[000:00:00;00] an insignificant part of the work is to disperse or eliminate or send the wagnerites to the war in ukraine under another under the women's flag, in fact, everything ended with yesterday 's decree, if i'm not mistaken, by putin's decree that well , it's not written there, wagner's worm but it's clear who it concerns primarily about that that all private military companies whose activities are related to a special military operation must swear allegiance to the russian federation to act in accordance with its laws and in accordance with its charter there is no one to do bond in russia thank you mr. pavel for the conversation, i am pavlova kiychuk and the head of security at the program center for global studies, strategy 21, a military expert was with us, dear friends

, stay with us, we will continue the conversation , we are waiting for a belgian professional diplomat of ukrainian origin, zenon koval, we will talk with him about the activities of the un and also about international politics, so stay with us, there are 15% discounts on spazmalgon in pharmacies, traveler's bank and savings if you like a woman, she can do everything probiz femina - this is your useful microflora if it is the norm immediately visible skin hair and everything else is just fire here probiz femina anu run grab microbes tired of heavy agricultural saws then the compact and powerful strong saw from unpacks tv just for you now you can easily cut trees and bushes strong saw is so convenient can also be used for carpentry , everything is an ideal tool for your home

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and the possibility of personal communication with the espresso team click sponsor and become part of the community with a ukrainian perspective with you vitaly portnikov and we let's discuss the main events of this week vitaly portnikov and top experts about the most striking events of the last seven days our guest will be the generator of satellite forces the former national security adviser of the president of the united states donald trump herbert mcmaster we will cut out current topics h three questions authoritative comments and forecasts in the project information marathon with vitaly portnikov every sunday at 8:10 p.m. the war in ukraine is the main topic for ukrainians victories and losses analysis and forecasts

politicians and geopolitics will talk about all this serhii rudenko and the guests of his program, people who have information and shape public opinion, people who defend ukraine and create the future, the main and interesting thing in the program is the verdict of serhiy rudenko from monday to friday at 20:00, repeat at 12:10, dear friends, we return to avatar and in fact, we present to you our guest zelen koval , a belgian professional diplomat of ukrainian origin, a special adviser at the embassy of ukraine in belgium in 1992 and 1995, a former representative of the french-speaking governments of belgium at unesco in paris, mr. zenone, we are glad to see you in our studio. i am very glad to be there directly, and not through skype or other networks. what brought you to ukraine this time, how long have you been here and why did you come to

ukraine? i always try to be in kyiv at least on august 24. independence day. and this year i arrived a little earlier already. since august 3, i have been in ukraine. well, here i have a mouse in my little sister near myrhorod. i also wanted to visit my father in frankiv oblast on his family farm i also want to contact them. well, i also have certain political activities that concern the world. is it irina francophonie in a bright country, so he has meetings with representatives of the verkhovna rada, the deputy chairman of the kornienko had meetings in the brain , so he is trying to connect one second, third, everything what can i do while i'm here in ukraine from august 3 to august 27, what are your events in ukraine while you're there, have you seen a lot of acquaintances , many of me, not only graduates, we also

play music. i'm a rocker, if you can say yes to a guitarist. so i went to a concert. er, the mytilnyuk sisters used to be filmed and recorded. this is a good friend of mine. so i was at their concert. er, we had them today. by the way, the gadyukin brothers were there. and i was traveling with him on the train . no wonder, from kyiv to lviv, and by the way, er, recently, long ago i am familiar with the gadyukins, because in 1992 i was one of them, then they organized a tour of red ruth laureates, and i organized concerts for them in brussels, at the franco-french cultural center, to love nick, that’s his name , we know each other from there, they then invited me and my friend igor to which with which we play or played in to the ukrainian team of belgium to perform with them in donetsk on the red hand so, look, in the third we played in donetsk with the vipers on the red hand and we have such

contacts, relations continue today, by the way, the date we forgot to mention today, but it is definitely worth to say today is the birthday of ivan franko the great ukrainian and i don't know such a sign of a hero of ukrainian identity in the pantheon of ukrainian heroes for sure and there is a very wonderful german woman very, very old and actually this german woman seems to have been made somewhere at the end of her life i saw franko, that's mykola biletsky. here she is now on the screen. it's already a day old. franko , that's already somewhere. it's definitely possible . is it even from the first world war ? and he's sitting surrounded by neighbors and ukrainian snipers . franko is in fact his union. the good legacy is what he basically did for

