[000:00:00;00] have we never had such a sociology that under 90 % would support joining nato, so why not take advantage of this? we never had such sociologists there 10-20 years ago, that is , internally we are determined and nato is on our side. therefore, now the best situation is necessary press on, i see that everyone is determined and our friends are in good shape, they are determined for us , and we are determined enemies in bad shape . that's why everything has to go smoothly and finish p valentine well, the war in ukraine has raised a very acute question about reforms in the rules by which diet in particular, the north atlantic alliance, regarding this rule of unanimity, we understand that indeed today we have already focused on the fact that there are countries that we will not have to convince. it is not far-fetched that probably in order to resolve such

issues, such institutions will have to be reformed and , for example , the issue should be resolved simply by the majority rather than by uniformity. only we have to convince someone. these are the states that are already members of this club, they must convince their partners in this bloc that ukraine's membership in nato is fundamentally important for them, that is, not only we are people, well, people of states that realize the importance for themselves of the best guarantees - it's a common interest, all other guarantees - it's just beautiful rhetoric , it's one moment, another moment for those who, uh, tell what , well, it's not worth anything. when i hear it

, well, we explain to people so that people understand it this why don't you go to this meaning if there is no meaning, go and sign it, but if for some reason you find it, it probably has a meaning, despite this hypocritical rhetoric of yours, so the same applies here, yes . when they start telling us something that something matters, it doesn't matter that it matters, if it didn't matter, then this war would not have started, because we understand that one of the reasons for this war in particular was the fear of the russian federation that after gaining membership in nato, ukraine would essentially will go beyond their e-e influence, and they wanted them , in principle they are ready to accept the existence of an independent ukrainian state. wars and we simply take a list of their issues

, then we look at what we wanted to achieve, so when we will add up the final score of what these or those have achieved, yes, as a result of this conflict of armed war, everything will be visible that put russia should not be achieved ukraine should become a member of nato in ukraine there should not be any second language in ukraine there should not be any federalizations there or somehow delusional what kind of propaganda was promoted here and many other things, that is, all that and militarization should be militarized as much as possible and there is one more important nuance . and what do you think? what is more effective, the guarantee or the availability of weapons, the available weapons of laziological , that is how it arises, then the next question is that in europe and in nato they understand well, what can really be better not 40 petriv and security guarantees well, because life is changeable and this for

them is even before it, that is, what i started to say. i would not like to seem overly categorical. people confuse the purpose and the means. it is necessary to understand that nato is not only these in particular, the means, i.e. nato , is not the trophy that we should win by defeating russia, nato in this context, in this context, it is in particular one of the tools with which we can achieve victory in this war not thanks to their direct participation, but that is not what i am talking about i'm talking about just this symbolic step and beyond nato, the european union, which i said above, we perceive as a tool for internal political transformation. for us, it should also become a driver that we will begin to change the security sphere, the economic sphere, the legal sphere, maybe after that

we will start to fight corruption even more effectively. they reported corruption in bulgaria to corruption in germany, you don't have corruption, but there are scandals from time to time, but there is no corruption, so be consistent, you want to help fight corruption, you say that you have more experience, here dear, we are ready to accept your help, in particular, not only with weapons and not only with financial means, but also with the fight against corruption , especially since we understand that joining the european union is to some extent a strengthening of supranational institutions, and this will speed up these internal political transformations, as a matter of fact what i wanted to say is that we are talking about a sufficiently high level of consensus, er, what mykola said, well, what is the right moment for today, it is necessary to understand that in ukraine there is not a single political force left that spoke against nato, i.e. those people who systematically since 2004, the fifth year, remember

