much, and it is because the second version - it

was not at all not like that ukraine, well today, when everyone is defined by who he is, it is very important to remember our common pantheon, our hero, our common understanding of the sense of history. here is our common assessment , we will talk about it. we will have a historian , a military historian and a serviceman. for rheumatism and arthrosis in the joints, it is so piercing, it is impossible to get used to it, it does not allow me to move. i tried everything. and at the pharmacy, i bought a yellow dolgit cream. it saves me from pain in rheumatism, reduces swelling and improves mobility. i used it in crimea for pain in the joints and back.

movies, television, sports, music, education, the free have a choice, choose what you want on megogo, so that ukrainians don't think about, whatever they talk about , war always comes first, war is our victory, seven days a week from monday, monday, seven different spheres of human activity - sports, culture, politics, eight expresso presenters, journalists, experts, opinion leaders in real time about the most current events through the prism of war , every day, author's projects on espresso , we continue not our ter lesya vakulyuk andriy sachuk today with you and what is the final hour of the marathon today and exactly as promised, now let's remember a little what happened. on this day in ukraine in 1918, there is already the 105th anniversary of the battle of kruty, which became

for ukraine and for ukrainians a symbol of heroism and self-sacrifice of the young generation in the fight for independence, let's remember this outstanding battle of ukrainians today there is an intermediate railway station in chernihiv oblast, 130 km from kyiv, but a hundred years ago its strategic importance was enormous at the beginning of the 20th century, highways in ukraine did not have a hard surface and the troops mainly moved by railway, the railway station was a gate to ukraine, from there it was possible to advance in several directions at once to kyiv , chernihiv, pyryatyn and the gold-bearing tank, therefore, on january 29, 1918, more than 500 ukrainian soldiers, cadets and students, took battle there restraining the russian army, which had a tenfold advantage in manpower and weapons from a military point of view, the defense was successful, they managed to hold back the bolsheviks for several days, during this time the representatives of the ukrainian people's republic managed to sign the brest peace treaty and gain

international recognition, however, one of the student detachments got lost in the dark in captivity, about 30 young men were tortured and then executed; later, some of the heroes were buried at the askoldova grave in kyiv. in general , they died in voy near kruty according to various estimates, up to hundreds of ukrainians, this battle almost immediately became a national myth from the 2000s, the memory of the krut heroes began to be commemorated at the state level , what are we, uh, now we say hello to roman ponomarenko of military personnel and a candidate of historical scientific historian mr. novels have a good day actually from let's say so from completely ignoring this date, i.e. from banning in principle even any mention of this date during the soviet period of the ukrainian soviet socialist republic to the attempt

to build such a national myth about 300 spartans leonidas and so on and so on thermopylae where are we now during this war in, let's say, in the assessment of what happened 105 years ago, well, in general, after 2014 there was a certain rethinking of our history, they began to pay more attention to the heroic relations of the damned struggle of ukrainians for their own statehood and national dignity and coolness have become one of those, one can say, a proper stone of heroic ukrainian history. i wouldn't say that it's just such a myth, because there really is a historical event that really took place and really

this pain can be considered successful, although not won, because ours retreated as a result, but they were able to fulfill the task, they detained the bolsheviks for a few days, and the ukrainian people's republic had certain positive results from this in the international arena. as they say even today, of course, heroic or something especially the fact that there were students and young people in their ranks, i won't say that there was a greater number of them, but there was a certain number of these young people, so in the current conditions it is very relevant because we are also fighting the same enemy as 100 years have passed, the enemy is the same and the same from the ukrainian people, from all strata of ukrainian society, currently we need unity in the fight for our freedom and independence in the story of the epb near kruty , there are such things that impress, namely what were , for example, parts that were nearby that had would take part in this battle and did not take part in the battle because they were under the influence

of bolshevik propaganda about russia and propaganda, etc. one can say the war for ukrainian independence is a hundred years old. so what are our positions now, how different is our position from what it was 100 years ago, well, now we are significantly different from it. now, let's say, we are in a more confident position than the ukrainian people's republic was 100 years ago, because currently we have a full-fledged state with a full-fledged the existing state apparatus, the power block, we have allies who help us with weapons and ammunition, and financially and politically, there was nothing in the world at that time, we have a powerful army that

