[000:00:00;00] on the eve of its entry into the north atlantic alliance, but returning to this thesis, one gets the persistent impression that at the summit in vilnius they will be watching carefully what will be the crowning or at least what will be the intermediate results of the ukrainian offensive in your opinion, or is our counteroffensive at all decisive now it is a question for the north atlantic alliance to accept our perspective or not. therefore, it is a false opinion if it really reflects the real state of the strategy of the ukrainian delegation to nato, which was expressed by the ukrainian parliamentarian because uh, i think we lost our chance not now now we can win we lost our chance from 19 to 21 when the ukrainian president was not in great britain when

finally in the 22nd year the ukrainian president was not at the nato summit in spain this we had our chances, and if we had then, against the background of the success of 18-19 years, we were talking about the pdc, today we had a completely different situation, i don’t know if it is possible to say that if the conclusions were correct and the strategy was continued in the xix-xx-xxi years, putin did not would dare to attack because he would i have seen the readiness of ukraine, it is impossible to judge so categorically today, but the fact that we would have completely different opportunities for joining nato obviously cannot be declared from ukraine that our military cooperation is a victory, first of all, because it is not just the ukrainian army that will join nato ukrainian state ukrainian society and this is not only a military component, this is also freedom of speech, this is the rule of law

, this is democracy, this is this, and this is a whole series of norms and standards to which the country must meet , or can ukraine join without ending the war in nato, well, i am convinced that ukrainian politicians cannot ask questions like that. maybe someone else can ask questions like that, we should ask questions already today and immediately , because this one meets the standards of the interests of the democratic world , yaroslav igorchyshyn, the people's deputy representing the voice faction, welcomes you mr. yaroslav we are talking about the integration of ukraine into nato, but today the secretary general speaking at this military committee and stoltonberg of the alliance told them that the alliance needs to redouble its efforts to guarantee the safety of a billion people in the countries bloc due to a significant number of threats that are constantly growing and that ukraine needs to be doubled or tripled, and oleg synyutka says that integration into nato is not only about weapons, about victory and about the army, but also about certain

social and state reforms, changes that we also have to carry out. here, our main task is, please, the approximation of nato standards, not only in weapons. now, let's say , in a natural way, we are actually transferring our weapons to mostly nato standards only because the post-soviet weapons as much as possible, there is no need to manufacture such junk. well, plus, the key producer of this is not needed , that is, russia is clearly not an option for us where we can draw our weapons resource, so we are already switching to nato standards and this war made a crazy natural push in this direction in terms of weapons, but there are other aspects, such as noisy purchases

, so is our misha secretka. in ukraine , even before the war, according to soviet standards , almost 80% of the information that it is related to danger and defense, that is, to find out what our military feeds on. it would be possible only for those people who have access to the actual state government, this does not meet nato standards at all, and only three types of information are too classified. and this is actually the placement of military units - this is their movement of radio frequencies, which are actually used in order to have communication between the parts, yes. that is, we understand the ukrainian realities, almost nothing is possible, and ignore such realities, everything that does not relate to direct military actions is possible, so that's why of course, what kind of weapons are being produced there, in what quantity, that is, everything related to military operations is secret, so in this direction we have to go a huge and

huge way. but is it now an opportunity for us to come to the maximum? automatically we are included in the western monitoring system for their use . it is already implemented in the ukrainian military, all it technologies , they are almost all adjusted, well, except there . unfortunately, we are creatively trying to develop themselves, but alya, there is a bell program that has been lavished with huge sums of money, according to which there are conclusions of our internal and external auditors that it does not work there, but they are still trying to appease the armed forces. that is, we have to start . well, when we communicate with our that is, western but eastern european partners, but how did you become nato members, what did they say

to you at this stage, or is it interesting that they, like us americans, europeans, said one phrase: you should become us. and for this, well, state officials have to steal and information must be transparent and accountable in society, and freedom of speech should be a fundamental aspect, and we will not have to fight for it, ah, hmm, even taking into account all the objective or subjective factors, when we become a nato country, in essence , it is not only the army, because our army is already one from the best countries of the nato army. when society becomes essentially nato-like, then we will become nato members, and even before that, it gives crazy opportunities, but ukraine will pay for it and is already paying such a price that no other country has paid. why would we be nato members? to there would most likely not be a war, well, the european commission in june will publish a preliminary assessment of ukraine's progress in the reforms necessary for hryhoriv's opening of our membership in