, there was such a block, not so yes, that is, who were uh against nato to this day, when they listen to the same boyka, the impression is that he always uh was a supporter of euro-atlantic integration why because the situation favors the revision of the views of the revision of the views of petrovych poroshenko, by the way, he also once opposed it, there is his famous speech in the verkhovna rada of ukraine where he is simply outraged by nato's aggressive policy in the balkans then yes, when this er. some nato members conducted a co-operation there, so everyone is reviewing their policy and today there are really the best moments when there is internal political content in ukraine and the security situation puts pressure on nato members to approve this decision and close it, you know, sometimes you have to come to terms with the inevitable, i said socrates while drinking this cup for a second, you are not being offered a hemlock well, they are really offering you

an elixir that is good for your health who is ready to drink this elixir or consume this borscht is with meat or without meat and go to the vintsyryshniks, don't abuse the same way and go to the crown, it's er, our friends from great britain great britain supports the simplified process of ukraine's membership in nato stated this the minister of foreign affairs of the country, james cleverley, is quoted by the garden . he emphasized that ukraine is developing , developing incredibly fast. kyiv reforms are necessary for integration into nato during hostilities, the position of the united kingdom will be such that it fully supports withdrawal from action plan regarding membership and admit that the offer to join nato by both sweden and finland did not require this, ukrainians have demonstrated their commitment to reforming the army in accordance with the requirements

of nato membership by their own actions on the battlefield, i think that all allies of the alliance recognize this that the opposition of the united kingdom is so that they are ready to go to the extent of supporting ukraine's accelerated membership in the alliance. in particular, let's remind joe biden , the president of the united states , that this procedure is not officially public now. supported by kateryna despite this, great britain is our closest partner and you see how quickly it reacts to the fact that, in fact , ukraine has long fulfilled the pdc, with its war and its heroic resistance, it has proved that it is still possible without the pdc, because ukrainians have been doing it for a long time as well overgrown and e p maxime otaki ot statements from great britain and which are at odds with the statement of the united states, and what

role can they play or will they balance the views of the nato countries in this regard, should a submission be made apart from or not necessary and in general regarding what should ukraine eventually get the status of a-a in vilnius on the 11th-12th well, the first thesis is that the kingdom at the beginning of this war and even long before the start of a full-scale invasion, it is meant since the 14th year , helped ukraine and were the leaders of this support let's remember at least from february 24, who were the first who gave a political statement about providing ukraine with tanks . when the germans wringed their hands and said that the german leopards should not be on the territory of russia because this is some kind of historical trauma of theirs there and this cannot be allowed, the british

they already said that the challengers are ready to send. the same story was with long-range weapons at a time when the united states was continuing discussions there on the sidelines of the congress , talking about whether it would not cross any other red lines of the russian federation, then britain provided the source and they have already effectively are working on russian positions on the territory of occupied ukraine, therefore britain is a state that is actually moving away from the status of such a regional leader and wants to demonstrate its leadership in the global manifestations and by the way, an interesting point is that when president zelensky went to the countries of northern europe, i found out information that previously, in general, the united nations and many other organizations referred to britain as a group of northern european countries, but britain refused to do so at all status and said we are not a part of some part of europe, and we are an independent

player who has his own ambitions, plans that achieve them, therefore, in this context, of course , gratitude and thanks to the british for what they in a similar way, they initiate the procedure, another point is that according to the statute of the same nato, there is no simplified procedure for ukraine to join the north atlantic alliance, there is a simplified procedure, a normal procedure, a complex procedure, this is an exclusively political decision. so there, since 1999, after such a serious expansion of nato , decisions were made about the passage of candidates from of this action plan regarding membership , but the same example of finland shows us that it is possible to do without it. that is, it all depends on the desire or unwillingness of certain political figures. ukraine in its fulfilled its duty militarily. i would say that it even exceeded its plan to join nato. it is unlikely that we will name any of the countries of the north atlantic alliance that have

similar experience in hostilities, similar experience in liberating their territories from e invaders . ukraine has it and that is why it remains here the question is exclusively in this political sense, and you know, despite the fact that there the european union usually declares that we are exclusively an economic institution, we are exclusively about business projects, there about a common currency, about the economic manifestations of nato they are talking exclusively about the defense union, which is aimed at you to protect the partner countries from the threat, despite these statements, these are all deeply politicized institutions . and here the role of the political leader plays a much more important role than any formally prescribed structures and instructions, similar things. if macron during months and years of this war, he was not against ukraine's accession to nato. to him, no trends there , no analytical notes or the position of the government there had any importance, and when