has been defending ukrainian land for almost a year recognized and even successfully transitions into a counteroffensive and the lost areas are taking place, then if we compare the current situation and the situation in january 18th, now we are definitely in a much better position than our predecessors were then, but there is always a question that i really like to voice it, even this is something to think about would we be in a better position now if it weren't for the efforts of the central council of the ukrainian people's republic, the same tough guys and heroes 100 years ago, that is, would ukraine be where it is now as it is without the experience of a very short statehood, what lessons can we learn from all this? well, the main lesson is that ukrainian statehood continues, that it is being restored, and it is very appropriate that many in ukrainian society lead the legal succession of the current ukrainian state from

the ukrainian people's republic and not from the occupying ukrainian soviet socialist republic. that is why the struggle for the state in the 17th and 21st years, although it was unsuccessful, but it gave birth to a generation of soldiers , a generation of people even who consciously went to death for the sake of the ukrainian idea to imagine it, for example, there in 1900, that is, 17 years before this event, well, it was almost unreal . that is the importance of the first liberation struggles , the existence of the short allegorical existence of the ukrainian people's republic, as well as the western ukrainian people's republic, in that they really laid the foundation of the idea and the further struggle for ukrainian independence p romane, not so long ago , ukraine celebrated the anniversary of zluk, or from

one of the cathedrals, and one way or another in such for days there are posts from people on this topic on facebook, but still, despite the fact that this is already what anniversaries, er, will be anniversaries , the anniversary of the lord, the anniversary of the fact that ukraine, er, cathedral, er, still for many people in ukraine, for ukrainians, despite the fact that now there is a huge demand in ukrainian for ukrainian history. they still do not accept it as their own for them, it is still some kind of poster holiday from a history textbook , for example, again, the battle near kruty. this is something so poster... it is possible that there is a memory from school about how teachers were told to teach some

poems about the heroes of krut and from teraban, what happened there on january 29, 1918, the battle of kruty, will ukrainians be able to accept their history as their own? i'm sorry that i'm somehow punning, but actually ukrainian history will become close to them, and not the soviet history that was which was written for ukrainians, well, this state of affairs is directly related to the fact that since 1991 there has been a single state ideology in ukraine . tell about the heroes of the ukrainian insurgent army, and in the neighboring school, the history teacher could also tell the children about the heroes of the nkvd who fought against the ukrainian insurgent army , that is, about what capacity and common understanding of the history of society can be the language here, and ukrainians are quite capable of perceiving their history. but for this it is necessary of

course, the state policy, which will be aimed at popularizing the ukrainian point of view, we now have a lot of high-quality media educational projects on ukrainian history that popularize its various pages, even little-known, but a few years ago there were very few of the projects, now there are extremely many of them. there, you can distinguish history without myths and local history. russians no longer look like a fraternal people, so gradually it is not a matter of one month or a year, it is necessary to work purposefully on this at the state level, including. so, gradually, ukrainians will accept their history will perceive it precisely through the ukrainian point of view, not through the soviet one, but the russian one, there or someone else, who will try

to impose their views on history on us. and in fact, this is a multi-subject test , do you follow this history around history , which did not find a place among the obligations a compulsory subject for school graduates, i.e. mathematics is the ukrainian language and history is optional and i doubt it, of course i know that there are children who are interested in the history of ukraine, but they are clearly in the minority and i doubt that they will choose history for the exam. now there is a huge part of the public that is in favor of turning to the ministry of education to introduce history as mandatory, that is, history tests as mandatory for this national multi-subject test . well, in my opinion, the history of ukraine should be mandatory

therefore, the subject of the language test should be three subjects, and i think that schoolchildren will not have much trouble passing this test, if we are talking about the fact that even the requirements for obtaining a ukrainian passport are complicated in our country, it seems very strange that ukrainian schoolchildren do not pass such a test is a question of its own. by the way, today is the day of memory of heroes. president zelenskyi honored the memory of the field, but in the struggle for independent ukraine in 17-21 years, he placed on askoldov's grave the defects of the state , yes, yes, of course, of the last century, this is what we put we are just seeing this video flowers to the grave of askold to the memorial of christ the hero of krut and noted in particular president zelenskyi , dear, today

