[000:00:00;00] we didn’t attack, well, there were separate operations, but it remains, based on the results of the offensive, it will become clear what is missing, maybe three sevens will do, and maybe we need to be , uh, it will be necessary. well, we will see what is needed, well, a new gun is lighter and more convenient for such movements, but in the end we must also understand that after this operation is over, it will mean that these weapons that were needed for deoccupation may never be needed again , other weapons will be needed to deter the new the attack of russia and there we are not here, we cannot fall into the trap of the last war, we liberated the territory and will do what was necessary to liberate the territory, but before the war they will be different after the liberation well, we will see here it is very difficult just for sure we will need

simple reliable technologies and what are already modern, just those that are useful in these latitudes . well, here you are talking about the fact that technologies should be simple and simple solutions. now, as we understand it, we will carry out offensive actions, and after that, we will draw conclusions that we will be needed at the next stage, and already on the basis of these conclusions, it is possible to approach the development of a model of the updated ukrainian army, because now this question is still being resolved, what should be the ukrainian army in the future, you are talking about the fact that there should be infantry, and maybe there should be solutions which can better protect the infantry and the use of infantry may be minimally necessary and literally one minute what should be the optimal appearance of the prospective ukrainian army, especially since this question one way or another, it is still up to date, but it should be an army that is included in

the nato defense planning system, there now this process is happening very intensively and i think that we will understand about this war , we will be valuable because we are something let's share with other nato countries , and they will share with us what is needed to deter russia or other enemies, actually on the borders of ukraine, there will be such an exchange of technologies. so for this , we need to prepare for this. i think, after all , the balance will really be more in the direction of deterrence than the offensive between the field and such activities , but, after all, we need to go another way and the fulfillment of our serious obligations with other countries that will need our storm infantry in the eye thank you very much for your as always interesting evaluations, professional evaluations, and our viewers, what's on the air of espresso commercials bo oleksiy ezhik experts of the national institute of strategic

studies and now valentin batrak is joining us director of the center for research of the army conversion and disarmament analytics writer valentino congratulations, mr. serhiy, we they probably heard a piece of our conversation with oleksiy izhak, we talked about the prospects of the ukrainian army, but where is it moving and you? i would like to ask, almost 15 months of the war have already passed, whether it is possible to draw conclusions about what the national defense industry did to make our army more powerful, if not i did it, why, and if i did it, what and how is it noticeable on the battlefield. if possible, i just want to start with the continuation , so to speak, of what oleksiy said, he said a very cool thesis, in my opinion, that technologies should be simple, modern technologies and they have what makes them work, new technologies work

because they are cheaper, more accessible, but can be used en masse, at the same time , the use of the latest materials, the latest achievements, allows certain breakthroughs to be made. began to happen, i remember september 19th, we began to look at the situation differently when in saudi arabia 10 kamikaze drones attacked the oil refining industry and saudi arabia even having anti-missile systems defense of petriv. i was unable to do anything. now i will remind you about the latest decisions regarding supplies, and then they will move to our defense industry. literally in the last two days , we should have received such things that i am

very, well, so to speak, provided to me additional additional signals additional convictions that i was actually on the right path before, first of all, spain will provide us with a significant number of kamikaze drones that can be used without gps guidance, but they are compact , inconspicuous, silent, uh, cheap and they are mass-produced yes, the same, the same solution, almost the same solution, this is a series of drones provided to us by great britain , it seems, they are called kinetic and can operate up to 200 km. they were previously developed for the naval forces, so that the ship would not lose a large expensive missile

and it’s so uh f- well powerful and used uh so inconspicuous uh silent uh drone that is capable of killing some patrol boat or something like that yes uh next again the united states will provide us with the redcat company to provide 200 e ftvi drones that are very maneuverable, very maneuverable, capable of developing speeds up to 170 km/h and can, let's say, be used not only for hitting, for example, vertically or e-e, a target along the trajectory, but even fly into some objects and carry out damage there such weapons are very difficult to hit the enemy, but at the same time, such weapons are very powerful and if they

are used en masse. systems well for example, we, ukraine, conducted the first ever attack by sea drones, and not just sea drones. and this can be called a mosquito strategy when a group of drones is used in the future. it will probably be a swarm of drones that will be controlled from one center, and then it will be possible will talk about a very powerful force despite the fact that all these drones are relatively cheap and they have a combat unit . now volunteers, for example we call ersatz killers that use private or i would say civilian

