[000:00:00;00] prof. igor eisenberg of the university of nur-sultan, we welcome mr. games here from friends to all the viewers , lord. well, let's try to start with the american-chinese escalation of the next air on the bullet. today there was a speech by a member of the politburo of the central committee of the communist party of china, ivan, and the most authoritative chinese diplomat at the munich conference, he specially arrived there for the first time in many years and said that china is not even satisfied with this, that the united states is compensating for the situation that they treated the of a balloon that they too cannot be a guarantor of security. well, at the same time, they are meeting with europeans, translating them in some way. how much is washington worried about the current conflict ? how is it reflected in the general situation? that 8 t is very concerned and it was still

a good wind ball because uh washington is i think that this is such a consensus between the democrats republicans between the political establishment that china is the biggest threat in the medium-term long-term perspective ensures the security of the united states and a liberal education in general because russia and russia as defined even in the defense strategy of the united states that russia is an acute immediate threat right now but in the medium-term early long-term perspectives the chinese are the biggest threat due to the fact that china is a country with a very strong an economy that in all inhibitions, it is growing, has a tendency to further growth a-and china- china can use this for er-er in its coercive

practices in order to switch certain countries or groups of countries on their side because of the usa's concern about china. in general, it has a very high level, and this event, with the bullet, it added, of course, it added you to the perception of china . the very fact that china is an adversary is not the first bullet. by the way, this seems to be the fourth , at least the first two in general, the usa was simply not noticed, and maybe it was even more, because it was no longer noticed, uh, and in the usa they still perceive this story with the bullet as such, it is a certain impudence on the part of china, because the americans, american specialists believe that in principle it is definitely possible to do more intelligence, to investigate information, to collect satellites, not with the help of such balls, that it is china that sends these balls in order to show, well, that we can

do what we want, even send er, these balls, er the airspace of the usa so that the relations between them escalated significantly escalated, although you must see that state secretary blinkin met today in munich with the chinese minister in england, that is, they talked about something, i think that despite these aggravations, the usa is certainly not interested in a hot conflict with china in order for these relations to have some kind of framework, well, that is, for it to be . it was possible such a cold war that would not have the opportunity to turn into a hot war igor 21

in your opinion , what will vladimir putin speak before the parliament of the russian federation, will it be similar to last year's address ? they are conducting a special operation here in ukraine in this regard in order to eliminate, including, the nazis. well, i think that this is precisely what you will not say because of the fact that from the last time . what did you say? well, then, that the west is a danger for russia that the west wants to rid russia's sovereignty, that the west is a threat to russia, what is russia in general, russia launched what they call a special operation precisely in order to protect itself, so to speak, from the threat of the west, that ukraine is simply a tool of the west in the fight against russia. i think that he will repeat approximately the same exactly what he repeated earlier, he will concentrate. after all, there are almost none

of them on the battlefield, well, look at it, this is how the propaganda speech will be, he can call everything a success, he should have already said that they almost almost released uh, so to speak uh the donetsk luhansk people's republic, well, i read something about it, that is, look at propaganda, how does it work ? yes, yes. i think that putin can say whatever he wants, mostly. to talk about others he has great success there that they are fighting successfully there with western weapons and so on. that is, of course, it will be calculated

for the russian population, of course , and it can be in some kind of messages for for the west a-a but it seems to me that the time when western leaders could listen to such putin's bowls has passed putin putin missed the moment when they could still talk with him a-a well, do you remember how many times macron called him, for example how many times he called him scholz, the conversation stopped i think that at some point all western leaders came to understand that if putin actually imagines himself to be, he is not the kind of political figure they are , that is, that there is nothing to really talk about with him, and putin at that moment missed when such an understanding came and what he would say, whatever public messages the event sent. i think that the event

can receive more information through such contacts, half -intentionally, when, say, the director of the central intelligence agency meets there with the director of russian of foreign intelligence or national security, he holds a meeting or a conversation with patroshev there, i think that through such contacts the west can get more information about russia's intentions and what you can't expect than putin's public promos. has his mood changed in his approach to propaganda , even to his own population, not only for the event? and tell me now, when representatives of the congress from both political parties turn to president biden and ask him to give more modern weapons of ukraine, including fighter jets. how important is this? is this a symbolic act? is this a change in such attitudes