is the memory of the people of krut. this is the current period of ukraine's struggle for independence and together we are approaching victory, it is actually nice to see this evolution of president zelensky himself who won with the slogans " what a difference" by the authorities of the series matchmakers, where ukrainians were made fun of, russian-speaking actors , russian production, and so on, this is a fantastic evolution that i want to believe together with the president, his voters go through , i have only one other question. let's say there are new converts in their desire to honor history, to learn about it, do they have enough expertise to make the right changes there in the educational program

, to properly popularize this history, well , you understand what i'm talking about, is there a lack of popularization of history , an emphasis on history or there is an understanding that just as the german nation was forged by a prussian teacher at one time, so a ukrainian teacher cannot be a hired person with a small salary who talks about his preferences here and there, i don’t know, tells something about stakhanov's feat, for example, trendomna or kosmedimian prose. is it sufficient at the state level for this examination ? and your view, well, the situation with the test just showed that this view is not sufficient at the state level , if you take it that way, we have throughout our independence, popularizers of history they existed and did their work in opposition to the state and not with its help, because

the state often declares that they create some committees that deal with the allocation of budgets and so on, but there are no significant results from that. sorry, no. and the current events just show that the level of competence in our government and in the verkhovna rada in the relevant specialized structures is not very high in this regard, because you are people who have not fully realized the importance of this work, ideological work, for example, is now being intensified in the army because even here you understand that a soldier who knows what he is fighting for and not against someone is a much more effective soldier than one who does not use any ideology, and the same goes for citizens, how can you build a purposeful conscious society if they do not know

the history of their country does not respect it and in general it is carried indifferently well and here is one more moment that i also want to remember right now talking about this date about krutyan well it is no secret that in the 18th-21st years there were many problems precisely with the unity there themselves in political circles, that is, there was a time when the delegation of the western ukrainian people's republic went to negotiations with the skoropadsk until they reached kyiv, where they met vynnychenko , well, that is, everything was changing, there was some kind of coup d'état, and so on and so forth, hmm, does this mean that we are like us evaluate it, how should we evaluate it, when petlyura, for example, did some things there, negotiated with the federal court, others fought with the federal court at the same time as we are today . so when, well, when we understand how important unity is, from what prism should we evaluate this

story, or is now the time when we should tell history without embellishment , the history of facts, but history does not exist without interpretation, it is also necessary to look at it calmly, these were people of their time with a corresponding worldview, they were in certain circumstances and did their actions according to his worldview and the circumstances in which they found themselves when petliura negotiated with the pilsud people, and he was right from the point of view of the leader of the directory to save at least something at the cost of western ukraine. but nevertheless , as the ukrainian state somehow survived , many did not understand his way out these are the soldiers of the western ukrainian people's republic of the ukrainian galician army there, led by yevhen konovalets and others, so they categorically did not support him in everything, but

petlyura had a certain right, it had to be recognized then of course, it is not worth comparing the situation at that time with the current one, because we still have a certain unity at the moment, as well as allies who do not yet demand us to cede our territory. therefore, it is always necessary to evaluate history and indeed the actions of historical figures precisely from the perspective of the time in which they were and in no case should you measure them by modern standards , because it is even ridiculous when they demand that bohdan khmelnytskyi or ivan mazepa or the same petliura have the worldview of a modern educated person and, accordingly, other there are state how many approaches and others, some kind of girl, as perceived by our modern society, these were the people of their time and this must be understood when we analyze historical events, and today i am mentioning yaroslav hrytsak for the second time. he must be having hiccups now, er, yaroslav, listen, you are very good

it seems to me that mrs. yaroslav is saying that it is possible for us to move away from the history of dates and surnames to the history of contexts. this is what you are saying to romanov when you see the broader context and what kind of context is needed then. certain optics at that time were called from the ukrainian optics, so you understand what difficult conditions, for example, the same hrushevsky found himself at the time . understood 50 years old was more than brad pitt turning on which action films he is filming and he was also a young father then so that you understand why i am saying all this, what about the fact that we often simply do not understand the context but i don’t understand the context, because it is probably simply missing in the textbooks, why is it so difficult to show this context, why is it so difficult to explain this context? i understand that this is a very

