[000:00:00;00] those fees of the relationship need to be changed because it is clear that the conjuncture will not change and of course the question is written especially in rural candy, well in turkey there is, well here everyone understands that if the negotiation with tomask is not for a while then there is a few menya including, it will be impossible to return because their security will not be ensured there, what is the role of the negotiations, the role is that whether or not kassey will take place yes, with some guarantee , the supporter of these negotiations and turkey that if suddenly, that is, they will provide they will ensure that safe people are safe, that they did not kill them, they did not

shoot at a supporter , that is, that this is going to happen a ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ it will not be the role of the guarantee, that is, damn, well, the honor is limited, everything will be very difficult, let 's talk about whether turkey is preparing for the tourist season, this is an important part of filling your budget, after the earthquake, as far as possible prepare normally. i think there is no problem in this because there are many people who suffered from the earthquake.

eh, or lie to me, the lady helped them find a new apartment to live in, eh, orientia , but eh, that is, eh, she has changed. last year now it's important to ensure safe cleanliness, it's to ensure fasting, that's it, that's it, it's possible to prepare as always thank you, archangel farlypol, a political scientist of the dna expert center for political research and joined our broadcast. vitaly portnikov and i in a few moments we will return to the air why am i here i have sensitive teeth they eat ice cream pain cold air pain sweet pain the dentist recommended lacaluten what effectively reduces the sensitivity of teeth if i knew the meaning of calut you wouldn't have at all before

had to come here lakalot sensit reliable protection against pain you read to work comfrey honey german ointment for joint and muscle pain natural waltz of zivekost from dr. tys ask at pharmacies we wish you health and your family's pharmacy comfrey ointment 100 grams with a 10% discount . so that ukrainians do not think about, no matter what they talk about, the first place is still the war, the war and our victory, only on espresso from monday to sunday, completely different spheres of human activity sports, politics, military analytics

six presenters, journalists, experts, opinion leaders in real time about the most relevant events through the prism of war in author's projects on espresso join the community with a ukrainian view of the world become a sponsor of the youtube channel espresso and this is access to exclusive content personal thanks pinned comments special icons and the possibility of personal communication with the espresso team, click to sponsor and become a part of the community with a ukrainian perspective, we continue the saturday polycloop program anzhelika sizonka and vitaly portnikov, we will talk again about such hot topics, some of which we have already discussed in the first half of our

program. however, i would like to hear , as always, the opinion of vitaly portnikov. assistance to ukraine and support to ukraine will not waver even if the war drags on and it will be such a long-term perspective after his statement, several more leaders of the european union directly supported him and the american president also joseph biden is this such a strong signal to putin that no matter how long he drags out this war, support in ukraine will remain and we will be provided with weapons, obviously well, it is not just words that even if the war continues, we will still be helped there, and quite important is the position that when the war ends will help us with weapons and it seems to me that this is just a sufficiently dangerous signal because i preferred to hear that donato will take us and then we will not need such help with weapons, we will be able to spend exactly as much on military budgets

how much are nato member countries spending and being under the nuclear umbrella of the united states and remaining confident that war will not come to our land again ? you were so strong that if russia attacked you again, you could defend yourself again, that is, that you could withstand any new war or new wars and the only guarantee of peace in such a situation is that in russia will understand that they don't have to attack you, and to me this story is so close to the scheme, all the time western countries believed that if israel is a very strong state in terms of the military, then it will end in the middle east , but as we can see, it didn't work, it worked to a certain extent already in 1977, it seems that there was a peaceful agreement with egypt, but for this it was necessary to live for 30 years, survive several

bloody wars and in any case remain at the level of tension in the middle east, which is already connected with the activities of terrorist organizations, and even arab states that have not concluded a peace agreement with israel, this glass is a more complicated situation, but you know that russia itself is replacing the entire arab world and terrorists at the same time, and therefore you can imagine a situation in which , let's say, russia does not wage such a big war against ukraine, which you are citing today, that it is a war sometimes ends, but begins measures to destabilize the situation, terrorist danger, sabotage actions, all this, as you know , officials from the federal security service know much better than fighting, and therefore it seems to me that you do not doubt this very idea we will support you even if you have this conflict for ten years, this is not a very honest position, i will tell you honestly, because no one said that in the confrontation of two states, one of which

is inferior to the aggressive state in terms of territory and population, you can allow the luxury of war for ten years, when i keep hearing that the conflict can last for decades, i still suggest not to forget the mathematics of this conflict and to realize that the multi-year conflict is exhausted , first of all, i did not give putin to our in a conversation with roman the immortal, i mentioned basharasad, the appearance of basharasad on the very borders of the arab states is a very dangerous signal, so 10 somehow slept coincided with the historical one, i don’t like it that on the one hand, the arab world is inviting to himself from volodymyr zelensky and at the same time, at the same time, inviting basharas so thus demonstrating that he really agrees with the thesis that time is vladimir putin's best ally, because even five years ago no one considered it possible to maintain any

