[000:00:00;00] destroyed an entire warehouse of ammunition oh what and my dad served in air defense and shot down a missile over kiev finally i can tell about it greetings to you on the espresso channel today in our military program we will talk about how ukraine seeks to increase the production of attack and reconnaissance drones because now we he entered the format and at exhaustion, where the ability to quickly respond to the needs of the front in

certain types of weaponry is of decisive importance from the point of view of the course of hostilities and the impact on the terms of the war as such, military volunteers say that drones on the battlefield needs an order of magnitude more, our government structures say that they are doing everything they can for this, in particular, there they decided to allocate forty billion hryvnias for the purchase of drones, they would remove restrictions related to the purchase of components of foreign production , raise the profit margin to 5%, you this is different, but does it really work in practice or does it really affect the increase in the production of unmanned complexes, we will talk about this with our guests in our wine program, we will have representatives and of defense companies and the ministry of defense of ukraine. my name is serhii zgorytskyi, the director of the information consulting company defense-express, which, together with the espresso channel, seeks to highlight the most

relevant trends in the field of security and defense , and now the first guest is arriving - this is artem vyunyk, the director of the athlon scientific production enterprise avia mr. artemy i welcome you to the espresso channel, it's nice to see and hear. congratulations serhii, and i will tell our viewers that your company is actually the most stable enterprise, as far as i'm concerned, at least he has been engaged in the production of unmanned systems for 10 years, and i don’t know if you saw it yesterday on the facebook page of the eastern command page where the 53rd separate mechanized brigade wrote that the fury complex helps them to destroy the enemy and works at a depth of 50 km. they write about the fact that there should be more such complexes, and i would like to start the conversation with

what has changed in the life of your company in a month , in a year, and in 7 months of almost combat operations, what has changed in approaches, scales, in vision, so let's start with such general things. well, unfortunately, no i saw the material that you are talking about, serhii, because frankly speaking, we are so busy with work that it is often difficult for us to track such reviews, but we are very pleased that the users of our complexes use them effectively and this helps us all to achieve such a desired victory that everyone wants, almost every resident of our ukraine, really, these 7 months have had a significant impact on the vision and organization of our work, and have added, let's say, certain challenges to our

company, as well as to all other manufacturers of unmanned complexes that also work effectively in our industry of course this caused certain changes in my technical part of the complex and in the organization of production and in our vision let's put it this way, today in the future we are introducing new ways of organizing ourselves we are looking for technologies, we invest a lot in the development of new solutions, and in principle, the growth of the scale of the company , of course, requires certain changes in the approaches to the organization in order to respond to the challenges

that exist today, and also do not forget about trends that we currently have on the battlefield and respond to these trends with solutions that will be effective. well, then let's talk in more detail about our reality. your company has increased in scale. you have recruited a significant number of people. you have purchased equipment. the orders coming from our security forces correspond to the capacities that your company currently has. well, let's say that today we are working and fulfilling large contracts for the ministry of defense we are working on new products. as you know, we are already at the final stage of the project of a lightning-friendly ammunition, which should become the high-precision high-precision model that will actually provide a radical increase in the efficiency of our armed forces.

but at the same time, for some reason we are stepping on the same rake again, we have to date already the beginning of august but we absolutely do not understand what the company will do in january of next year when we deliver the last batch of products under the current contract unfortunately unfortunately there is no understanding of the existing need. there is still no understanding. when, after all, the work on the installation will begin. and eh, actually, eh, such a delay, taking into account the logistics that exist today, eh, which developed after the closure of the airspace, the disruption of certain connections, eh. she requires today to urgently start the procurement of components for the execution of the contract already in january or february and delaying the issue of concluding a contract for today, well, in fact