complicated history of that period, but what should this ukrainian prism be through which we have look at the events of 40 years ago to understand what mistakes we can and must avoid, we must avoid now in 100 years, in fact, it is not difficult to do, it depends on the teacher, because most teachers, especially in the schools of well and well, for the fact that they perform their work formally according to what is written in the textbook without any desire to somehow delve into the events to scare the students of what actually happened, this is one of the reasons why history is one of the most unpopular subjects at school. and many of the students do not like this subject and teach it only to pass the external examination to finally forget, but here

it depends, well, the human factor , if there will be adequate teaching in history, there will be an understanding of the context. to know our predecessors, we must know their achievements, we must know their mistakes in order to analyze them and draw conclusions for the future, because the context is the context, but history is made by people, well, it means that it often happens to us, that with us , everything boils down to the fact that here are the heroes vynnychenko here is the hero skoropadsky's boats quarreled regardless, they were all for ukraine well, you don't understand. in the context, he is complicated, he can be more complicated than it seems, he can be . let's just say that he is not invincible, this means that he is traitorous, this means that uh, what, what do we or we explain the context then we tell about the details of which perhaps we would not like to tell but then we simply treat the same students and the same citizens of ukraine as some well, relatively speaking, how

do they treat their population in russia, hide propaganda or history must be propaganda does national honey mean that national lie, for example, are these identical meanings , then why? well, well, here are the moments. but i understand that simply for this you need people with different expertise than those who are in the same ministry, there is a specialized military serviceman, but as a military historian, does it happen that military people, uh , are some of your brothers who ask about some historical events or have certain ideas about the history they were taught, but now this this story is interpreted in a completely different way and they argue with you or ask, if they ask, what is the most asked about, this happens so regularly, because

now there is indeed a certain surge of interest in ukrainian military history among the military our struggle against moscow, starting there from the time of the cossacks and ending there with the first liberation contest of the second world war, the most questions about the second world war , because there are really many contradictory assessments there , for example, the perception of the division of troops among galicia, the quality of acceptance in modern conditions, many guys are interested in this, especially there it is bad in western ukraine, and the eastern ones as well, because many people, after reading about this division , use some soviet or russian sources, which, let’s say, are not quite competent have a certain task, although you know the ukrainian heroes of the ukrainian national liberation struggle, so the surge in the history of ukraine is interesting now

, well , not only the military, i would say. a civilian can write there with some question and you are surprised even this person who recently was not interested in history at all and here she begins to understand because it is worded like this, i decided to understand for myself in order to finally realize and convey to their children there by the hour this historical truth, as it actually happened. and this really needs to be used now by our profile committee , ministries, etc. to our society for talking to you and for what you do for what , even in military uniform, you continue to tell about history roman ponomarenko

military serviceman candidate of historical sciences and a military historian was with us, a viewer wrote here, saying, “why are you presenters saying such things, our children learn and love history , you know, if you concentrate only on those children who learn and love history, then of course you can say that what i say is a wonderful nation that's how they teach, but if you look at all the children, the sad truth is that for the majority, even now, the history of ukraine is unfortunately not a subject of interest, and indeed, as the military historian said again on our airwaves, that children study this history only in order to pass that test and forget about it, and unfortunately, unfortunately, then for us, full-scale invasions from russia are a surprise for many of us , because those people who taught history they always knew it well, they always said that the war with russia is inevitable and it will be because this is the philosophy of russia, because russia has always

tried to destroy ukraine as a reminder of what hmm who was really the first? well , valery, the brave commander in chief of the armed forces of ukraine, also said something about today date ukrainian soldiers gave their lives near kruty but defended independence and won recognition for their state today we continue their cause with dignity the price of struggle is high but the price of defeat is much higher therefore we will not stop until we drive out the eternal enemy from our land valeriy zaluzhny what are we continuing now we all we live almost in a history textbook and now a new page is being written, a new and another history of the struggle for independence will have another 13th as we 11th more precisely as we have already joked