[000:00:00;00] i want to emphasize that ukraine needs ukrainian heroes alive - this is our principle. they think that every adequate person will understand these words. they are chosen to rescue the defenders of mariupol. it was started by our military scouts that the work of returning the boys home continues . this work requires delicacy and time. it took ukraine exactly four months to bring home the first defenders of mariupol on september 21, 2022, the main intelligence directorate of the ministry of defense, together with other law enforcement agencies, managed to conduct a unique operation of the great exchange, a total of 215 fighters, in particular 10 foreigners, were released from russian prisons in addition to two hundred soldiers. we

returned five more combat commanders for whom we had to fight the most and for the longest time. safety in comfortable conditions and under the personal protection of the president of turkey until the end of the war , but we will provide their families with the opportunity to see them serhiy volynsky svyatoslav palamar denys prokopenko oleg khomenko denys the release of our prisoners from individual defenders of azov steel continues until all our people return home and people and territories , especially it is a proud steel city on azov , the sun rose on the lawn, the wind over dune, the bear is cold, but it is gone, it smells like spring, the eyes are already

tired of the habit there are too many reasons for a dream , how will we be? you will be fine again, no ship 's cannons will break my dream, i believe my heart will never betray

me, the righteous city of mary will stand forever as long as the sun is above the garden the sky rises mushrooms and your mind's rubbish is a seam yesterday at night the concrete smells of war think how you will be tomorrow time there is no reason heart hands have lived a long time scream you nomedia ours will not break my dream plane my heart i congratulate you dear tv viewers on the air of

the espresso tv channel program studio event we will analyze the most important events, in particular those related to both the military and diplomatic negotiation components, our guests today are andrii piontkovsky , a political scientist who is in washington, and mark wolter, a military expert and a former adviser of the commander of the ground forces of the united states on the european continent and now on our broadcast will be mark voider, ex-adviser of the former commander of the ground forces of the united states on the european continent, a current professor at the american university in kyiv. glory to ukraine, mark. greetings , yaroslav valentiny, thank you for the invitation. good day, always a pleasure to join. well, what happened? what happened, russian aircraft shot down an american drone in the black sea . as far as i understand, this story is much more serious than it is trying to interpret like this

because it is about aggression in international airspace, you would be right , it is a severe violation of international law, or this american drone was in the border water areas. how do you know how russia is trying to show that it has such quasi- sovereignties, as i would say, and in the black sea , what is for russia from the point of view of russia and russian strategic interests, the black sea is an internal lake and all the countries that exist in the black sea region, such as america, for example , or other consequences of the country, and they are for russia well, from the point of view of the russian problem of external power, and uh, russia is trying to help show that this is their uh, the basic phases

of the legal territory . of course, this is propaganda, it was running . that she also very much shows that she is very worried about the next next account e-e in france in which 13 ukrainian villages especially in the direction of crimea you know a drone club somewhere as far as i know 120 km from crimea ago in the direction of crimea and katana who can then look with your from your intelligence with your with your military leadership therefore and for russia and it is very important to limit e-e access to these data to limit e-e access of western american and western writers so

communities and so that in the verification or to and yes, from the quantity or quality of intelligence information before the offensive of ukraine, in which everyone expects already in the following places, i think the reaction is still so balanced on the side of american policy statements that this may be an incident if it is so to me, we were reminded of the incident in poland. i see that in the information space nato and the usa do not want an information war to unfold there directly and for the temperature to rise so much, but i think that there will be consequences and the excellent military leadership will take measures.

there was a conversation between austin and shoigu. also a serious signal , because it’s been a long time since there have been such conversations, let’s look at how many of these incidents always or should they always have such a potential uh-uh potential possibilities from the point of view of american analytics a-a m-m lead to escalation, that's why and there are always bullets, it's real, it's a kinetic gathering, it's real, and it's logical that the military leaders of two countries are trying to form a scorpion, fix it and explain what happened. i think that the russians will retreat from their opinion and their propaganda thesis that it is it could it is among the innocent well, as always, they blame the side with their hands, and therefore i would not expect any

such informational breakthrough. but maybe turkey will be able to give america the opportunity to introduce its boats. the story of the downed drone is somehow woven into dvinkin's business card to russia, we understand that russia will now try to demonstrate its greatest possible strength , aggressiveness and readiness to compete, in particular with the united states, whether we like it or not , but there is a feeling that the world is turning into a bipolar system, in particular, it is not about confrontation with russia, yes , it is about the formation of such a larger, broader political, perhaps not formalized union, where the flagship is not moscow, but beijing, when they said that

it is really being formed now, or to see a new the new international system - the new global order, and indeed it can be bipolar again, but moscow is no longer there. well, the whole of the soviet union and therefore china knows very well these facts, well, the composition for china is matches, brother, let's say so from the point of view of the deceased junior junior partner we say yes yes that's why and uh this is logical and he wants to assert his position and show putin and in the usa as well that he is one of the two players in the new peace lease uh order but the problem is that you know chinese