, it will already mean uh-uh in literally another month a-ah failure of deliveries at the beginning of the 24th year, in fact, the supply of finished products of those complexes that you mentioned at the very beginning, which are working so effectively today , but i really hope that they are also the work that is being carried out with the ministry of defense and , to date, with the ministry of digital transformation, which have certain budgets, that's all will lead to the conclusion of a contract at least in august of this year and the company will not stop waiting for components in january or february next. well, that is, as i understand the problems with the ministry of defense that the numbers of changes regarding the conclusion of the contract are similar, despite the desire of both ministries to purchase your products, none of them has yet concluded a contract that allows you to provide advance payment and the purchase of components that will speed up the production

of your complexes for the armed forces . we are working, we hope that we will really do everything possible and we and the state itself will make it possible so that we do not stop but continue to supply as efficiently as possible without interruption to supply our complexes are up to of the armed forces, and when we talk about increasing the volume of production and try to divide all these problems or areas by priority, planned procedures, as we said there, financing , industry, the capacity of the enterprise, the personnel potential of the enterprise, these are the four categories, how would you rate them according to priorities, what is the most disturbing you just want to start increasing production scaling well, first of all, we must say that we have scaled up production very significantly. this is more than 10 times

. it will be a little difficult, there is no time, this is the production of complexes, the staff has recruited at most 10 times , no, actually, the efficiency of production has increased significantly , there is also a several-fold increase in the number of personnel , but the increase in the actual quantity is much greater, we produce products at the expense of after all, the systematization and unification of what processes and the expansion of the capacities of each division actually exists in the company, but today the key issue remains confidence in the future, because it is impossible to expand production when you you don't understand. what are you going to load this capacity with tomorrow? actually, the lack of a contract for today is already creating a certain tension in our company, because we don't

understand what, for example , 150 people will be doing in january of next year, if we still have a contract will not be or it will be concluded, for example, at the end of the year, as i hear about it, that budgetary appointments may appear later and only after that work on concluding a contract will begin later . the contract can be concluded, for example, in december, but under such conditions, you will continue the deliveries of the complexes only somewhere not earlier than, let's say, april or may of the next year , that is , there will simply be no deliveries for several months. losses of the enterprise and to the reduction of some possibilities well, in the end to the reduction of supplies to the armed forces, despite the fact that the need is calculated

, it is great, it is er and we are ready to satisfy it as efficiently as possible, but next, after confidence in the future, there is, of course, a certain problem with communication, but this is more about promising developments and the search for some innovative solutions because, in any case, the manufacturer cannot and should not come up with some technical solutions without understanding the problems or , let's say, the ideas of the military regarding their application on the battlefield the fact that

we must build a very powerful one a system of constant communication of such partnership e partnership work with the armed forces e of course taking into account all issues of secrecy and so on, but still , constant daily work must somehow be implemented and then manufacturers will be able to understand the needs and understand some problems e e offer interesting solutions that are possible let's say this the military could not even imagine, well, that is, in fact, we are talking about the fact that when you develop the thunder strike complex, so as not to invent a bicycle, you must clearly know which optimal missions are required for this of the complex and from this count down to the technical requirements and to the design of the device itself, and when our developers of shock drones appear , there are many of them . much longer than this dialogue between the military and the developers would have been, then

a more productive basis for interaction would certainly have been created . this is the direction we are going. let's say this, this issue cannot be resolved, for example, by holding some formal meeting there . let's say once a month, this is possible only in close communication in close communication on a daily basis with people who plan operations who plan those or certain missions that face certain limitations, our own solution, how shall we say, a solution with problems , the solution of which we could offer, but we simply well, let's say, we are forced to collect this information in fragments from those who have

some experience in the application of some certain idea has some difficulties. but it seems to me that if these processes were more systematic and more organized and centralized, perhaps at the level of the general staff, i think the efficiency of the work of each of the factories in ukraine would increase radically. and here we are with you just before the loss we believe that in ukraine we need to create such an ecosystem that provides for the maximum efficiency of each participant, that is, from the manufacturer to the customer, in order to create conditions for discussion, discussion, and then the minimization of procedures that can interfere with one or another process, so that this movement towards such an ecosystem, from what, from what, from what, in your opinion, should this movement begin eh, well, first of all, it seems to me that this movement should still begin with communication eh. this it will be enough. this will be a breakthrough that

will allow you to at least understand what the next step is. this should be the formalization of these or other requirements, or requirements are a bit of an outdated word, let's say the formalization of those ideas in format for example some for example of operational-tactical requirements eh, which in principle will give the opportunity eh to already move already to move in some more structured space like this eh well, for example, we work with these overruns and putting in this solution rather large ranges eh we do not understand and what for example, we have to get the minimum, minimum, necessary ranges so that this decision is already effective today, and unfortunately no one can ask such a question, no one can actually answer this question because, uh, those who have a certain

