[000:00:00;00] this gave when this war is a generational one, when this war is about the destruction of the identity of ukrainians and its statehood of ukraine, then of course there will be no discussion of diplomacy until one of the old ones simply will not be able to continue fighting. ukraine can fight. we have the will. we are determined to liberate the territory and thank god that we have such international support. the russian federation can still do it, despite the fact that they are doing badly. and there with technologies and in the economy, but still, it is such a monster, which still has certain powers. therefore, the matter is still pending diplomacy, well, they don't work, and the chief diplomat in ukraine is not kuleba, not even zelenskyi. and this is the armed forces and everyone who holds a weapon in their hands, and i will now explain to our viewers, continuing what you said, why i chose to talk to you today it is about those plans not to show this plan may help or may not help to end

the war in ukraine one plan will not help these plans may be used already after we win that is what you just said mr. oleksandr zaluzhnyi is the main negotiator now, our guys are on the negotiation front - they are the main negotiators, and we are looking at all these plans , and i am just inviting the guests so that they can explain whether it will be possible to use them after we win already on the front line, we will win this war, and then further will it be possible to somehow use them just for that and not in order to somehow bring peace to ukraine, let's talk about the african initiative as well. please tell me, how do you see their initiative, because

they are somehow very, i would even call it more radical , they took it upon themselves, they are pushing the door to ukrain in kyiv, they are pushing the door in moscow, they want to come, they want to talk about it again blah blah only or no, no, they have absolutely utilitarian goals, they want ukrainian grain and russian fertilizers to go to their markets, and in fact to save certain regimes that survive there on bread and water. that is exactly why they are doing this. i want to remind you the same. the same. the african union. do you remember that sometime in february or march , the president of the african union came to moscow and talked about his desire for peace in ukraine, but he never visited kyiv, and then he immediately flew to paris to lobby for russian interests . and russian grain, the lifting of sanctions and russian fertilizers so that they go to european markets on the african continent, so they will be practical. i

think that we can offer them an interesting option, one of the points is the opportunity for them to pay the russians for what they actually consumed and goods, and it seems to me that it would absolutely be a good idea to create a similar mechanism like the so-called black sea grain initiative, somewhere in brussels, there is a commission of the parties ukraine, the eu , and russia and the eu, and for example, there is some kind of bank that can check whether these are real contracts or whether they fall under the let's say so, that is, under a certain idea that this grain goes precisely to african countries, that they can transfer this money to russian counterparties, it's one story and another story that the russians want to sell ammonia, well using our pipelines, please, but then let's talk about the fact that, firstly, the product list

of what ukraine can export , the so-called black sea grain initiative , is expanding, secondly, the number of ports from where it can be is also expanding, and thirdly, the obstacles that the russians, as procrastinators, use in order to to reduce ukraine's export opportunities i mean artificial delays with court inspection that go either to ukrainian parties or from ukrainian parties thus exerting pressure on us, on the world community, well, above all, on african countries that suffer from this, and they are putting pressure on the europeans, on the americans, do something about it, in principle, we could come up with such a temporary option until the end of the war, until our victory, or because i think that at all, you know everyone still says that this grain initiative is good, but in fact it is russia that creates exceptions to international law , international maritime law is international law, and in fact it does not provide for any additional regulations of this type

, some more russian bureaucrats will uh it means landing on the court which go from ukrainian or to ukrainian ports in that. of course, this is a temporary temporary measure and well , we can use it to our advantage. i think that it is possible to offer a counter-idea to the africans in a way that the russians get more opportunities for their own exports and we are more for our own and everyone will be satisfied, especially in africa , oleksandr. please tell me, because i honestly don’t know, but you talked about the russians exporting ammonia, and they, for example, from their novorossiysk cannot do it. not only through us, i understood that the south port is so. well, that’s it. they have several points , but this is one of those points that they are very interested in, and the second point is, of course, that they want a number of k-campaigns to actually be removed from the european sanctions in order to trade there. anything, because in principle we can't

