[000:00:00;00] the use of the same stingers in the war against the soviet union, which cost uh, well, with such very big cases about urban aviation , because it is necessary to work out tactics, so it turns out that the afghan mejikhs worked on chinese and british ones. well, then when the stingers came, they were able to scale, so what if even the commanding officer of the air force of russian weapons on the su-25, although it would seem that who should be protected ? thank you very much. air capabilities that ukraine would receive in some time from the netherlands, denmark, sweden can further and from the united states, and so on and so on andrii smoliy, political expert , lawyer, public activist will appear with us now and we will have such a tough conversation

good health p andriy thank you for finding time for us. good day. what is the hardness of the conversation? i continue to discuss one way or another peace or nato in exchange for territories and in parallel with this i think before the war and you remember it well. i am convinced that there are many such questions and if such proposals arise in the west, then they are being talked about and discussed somewhere, and it is worth paying attention to it . it seems to me that it is worth paying attention to what you would say to nato in exchange for territory, mr. andrii smoliy . throwaways can be called in different ways, let's say articles, posts, after all, retransmission of such an opinion in the western mass media is not just like that, and of course you need to

pay attention to this information when someone says it and listen well, let them write whatever they want and tell us to do what we want, but i'm sorry, please, this is not just happening, so it's necessary to analyze and understand why it's happening, it's really happening because among some representatives of the western political community, among some probably even high-ranking officials of those or other states or organizations really have such an opinion that listen, there is a war, this war, relatively speaking, has dragged on from their point of view, and it is necessary to somehow conclude this issue, i.e. finish as from their point of view or finish with our exit to some certain borders there or on february 23, 22, or december 1, 91, or others, there are options

for a freeze, a so-called reduction in the intensification of hostilities, and so on and so on , that is, otaki of various a plan of thought, a different plan is going on, one way or another, they are swarming somewhere in the chairs of western experts and some western politicians, and that is why we definitely need to pay attention to this, because one way or another it is our support - these are the people who shape our agenda as well - these are the people who give us finances, these are the people who in one way or another influence our politics and our position. it is another matter what position we have, how fundamentally we take our position. well, we see that, at least publicly , the ukrainian government, and at least publicly , the majority of ukrainian society the position that we must fight on, we must go on, and we must eventually

leave. well, let's say that at least on february 23, 2022, and legally, if we speak in legal language, if in the language of the constitution of our state, of course, this is the first of december 1991, that is, our legal borders of our state, generally recognized by international law, but i emphasize once again that such bells already exist, they must be responded to, and they mean that in the conventional western western world there are certain doubts about ukrainian counterattack regarding how long the war will drag on and regarding what positions we can actually take, moreover, everything is complicated by what we have today. what is august 20, we all understand that uh, in essence

, both western and western society and ukrainian society was pumped with this hope and expectation of a counteroffensive, various persons put it into our heads accordingly, we will say that in our country the counteroffensive will begin in full, as large-scale as someone imagined, in april, may, june, july-august, we already have august 20, that is we have to understand that de facto we still have 10 days of august. we have september, and let it be october, but if it is there until the end of october, thank god, it is very good. there are 1.5-2 months, and then accordingly, again we move to approximately the same positions in which we were, relatively speaking, last winter, that is, we are either waiting for frosts to come further, or we are waiting for spring

again, again the long-awaited april, only already thousands of which is the 24th year, right. including the winter, which applies to the fall, which applies to the actual er-er, apparently, the cessation of the intensification of hostilities, i mean the hostilities there, exactly on the andrii line, the territory is too much, this issue is a guarantee of security for all ukrainians who do not live in the donbass and crimea or maybe only in donbas or maybe only in crimea is the right price or wrong price is the price in general we can talk about such an exchange security for the territory of nato for donbas it is important no it is really important but here is the first

question and where are the guarantees that we will get membership in nato that is, they can verbally promise us no, no, we don't, we don't have, in such conditional words, we can't say it, it won't be indisputable in words, you are a member of the ato or you are not a member of nato, and then there are guarantees in the fifth article if to speak from this point of view is the question, most likely, is how kyiv society and the ukrainian government are ready for such a situation, as far as i can see, ukrainian society and the ukrainian government are probably not ready for such a situation, that's why i don't see the point , even in principle, for now, again, i emphasize until now what to say about it because one way or another 3/4 of society will say no if three quarters of society say no it means no and again there is a moral component here there

is a legal component and how is this possible implement if the territories that are currently occupied are enshrined in the constitution of our state in the constitution of the russian federation, also for the same territories are also written there as russian and there, too, something must be done about it , but it is not recognized by international law. and what does international law look like? okay, no, russia it is not clear that russia does not have this international agreement. let's talk about our agreement between ukraine and nato, and not between ukraine and russia . correctly, that is, from this point of view , i have a model of such interpretations and a moral model of these interpretations because