the european union. well, the concern of ukrainian analytical centers e-e notes that the e-e assessment of ukraine's fulfillment of european integration criteria was 6 , 8 tenths of a point out of 10, that is, it exceeded two-thirds and this is definitely positive 9% of 100% 80% a-a what is included in the eye eh 3.2%, which we have not yet completed you know, i very often get the impression that someone specially at the top of the government is doing everything possible so that we still do not complete this homework after the start of the negotiation procedure, this is the basic thing and this is obviously freedom of speech, well, without freedom of speech, we are dear and the road to nato is closed to us and to the european community, today in odesa

the dumskaya publication is being searched, that is, a publication that has its own position, a publication that talks about it, you see, in odesa , a representative of the opsz sits as the deputy head of the regional council, and no one cares, and the opsz sits in the parliament, and no one cares, but the duma edition, whose founder is a member of european solidarity, a member of the regional council mykhailo shmotkovich, it interferes with the duma now, i think they probably wrote something wrong well, what else to ask? and why was espresso excluded from the digital ether ? with the direct and the fifth and we do not return it, we consider it a poroshenko channel, although we have no relationship with poroshenko, please, and what is wrong in lviv that the servants of the people together with the representatives of the police have been for more than six months

block the work of the territorial election commission so that the deputies of the regional council elected by the residents of lviv oblast from european solidarity and the galician party receive their respective status, so what is wrong , why are the servants of the people from the opsz acting like this in nisson and where in lviv, odesa, kyiv, i will give you an answer to your questions, because the duma has a relationship not only with the mentioned deputy-obrada, but also probably indirectly or directly with oleksiy goncharenko , a member of the verkhovna rada, all goncharenkos want to close their mouths in the case there about 30,000 additional payments the military and in this way the pressure is surely being exerted, but you will shut your mouth. we will close the persecution of the publication of someone close to you. when oleksiy honcharenko not only as a member of the verkhovna rada, but also as a representative of the parliamentary assembly of the council of europe , according to the decision of the leadership of the parliament, i do not know who inspired them with this decision, but they did not publish it in borders of the country so that he could take part in the conference in switzerland, which actually as a delegate of the parliamentary assembly of the council of europe is

really too much friends if you have already mentioned odesa and mr. yaroslav is still in touch with us e p yaroslav, you noted an important moment on the way to nato , european integration, we as a society have to abandon the practice of officials being linked to bribes, corruption , and so on, and one of the most successful reforms in our country is the reform of local self-government, and uh, literally we will regularly say that representatives of local self-government are now sometimes even forced to carry out some attacks on themselves we all remember what happened to the mayor of chernihiv , mr. mattroshenko, we all remember the consolidated position of the mayors of various of ukrainian cities, which are very often, well, at least in rhetoric, even in opposition to not one, but when the issue of defense comes to real reforms, they all become one wall in this direction, after all, it is

trukhanov's case and the attempt to take him as a hostage in the walls vacancies from the mayor of kyiv, vitaliy klychka. this is not really about the protection of local self-government . a normal, adequate judicial system simply fell apart, there was no component of actual corruption, and at least mr. atroshenko never had a suspicion that he was cooperating with aggressor countries, that is, with russia, and mr. klitschko in 14 in 2008, i asked the law enforcement agencies to check the russian citizenship of mr. trukhanov , showing a copy of his passport, then the security service refused, giving no

and no answers, but mr. trukhanov went to the elections and won the elections that then took place in odesa on may 2, 14, and when thank god that the patriots of self-defense a-a avtomaidanov managed to protect the city from the actual creation of the odesa people's republic of odesa narodnoi respublika so that's why a-a when we talk about local self-government it needs frantic protection, because if we want to build a new ukraine, i really do not like the rhetoric of restoration as critical against the restoration of post-soviet ukraine, which actually existed before the war, unfortunately, in one or another metastases, we need to build a new and with you, it would be based exactly on independent local self-government, which is protected from e-e centralization. however, their

