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for us respects and is beautiful listen to your fm galicia ukraine-england on megogo in the selection for euro 2024 our national team needs to tame three lions turn on the match on september 9 at 19:00 cheer for the main team of the country on megogo there are discounts on kanefron m 20% in podorozhnyk pharmacies you and savings there are discounts on motilium tablets 20% in podorozhnyk pharmacies bam and savings the war continues and not only for territories, it is also a war for the minds

of russia throws millions of petrodollars to turn ukrainians into little russians ukraine will become russia dissection and analysis of information about ukraine by russian propagandists specific facts and methods by which enemy propaganda turns people into obedient zombies plans to vote residents of the ldr let's counter the information attacks of the russians in the project of the chronicle of the information war with olga laziness tuesday thursday friday at 17:10 on the espresso tv channel, watch this week's program collaborators who develop propaganda channels in the occupied territories glaza выдольный желать работать yes who, in exchange for a position, adjusted the fire in the cities of ukraine for the betrayal of ukraine and gave them 15 years watch on wednesday, september 6 at 17:45 the program of collaborators with olena kononenko

on the espresso tv channel hello, this is freedom in the morning, the informational project of radio svoboda , guests are here every day, this is the ship district of kherson, inclusion live we are in bahmut tell the main thing on weekdays at 9:00 the war in ukraine is the main topic for ukrainians victory and loss analysis and forecasts politics and geopolitics all this will be talked about by serhiy rudenko and the guests of his program people who have information and shape public opinion, people who defend ukraine and create the future, the main and interesting

thing in the program is the verdict by serhiy rudenko from monday to friday at 8:00 p.m. repeat at 12:10 p.m. this is the 23rd separate rifle battalion of the armed forces of ukraine now we are already in such a significant salient, and actually at the very edge of this salient, we are holding the defense, the battalion has wedged itself into the defense of the orks in donetsk region and is holding its position right now, the military needs our help, the fighters need drones to lead the development and destroy the enemy, we are still on the approach, we take the approach every drone is a lost enemy and a saved life of our soldier, join the gathering, let's show our fighters that we are with them. i welcome this exclusive interview on espresso. my name is yuri fizer, and my guest today is the plenipotentiary and extraordinary ambassador of the united states of america to russia in

2011-2014, as well as the director of the freeman institute in the field of international studies at stanford university, michael mcfall, we will talk with him about many things, but mostly, all the same, to the great regret of russia, about the war that russia started last year and already has been leading for more than a year and a half about our victory. we are standing. congratulations, maxim and thank you for joining. thank you for the invitation. i already told our viewers that we will talk mainly about russia and its brutal war that putin started in february 2022, as well as about our victory , not only about that. ot e-e noty makchas questions you wrote an interesting book that i bought and read the book is called the unfinished revolution in russia political changes

from gorbachev to putin changes took place but why there was no revolution is a complex big question that is difficult to answer when i wrote this book in 2001, it was after ten or even 15 years, if you count the gorbachev period of political transformations in the soviet union and then russia, and something was achieved then, or so we thought, first of all, the collapse of the soviet empire took place and 15 countries, including ukraine and the russian federation, gained their independence and compared to other empire collapses it was relatively peaceful at least until last year and come back2leto they made the transition from a predominantly command-administrative economy to a market

but in this book i wrote that the transition from dictatorship to democracy took place but it was ambiguous and i am concerned that in this book where i examine various elements i said that democracy in russia was not consolidated and tragically that now two decades later we see that putin took advantage of these weak democratic institutions and destroyed them today i witnessed the return of the russian dictatorship that it was known in advance that this would happen if, for example, boris nemtsov became the next president of russia, because there were plans to anoint him as boris yetsin's successor the tradition could have gone the other way but in retrospect there is no doubt that the statutes were too weak too fragile in 2000 when putin came to power and that allowed

him to actually destroy them uh speaking of putin you know him quite well is the putin of 2000 different from putin today's question is a great one, my answer is yes and no a-a he was anti-democratic in 2000, but he was not like that from the very beginning. i wrote my first article about putin in 2000, warning the world about his anti-democratic actions. he has always been as an imperialist he mourned the collapse of the soviet union he is from the kgb and spent his whole life defending the soviet empire but 20 years ago he was much more pro-market and pro-western about market reforms he reduced the individual income tax