that sooner or later will lead to a change in the administration's position regarding aircraft ? and secondly, look at the representatives of the administration, they do not say that there will be no planes, they say that this is what the discussion of this issue is about, in fact , look, the prime minister is the minister of great britain, and today he said that great britain begins the training of ukrainian pilots to work on western fighter jets, that is, begins. so this means that the decision has actually been made . i think that we must understand that the problem with western aircraft is a very complex , big problem, and it cannot be solved at one moment, if we say today f16 planes will fly to a certain number of ukrainian airfields, this does not mean that tomorrow they will be able to be

used by the ukrainian air force because learning how to use them , unlike soviet aircraft productions used by ukraine, let's say in 16. these fighters and attack bombers are in one plane , i.e. pilots not only have to learn to fly them , they have to learn the tactics of their use according to the regulations, let's say the pantogon, retraining a pilot on an f-16 takes 6 months, it is necessary to prepare the airfield infrastructure it is necessary to prepare engineering and technical personnel for aircraft maintenance. that is, this is not something that can be decided today for tomorrow, even in a month. another question was it possible to start solving this problem

, let 's say, at least six months ago, or even earlier, or even before february 24. uh, on the atlanticaunso website, the fact that it was not done before, well, i don’t know there for reasons that uh, if uh, if the event was supplied for such a thing in ukraine, could it provoke russia? well, there were probably considerations, but i i can see from what i see that now i see that it is being done i understand that it will not be done directly today for tomorrow but uh, from what i see today i understand that ukrainian planes will appear and when is it we can't say with you well, in how many months it will happen, especially since i am still sumakh today i said it completely it became clear to me because it does not make any sense to train pilots if if there is no principled decision on the transfer of languages, that is,

if the pilots start to prepare means sooner or later they will be on planes, yes they are, igor, let's summarize the meeting between lukashenko and putin. lukashenko went to an audience yesterday in russia, and first of all, what did they agree on, was it a kind of meeting, well , let's say something about it in order to pretend to the western countries that they are still such partners, allies and support each other, and lukashenko recently made statements that belarus could allegedly enter into a full-scale war with russia against ukraine if at least one soldier crosses the border of belarus, what is that hint, well, look, they can do provocation, they can do it, they know how to do it. well, in the same way, just like, say, the soviet union did when it started its offensive against finland in 1939, just like

hitler did when he started, er, outline against poland on september 1, 39 it is just to pretend that some ukrainian ukrainian military allegedly entered the territory of belarus. i think that lukashenko will, as he has been doing until now, do everything possible to prevent belarusian troops from directly participating in the war because he he understands that this is for him personally, it can end badly for him personally, the most important thing is to be in power , uh, for sure until the end of his life, how he how he understands it, that is, he probably thinks that he is immortal, that is, he will interrupt forever for this to him it is necessary to avoid any upheavals in belarus because, well, from what i see and read, let's say from what

the representatives of the belarusian position say, participation in the war in belarus would be very unpopular among belarusians, in contrast to russians who the majority of russians support the war, the majority of belarusians will not support it, that is, i can not assume that putin again ordered lukashenko to do what is necessary. lukashenko was finding some reason why why is it necessary to wait? well, i am quite quite ridiculous statements lukashenko made regarding the production of aircraft , the court appears in belarus on the 25th they only asked that everyone have technical assistance or sifted through what is needed. and we will do everything, everything, well, this is it, i think that it is, but for internal consumption, such statements are made, but i do not think that honestly the choice was at their meeting, it already meets , or every month or two months, the same thing happens, that is, putin would probably

like to involve the entire belarusian army, which deploys somewhere around 70,000 to participate in the war, lukashenko does not want this because he does not want any threats lukashenko will, of course , give putin the green light to use , let's say, belarusian airfields, the territory of belarus for russian troops from there. you understand what mr. igor did, but if to talk about this audit, we often talk about it, but now there is a message that the american deterrents will go even to the combat zone, why is this? i think that there is such a delicate point here, the audit is being conducted, it is announced in the united states, and very much attention is paid to this, not only in relation to audit, help ukraine, because here

the spending of funds is, well, this is such a very important thing, so every every sense from the budget must be a report. institutions, they are sounding the alarm about this and what they are checking. where are the billions of billions of dollars allocated for aid to ukraine going? this is absolutely what it is for their work. i think that it is possible that some other terms of the check are due to the fact that, well, the republicans of the house of representatives, it is in most cases, they exclude this from the administration, that is, they demand a report on what exactly there were no abuses with america, that money, with american aid, with american weapons, that is, that the administration wants to show everything is in order, everything is under control, everything is being checked, we must not forget that the congress must approve new budget