ukraine. let me remind you that in fact he returned ukraine to a certain extent as ukraine. was involved in the liberation movements of the ukrainian struggle and you are actually a descendant of this second wave of ukrainian emigration, if you can briefly tell your story and your father was a member of the organization of ukrainian nationalists and when the organization announced the restoration of the act of restoration of ukrainian statehood in lviv on june 30, 1941 , well, not only in lviv, it took place in lviv, but in other cities and towns of ukraine, and my father was personally involved in this proclamation in dolyna, he is from the frankiv region, so that shortly after that, in september, it began

a wave of the rest of the germans who could not imagine that there were some interminable shortcomings proclaiming the restoration of their anti-reich statehood and that all those people should be framed so that my father was caught then he was taken away. krakow has such a prison called montelyuch, a very unpleasant name for those who know what it represents. well, in 1942 , they were thrown into prison, while the first group of ukrainian nationalists from bandera , mainly from avshiv, and you know that the worst or the most severe camp for the destruction of all kinds of opponents, thank god he survived, because the ukrainians who were in that election were very supportive of each other, supported them

when the soviet front was already approaching avshchyts, then they expelled all those who could walk with them, it was done in twos, it was called a march of death it was already in january of 1945 and they were almost barefoot in those robes or pajamas , you know how they looked, built prisoners evaluations, then they were taken to austria before your hands were called maudzin and from that camp they regrouped people and sent them to smaller camps where they worked, they dug rocks there to make some weapons and so on, then they liberated them on the day of easter, easter of the 45th year of the resurrection, they arrived the americans met the germans then they were behind them to the refugee camps in germany in bavaria mainly there two such main camps were

auxboard and reginsburg and later father father and luckily tried to cross the border to belgium several times to learn to continue he didn't succeed in studying at the university, he didn't succeed, he was constantly being set up and sent away, but finally, through our ukrainian bishop in rome, the greek-catholic bishop buchko, so he was called buchko , some of our students received scholarships from the vatican and he was able to get to the belgian catholic university in near the city of leuven, he completed his studies there, he met his mother, and the family was also taken out, my mother was from przemyśl, so that's how our family began. and when i grew up , belgium, well, we obviously speak ukrainian

there is a lot of ukrainian culture at home, my father also headed the union of ukrainian youth abroad for more than 20 years, it was a broad organization, so a bit of a competitor of plast abroad , i would say that plast abroad went more according to such scout laws, although there were also some children of patriotic families, and the sum was exclusively more than you said to such an ideological organization, which included not only children from good or rich families, but also about these people, and asks to impress upon them a little love for ukraine so that they felt like ukrainians, but your story, the story of your family history, first of all destroys one soviet myth that the people of bandera were the aids of the nazis. well , there is, i will tell you, the biggest aid for this was the russians themselves. think about vlasov

in their army, who supported them there germans and so on, many more than any, any number of ukrainians and bandera, if he had a temporary agreement with germany, then he was not a kolyabarenko, a laboratory worker, a person who carries out the orders and plans of the one who manages this is a plan, kolya burator, an employee, a collaborator, he was not an employee, he was a temporary employee, he had a temporary agreement, but he had his own plans, his plans were the liberation of ukraine, the restoration of independence, and that is why the germans arrested him, put him in the saxonhausen detention center , so you need to change, mix those concepts and do not use the term a collaborator when you talk about bandera well, all the more so that here it must be said that on august 23 , by the way, the hands of leonid

kuchma, the former president, coincided with a holiday in our country of the state flag on august 23. but i am trying to remind our viewers that for europe in the european union , in particular, this is the day of remembrance of the victims of stalinism and this is the day of the black ribbon blackview and accordingly we must remember that it was that all this it started with this signing of the act between molot and ribbentrop and the video of the soviet union , that is, of russia, germany, so what are you doing? nazis and so on, if you look at the elections, what was the turnout of the emergency grassroots parties in ukraine, about two percent , look at us less than, for example, in the netherlands , look at france, the lepen party

had almost 20%. so what are we talking about, uh, we're going to take a short break with you now, but first i'll ask one question so that there's a small hook to make uh, um, these dp camps , where did the ukrainians end up, these are the places where the displaced people ended up, where did the ukrainians end up after they were somewhere there in they were caught all over the world because they were fleeing from ukraine, then they had two paths either somewhere in europe or somewhere in america or in canada or back in the soviet union. by those who returned to the soviet union and listened to this soviet propaganda, let's share this story, because this is the part of ukrainian history that we don't know. we don't know because people left ukraine and ukrainians always thought, and he went abroad