relationship with your machine, he destroyed his country. this country does not have any real economic or political prospects. now there is another idea that maybe these countries that did not recognize assad, that consider this a tyrrhenian country, that believe that the situation is deteriorating there, they will help him rebuild the country in the meantime, and that is even an iota of interest this also speaks of putin's conditions in the war with ukraine . the countries of the arab world and turkey did not give in one iota. they wanted the return of the refugees. how can they return when you understand that they are there? they will be repressed, that they will be killed there, that they will be deprived of life prospects there, they have no place to return to, just like that. by the way, the matter with ukraine is that we have no place to return to the agreements with russia, because these agreements do not guarantee us safety, but guarantee us, in principle, the creation of an opportunity when russia will eventually destroy us, that's why i believe that president pakron today at

a meeting with president zelenskyi said that tsemki itself is a turning point in the war. i think that the turning point will come then when the western countries will be ready to support us as a part of their own world and not as such a night watch, do you know if this, uh, this outpost on the game of thrones, where people simply lived on the border with all these orcs, by the way, in fact, with the dead, so practically with the russians we see so there were four levels of defense, so that means uh, this one what was it called the night watch was also called a night watch of some kind i don't like tv series, but in game of thrones, that means there was this watch then they were wild and it's worth it by the way , watch it because it's this one our policy

the current one went wild and there were these uh and dead people who threatened the whole world and then there was no word , well, some new technique. dragons fly, but the truth is not in this . this time it's us because we from these savages turned into fighters of this guard or you moved to the walls and the russians didn't transform we were just with them for a long time in the same field and now we had to move behind the walls of the fortress but again we are in we all sit in this fortress and the whole other world he just gives us weapons so that we can shoot back at them. i say it again, it's absolutely

wrong and without a promising position for our future. the perspective is nato. war after war will not roll over the earth, because in any case, this is not existence , you understand, you will also see from the experience of a huge number of countries that live in such a state, they can live with patriotic fervor, but the majority of the educated population it is promising to give schools abroad a higher education so that children can get abroad to work themselves, not far away, but to come here when it is safe for the new year, it is not christmas in the back of the city, of course well, it is obvious and it is not logical , because if you understand that there are no good prospects in your country, then the best form of patriotism is emigration, this is the case with many people, and it seems to me that ukrainians simply do not deserve this, they deserve to live in a peaceful, successful country that is capable

of development and for this we do not need guarantees that we will be able to fight back from russia, do you understand us? we need guarantees that we will not fight with it, mr. vitaly . but why does this understanding not reach the example in the administration of joseph biden, because when we speak even on the example of fighter jets, for 16 years we asked them to thank to god, you asked , first of all, our armed forces of ukraine to demonstrate their strength, uh, imity. however, they did not prepare the pilots, they did not prepare the infrastructure, and now who knows how long it will take for us to be able to use them, the logic of our the military when they tell us that we need to keep bahmut for this reason that if we do not receive it for a long time, the russian troops will go in different directions and will already block the very heart of our country or in many regions in the east, then we

have to stand in bahmut and our soldiers stand heroically, how many months, how many times, 300 or so days, and from the point of view of selective action, ukraine is bakhmut, simply great, we have to stand and restrain russia, because russia could not spread its influence on bolsha part of the territory, let's say the post-soviet space, so that it did not generate conflict, so that it was exhausted, not by escalating the situation, so as not to bring the situation to a nuclear war, this is absolutely a policy, it is logical , especially since we know that president biden has always been afraid of several things in his policy, the first is of a nuclear conflict, the second is the direct involvement of the united states in any war, this is his political credo, he was one of the employees of the barack obama administration who strongly insisted on

the withdrawal of american troops from afghanistan much more determined than the president himself and other employees of this administration in this regard, the view of president biden, they absolutely coincide with the view of former president trump the washerman, they are antipodes, but in this coin, president biden is a man, let's say yes , justice, he is ready to give any country that fights for his freedom and sovereignty against the dictatorship, any level of aid, he advocated for it during the yugoslav wars, it is not that he suddenly became such his position during the wars in the territory of the former yugoslavia they are even against slobod milosevic, his hatred for the leaders of these terrorist groups of bosnian serbs, it was declared by him as a senator and set out in his memoirs - this credo he called milosevic a war criminal that when they were negotiating with him it was god knows when and so then many tried to do so be more careful about this dilute smooth these cats but at the same time senator biden absolutely did not