allocations with the help of ukraine, although almost 45 billion dollars have been removed from the scientific budget by september 30, but they can finish earlier and it may be necessary that even earlier the congress must be approving an addendum to the budget in order to allocate more money for aid to ukraine, and the republicans in the house of representatives are in the majority, so if you turn it off, the administration must meet to show that everything is in order well, all the more so that submitting representatives is among the republic there is an ultra-right group, one out of every 12 of these ultra-rights in general. they introduced a resolution on ending aid, did you cynically call this resolution about fatigue from ukraine , and the speakers of the map said that he was against of this resolution. that means that he will not even put it to a vote. well , in order to get help through the congress, i

think that, in particular, and because of this, this control of his can be strengthened, and, well, i i think that this is correct, because it is necessary that the money be spent correctly, but it is necessary that ukraine be able to receive new aid packages without any obstacles, so that it is necessary that additional funds be allocated this fiscal year and that for the next fiscal year , which schedule will begin on october 1, so that the funds are also allocated, be in direct contact with us and join our broadcast. already iryna herashchenko, people's deputy of ukraine , members of the parliamentary committee on

foreign policy and inter-parliamentary cooperation, mrs. iryna, greetings to you. so, after this, let’s give intermediate results, iryna, on this, i promise once again, the munich conference, what kind of atmosphere did you see there , the atmosphere of expectation of this quick victory or the atmosphere of awareness that it will be necessary to help ukraine as much as it will be necessary, well, for me, the parallels are very important this was last year. when it was already very strong , this breath of a terrible war was felt that we are one step away from something terrible and that cannot be denied. last year we kept repeating all like mantras about the need for a political and diplomatic settlement, and the ukrainian authorities and our partners said that they still believe that putin will not go any further, but this year's munich is fundamentally 180° different in terms of atmosphere from the previous conference, primarily in terms of faith in ukraine, our international partners do not they are hiding that at the beginning of the full-scale invasion, they gave

ukraine a maximum of six weeks to survive there and the fact that we took place and simply stood as a state did not lose statehood, this is really a great victory here, the ukrainian army is simply superior to him. i am at this conference, but how our partners and the world see the development of the war, first of all, everyone is really worried about the possible development of such a scenario that it will be a frozen conflict, everyone realizes that this is the worst possible scenario two, it is very important that at the conference no one talks about peace , they talk about the victory of ukraine, and this is an absolutely important emphasis, because the victory of ukraine implies the defeat of russia, and everyone is aware

that in order to defeat, we need a very serious military aid armed aid third well, if a year ago germany gave us 5,000 helmets just as a shock to itself , today chancellor scholls calls on partners to more actively transfer tanks to ukraine, these are good signals, but it is important that they are not just words ukraine is worried about logistics and speed transfers of weapons and of course their number and here about er-er these trends that are alarming and er-and our partners between the lines and not publicly er do not hide that they are afraid so unfortunately we have problems with communication a grain surveyor, but it will be restored because there are actually many questions regarding the munich conference, in particular the message of the main president, uh, i think you listened to mr. vitaly , his speech was to speed up the supply of weapons to us, our partners, especially within

the framework of the tank coalition, even in lavshol he already said he said to all partners who has tanks, let's all give them to ukraine. although before that he himself was not very uh so willing to give us such heavy weapons, ms. iryna , we are already with us, ms. iryna, just now, i was asking about the main message of our the president who spoke before the partners and said that the most important thing for us is to speed up the provision of weapons, especially within the framework of the tank coalition, did they hear us because we don't need it in two or three months, but already now? and i agree with this messenger and i want to say that this year ah, in munich, the three largest delegations, the american, german , and ukrainian, and the ukrainian delegations are working together as one fist, all of us abroad represent one team, the ukrainian team, and we repeat

the same position, weapons are needed today we have no chance to delay with this, unfortunately time works for russia every day, russia is destroying critical infrastructure of civilian settlements of ukraine, killing ukrainians , modern weapons are needed in larger quantities and today, and this is very important, but apparently the communication was really interrupted, that is what worries me our partners are afraid of the disintegration of russia, they are afraid of russia as a nuclear power, and there is a feeling that they are providing ukraine with weapons in such quantities once again, so as not to cause another escalation, this is the first thing, and the second thing is that they are all afraid of the conflict between russia and nato, and so on in this matter, we just need to clarify once again that today ukrainians are basically protecting nato countries so that the war does not come to their territory, so give us the opportunity to simply knock out the occupier from our land, for this we