experience have it completely different, it is not it is generalized, you know, it is actually individual because different units work in different areas and the depth and from the area of ​​responsibility. they are completely different and the manufacturer is actually faced with such a situation that he has to either accept something as a constant for himself and work on it, but i am a risk what, for example, after that? after development , such a product will simply turn out to be, let's say , limitedly usable, that is, as i understand it, the greater the requirement for range , the higher the cost of the product itself it is complicated by its design if we are talking about the fact that it is necessary to destroy the range there by 10 km, then it says there in a month or through the product, you can offer a solution for the fulfillment of this combat task , well, that's right, for example, the question is only exclusively of the range, it has a very strong effect e-e completely affects the entire system, the entire complex

of solutions and the cost is also radically affected , because shorter ranges can be provided with much cheaper means of communication, for example , between e-e, let's say there will be ranges it will be necessary to rebroadcast the signal and provide e-e communication through some additional devices of mr. artem iq here are your internal estimates regarding when you will already begin to e-e test the thunder in the version that you consider optimal for yourself so that it could be used on the battlefield then we are actively working on it, i am not ready to name any dates or any er specific er timelines for the completion of the development well, in principle, i think it is not necessary for our enemy to know, we are working on it i think that soon

we will see the results of the application, well, not only do you have thunder, you also have fury, this complex is systemically changing , it is becoming much different, it is becoming more qualitative, it is becoming more powerful, what has changed in the fury itself during this time of hostilities, how was the experience of combat operations on the battlefield taken into account well indeed, as before, the fury complex changes almost daily, and the software and uh, the actual design of the uh complex and the aircraft, we are really working on increasing the uh flight time on increasing the payload by more unification and not in principle again certain solutions are already implemented certain solutions will be implemented there by the end of this year and i think that our users will be even more satisfied with the characteristics and capabilities of our complex mr. artem well time is running out

very quickly thank you very much for including i will remind you of the work you are doing for our country and our viewers that expresso was effective. solves the project creates a project in the debtor's ammunition named grimm and now we have the next guest on the line, vadym kudachigov, a fighter 24, decides the brigades until recently and the ideological inspiration of the project of wings of revenge p vadim i congratulate you if you see me itches i hear you yes i hear you i congratulate you friends, i'm on the road, so excuse me, i'll answer questions directly from the car and how did it happen , well, i don't think it will affect any of our conversations and i'd like to start our conversation with the fact

that about a month and a half ago, you and i we talked about your initiative project to create strike drones in the revenge wing project it was about the need to produce about a thousand new autonomous unmanned hunter killer bombers and i would like to ask now at what stage the project is such difficulties do not exist when there will be any noticeable results about it is possible to talk well, on a larger scale, well , first of all, this aircraft has three modifications, this is a modification of the autonomous kamikaze, this is a modification of the autonomous bomber, and this is a controllable modification guided bombers, we have now completed the testing of the first sample, what about the sample of the first modification and the autonomous kamikaze, and now we are undergoing certification

, this is also, please, said artem, eh , ahead of me, eh . the 256th to 1256th resolution was adopted there, all the same, the procedure was adopted , it remains very difficult and complex, it is archaic, they have not gone anywhere , they continue to use it, well, such a scoop use, artificial use there price adjustment, although this is an absolute period. now we will definitely try to restore the connection because it is interrupted. and we do not quite clearly hear what vadim is saying . i will repeat something. he is now the main driver of the project called wings of revenge , which involves the creation of a new family

of attack drones. this project was presented about a month and a half ago to the ukrainian community, it envisages, well, different versions of these unmanned systems. vadim says that now the tests of the first version are ongoing. well, the main question arises about scaling of these samples, because one sample on the battlefield does not decide anything, a significant number decides and decides that the personnel should be prepared to use one or another weapon, and then it really gives some effect on the field, because if it is not there, then we understand what point proactive decisions do not affect the situation on the battlefield, vadim , if we are hearing now, i would like to re-recruit our guest for the time being, and i will tell you that there are currently about 40 companies in ukraine