if the society is not ready and the society is not ready, then i have no idea if you have seen the discussion yet, maybe in three months the society will be ready, because i am absolutely convinced that a simple opinion can arise in the society, people in donbas, many people, i do not say all, i do not say the majority, very many people voluntarily joined the anti-ukrainian army. i don't know what they are called there, but it is anti-ukrainian , and also many people joined the ukrainian army . finally, the ukrainian army entered the territory of ukraine and now they are conditionally sending 10 billion dollars to ukraine and then the restoration of donbas begins, and then people from poltava, and then people from kyiv, and then people from lviv ask the mothers, wives of the dead, i lost a child, a husband , a father there, and now they are given money to restore

those people who killed ukrainians , such a question is not simple and moral. things but the second question and what to do with the part of the occupied zaporizhzhia region, 70% of which we will not expand , but as of today. this is zaporizhzhia there is kherson region, and i think that the discussions in general, including those regarding these territories, which i am more than convinced are at least two-thirds pro-ukrainian. it cannot be here at all. and we . as far as i understand, the discussion is going on now and in relation to these territories, it is de facto talking about the current front line , yes, that is, the current front line is not only donbas and crimea, the current front line includes

zaporizhzhia, and we are setting up another topic, we are not talking about the territory, we are in spite of myself i am trying to find out whether it is possible to change the principles security on the territory is the main thing, which territories 100 km 50 km 1 km 1.5 m doesn't matter but such a principle can be applied in the middle east israel there is peace behind the territory there is such trade we are already used to it well who cares and we have great security beyond the territory and a lot of moral thoughts arise, i don't really like to talk about moral because moral circumstances are difficult to feel. i have never met a person who, apart from the word moral, can draw it somehow, somehow give it a feel and give okay, the last question and

let's finish with this, it is also very important question a s - when ukrainian officials say that peace negotiations can only take place on the basis of the peace formula from president zelensky, this means that all other doors are closed. that is, we do not even look. we do not consider another option from your point of view , we simply say that this is on the table this option and others do not consider it correctly from the point of view of diplomacy, from the point of view of negotiation processes and so on. well, i think that in principle you can consider other options , of course, talk about the fact that it is exclusively without an alternative point of view, well, be wrong. although from which side we understand that today this is the official position of ukraine, that the official position of ukraine is this, then in principle this issue can be considered, and as of today, more than 60 countries

have confirmed that they are ready to follow this peaceful to the initiative although i do not rule out that there may be other proposals i do not rule out that some specific amendments may be included in the end in the end case because what is it now these uh we are peaceful so to speak proposals peaceful positions peace plan so it is so far, the plan has not been implemented, and given the actual map of hostilities that is currently taking place, it will not be implemented at least for the next few months, when we reach the point of actually implementing this peace plan, i am more than convinced that it is possible for the united states of america and some european states, and maybe even ukraine , will introduce certain changes and proposals for changes to this peace plan, of course they can be. that is, this is not the final option, this is

an option that is simply proposed as a draft as as a draft law to which amendments will be made, to put it bluntly, that is why i would not consider now that this is the only alternative, i would consider that one way or another in the future it will change depending on the situation and the situation is our situation well, as we discussed only what about nato , how we were there, very different things that concern the future and in general hostilities will be, they will not be, there will be some kind of stoppage. it is clear , thank you very much andriy smoliy, political expert , lawyer, public activist was with us thank you thank you very much for all the answers, now we have advertising, and then we, as it usually happens, will pour the ministry of health somewhere, for example, to africa, but

anyway, first the advertising. thank you, mr. andriy , turn on the championship on megogo. find out about the battle of the titans on august 26 exclusively on megogo. hello, my name is volodymyr chesnokov. i am the long-term captain of the vorskla poltava football club at a time when the east and south of our country are thundering

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, our program continues. we are now, as i promised, in africa with you, and we will rush on all possible modes of transport er, where is maksym waiting for us? smart independent expert , doctor of political sciences . he is just right. as far as i understand, he is located in the south - in the south african republic. i could be wrong. from the 21st to the 24th of august, i.e. tomorrow, brics itself 8:23 p.m. and a lot of questions thank you for making time for us, maxim , well, look, what is brics like in general, apart from the fact that we know something about it, we also know, for example, that 40 the countries of asia, africa, and even europe still want to join this whole brazil, russia, china , the south african republic , as far as i remember, i have listed all of them, well, if

i forgot something, well, excuse me, that is, how is it, how is it to watch , this is new, what was the name of the movement, not the transition as it was when soviet was the union and the united states, the nato bloc, the warsaw pact bloc, what is this knowledge, at least in some of its basic er forms of ideology, it is obvious that bricks er is the heir but it is interesting that there is russia, that is , russia entered the brics er when er so to speak, this bipolar confrontation in the world ended when the system of socialism disappeared and the heir of the soviet union, the russian federation, did not