activities and law enforcement systems can act only on those who really commit a crime, but according to trukhanov, i apologize, but there are stains, well, if there is no place to blame the kidnapping conditional privatization of the krayan plant law, but we mentioned mr. shurkovich oleksiy honcharenko, they are constantly fighting with trukhanov with pro-russian forces , why because what is being rebuilt is happening construction of beaches because the destruction of ukrainian odesa is actually taking place and what if the worst, most likely in the interests of russian capital and russian interests , the security service of ukraine did not succeed. saying it's not me, it's me the city association asked when

he took the atrosh woman as bail, well, if the people of kyiv had rather supported him and there, although , again, this is how we can talk about debatability mr. trochinka himself spoke a little about the various influences there, but there was an understanding that this was the protection of local self-government when the leader of the kyivans who stood on the maidan, a very large number of whom are now actually fighting at the front from other regions and where to bail out who is probably corrupt and who whom he himself literally at the beginning of the war, he accused me of belonging to the pro-russian camp , having a russian passport, well, this is either an inconsistency, or it is already starting to look like a corruption surety, you know. after all, i once had a draft law. unfortunately, the servants of the people were afraid to consider it. it forbade top officials to take bail for people accused of corruption. why is the symbol very bad in our country, and now it is so

that the impression is created that they are all smeared with the same corruption. they take money and the like, and here we would like to confirm it, yes thank you, yaroslav, unfortunately, we don’t have much time , unfortunately, i’m sure that klitschko’s speech is lying, he really said from the podium and the parliament then to check i ask to check trukhanov’s citizenship for what such a deputy, anatolii kyrivochkinov , do you remember them, the former prime ministers, by the way, the head of the ospp e-e showed a certificate from the consulate general of russia in odesa. where is it written? in the year he was not a citizen of the russian federation, the certificate is actually valid for six months from the day the visa was issued , ayubaiken. do you understand the question? no , it is not related to this story. well, are we

going to take trukhanov on the move? exactly, no. are our deputies from the european solidarity in odessa really fighting against the opz against trukhanov about all the corrupt people, really yes, but on the other hand, well, today there is an attack on local self-government , a lot of exclusive powers of local authorities today, under the pretext of wartime, are transferred to state structures and central bodies authorities under slavuta and draft law 56-65 when local self-government wanted to elect authorities and then it was voted in the parliament with the servants of the people together with the police and thank god it was not signed by the president and it did not become a valid law, it is also an attack on local self-government, and with the permanent local self-government, the road to the eu and nato is closed to us, and whoever attacks local self-government today is actually attacking our road to the eu and nato, and that is why

you can't do any kind of local self-organization. i'm not talking about trukhanov . i picked up the phenomenon, but sukhanov is clear. well, we never supported him, we don't support him and we won't support him. well, if he's a corrupt person, let him answer according to the law. and how can there be any other way? klitschko's explanation that odesa, as a territorial community, is part of the association of cities, klitschko heads the association of cities , so he defends himself. he presents himself about klitschko's explanation. ask klitschko's consul aya baikin. good surname, but the reference already. i hope for six months for his baikin, a suitcase, a train station. guests and online guests of our studio thank you, dear people's deputies, so on, we will talk about the osce report on the crimes of the russian federation against ukrainian children and our next guest, kateryna rashevska

a lawyer from the georgian center for human rights analyzed this report katya, we congratulate you glory to ukraine glory to the heroes so what conclusion did the osce representatives come to, what does this report consist of or does it actually resonate with the official and very truth-based position of the ukrainian state that wants to protect its children eh yes absolutely echoes, moreover, the experts have placed certain emphases and their position is somewhat different from the position of those international organizations that have already expressed their opinion regarding the deportation and forced transfer of ukrainian children from on the part of the russian federation, in particular, they see such actions as signs of not only a war crime, moreover, the previous two moscow mechanisms of the osce have already accurately concluded that, for example, deportation , while it was the so-called evacuation by the russian federation of children from the kherson boarding school, is nothing more than a war crime