politics has also been changing for 45 years. there was already an axiom in the west, hmm, in western analytics, in western politics, that china is governed only by, well, in general, commercial logic, that china is interested in stable trade with america from europe, and so on, and no one i didn't think that he was leaving, they were uh, behave aggressively, but we already have other leaders, other china. i would say , i wouldn't say that these pray and or stare mysto or but everyone and putin are very similar and both are authoritarian and seem to me to be very ideological that's why and i will wait ideological, we ask what this

ideological brizos is between russia and china, so that it still appears even more so and we can expect that china will simply be, well, on the one hand, i said to show the city against it, on the other hand, er, to play this so-called two-year the role of a peacemaker, what does he know china has proposed such a measured plan that de facto can actually freeze the conflict but it cannot solve it in any way or in any way, and therefore china simply continues to be and will be an even more important factor especially well, not only in relation to ukraine and the china sea are late in chinese i think that the biden administration still considered china as a more er predictably more er responsible power also in the strategic

plan it is really a rival of er russia but in the short-term, plagiarism is really russia - it's a renegade renegade renegade china is still considered more uh, the majority of the country is serious, and that is why we must see everything, for sure , as well as efforts to talk between the american administration and the leadership, after the conversation and meetings with putin, all the bells and whistles seem to be planning a virtual conversation with president zelensky. i would like to ask your vision of what china's real undeclared plan might entail, and accordingly, let's try to predict what the president of ukraine and the chinese leader can talk about. i can find out that from the side of ukraine, your leadership, president

zelenskyi can try to convince china that this war is really not in the interests of china what , for example, is a huge erghost, financial , commercial, strategic, strategic initiative of china, train and road, for example, you know there are communication routes through eurasia, russia, of course, central asia, and belarus, ukraine, in my opinion, it was logical because china wanted the war to stop. so i would say that zelensky will definitely try to make such surnames i will rationally study a rational national strategy and will also try to find out

if everyone really intends to help stop the war, but i also see such a structural problem here that no one in ukraine, no one in the western world can be a serious politician to behave on the fact that the war has stopped and russia has received these territories, which they are occupying illegally, so it is difficult to see how even if everyone can convince putin to leave these territories , what about me there will be a conversation in moscow about ammunition and the help of financial instruments and other ways and methods by which china can help russia, and probably everyone will offer some that are stopped in the fire, some that should be checked, or open or time

points of their plan, to be honest, i don’t think that this is there will have to be success for what i think everyone and then is too ideologically close and dinner is a big taxi they don’t want a global war so that this system collapses yes but such a hybrid such a frozen conflict is the west and america is constantly distracted well away from china at a distance and i i think it is in the interests of his , well, strategic vision for the new global bureau of order. recently, several very important, as for me, information attacks happened , in particular, russia began to blame this event, began to blame some invented by her, i don't know ukrainian-russian underwater terrorists and so on and so on in the undermining of nord stream one and nord stream-2 and as far as i understand, taking into account the fact that the event itself happened

long before the current information attack , russia is now preparing to use this information plan, this information atmosphere for something, this is very logical logically , from the point of view of the russian hybrid war , information was the main component of the so-called gerasimukh doctrine, we know that the commander is now gerasim on the battlefield, it is almost a total failure, and there will be no serious successes therefore, it is logical that the russian command and the kremlin are trying to expand the conflict to a hybrid drone plan. as moldova said to calculate the situation now

, the accusations of destroying the northern stream are logical. and this big project is why the germans had a muscular, well , europe and the gas crisis in general, first you shoot more carefully, that is, here the informational component is very connected, for example, directly because of political pressure, and i always say it is a war. unfortunately, you have it in a compensatory plan. but in the global european and global a-a space, it is a hybrid. there will probably be provocations, it was more. and i also read so far. both the cyber and the new ones that

are being built will be built, so we can check that you are the author of a hybrid to ukraine. well , we welcome his team. and of course, the kremlin, which will support him if they can’t reach some kind of progression, some uh, what kind of victory? well, there will be a retread in russia, the victory will be difficult, and they will expand conflicts with hybrid methods, that is, it is about the threat of the so-called underwater communication between the old and the new world, in particular, it is about trans-atlantic and pacific cables, yes , it is possible that's why russia has been a long time, well, the russian chuvnik football has been a long time ago, uh, i think in the forest . before, they always uh, tried so hard, it was, as i wanted to say, like a training session, but

the politicians, the moments were like uh, the politicians of the world what are the russian concrete and why the apparatuses and so and yes we are international communication transport communication very much this is the backbone of the real international international economy and politics and that is why it was forever in time or increased confrontation that russia also tried to damage such drops of course there are already things it's about well , it's not easy, it's not just there, it's necessary. underwater, well , a deep-sea device is there, a few kilometers away, there are a lot of things there, it was about 50 m apostolov, 130 m in the atlantic ocean uh, a few kilometers ago and well, in those illogical terms - it's much more complicated, but as i said before, and maybe i would, i'm sure, that cutting her transplant communications like this is part

of some kind of plan, eh military plan of time , potential bodies of compensation from the back, a strange understanding between the saudis but for the iranians, in fact, this is not a story about diplomacy, but a story about a certain revolution in the middle east. what are the possible consequences of this understanding ? well, this is again the role of china in this plan, to indicate a huge success, well, at least in terms of information. let's see if it will be real . this is one thing. he signed a condition. other things are that iran supports many organizations and villages in the middle east. what are the enemies of saudi arabia? the science of the rebellion in yemen, of course