become an opponent of the collective west, as they call it. but at the same time, so to speak, she distanced herself from him geopolitical construction in fact now i am really uh and have lived for the fifth year already in the republic of south africa and to be honest, about the fact that the bricks forum starts tomorrow, very little is actually said here, that is, in the news, it is somewhere uh- is far from the most important topic of the bricks summit, as with the previous bricks summits , no special sensations are expected, and the decision itself is not expected because it is a very specific organization, it exists precisely at the moment when forms are held once a year

brics actually demonstrate that these countries are together, but why are they together, what are they doing together, this is a question, so to speak, without any very specific and clear answers, but of course , all organizations have an ideological concept and it is, so to speak, gaining more and more development today when we talk about the global south so uh about this idea of ​​the global south about it uh about him as an opponent of the global north or the collective west uh and this global south which is very reserved about the russian-ukrainian war and er, to a large extent, er retains its s- traditional relations with russia, for this global south, bricks is such a point of attraction for today, and the 40 countries you mentioned are a sign of that, well, there is no

drama in our conversation with you why, because in your previous statements, the words were exactly identical to my words. that this is something completely frivolous when the editors and i are preparing a program and they say well , they are talking about some kind of common currency. when they say a quarter of the world's economy is the global south it's over there india and china and brazil and so on i say well listen more than half is the global west besides that it's more than half it's also the latest cutting edge technology it's breakthrough science it's vertical so-called agriculture is the 22nd century. and here i am asking about some guinea-bissau. i apologize to the people of guinea and bissau , and i am somehow very skeptical about it, but

i will ask you a question, since you are still in africa, you should ask about africa, to what extent in africa do they feel the situation around niger, how much is it higher in the news, all this news than bricks, this is still your territory, despite the fact that you have a large white population , but it is still africa. to repeat, being in africa for ukraine is that africa is very big and in fact niger is quite far from south africa, it is a completely different region and there is something excellent, so to speak, the political situation and the political agenda

i would said because uh nigga is in a very unstable region, so to speak, as we know, coups d'état are constantly taking place there, burkina faso , mali de wagner is going, so to speak, to nigeria , there are constant riots and dozens of people are killed, south south africa , well it is usually at a certain distance from this region. it is a fairly stable democracy and here it seems to have its own agenda, although the general idea of ​​africa exists, and there is some kind of sympathy, and an attempt to think of oneself in a world that is somehow separate and in solidarity. but honestly saying uh the situation in niger is the same as, for example, the situation in sudan, where there has been a long-standing conflict between two, so to speak, armed groups, well, enough, so

to speak, for the background background sound in today's politics, mr. maksym , the last question may be important, it may also look quite ironic here in south africa and the islamic wind is blowing because i just have my own experience many, many years ago i was in senegal well , there was barely a mosque somewhere now you look at how people dress, well, it was really 35-40 years ago why and you understand that there islam is already a reality and in general this islam is coming from the north and we see how they legally showed footage if it was 25-30 years ago, they were not even dressed like that these guys who are gathering around the problems of the sohel and and and and we see it going and where and where and where and where to the bottom and how much it is felt in south africa whose is this someone who predicts that problems may come sooner or

later okay after 25 years well, i'll give you two small stories on this occasion , if there is still time, i will tell you the first plot er, he is so international, it concerns international politics, er, you are talking about how he moves from the north, this threat is islamic , so it has reached mozambique at the moment , it is a neighboring country on the indian ocean , directly neighboring the south african republic. here in the north there are such radical islamic groups have created very serious problems , including the french total energy company, they have blocked the extraction of hydrocarbons and so on . mozambique has sought support from its neighbors and

in principle, south africa is the only ally that can actually help her in this situation, and somehow you help, by the way, they tried to attract bugner, but after a dozen wagnerites died there, so to speak, this idea had to be abandoned, this is one plot, another plot when the war started, actually this full-scale , how do we say it, interest in ukraine appeared , before this situation, i was invited by some local south african radio station or in johannesburg, so to speak, and invited to the air well, let's discuss what is happening in ukraine, what kind of war is this and what is it, and when i already went on the air, when i heard who my interlocutors were, i realized that this is a specific radio for the muslims of south africa and

, first of all, for them and by the way this is characteristic not only for muslims , for the very rich, especially for the black population, the ideologically black, so to speak support who israel we ukraine - this israel or palestine are all paradigms, we are someone, as if as if refugees are accepted by europe and so on. well, if we say some objective things, then islam today is mainly represented by migrants from bangladesh from pakistan, that is, islam is not here. this one is not from the maghreb and not from the middle east, he

is ideologically a little different, so to speak , but what brings islam apart from religion, i