in addition, the experts found a violation of a third part of the un convention on the rights of the child, that is , a third part of the convention was violated by the russian federation during such transfers and illegal deportations, these are 14 articles just for understanding and, for example, the whole absurdity of the situation that the right of ukrainian children to health, recreation and leisure was violated in the so-called rehabilitation and recreation camps , we are also talking about citizenship imposed by the russian federation, which is no salvation and no additional rights and only an arbitrary violation of the un convention on the rights of the child, international humanitarian law , finally no certain conclusions concerning the reports of certain odious international organizations, in particular, you remember of all i was shocked by the news that the ukrainian military is allegedly placing its installations in schools near kindergartens and

so on, and they lost a lot of reputation after this report, but by the way, some independent commission was supposed to analyze their reports and the commission came to the conclusion that actually the basis that was taken for the analysis of the capacity, it was, well, very imperfect, yes, absolutely, unfortunately, they made public a certain part of the conclusions, i remind you that it was only a statement of the report itself. we did not see it with our eyes, it was not available. or maybe it it simply did not exist, it was not clear what was the methodology on the basis of which the appropriate conclusions were drawn. at the same time, i want to remind you that ukraine is a participant in the so-called irish declaration, this is a declaration on the protection of educational institutions during an armed conflict, and the russian federation is a participant in such a declaration not me. therefore, ukraine guarantees the safety of educational institutions in the course of an armed conflict, and here it is important to understand that it is the russian federation, neglecting the relevant obligations, that actually commits

a war crime and this crime of human shields. i want to pay attention to the living today, also because the experts of the moscow mechanism are talking about it, but we are also now seeing how the civilian population is simply being taken out by the thousands from the occupied zaporizhzhia region and, in principle, we are now in a certain information asymmetry , not we understand in detail what is happening on the fronts, but to a certain extent, under the condition of proof , it can also be called human shields , they are simply covered by the population , including the children's population, in order to to save one's own skin, see katya, i am interested in such a purely the moment is very important and is there a difference in the qualification of the actions of the russians when it comes to the deportation of ukrainian children to russian territory and kilimova is about the transfer of ukrainian children to occupied but ukrainian territory. are these comparable

moments? must understand that in general laws, deportation and forced relocation are provided for as war crimes in one article of the shtrovka statute, that is , they go like this in the merchant and the fourth geneva statutes convention to the additional protocol. that is, in principle, it is together, but we must understand that in some cases this is what we may sometimes call forced displacement, and unfortunately , according to the assessment of the report of the moscow mechanism, this can be considered as a legitimate action that does not violate international humanitarian law on the part of the russian federation, i.e. sometimes when the russian federation relocates part of the population in connection with the movement of the front line on the territory of occupied ukraine. this may be legitimate. i will cut it. it will be on all channels. it is me legitimately until the moment when i am a danger. all other acts of the russian federation that

are related to forced passporting , reunification of families, further deportation on the territory of the russian federation, and an unprovoked delay in the repatriation of this civilian population as gross violations of international humanitarian law and, accordingly , war crimes, therefore, if initially to a certain extent security considerations can justify such a transfer, then in the subsequent actions of the russian federation simply testify in favor of the fact that this is a separate war crime and i want to emphasize that ukraine has repeatedly asked the russian federation for permission to cooperate in order to open evacuation corridors from the occupied territories to the territory of ukraine under the control of ukraine , a safe territory. the russian federation has ignored such requests, among other things and testify to the criminal nature of her actions kateryna well, in general, at the current moment , how many deported and removed children

can we talk about with ukraine and where exactly in which it is in this part of russia or the occupied part of ukraine. they are located. please wait a minute. we are talking about 260,000 children, but you must understand that in connection with the events in the zaporizhzhia region, these numbers are much higher. i emphasize that the relocation was carried out to 57 subjects of federation, currently some of the children remain there until the occupied crimean peninsula on the territory of the so-called lpr and dpr, and it is also especially important to pay attention to the territory of belarus and currently children from the occupied zaporizhzhia region are exported also on the territory of belarus, the question is why there is no claim against both putin and lukashenka in the criminal court in gazi. well, this is a promising question . thank you. kateryna ryshevska was in direct contact with the studio of the yuryivska public association, the regional center for human rights. we

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