that are starting to create e-e in complexes unmanned strike reconnaissance is the second burst of initiative of our enterprises, because this situation happened for the first time in the year of the war in the 14th year, then about 50 companies appeared that began to manufacture unmanned aerial systems, of those 50 companies, at first 30 remained there, then it decreased to 10 and this is exactly the combat core of 10 companies. and now it is the main potential for the production of serial samples that are adopted into service. this is in particular the atla navi company that manufactures the complex furia a1 sm company deviro e-e uk a specialist of this company itself e is now creating the main samples that are used with the armed forces and new projects are appearing, we are now in touch again vadim kudachigov p vadim would like to e-e to explain to

what stage is the project at now? you said that the ministry of defense's requirements for the rkd for the documentation that this acts as a certain brake in order to speed up the entire testing process. so far, we have purchased eight aircraft for a volunteer day for money. purchased we are creating a worm. this is the money that was offered to us for the purchase of the silpo fora company and the vostok bank . well, i am very grateful to these companies that financed 8 planes and we decided that we will now hand over one of our specialized structures, which will be quietly used at their discretion. there, uh, what are the combat tasks? but i asked artem vinnyk what the problems are now. they are not so difficult for our drone manufacturers, this is the first level

, these are procedural problems, the second is financial the third is industrial and the fourth is personnel. how would you prioritize these problems based on the experience of your own company ? what bothers you the most , the first is personnel problems ? at the moment, we continue to order such professions with state funds as financiers, some marketers at the moment. now they are needed and they don’t have to study for years. they have to study this all in general . some of them are accelerated in the program, but it is needed now. it is now very necessary . we now, uh, in our company

, the salary is somewhere around 40 thousand 30-40 a then 50,000 uah and we will not be able to find personnel who can work, so if suddenly someone hears me, please contact the company and we will hold a competition . the second problem - these are really industrial problems and we are long talked with the representative of the minister of technology. i really hope that in the near future we will have a meeting with the new minister and we will be able to discuss this problem, and it concerns the fact that the state banks of ukraine do not lend to enterprises of the military sector. they are just asking. what do you do with the defense company? really electronic technologies . can we engage in the production of weapons ? no, sorry, we do not lend. they tell me

that the state structure of the state bank and here there is a certain dissonance. i do not. able to purchase such equipment well, the high cost and the equipment that i cannot install on leased premises because each machine that is there costs 100-150 thousand dollars for just its arrangement and adjustment , and it costs somewhere around 10-15 thousand dollars, and if it will be done in rented premises well, when will my rent be raised there, when i saw that i installed everything there, there was ventilation, there was electricity , i changed something else there . pay and 10 and where are you in our activities and the state says but not with you there was a contract for five dollars. well, that's all. we'll leave you $5, and you 'll dig up the rest somewhere yourself and pay. well, in general, these are

the general problems that we need to solve specifically with the government in another way, because artem told us that we must create conditions now the state is saying there we want to create some centers there where business will come to organize some courses there it will just create conditions for us don't bother just don't bother don't bother with your inspections don't bother with your e-e just ask there the title of the nose and no one's business, well, christmas trees-sticks, well, they are optimistic that now it is necessary to systematize, at the moment, it is necessary to collect everything that is, here is everything that the enterprise is able to produce, the state must buy everything because now more now

are purchased with volunteer money, a fund must be created which will be bought , even just now, i tested it, and some military unit likes it . light up this market, then we will systematize everything now, we need to take everything that is from everyone who can produce, my point of view is takaya well, it is radical enough vadim, as in many other e-e issues, but now the government is talking about the fact that they directed 40 billion hryvnias on the purchase of drones, the fact that they have removed these reductions is related to profitability , that is, now the walrus is 25% for manufacturers of unmanned complexes, it says that where there are problems related to the purchase

of components abroad, remove vat there on on such things, these things, you felt at your enterprise that this is an impetus to speed up the production of shock drones that you announced, at the moment i am filling out 36 protocols, at the moment i am completing the rkm and you will become experts artemakh всё раво это rkm well, here i am i'll just explain what rcm is, estimated costing materials, it's the cost of the components plus the cost of the work, on which i can put 25% of the profit, it's the stimulation of inefficient production, that is, the more i screw up all kinds of derms, damn it, well rent and something else. that is, if i have a huge company with a lot of expenses, then we and the expenses of the example will amount to $50. $300. on