believe that the americans should fight with the former haslavia for the croats or the muslims of zapadniv, but we are not asking to fight for us, we ask to take us into nato is not always so it is to a certain extent to fight for us with us well, they will say that the fifth article and so on, we will not apply it , you cannot take us into nato by applying the fifth article, the essence of nato - this is the fifth article, of course if we find some formula that will talk about the application of the fifth article exclusively in the territories where military operations take place, this is to some extent a compromise wording. i think about it all the time, but with on the other hand, if the shaheds fly on is kyiv an attack on a nato country or not? can we pretend that this is not an attack ? where do we draw this red line, that is , missile fire is not an attack and shahed is not an attack, but an attack - it is when the boot of a russian soldier crosses the borders of the five

regions that russia has formally annexed. and if russia wants to occupy kherson again, it is an attack. is it not an attack? because it is in the new constitution, how to define it legally? i think it is absolutely obvious that western countries will always say first political agreement, then european, euro-atlantic integration, start with this, and first, a political agreement, and then investments first , and i would say this is a gift to putin, because vladimir putin understands very well that he can pull this cat by the tail as long as he has the strength and opportunity and not even winning this war to turn ukraine into a marginal territory in the center of europe in a territory that lives on western money in a territory that exists exclusively with the help of others in a territory whose citizens die every day in

one or another number on the fronts in the territory where people are forced to sit in bomb shelters when he finally produces his missiles or buys shahedis how long can such a life take place two years three five eight here and what should we expect in this situation as eh the panacea for putin's death and the end of his presidential term , i don't want us to focus on changes in russia in our thoughts about how and when the war in ukraine will end, we can live with russia as it is russia can exist in its current form for ten years if we we start all the time, i hear that russia will change and i feel myself from time to time. when i see these people , it's like i'm sitting in some cafe in paris, in berlin, in istanbul in the 30s of the 20th century.

any serious person will tell you that such a regime with such a planned economy and such an equal view of the world will sooner or later be covered with a copper basin only when, well, we waited - we waited for 70 years, it will be covered again if you do not fight with such a regime and you understand that he has a crush on you, you can just wait for it purely optional, as long as you like, just study. and when we live until that moment, but we don’t need to live out this life if we don’t fight. they live for centuries to this day, this is their sacred right. let them live in the taiga. the main thing is that they do not touch us. let all russians live in the taiga, they don’t know how, mr. vitaly, they don’t touch anyway. the problem is that we

need to fence ourselves off from them and stop live in the hope that they will become wiser or they will suddenly think that ukraine is not russia, they will not be, at least in the next generation of people, and the more people they have there who will die in the war, the more obvious this hatred will be, this desire for revenge. so let's think exclusively about how we need to convince the west to make ukraine a part of the west , part of nato, part of the european union, and not think about how to convince the russians to stop eating meat and start eating broccoli, i don't know if it's colorful about nato, such an interesting statement uh, said henrikesinger, secretary of state of the united states. however, i honestly did not understand her. i hope you will explain what he meant . he said that the united states should accept ukraine into nato, and this is even an advantage for russia , because in this way ukraine will not be able to decide on its own.

decision with territorial claims. he means that we will be forced in a certain way to somehow give up the territory, if anything , he says some things that are absolutely logical if they are not accepted in nato. so we cannot unilaterally implement no military actions he tells the russians you are afraid that russia and ukraine will attack you he is talking about the territory in general he is talking about the absolute other things eh he is saying that russia will lose many of its conquests but it can keep sevastopol that's all eh to receive reasoning, but he is talking about another thing. you russians say that ukraine is aggressive, that it threatens you, that it is such a terrible nazi creature . well, we already agree, we take it into nato so that it itself could never attack you. and there is diplomacy and why

about which son lives, they always told anecdotes, you know about kyson gerard, farmers and the british queen, well, she is famous and it is not good how kyson already convinced one farmer to let his son marry the british queen, he gave arguments, the farmer refused, then in the end he agreed and here he said beautifully. now all that remains is the queen. yes, to a certain extent, this is a sketch of shuttle diplomacy, many such sketches are energetic, they do not refute those sengers, they are about images, son , this is an image of kissinger, so cynical what he just laughs at the russians, he says that ukraine will soon destroy you with terror and we also don't want anyone to destroy you, let's protect you, we are ready, we love you very much , we will protect you, we will take her, we will take her to nato, and we promise you that she will not destroy you, sleep peacefully, dear