need weapons. we cannot just be a human shield, this is very and it is very important that several details that are important at this conference, this is a discussion that should be an international tribunal over the putin regime, it is obvious that not only war criminals who fired directly but the key criminals are putin - these are his gangs who gave uh these teams made these decisions and they have to suffer punishment and third - this is a sanction, it is obvious that the putin regime is gradually recovering from sanctions and is looking for new sales markets, and therefore it is essential that the sanctions are strengthened and not well it's just there, yes, nominally, these packages were formed, of course , we are outraged that there is no package in the 10th package , for example, rosatom is very worried that russia is now replacing european markets with third

countries, india, china, and it is obvious that everyone in meetings with our partners, we talk about the seriousness of the sanction and the need for a joint dialogue with third countries so that they also join the sanctions against russia . i know something again with the connection . unfortunately, the connection is worse than with the zoryanyi radchenko front. but i think that we will still find time and opportunity to contact her. the fact that the former minister of foreign affairs of china, who is now in charge of the diplomacy of the politburo party, specifically came to munich to accuse the united states , this does not happen so often, that is, it is clear that the main topic that all

observers are talking about now is that he specifically said what about any peace proposals from china regarding the end of the war, what is driving you, the accounting will publish peace proposals, but to be honest , i can imagine the price, not proposals to give us territories, yes, the russian federation in general they will pretend that none of this is the case, but they will demand the neutrality of ukraine, so that the nato bloc takes into account the fears of russia. oh, and iryna. well, you’re already here, please tell me, and you ’ve heard all these chinese conversations about china’s peace plan, what do you think about it at all, because in i have the impression that this will be a false plan, and it is obvious that everyone is concerned. i think that the whole world is worried about the escalation between america and china, and i think that everyone is interested, of course, in the normalization of each other

, very often, it is also obvious that is china is interested in weakening russia, weakening the west, and this is his game, and here it is very important that ukraine and our partners work very actively, including on the reform of the security council of other international organizations and through which it is possible to influence third countries and for it is important to me that it is possible , but for the first time at the conference such a hint was sounded by french president macron about the need to reform the un security council. well, of course , my observations are interesting that world leaders are now trying to say that what is to show yourself, which looks a bit strange too. when they say that they didn't believe that wagner was part of putin's army , they tried to trust putin. i would like them to

draw conclusions from this trust or trust game, and today they don't. repeated these mistakes and were not afraid of the disintegration of russia there or chaos in russia , when the main problem is that russia today is creating chaos in the whole world, creating security chaos in europe. you know it was a conference without russians, for the first time the russian delegation was not invited. and the perspective was what the world should be like after the victory and without russia, well, i mean not russia geographically, but russia from the point of view of its absence in international organizations and in civilized society and ms. iryna regarding

a ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- appeared on the part of the czech republic. it was a very unexpected statement, it was made at a traditional ukrainian lunch held on the sidelines of the munich conference, and that's right. it seems to me that this is such a parafracracy of the fears i said that many of our partners may not have the right vlog there. it is said, but between the lines, they did not run away because they are afraid of the disintegration of russia, there is chaos in russia and ukraine, this should be taken into account, perhaps the president of the czech republic expressed it so, you know , more sharply what we heard somewhere between the lines. of course, this is worrying and very important

that the ukrainian minister of foreign affairs and our partners who were present at this lunch, the prime ministers of estonia, finland and sweden, very clearly emphasized that the scenario must be different, russia must pay the highest price for its aggression and war, and it is obvious that it cannot there should be no concessions regarding the territorial integrity of the sovereignty of ukraine. to what extent, in principle, can it be assumed that this munich will become such? i would say that this is a clear indicator that foreign policy has changed. and there will be no more attempts to find an understanding with putin. no, we are clearly aware. that, of course, foreign policy is generally changeable, and you, as professionals who follow the munich security conference from year to year and other important international events

, know that, for example, two years ago, a year ago, the key topic was martial law, and today it has already been pushed aside by other problems ukraine occupies a key place in the world today , as we must realize that the world is really faced with a lot of problems every day , it is very important for us, so while the world's attention is focused on us, that we use it correctly. from the point of view of obtaining weapons, getting closer to yesinat integration, and very serious work that must be started now, and not in some myths, but serious work regarding the future reconstruction of ukraine, but the world will naturally look for