quadcopters and drop some ammunition , such systems allow you to use them very effectively at 1-3 km , more powerful systems and such, for example , the americans gave us the switch blade. candle blade 300, then it is already there 10 km, if brothers, let's say our closest cell for armored vehicles, it is already up to 30-40, and maybe even and one more clarification, we are now talking about the technical characteristics of foreign drones and we understand that in reality what are you on supplied. they may be good, but their number is in any case limited and the question arises as to where our defense industry stands, can it be such a multiplier, and the creation of either foreign samples or its own samples so that there are more of them . and if it is possible, who should be their leader

the driver of these processes, so that we have a lot of these drones, so that we do not go there for western supplies, i bet on mine , who can be a driver, is there such a driver in ukraine, if not, what, what should be done , this is absolutely what it is about. i understand that the ministry of defense cannot now take care of weapons for the future, but rather for today and now . in this way, we always calculated that there would be another flow of funding, and we linked it with the ministry of strategic industries, but this is due to the fact that we have internal political things there internal political moments did not allow him to make tretekhprom such a center. although there are now signs that he can wake up, even the fact that mintratekhprom has become the governing

center for ukroboronprom is now already it's called the joint stock company ukrainian defense industry. if so, then these discussions and different competitions and quarrels are a thing of the past, and i think that it is protechprom who should be doing this, but he still hasn't woken up yet, but what it is interesting that the ministry of digital transformation has taken a step ahead and is now ahead of the ministry of defense and the ministry of technology and industry and has now created, for the first time, the brain techno cluster, which can be such a communicator between, let's say , all interested systems, including with those civil er and state plots well, for example, like the sikorsky challenge, which was created at the er national university of ukraine, kyiv polytechnic, kyiv polytechnic institute and a very interesting experience

. there may be a search, there may also be a combination of budget funds of internal investors and funds of external investors, including i do not rule out that if there are any solutions, we will prove that they are at the level of the spanish technologies that i just mentioned british, american, and they are also there, especially when we are presented to the bravivan cluster, we saw very interesting solutions , for example, an underwater drone, for example , a very interesting, interesting solution, and if we can attack, and by the way, we are talking about a variety of range of combat ranges of parts well, after all, this is this second center, which will take care of technologies for tomorrow and the day after tomorrow, will be able to provide us with ultra-modern

systems. well, of course, it is not only drones that can definitely be developed here electronic warfare systems, the war has shown that this is a very important direction. intelligent ammunition for artillery can also be developed here, and we already have projects such as the typhoon project, let's say typhoon-1 typhoon-2, but they are being developed within the limits of, let's say, now such ministerial or within the limits as we say, there is a program, for example, a missile program, the most powerful areas should be separated into separate programs and financed, well, without taking into account, let's say, the procurement plan created by the ministry of defense, then we we will have the opportunity not only to finance it from the budget or from investors, but also to find

partners. mostly, i would say that it can be western nato partners or other partners who are powerful financiers, investors, countries such as , say, saudi arabia or the united arab emirates. such countries can also act as initiators and we will be able to have powerful missiles and powerful rocket-propelled artillery and receive ammunition that will be more powerful in terms of its capability and more accurate, which will provide huge advantages on the battlefield, and of course, it is very important for ukraine, and here i agree with oleksiy izhak, who said that ukraine should be integrated into the nato support system, and since these processes are now taking place before our eyes,

for example, only at the beginning of the 23rd year well, let's say the norwegian company nama zaya to increase the production of ammunition in poland three times , let's say in the czech republic, we also have to integrate into this process, and in order to to integrate, we must make a very clear division of what we do independently, what we buy, and what we do with partners for this. it seems to me that if microtech industry will take care of this systematically, it should create some kind of scientific scientific and technical committee , for example, but decisions were made individually, corvettes were purchased which now we cannot use in the war and in the near future we will also not be able to use them , well, qualitatively, so that they strengthen our defense capability, this is an example of how we went in the wrong

direction when there was no systematic approach now it is necessary to change it and implement a systematic approach. it is very good that we have the first solutions, by the way, another decision of the ministry of the interior. i really liked the fact that the profit for drone manufacturers has been increased to 25%. i don't know how this idea works. but if it really is an effective mechanism, then it will increase motivation dramatically , because now manufacturers of various unmanned platforms can have profits. well , somewhere at the level of 5-6%. because there are quite a lot of foreign components, but it is not bad if even about 50% of the components are equal it is important and profitable to do this, because then the ukrainian defense industry gets on its feet, so to speak, it integrates into the general