put any restrictions on their ports on their exports , that's why. by the way, it's very important that these two agreements that ukraine, turkey, the un and the un have turkey and the russian federation do not exist the russians always say that this is a package deal, but there it is written that if one agreement is not fulfilled, the other must be fulfilled, the russians tie them up and constantly violate them in things there, do you remember that in the agreement itself it is written that the period is 120 days, and which one continues, yes and then you can revise it accordingly, this will mean negotiations, but the russians tried to push it on the eve of the elections in turkey, they then extended it for 60 days until may 18. and now they generously agreed to extend it a little again, that is, they are playing with that's why we have to understand that every

step towards them must be two more steps to meet us, russia must develop, mr. oleksandr . tell me, please, let's give some more. yesterday, when i was speaking on the air, i had to say that i did not have accurate information, whether there are or were representatives of the holy see already in kyiv. are they just going to be, but the fact that they are definitely going to be in kyiv and in moscow, well, it is 100%, tell me please. well, how to perceive this father's initiative of pope francis? well, you know, he has such a mysterious plan that when he told journalists in italian and in kyiv, in moscow , they said, "well, this is the first time we've heard about it. but it's completely understandable from a christian point of view, this man is experiencing and he prays for ukraine, that is, as a good christian, he does a good deed and of course we have to give back, but from a political point of view, he made several statements and in general the vatican did such things as

a joint there, uh, this procession, other things, of course, they caused us indignation, and even more so by the way, i was also there a month ago in his interview where he said that i know very well what is happening in ukraine because i communicate with the russian ambassador and he has one of his parents from ukraine and well, you just know that, it's shameful to say so, understood. he has absolutely normal, one of the best intelligence agencies in the world, and that's why he could certainly have more objective information than listening to harmful e -russians, that is, this fsb-shnik who works there at the holy throne, that's why we'll see. i don't know if he wasn't there i don't think they can do anything again let's remember stalin's again. and how many tank divisions does the pope have, that is, he is a moral authority in the world ? yes, of course. and is he an authority for a person who has no soul? well, in fact, he is not a christian . in essence, he is, from a christian point of view, they are the devil, so what?

does he make friends with us at all or can he obey the shepherd absolutely not or can he obey only when he has no way out when he will try to use any importance that is i mean when he already understands that he can't continue the war, it's not that he can win this war, that he has problems staying in power, and in this way he can take a certain step and say yes. i believe absolutely. that is, all of these are absolutely normal. the peace plan proposed by ukraine is based on the norms and principles of international law . there is nothing for ukraine to write down some stipulation that was not in international law, and therefore away from the entire ukrainian territory , accordingly, reparations for and punishment criminals, because actually this immunity, that is, not the punishment of soviet cats, it

led to the fact that the current chekists decided that the same thing can be done. by the way, it is very good that the parliament defines the dafa definition of this new concept. it is clear to me . it is clear that this is the best option. i hope that it will be the unified peace plan and it will be implemented. that's right, oleksandr, our ukrainian peace plan and our brave ones defenders on the front line this is how our victory will happen. i thank you very much, mr. oleksandr, for participating in the program and for the fact that you laid out on the shelves and disassembled into atoms all these peaceful plans, some of which are not peaceful and some of which are not the plans of many leaders recently, they have been trying to at least show that they want peace to reign in ukraine as soon as possible. thank you very much oleksandr hara , an expert on foreign and security

policy at the center for defense strategies. quick summary because we have some technical problems in youtube and we don't have any questions to which you should have answered, i'll just remind you of the question we asked you about whether the peace plan is the most realistic i mean the peace plan of which country which leader is the most real chinese brazilian your option there is no voting now on youtube i see that you can just give your answer in the comments well and i thank everyone who is now watching yours on youtube 1110 people thank you very much well i'm going to communicate with another as my guest, whom i always welcome on the air espresso oleksandr kraev, expert of the foreign council of foreign policy of the ukrainian prizma p oleksandr congratulations glory to ukraine glory to the heroes , glory to you to see yury each other, you know as