, is the organization of sichi. structural problems that only one condition cannot solve. but the real problem is that america has had many years. i wouldn't say that it is absent. but america had other priorities and the china sea, of course, nato , of course, ukraine, russia, and there are many policies politicians, analysts, even those who said that america already needs to be so far from the middle east that there are similar problems and other , and therefore, more middle eastern countries see this and for them iran is an existential threat, international politicians have such a principle that when their hegemon is absent, that is, the former region of america, yes, the fifth american fleet is still in

bahrain, but all the senses are such that america, for example, saudi arabia , the motherland, and you know the problems there, journalism shows and problems, and therefore colleagues there are no small countries and what’s new. well, they are characteristic. i say yes , or new, a great power, but before i thought that it would be russia, and russia is the russians. i am in the middle east, now russia is military. it’s really the arabs of this, and i see it because it is logical that the other great power - this is china, which is perceived as more voted, and also china will have to than aura, it is changing from iran - you are changing your policy

to be democratic. internal changes, and therefore for the country. it seems to me that now china is very convenient, that is, to accept that china is china at a distance of so many thousands of kilometers, it is not a direct threat, but it has such a rich influence and rushed to victory. unfortunately, for china , that is why and all -he will probably be in moscow, we will also come from some sense that he has already solved one of the main global problems in the middle east, is

it possible to try to solve it now? about the visit all the calls to this are a story not only about diplomacy or any peace plans, are they real or realistic? is this also a question about resources, in particular about military resources, and china may or may not provide russia? well , according to this, it will also largely depend on how long it will be russian aggression against ukraine. china itself will not fight . no, i will not go to the middle east in support of russia. the chinese army did not fight with 70 in 1979 and fought with bullets against vietnam. won so that's why and i'm wary of attention, there are some concrete steps in that regard, but also very important moments when the russian army is already using the state, old

or epifants and weapons, everyone already sees these, you know, also financial instruments and also with the support of the russian economy and of course russian oil and gas well, in the end, india also uses this moment very much and it can be the most important moment of supporting and electronic company in circumventing western sanctions and therefore distracting the west especially america is on the battlefield in ukraine to freeze conflicts or make it so long there it was in the interests of china while china is preparing it is possible to join you in the future for several years of its future thank you very much dear mark for this extremely interesting informative conversation and i want to remind our tv viewers that

mark voidler, ex-adviser of the former commander of the united states ground forces on the european continent, professor of the american university in kyiv, worked for them now on the espresso tv channel. thank you antin and glory to ukraine, glory to the heroes, glory to ukraine's heroes, andriy piontkovsky, a political scientist who is in washington, will be working on espresso tv channel now. glory to ukraine andrii andriyovich, i congratulate you. good evening. the story of how two russian fighter jets shot down an american drone in the black sea is not only about russia's military provocation, it is also about the launch of a fundamentally new additional case, which is called the possible strengthening of the discussion regarding

the supply of aviation to us. well, you are right. and first of all, the day on the states to discuss the presentation of modern offensive weapons in ukraine well , we saw certain restrictions, the request imposes on us . a strange restriction how not to use if the planes go down from which uh, rockets rise from the tin of ukrainian cities rise from the russian generic how not to wear well, here is the question less, he determined dry conditions in relation to ukraine, he, um, he does everything for the fact that the calendar

of his victory, but all the time, he adds one ear of corn. a harsh statement , uh , consider me permissible if so , igor, the students did not interpret it as an attack on the americans. statute and i don't want immediacy in stoknoveniya well, this is too small a story, the story is too small, but on the other hand, we remember that this was preceded, in particular , it is about the flight of a powerful aircraft 200 km from leningrad to the dash of st. petersburg, well, yes, it is necessary to react to putin's blackmail, including the attitude of the only street here, it is necessary to give due to the americans, they

warned their partners at the time, back in october, that the use of putin's tactical nuclear weapons in ukraine would be followed by what she fenced and not they explained that this will be the complete destruction of the russian group on the territory of ukraine krym, that putin will be killed personally well, in order not to forget about this warning, they are similar flights and gestures of course it will be wrapped in various diplomatic tinsel of a propaganda plan and so on and so on, but the story is not trivial the visit is not banal, everyone is ringing during a full-scale russian invasion of ukraine, will visit putin, you know, i will start