russians to a certain extent and that's what you would say if you were putin, the kin agents we want to destroy the old shit . well, that's all you told them. putin . because putin, in other details, he usually doesn't admit that he wants our destroy the doctor talks about the borders where they are there will be that russia can keep it, it can't keep it, it's the opinion of a political expert caseger - it should not be forgotten that he is not a military analyst at all, he is a political expert with a lot of experience, and one more thing must be understood that what he says to some extent reflects the position of certain circles in the united states, he does not have henry kissinger as a unit , there is collective oxygen, which is almost 100 years old, almost as long as the american post-war diplomacy, and this post-war diplomacy, she comes to the conclusion that ukraine will still have to join nato

or there is no other option to secure the situation in the region. this is the most important conclusion. the issue of borders will be left to the armed forces of ukraine. you see, we should also not be naive. if the armed forces of ukraine liberate our territory from the enemy, it does not mean that tomorrow will come . oxygen to us and will say: let 's give russia something that belongs to it . sevastopol will not mean only how much we can really really liberate. well, i thought that at that moment when we have brothers in nato, we will have territory under our actual control, we will wait for this expected offensive , which many are talking about, the woman we are all waiting for. and when this offensive ends, we will be able to talk about the future, that in the future, a new offensive will be a russian counteroffensive, is it possible i doubt it, but then again, i'm not a military expert, i'm not even a budanov, fortunately. so i'm not ready to make such predictions, because i believe that the head

of intelligence has much more information than you and i. when he says there is no russia opportunities to attack. i am also at the moment, too. so, will there be preparations for a new offensive of ukraine, then , that is, there are always several options after each military decision , a political decision, preparation for a new military decision, or this note and finding both sides in a state when they are not they can continue to do nothing, this is also a possible version of the situation, but what it will be now is impossible to predict, because you don’t understand it, many people treat this horror like a football match, it’s not a football match , people die every day. people are someone’s relatives children men at the beginning of the program we told you that

our colleague olena cherninka's son died today under the bahmut . we work with her, we know about her son, but how many people we don't know lose their relatives every day, do you understand this very myts, that's why this is not football and we must clearly realize that this is a real , cruel, terrible war and the people who are fighting this war they lead from the russian side, they enjoy the number of victims because they need exactly that. the more people die , the more opportunity they have, if not to conquer ukraine, at least to turn it into a marginal country that will never be some kind of antithesis in civilization, which is also important. this is what putin would like and we have to do everything so that this does not happen, and indeed, ukrainians do not need to sit on sofas and say well

, when there is a counteroffensive, it is very easy to sit and think about this topic, but it is very difficult for defenders to defend every millimeter of our to win back the land with our lives and health, therefore we wish them success, of course, and we support them, but we do not forget . by the way, the espresso tv channel announced a new fee of uah 1 million. go to our website, there is a link to the bank, all the details, please provide this is our war with you and we have to win together. let's move on to the next topics. let's talk more about the tusyans. we talked to an expert, but i would also like to hear your opinion. here is this new military alliance that beijing has proposed to kazakhstan. it is very interesting because russia is not there. however, in what way are they going to defend themselves from, say, whom? kazakhstan is worried that they may become the next

victim after ukraine. they know it for sure . at the same time, they simply do not know how to resist it, because they are separated from the west by russia, and the most important thing is that they have a regime of a post-soviet nature, i.e. this regime, on the one hand, is afraid of an attempt by russia in any form, it is not necessarily a war , they were already in kazakhstan in january and invited kaya himself, you can come and not, er, leave. i want to remind you that afghanistan soviet troops were also invited by the head of the revolutionary council of afghanistan, kharkiv zolamine , how is it different from convenient tokaiva, i would like to know, well, they came , they killed him and left.

they were confident in the balance that they would get the support of some other force, but they did not intervene because , firstly, the west is not so easy to come to their aid here, and secondly, because the west will demand from them what they do not want, that is political economic real reforms, they are not ready for them, here are all these five presidents, maybe four, because kyrgyzstan is a more complex political organism, but the president of kazakhstan, the president of uzbekistan, and even more so the president of turkmenistan, who do not know what we should do with our own father as their own people, they are not ready for any real reforms, but china does not demand political reforms from them, you understand, china simply demands mutual alliances from them, and this summit, moreover, it is interesting

that these countries did not hold it just like that siam is the ancient imperial capital, this is the silk road, and it’s like that, by and large, here i’ll show you a caricature from the chinese press, you see it’s the chinese hand , central asia against the backdrop of our war, and here the american eagle is flying over it, you can even try it and you don’t know how to show it to the viewers of this caricature. this speaks of how china perceives this meeting as an outstretched hand as an alternative to the concern of the central asian countries about their future, and therefore, of course, a lot of this