war and it was good now we understand what that is to leave for himself left he was taken away he was arrested so this is a big difference who fled from the soviet authorities a lot of people were taken away for forced labor during the second world war these people did not leave voluntarily they were taken away some ran away obviously but you need to know that even when those who speak were spinning these are the soviet repatriation commissions that were recruited, go back to the union, we will now rebuild it after the war , all the forces are needed and everything and they ended up not in the east, but in the far east of siberia yes, our parents. i must say that most of the people who ended up abroad during the second world war, these people are political emigration, people who firmly believed that it is necessary to fight for the independence of ukraine, they lived for a certain time on two sides because i think they thought maybe the americans will really go further churchill in plans, he wanted to continue the war, he was not allowed to do so paton died such

a mysterious death in luxembourg, so i don't know if, but he also wanted to continue this mood because they knew what a threat he represented the soviet union, so they tried to recruit our people to return, but our politically conscious people did not fall for that hook and started building because there was no other choice in their communities abroad , we continue literally in two minutes , stay with us stiffness in the joints and spine, osteochondrosis, gout radiculitis, arthritis and arthrosis, with all these problems , the means for external use dicrasin will be useful to you, consultations by phone 0800-215 349 calls are free, turn on the cycles well

, everything as you want, click and now you control the game watch what you need in tv shows, mego, turn on hundreds of channels, thousands of movies and sports, photos for ear pain, 20% in pharmacies , traveller's bank and save money, boredom in the joints and spine, osteochondrosis, gout, radiculitis, arthritis and arthrosis, with all these problems, the remedy will come in handy. for external use of dikrasin consultations by phone 0800-215 349 calls are free ukraine's independence is held on their shoulders real heroes defend our right to life and freedom around the clock we ukrainians never encroach on

foreign but for our own land we fight until victory sbu destroys the enemy everywhere on land in the air and at sea independence is a component of the genetic code that unites ukrainians it was and will be because we will definitely drive out the darkness that came from the east happy independence day ukraine sbu we are getting closer to victory together koval today we have a belgian professional diplomat of ukrainian origin visiting us, and actually in the first part of the conversation we talked a little about how it happened that mr. zenon was born in belgium , in this part we will already talk about

current events eh pneumone this time you sat a little maybe in the shelter you heard how you started rockets overhead so i heard obviously eh those signs of alarm as sirens are buzzing in kyiv and in other cities and to a certain extent what to say to him that i really i felt almost to my skin. what was going on? one day, ivan, a volunteer, planned to go to chernihiv because she works there with people in okolitsia in the region , and on the way we stopped in a small village near kyiv, which was 85% destroyed by the russians , and there bel and my friends were there. you help those organizations are getting money, and she wanted to show me exactly what was going to be done in the house, they installed new windows and panes for people , old people who, er , do not move anywhere.

in the direction of chernihiv and entering chernihiv, we found out that just 20 minutes before our arrival, a rocket was fired into the very center of chernihiv, so if we had not stopped to inspect this village, we might have arrived just at the moment when the rocket fell there, it was terrible we had just to meet the guide in the center of chernihiv and well, we still walked around the city a little and so on, but we felt that the atmosphere was not right, the way to the center was obviously blocked, and they began to think about what had happened , how many victims of wounded people there were, it was terrible and it’s just ridiculous, and i think that one of our journalists, vitaly perdikov, said that the country should organize such an event in the very center of the city and widely advertising on all possible channels. this is

simply unacceptable. maybe for the second year already the war has been going on for more than 1.5 years, the war has dulled a little. this is this. this is a feeling of fear and everyone tries to live as if there is no war somewhere, somewhere, if it is not exactly a front-line city . well, this does not apply to chernihiv, and the russians who reminded us that this is their city are on the front lines . that the front is actually the borders with russia and belarus, and i wanted to ask, how did you take it, do you look in particular at that, that is, in our country , in our country, in our country , we had very great successes, we were given an advance candidacy for membership in the european union optimistic statements that we will fulfill all the first prerequisites by last autumn, but i understand that only two have been fulfilled since then. then there was another announcement no less ambitious that we are about to, but it seems that things are not progressing so well in principle it is not too optimistic to think that we can