system of building defense potential, and it is ideal if you can provide more than half of the capabilities yourself. well, now i think so, it is at the level of about 8 dash 10% is happening, and it is primarily a burden on repairs, modernization of old equipment, and actually, the production of products of soviet standards, of course , for some time ukraine will still have many such systems, although it can be said here that some of the solutions for modernization, for example, the rsv in all types of the rsv, the modernization is so decent that it allows you to confidently use such reactive systems of salvo fire in the war, ukraine can also

strengthen its capabilities by bringing western business here. well, for example, in ukraine is already almost in fact first german literally half a minute if if i half a minute then in principle he will finish his opinion because we have next year waiting for us thank you very much for your such good professional evaluations for your time for your quality comments, and i will remind our viewers that the sts channel was on the air , valentin batrak, director of the army conversation and disarmament center, analyst and writer. and now we are joined by maksym palevyanyi - this is the executive director of the national association of the defense industry of ukraine on audi, this is such a non-profit a public organization that unites private enterprises of the defense industry. maksym, i congratulate you. good day . you must have listened to the inclusion of valentyn

batrak, where he mentioned the prospects for action of the domestic defense industry and i would like to hear from you how the private defense industry of ukraine is feeling now, what problems it has, what benchmarks, and whether the war really gave impetus to new initiatives for our private enterprises. e-e of private enterprises related to the defense industry of ukraine e-e their production activities cover e-e in principle practically all directions of weapons used in the armed forces of ukraine today these are unmanned aerial vehicles, this is armored vehicles, this is artillery weapons and electronic warfare systems . well, and so on. well, in my opinion , the impetus for the development of the private sector in the defense industry

was the year 2014-2015. in these years, a rather powerful impulse was given and new enterprises appeared , private enterprises in the defense industry , there were only state-owned enterprises, new developments appeared, which, er, today work directly on the battlefield, are used and have export potential also in the world , which are now the most cool things that are manufactured by your enterprises that are part of the association. -e unmanned detailed device pd-2 everyone knows well and hears every day on television and very

well the eye for an eye initiative . calibres, this is also the means of electronic warfare of the company tritel note, and they are also well-known in the military and experts. they also know this station well. bohdana’s system is also your system . this company is also part of the association. the amount of information about the further development of this project. when we see it on the front line, i can’t. divulge this information because these works are carried out within the framework of a defense order, but soon i think we will see everything but is the bureaucracy still preserved and the labyrinths as complex as before or has it become somehow different now well, let's just say that it became a bit easier to work, because private enterprises can also work not directly with

the state customer. previously, it was only the defense industry enterprise. well , the bureaucratic regulation of this process remains quite large. well, based on my own experience , i can say that it is much easier to make a product and put it in the army than to draw up documents and go through all these bureaucratic things that we have today it's a pity that they still exist. valentin and i talked about the fact that there is a government decree on increasing profitability for entrepreneurs who manufacture drones there, they raised the level of profitability to 25%, and the rest of the manufacturers who manufacture no less necessary products for the armed forces are there ammunition, there are mortars, are they those machines in fact, now we are stuck in the shackles of the old profitability, but in your opinion, should we try for a certain justice if all ukrainian developments

had the same rules regarding profitability norms? well, of course rynkova the economy should be a market economy, and regulation in this area is quite significant for us today, even before the start of a full-scale invasion , work was carried out to streamline this uh, this work with the ministry of defense , the ministry of economy, and the ministry of finance in order to move away from the system of calculation and calculation materials so that the customer's representative office did not control every document at the enterprise , every invoice, every purchase, but formed a single price that was the basis of the state the contract and then the enterprise could work calmly now we have a little contact, i will say that we have contact with maksym polovyani, this is the executive director of the national

association of the defense industry of ukraine - this is not a shelter public organization that unites primate enterprises of the defense industry industry, and i will say that there is also the first league of defense enterprises, another organization that is also engaged in ensuring that private enterprises provide our armed forces with defense products. now mr. maksym is coming back to us. maksym will continue his opinion regarding the reduction of formal procedures related to the manufacture of military equipment, relations with the ministry of defense in order to facilitate the work of the enterprise and , including, to facilitate the work of the ministry of defense in this area, it is necessary to adopt and change the regulatory framework if the legislative framework in our country the country in this field is more or less modern, more or less regulated , the regulatory framework is a department or instructions , departmental orders, state standards, and so on