always, mr. oleksandr, look, because we have some technical problems now and we did not put this vote on youtube, how would you answer this question, you know , i wasn't going to ask you, but since we can't ask it on youtube, how would you answer the question of whether the peace plan is the most realistic chinese and brazilian, your option, i vote only for the ukrainian peace plan, and there are obviously several parameters here, not only because we are all ukrainians, because it is our plan that meets our interests, in fact , the ukrainian peace plan is the only one that carries with it long-term guarantees, that is, if we take the brazilian the chinese even the african plan, to be honest , the brazilian african is the most like seven countries , and the most powerful among these countries is one of the most powerful. please tell me if it can be called historical, it actually is historical because, first of all, the very fact that ukraine, even at the level of the fact that we are guests, so that we are not part of the organization, but we are equated

to the level of a meeting on the reception of a political diplomatic diplomatically, we are equated to a group of sardines. this is already a very powerful indicator if we conditionally consider that the group of seven and is an expression of the so-called collective west well, because japan we also, in principle, write down to the western world the western worldview as such, which means that this was a clear proof and i said that ukraine is part of the heart of the west ukraine and part of the fundamental the coalition of the strongest western states, which embody all these principles around which western societies are built, that is, from a political and diplomatic point of view , this is a very, very important signal, it is also a historic meeting. two years ago, i could have imagined what would be discussed at all, i.e. this issue of providing fighter jets, in which we were fortunately successful, this is the issue of changing the very structure of sanctions, because let me remind you that the ukrainian delegation

also came with the idea of ​​not just banning to russia, the export of everything that falls into the sanctions lists, and to allow only what is not there, that is, conditionally speaking, to prohibit the export of anything except separately permitted goods , such and such sanctions a long time ago, well , almost throughout the cold war, they were not imposed against any country, also the idea of ​​​​restricting the trade in diamonds this is where it fits in. that is, we have reached an epochal, historical level in relations with the west and in the perception of ukraine by western states - this is the time we have raised such issues of restrictions in relation to russia that do not simply cross all the red lines that in in principle, the format of moscow's red lines is being destroyed as such, these are two well, and the third is really we managed to hold a number of multilateral and bilateral meetings with leaders with whom we would otherwise not have met well, let's say with the leader of india on render mode, that is, and in the fact

that we were instrumentally able to these same use this is number three - it is also an extremely important element. that is, it is very serious. i would not say deadly, but a very serious blow to moscow is absolutely correct. well , we clearly showed where is normal diplomacy, where is the western world, where is money, power? weapons democracy and where is russia? look, i don't want to compare this, or i mean the 7 + 1 sms group in hiroshima with the yalta conference in 1945, but anyway, is it possible to somehow compare them ? tehran on the 43rd. that is, we are still planning to plan our victory. everyone already understands what ukraine needs in order to deter the russian invasion. everyone understands that ukraine needs more than just territory in 1991. ukraine needs justice . ukraine needs a contribution to ukraine. nato is needed, this has finally become established, and everyone has understood that it is not possible to follow

the russian red line, that is, it is not necessary to lead to a nuclear war . it is necessary to be careful, but one should not be blackmailed by moscow, and that is why i would say that it is tehran on the 43rd. we are really moving more precisely on the 44th we are really moving in the right direction to our own yalta-45th and yalta 45 where do you think it will be, we would really like it to be in yalta 2023 or in yalta 2024 this is just cool and well, let's go further e-e taking into account ot for all that you said, the decisions that were made during the general meeting at the summit of the group of seven over bilateral meetings , taking into account the statements that were made, and a lot of statements were made. what do you think, how can the position of those countries that , well, change now were quite neutral about what russia is doing, it started uh in the 22nd year

, on february 24, in fact, so if we are talking about those countries that still doubt about the countries of the global rooster, about latin america , let's say why they doubt there are two basic reasons for china's position well, unfortunately, we have to state that many secrets are simply dependent on it or purely economic interest , they simply do not see the reasons why they should support anti-russian sanctions if ukraine is somewhere far away and they will lose money on this too, and now that we have a clear position countries of the big seven, more precisely, the group of seven, when we have a clear position of the largest and most active economies in the world. well, it simply becomes clear that the money actually lies in supporting ukraine, what is the opposition of russia , some kind of sanctions or just a position pro-ukrainian it is indeed also certain costs, well, there is no getting away from this, but the real big money and the most important technology, modern equipment, modern communication and security lie precisely in cooperation with the countries of the group of seven and therefore, one way or another, but everything