an overt political decision appeared, it was his personal he suddenly became a supporter of ukraine joining nato, well, at least according to the statements of the western press, then similar things apply to other leaders and biden and representatives of other european states, for example, so everything will depend on how well ukrainian diplomacy will work and how successful ukraine's situation will be at the front, because everyone wants to become, let's say, a participant in victory , a participant in various positive manifestations and dynamics on the battlefield, so it seems to me that this is one of the parts that could help speed up, let's say, the position of the states that are still hesitating to accept ukraine into nato because everyone wants to be in the winners' club. thank you very much, maksym dzhigun, a political scientist , shared with us his thoughts on what to expect from the vilnuyev summit that will take place on 11-12

july thank you, let's try to sum up our conversation today, there were a lot of theses . ukraine will be heard there. so the most important thing is that if this summit takes place without it, it will be an absolute misunderstanding of the situation in ukraine . in your opinion, mykola, what can happen in order for us to understand, for example, that this is a complete failure on the part of our partners? i would not i was setting myself up now for negative modeling, everything is moving quite well, it is moving in the right direction, er, they are interested in us, we are interested in them, the enemy looks weak after these er, er saturday events, so we have to finish it off, we in vilnius

made a mistake. well, not you and i. yanukovych, as i represented our state at that time, is extremely big. we have been correcting this mistake for 10 years. our path of development and now we are turning back now very hard because of blood because of very difficult historical decisions we are returning to our european euro-atlantic path of development so i see that this is the second time we have definitely not made a mistake there we will do it, we will press on. and i think that ukraine has been doing the impossible for the past year and a half, it's just such a big giant marathon of impossible solutions to the confrontation with russia while arming the army, there are changes inside the country , how the country helps every soldier, how we are volunteers, how we will inform you about all this talks about such a well, it's just passion and zeal when a country does something that no one expected from it and no one expects from it, and

we just went along this line, well, according to a large number of constant focuses on which no one even hoped, and that's why i think that vilnius will also be such a nice focal point when we do what we were told that ukraine is a gray area, that they will never be accepted into nato. that means security spheres , now all the reasons have started to appear on the territory look at bilhorod, the second question is there, and when ukraine joins, that's why we're moving in the right direction, then everything on our side is pressing, and then we'll celebrate a great victory, its opening is a must. thank you, political scientist mykola davydyuk joined our broadcast. thank you. very much, valentine, there is literally a minute left, and we understand that the alliance will really benefit from the accession of ukraine - this is definitely one question then, why are we delaying if everyone understands everything? well, because

, for example, there was such an unpleasant story between turkey and greece, because actually within the alliance has its own internal contradictions, because the implementation of the alliance is already a certain element of the reconciliation of these various contradictions, which actually brings us back to your question about changing the procedure for approving decisions they are procrastinating and procrastinating, apart from that, they are calculating, analyzing the risks and potential gains . and here is what my colleagues said about the defragmentation of russia and that the putin regime is weak. could become yes. that is, this is the subject of another discussion, but it is simply an illustration of what is actually the processes that are taking place and will take place in the future. beautiful, this is not a black swan and not even a black rooster, just a rooster because a black swan is an unknown unknown. and the fact that such a thing was about to happen in russia

was well known, and to this day, many people are already counting and thinking not about the future of ukraine, but about the future of the post-russian space and about the challenges to security, in particular, because of this, they actually have something to think about, but i will repeat this question, first of all, about the future of nato, that is, it will be fateful for them if they do not approve it as it is supposed to, well, it may have entailed certain centrifugal tendencies in within the borders of nato, it is necessary to realize this, i spoke about it, and about the fact that there are different views , well, some parallel security structures will be created if they want to turn nato into the un. well, i congratulate them . thank you, mr. valentine. valentin glydykh, a political scientist, joined our broadcast