. they still remain at the level of the 70s, 80s, and 90s, and this entire system must be changed completely, that is, when we talk about what you manufacture, your company manufactures an armored vehicle there, and also an armored vehicle is brought in by a special transporter, and this armored vehicle is of foreign production , because there is no accompanying document from a foreign supplier, this means that the ukrainian company foreign companies are not in different conditions when trying to offer their products to the armed forces , there is such a challenge, what does it prevent you from thinking, well, feeling really in control capable tactics, well, such a problem really exists because the resolution, and the regulatory framework that exists today. it allows

the import of samples of foreign weapons if they are current. in the vice of two circumstances , the first is bureaucracy, which requires the entire process of adopting one or another model for service , low profitability, and the other reality , when a significant amount of military equipment is purchased abroad, and these procedures for foreign suppliers are actually absent, of course, here is the question of the ministry of defense, which wants to have equipment now, and really foreign supplies absolutely contribute to the fact that the needs of the troops are met quickly, but on the other hand, then the domestic defense industry itself remains behind the scenes, which actually cannot on the one hand , to compete with this mass of foreign military equipment, and if we completely ignore the needs and interests of the ukrainian defense industry, then we will have risks that we will simply be doomed

for further purchase, the boundaries of equipment and maintenance, repair and modernization, and the potential that exists today in ukrainian defense companies, we can say about 200 e-e key enterprises, which at one time before the war fulfilled more than 50% of defense orders, the war affected their capabilities , so they are partly wild enterprises that came under enemy missile attacks were relocated, but all the same they resumed their production and production of equipment for the armed forces. this segment is wide enough. we are also talking about armored vehicles and fishing equipment and about radars, communication systems, anti-drone systems, drones themselves , individual protection systems, that is, in fact, the entire range of e-e weapons technology in the country can be satisfied with ukrainian defense industry and state and private, but the question in because there was a serious postal service serious attention to the development of the national defense of the guests why do i say so about this repeatedly because really now

foreign companies that today offer us the most modern models of technology there and unmanned vehicles and armored vehicles, and there, tanks, armored vehicles, everything will be fine after a certain time, they will actually dictate the rules of the game, and it is very important to find a balance between the interests of the foreign defense industry , which will mainly perceive ukraine as a powerful arms market, because in any - in any case, we will really purchase a significant amount of weapons, the format of our army was not all the same, we will need weapons , but this does not mean that this process of purchasing foreign weapons should not be balanced with the interests of those enterprises who have been creating their own national product for a long time, so that the creation of such a national defense product is an important component of our security here in part . by the way, what valentin batrak said is that better integration should be ensured in kyiv between different structures, because when there is a minister

of technology, there is a ministry of defense ministry of digital transformation each of them sees the priority of certain projects in a slightly different way, and no matter how much we talk about the fact that we can balance their interests, it is not happens because it is possible to say that not always what is ordered by one ministry clearly invests in the needs of the same ministry of defense now really everything that can offer all of it can really be used on the battlefield but when we talk about perspectives about a common vision after all, integration into the work of the three ministries is absolutely necessary in order to determine what is needed for the long-term and not the most optimal forms of interaction with our defense enterprises and foreign enterprises that want measures in ukraine. so we have examples such as the german company rain metal, which manufactures turrets, guns, and ammunition for the same tanks; leopard e rhythmmetal proposes to create a plant in ukraine, and

i think that this will be a certain important and interesting pilot project that arithmetal is ready to create in ukraine , despite all the risks military actions, this means that, first of all, the germans clearly believe in our victory, which we already want to conditionally put such beacons that the actual part of the defense products or defense industry that will be in ukraine should have relations with germany. so we are now even at an extremely interesting stage where , relatively speaking, we have to remember our own and create optimal models of interaction with foreign companies that want to offer and produce defense products in ukraine. these are the main conclusions that can be drawn after talking with by our experts who talked about the main trends on the battlefield , the possibilities of our defense industry and how to combine these trends in order to create

a substantial basis for effective work of our armed forces on the battlefield, and then stay on the espresso channel and the broadcast will be continued by olga leni, and their chronicles of the information war. congratulations sergey, yes . literally in a moment we will talk about the general, i would say this is the general mood of what happened this week. congratulations , you know when the russians all kinds of bad situations begin for them. let's say that on the battlefield they immediately start talking about the fact that they don't know what the goals of war are, they don't know why they are fighting, they need some kind of ideology. but