that was talked about these three days, all these important decisions they just show these countries that they doubt that boys and girls if you want or feel safe to earn money and have contact with normal countries, then you have to support these decisions, otherwise it is good and then how do you explain the statement of the president of brazil, luada silva, already after exactly when he said that his position on the russian war in ukraine, he did not call this war russian, regarding the war in ukraine remains unchanged, a very interesting statement because it has already changed in recent months several times, and that's why it is probably copper. well, let's remember first , gula spoke about what was needed when he was still running for president. he spoke about the need to expand cooperation with the states in order to ensure that this conflict does not go beyond the territory of ukraine, but ukraine must be supported. after becoming the president, he began to say that it was possible that ukraine should cede territories

so that everyone would be calm because everyone was tired of it when he received his packet of gate. he said that he never meant to cede territories, he just always stood for a peaceful solution, and that's why it's quite funny to me now to hear the statement that his position remains unchanged, it was constantly changing, it's just that at the moment we see that he was trying to reach normal relations with china, and that's why he says what zen-pin says, it's just a little more radical jsc lola for normal relations with china, they can somehow cooperate eh well, i'm not against russia, but in some way, it's better to formulate in opposition to russia, in fact, such an option possible because let's not forget russia, china, brazil, south africa, india, that's all brics and bricks is currently working on a plan to create an investment fund of the big brics bank, which will actually be

an alternative to the imf and in this project in these brazil and south africa are the most interested in the two projects. only china and russia can guarantee these projects and provide money. in fact, in this conglomeration of these states , there is a country that, on the contrary, will force them to bear unnecessary costs. it is realistic, but from the point of view of a pragmatic economic and profitable policy . the union of mr. oleksandr will be interesting, the next question is this. i remember that i already talked with you about the transformation of chancellor scholz of germany in relation to his attitude towards the russian war in ukraine, but look at the same from the statements that he has been making recently from the fact that now as germany is helping us. me personally, it seems to me that this is not even

a transformation, but some kind of radicalization of the scholz . please tell me, this is some kind of phenomenon. how can it be explained? it seems to me that it can be explained by two things: the first is political scholz's indecisiveness, well, have you seen that even in domestic politics, even in the formation of a coalition government, he was extremely cautious, it's not even so much indecisive as the caution with which he does whatever he wants, he doesn't rush into anything, he is remembered for his behavior even in the position of minister of finance for which accordingly, he received the greatest political recognition, that is, he always considers every option. he is never in a hurry to make a choice, and he is the kind of politician from whom you should not expect any drastic political statements or drastic steps, that is, he is what he is at the time was very different from that johnson, now he is very different from biden, because biden is ready to take such steps on the contrary, that is , he remained a financier even in the position of chancellor, this is the first.

the general attitude of the west is changing he sees that the united states has stopped being afraid and is becoming more radical let's remember the french, the second decided to provide us with anti-aircraft missiles on a level with the british. well, let's say that four years ago, i could not imagine such a situation, so he simply saw that the new trend of western politics is radical support for ukraine, he understood that if he does not take up this trend now he will simply fall out, and then all the questions about german leadership in europe, and even more so in the west , will cease to be questions , the matter will be resolved that germany cannot claim such leadership and therefore something is once again its own i don't know with his sense of caution, he felt that now is the moment when for such decisions the time has come, well, god, let this caution lead him to make even more correct decisions. let's say a few words

about the european summit that took place last week in the capital of iceland, reykjavik. they also talked a lot about supporting ukraine , but i am most interested in the decision that was made regarding the creation of a register of losses . the wars in ukraine will be from frozen russian assets in europe and it seems to me that this will all be some kind of long story, considering how these registers and assets are being frozen, how are the governments of different countries treating these frozen assets and deciding what to do with them, in your opinion this is a long story. is it really not? unfortunately, the story can really be long, because if we are talking about the supply of weapons or certain political decisions, then it depends on individual leaders, and it is much