and visited our studio today. the criminal prigozhin, we will talk about this further with ivan stupak, a military expert of the ukrainian institute of the future, a consultant to the committee of the verkhovna rada of ukraine on national security and defense , in particular mr. ivan, congratulations congratulations congratulations , especially in the context of the participation of belarus in this process and of course in in principle, after putin's spokesman piskov announced that the war criminal prigozhyn, in particular, could go to belarus, many questions arose, and one of them was whether there is now a threat from the north is even bigger for ukraine, won't they attract the same wagnerians in order to attack, for example, ukraine to go to kyiv, but in our border troops they say that the border is reliably protected and such even if such an attempt will be made although they do not see the prerequisites for this, there is nothing in them it won't work, i'd like to reassure our viewers first, ivan, to what extent is the venue likely to be the wagnerites on the territory

of belarus, or could it be a danger to ukraine ho-ho-ho, it's been said loudly yes loudly , because i don't know, will the wagnerites go in general did they get there, in what composition, who was allowed to leave the territory of the raffia, who wanted to go after the beauty, don't forget that there will be internal disputes there , like zhenya, we didn't agree on this . i won't go there either. yes, i want to be there for us in the territory of regression and now look how long the question of technology has gone on here, and the technology will be there or the technology will be belarusian, to my great conviction, now we are not talking about an attack from the territory of belarus at all, even with the use of wagnerites, i am strongly convinced that the wagners there will do what first of all, of course, to introduce business with africa, to develop business relations and to make a kind of battering ram for the belarusians so that african countries would buy belarusian harvesters

, tractors, some electronics, and so on . wagner should teach the belarusian troops modern tactics, the method of war strategy, because lukashenko understands from of all the surrounding countries, he is the last, his army is the last, which does not know anything at all , during the second world war , there was not a single military application of the army there, okay, okay, k b in kazakhstan, when they went there as a police function, it does not count as the ukrainian army. they see what is there. well, there is one for ten times more than the russian one, too. and so he is trying to teach his people as soon as possible and use the experience of the wagnerites in introducing hostilities in the conditions of the city in the conditions

equal terrain, aviation, drones, electronic warfare , everything that hesitates, worked hard, the belarusians want to take advantage do you think that he was really able to derail this situation? yes, let's talk in simple language, is this role exaggerated and it's just that, let's say this, in the public plane , it was formed in particular by russian propaganda and by the belarusian media, i agree with you, this is the second option of exaggeration, he was just there to convey it. yes, he transmitter yes, he received it, he gave it to him, they told him that he actually gave it once again to the great and convinced beauty, they pressed my- most likely family family maybe his family maybe his family there commanders closest there well conditionally yes there they showed on video what are your thoughts now we will cut off your head conditionally yes and this made them completely turn around everything they planned did not explain anything at all there like forrest gump so i got tired of running i stopped

and went back all of you do you really think that this was actually an unplanned game played by former kadvists on people, a game on the public in which everyone played their role and that really the beauty could uh, it was his sincere desire , this demarch was a coup if we didn't call it and in the end, as you say, they were blackmailed, most likely it could have been an impulsive act, because where are you, an impulsive person, that’s all . let’s get together, but on the other hand, he planned this attack on the wagner base, he ran there, most likely, this story was planned by someone in moskvi was waiting for him, maybe there was some kind of tacit agreement , let's do it, and we're waiting for you here, ana, move slowly. and when they say, oska, the debists have planned. listen, well, i always always say everything, and try to plan

to take seven of your friends on friday night. yes, and to agree on a time to gather in one place for a while, well, not in life, don't get together, someone was late, someone with his wife let someone go, someone has something in pain , someone doesn't eat meat, someone doesn't drink beer, well, listen, there's such a big promotion and what what have we achieved with such a conditional resolution, nothing, mr. ivan, but for ukraine, of course, we want to hear what this rebellion prigozhina will mean directly. and yes, in the political context, we have already said more than once, give us the keys to military operations. so, for example , now if the wagnerites a-a to reform this structure and sign contracts with someone, there may be different ways. as far as i understand how important the wagnerites are for the occupation forces, in the current conditions they once were when they fought for bakhmut, we understand that nowadays how much it will be among a significant loss if the wagnerites for some time and