implement something, well, it is very difficult to implement and work in the circumstances that exist in ukraine today, obviously the verkhovna rada is trying to pass a number of laws there and so on, but the adoption of laws is not enough, they must be the british say to implement means to implement in life, and if there are no levers to actually fulfill them , then there are problems with that itself. now we are facing a problem, because it should be, i think, in september or october. so to start negotiations really with the european union so i think that there will not be a green light yet , but we have to start, well, listen to what they will say, how they evaluate what ukraine

has done until then, because the road will still be long after that, if we fulfill the prerequisites with a wedge, then conditions will come, those conditions are, i don't know, more than 30 separate sections on which negotiations will have to be conducted : agriculture, justice, social issues, and so on. and so on. and so on. the level is closed, the section goes to the next one, but in some disorders it is also necessary to say that ukraine is not so bad when it comes to digital policy in ukraine . it is very high. maybe better than some other countries, but now in the villages you can safely pay with a card. i know that this would not work everywhere in western europe , but listen, on the other hand, there are such things as, say , the independence of the judicial branch or how fully democracy works, for example. well, i

understand that now there is martial law, but not less, but recently we had lindsey graham, a senator, who is a very great friend of ukraine, and he said that elections should be held in ukraine next year no matter what, because i understood , it seems we can understand why he is so he says because there is a growing wave in america that is fueled in particular by the trumpists that ukraine is an inferior democracy. that is, they just don’t say it openly out loud, but not openly, somewhere there in social networks, it is thrown that there is no democracy there in ukraine. this is the second afghan, we are wasting money in vain, in your opinion how to prove to ukraine do we have to prove that everything is here, roughly speaking, this is a european country well, first of all, you need to remember that you know , i always talk about processes and not about any

individual facts if analyzed from independence of ukraine , so that it has already taken place and some changes have taken place under the government. it has been democratic. so it is impossible to say that there was no democratic process here, in the end , when they chose uh, during the election , uh, presidents of zelensky were also uh, observers and so on, so now there is another the state is martial law and whether it is possible or necessary to organize elections during the war, this is the second question, it is necessary to look at what is the legislation of ukraine, what is the international legislation , the legislation on the legislation of martial law, and how are americans doing things there , when their president died, the second sound during world war they elected a new president, it was truman who came to

power, but the americans in their territory, except for garbur, when the japanese destroyed part of their flight there, they did not feel the war on on their territory, and here there is a war on the territory, these are also completely different concepts. well, there are also refugees. well, not refugees , forced refugees, let it be so, there are millions of forced displaced persons, forced migrants. zelenskyi is known to everyone. he does not have a plan for putin , but everyone knows. what is putin's plan to simply wait for help and in the war to exhaust his daughter at this moment? when ukraine can no longer resist and not only that, but work in the meantime to weaken the coalition that supports ukraine. we know what they have, everyone knows rammstein, too. yes, there are more than 40 countries that support ukraine, weapons. but in that rammstein is a rather

shaky coalition, it is a democratic coalition, and in those countries that are members of rammstein , they are fighting back. elections are taking place in america. there should be elections in germany, there have already been elections in spain, there have already been in turkey, there have already been in italy , we thought it could get worse, but we see that italy strongly and continues to support ukraine, so you see, democracy is shaky than a country like russia, which has its own tsar, who gives instructions, gives orders, and everyone does it, and he says there is no debate of any kind, here we have them literally for half a minute, does this mean that ukraine is at its worst now , what is the war on time of the war for endurance for exhaustion as if ukraine should also work to support this coalition there is no need to wait we are working we have our own diplomats our president clutch i speak as a ukrainian - that's how our president

er-e they travel meet with people he makes a proactive policy, i.e. sub policy object a not an object of international law and as long as we have the initiative and remain subjects everything will be up to us thank you, mr. green, for your participation in our stage since morning and a belgian professional diplomat of ukrainian origin visited us now anna appears on the screens and lamelnyka, this means that we will see what happened there in the world. anna eva, you have a word. good day, colleagues . thank you for your work. the news editor will continue to work and we will tell you about the most important things that are happening in ukraine and the world . i will start this issue with the situation in the zaporizhzhia region in the temporarily occupied berdyansk of the zaporizhzhia region, the enterprise to which the russians were transporting equipment is on fire, the