easier and faster to convince individual leaders. that is, in essence work with an individual person with his apparatus or work with the information field, respectively, what my colleagues and i have been doing in the last 14 months is the study of these topics with a specific audience with specific politicians about if we are talking about money questions if we are talking about finances first of all we have the question of the fact that in europe, in fact, in most countries, there are simply no measures in accordance with the law, that is , we have never before in modern history had the question of frozen assets, state reserves of a certain country in in the case of its full-fledged aggression against another country, they must be removed and transferred to a third party that suffered from aggression, that is, we have a question not so much of personal choice or political will, because it seems that we already have it, you know, a question of huge complex, heavy bureaucratic legal and financial mechanisms that in the west should work in general according to their own structure

and therefore yes. unfortunately, it may be delayed purely due to the actual operation of these mechanisms, but there are great positives here that we are already talking about it i mean, we didn't start talking about it. as soon as we changed this territory , when ukraine still needed this money the most, the process would be delayed. what the russians did in bakhmut, what they did everywhere, it will be restored with russian money , that is, the process will be delayed. but it is good that we have already started this process now, mr. oleksandr. please, this money is frozen, it will be necessary to have some kind of unified decision to take it, or every country on whose territory in whose banks there is this russian money can, at its own discretion, take this money and use it in accordance with this register and in accordance with the second conditional works

option, that is, we do not have any unified international structure that will say that here you have money in your state accounts or in your private semi-private banks, i, as an international structure, make a decision that you transfer this money there, it does not work like that just a part of internal sovereignty. that is, it will be a separate decision, a separate legislative act, a separate resolution of the parliament, the cabinet of ministers in the central bank. it depends on who manages it in each specific country. that is, it will be a separate mechanism for each individual country. about the possibility or impossibility of a default in the united states of america yesterday karinger pierre, the spokeswoman of the white house, said that during the negotiations between the republicans and the democrats these negotiations took a step back today anyway, well, actually, given the time difference, it was yesterday, the president of the united states of america, joe boyden, said that he was satisfied with the conversation with kevin mccurdy, the leader

of the republicans in the house of representatives, in your opinion. well, we have already discussed this with you several times spoke, but considering these two statements , will they agree or not , in fact, they will simply agree dozens of times in the history of the united states, even modern times, negotiations were literally delayed until the last days, until the last week, i will remind you that we need that well, we need the americans to finalize these negotiations by the first of june, otherwise it will really start the process of technical default when, in fact, there is money, but it is impossible to pay it due to the conventions of the american economy and the payment of debts . in fact, all adults, that is we are dealing, let's say, not with trump, not with democratic socialists, or even with some populist politicians, we are dealing with normal leaders of adequate parties who really understand what is wrong with them there is no question that the republicans are in a position and will not advance these negotiations under any circumstances, the same applies to the democrats

, everyone is ready to compromise simply because, again, this is a question of money, this is a question of promises to the voters, and therefore we just need to add up the numbers for now. we stand on at that stage when both sides realized that default is not an option for them. but in order to avoid it, accordingly, the budget must be adjusted in some way. and here is how to adjust it. well, this process is precisely what delays the negotiations, because it is a question of numbers. default is not an option a-a p oleksandr thank you very much for participating in the program. thank you for your professional answers. it was oleksandr krayev , an expert and foreign policy council of ukrainian prisma, we talked with him about many things, mostly about the group of seven summit held in hiroshima, japan. well, what well, usually in this case i summarize your answers to the question that we asked, but for technical reasons, unfortunately , there was no question on youtube today. therefore, i can only

thank the 1,280 people who are watching now on youtube, in the end, thank you very much to all those who watch us and wherever espresso tv channels and our program are shown, well, for today i am forced to finish the program world during the war, but not to finish our broadcast because it continues and will continue it my colleague serhiy rudenko and his verdict serhiy i congratulate you on the word i congratulate yura literally in a few seconds we start the verdict glory to ukraine this is a verdict program my name is serhiy rudenko good day and good health to all today may 22, 453 days of the heroic struggle of the ukrainian people to the russian occupiers, on monday night , russia again bombarded ukrainian cities with missiles and drones