- well, they will drop out of the process, yes, yes, wagner, uh, with a toilet, weighs much more than wagner without an adventurer, even those who will sign contracts and join the ministry of defense of the russian federation should understand this. they are not will mean nothing, prigozhin gave them that cruel discipline , just unbelievably cruel , and it was thanks to this discipline that the wagners all held their ground . you know what the russian army is equal to . they said that maybe it didn't happen, but maybe the development of the event will be even more interesting . and that, relatively speaking, the kremlin will withdraw its troops

there from the territory of ukraine in order to resolve the situation or strengthen the positions of its power structures inside the country itself. someone will pull up there, others, perhaps, private military companies will also come in to organize a demarch, can such a thing happen , well, let’s call it a language escape. they will call it whatever they want, but under this sauce they will withdraw the troops from ukraine, this is possible, everything is possible but now there are no prerequisites and we have to wait for it, well, when it starts there in russia, yes, let it be a bonus, it will happen. okay , and we cannot predict and influence it, it is an internal process, so, once again , we hope for it every day, watch the news feed that there when when will it start it will be just too much disappointment for us thank you ivan stupak joined our broadcast, a military expert of the ukrainian institute of the future, a consultant to the committee on national

security and defense of the verkhovna rada of ukraine, of course they talked about what happened over the weekend in the territory of the russian federation about the failed coup of the war criminal prigozhin and about the fact that it is not worth idealizing hope anyway, because we understand that all those who take part in this process are enemies of ukraine in the first place and we hope that before it is possible if international justice does not catch up with them, if justice does not catch up with them , then at least among themselves they will repay each other for all these crimes committed against peaceful ukrainians well, in the context of how they declared in the kremlin that yevgeny brogozhyn himself could be transferred to the territory of belarus , probably and some of the same mercenaries would also go with him, of course there was concern in particular in ukraine and ah in the east of europe, because on their border a private military campaign could simply be stationed

we want to hear now, we offer you to hear the reaction of the ukrainian defense forces, in particular, the attempted attack of the wagnerians from the territory of belarus will be suicide for them, the situation with rumors that now the criminal is beautiful with his mercenaries will try to go to kyiv from belarus, so commented the commander of the combined forces of the armed forces of ukraine, lieutenant general serhiy serhiy nayav, saying that this is nonsense, he assured that at the moment in the north of ukraine there is no build-up of equipment or manpower of the enemy. the state border of the enemy is under reliable protection 24/7. if this happens and the enemy tries to cross the state border, it will be nothing but suicide for them, our soldiers are ready to give a decent response to anyone who

dares to cross the state border with weapons in hand and tension on poland's border with belarus is not ruled out by the polish government's commissioner for the security of the information space, the spokesman for the minister of the coordinator for special services , stanislav zhan . the president of lithuania believes that belarus will become a refuge for prigozhina nato then it will be necessary to strengthen its eastern flank if prigozhina because part of the grouping will end up in belarus with with incomprehensible plans and incomprehensible intentions, this will only mean that we need to further strengthen the security of our eastern borders, in any case, if the fate of yevgeny prigozhin, a war criminal and the leader of militants with the private military company vanner, did not happen, in any case , what happened in russia the federation definitely played into the hands of ukraine in particular, because it demonstrated at least that putin's regime

is not strong and, most likely, it will not last long, and many people are higher. in fact, it is very bright, perhaps one of the first such powerful puzzles of the defragmentation of the entire putin system, he is actually the head of this criminal syndicate that currently rules with russia and actually we are now on the threshold of an extremely interesting and dynamic time that may turn out to be who knows what, but let's hope that exclusively for the benefit of ukraine itself that the last hour was also dynamic for you, it is interesting, we hope that the beauty