and moved russia to a flat tax of 13% he reduced corporate taxes and favored private property today is no longer the case he has re-established strict state control over the economy especially after the second invasion of your country once he was open to interaction with the west he even talked about russia's entry into nato by the way, i will remind you because today he says that you are not nato in everything and he was forced to invade ukraine due to the expansion of the north atlantic alliance, but 20 years ago he was not afraid of nato, he wanted to join the alliance and even said about ukraine in 2002 that if ukraine wants to join nato, that is their business, not ours, so that in these two aspects he has significantly changed his thinking and in recent days he has become

a much more nationalistic patriot who allegedly professes conservative orthodox religious values, i wouldn't call it conservatism, but it's something that didn't exist 25 years ago. why did he change? i think one of the main drivers was that he became more authoritarian in order to fear his people and therefore he needed an external enemy to justify his authoritarianism . and it was then that he became more anti-western and anti -ukrainian; secondly, he is afraid not of nato expansion, but of democratic expansion in 2000, georgia in 2003, most importantly, the orange revolution in

your country, it was a threat to his authoritarian way of ruling and of course later the revolution of dignity became an even greater threat but not russian security and here i want to make it clear for 1941 from the time when hitler invaded the soviet union there was no military threat from the west against russia none but the expansion of democracy threatened putin's rule inside russia that the russians need a strong state, the russians do not need western methods of governance because they are different, i remember how in 2011 i was at a meeting with him and the then vice president

biden and he talked for a long, long time about the fact that russia is not part of europe, is not part of the defense, he says that ukrainians are not a separate nation, that you are just russians with an accent, that ukraine has become an independent state, this is another of his very strange arguments that if ukrainians practicing democracy, the slavic peoples can do it. yes, what threatens the administration of your country in the first place, and also of my country, is the enemy from outside in order to legitimize its dictatorship at home, and he found this enemy, unfortunately uafeng in you

often called the architect of president obama's reset policy towards russia, this was 10-15 years ago, did you really think that relations with the kremlin could be changed at that time, i'll be honest, i think there is a lot of misunderstanding of what we were trying to do then in 2009, we sat in the white house and determined our national security interests and the highest priority, one of these priorities was the need to cooperate with the kremlin, then president medvedev, and by the way, in 2009, was radically different from that crazy medvedev that he has become today, it is very important to understand that he was completely different, well, i will give a few examples , in 2009 the term of the treaty on the elimination of medium and short-range missiles

expired and president obama decided that the missile defense system corresponds to the national interests of the united states and that it is impossible without the russians to negotiate arms control, that's why he said that we need to enter the negotiations, and the plane signed a new treaty on the sno-3 dsn in 2010 , reducing nuclear weapons in the world by 30% as a friend he decided that we should stop iran from getting nuclear weapons and for this he wanted to introduce multilateral sanctions against iran, it is possible to debate whether it was the right decision but at the same time he wanted to impose many multilateral sanctions for this russia had to vote with us that they and did by the way at the un security council meeting in 2010 we decided to send our troops to afghanistan in an effort

to defeat terrorism there we were also going to fight terrorism outside the borders of afghanistan borders, including in pakistan, at that time 95% of our supplies went through pakistan so president obama had the idea that we needed to diversify our supply routes to afghanistan and that meant going through russia through the so-called northern distribution network we had to negotiate with the russians and by the way, we violated the sovereignty of pakistan in 2011 and killed bin laden himself, we could do this only thanks to diversification. i think that many people misunderstand our desire to have good relations with russia, although other beliefs are possible. i don't even believe that the allies believed in this, like me. we should not choose mood music or a positive attitude towards the country

as our goal, the goal should be specific tasks that advance national interests , in the case of my country, the interests of the united states of america, so for a while we this is how it ended, of course, for two reasons : firstly, putin returned and he was not interested in cooperating with us, and secondly , mass demonstrations against putin's regime arose in 11 and 12 years and putin accused us and me personally of these demonstrations, as a result of which cooperation on other issues such as iran or north korea or even syria, which was being corrected in 12-13 years , turned out to be impossible with putin, who was in the kremlin, because you know them very well , since you lived in moscow for four years

why according to some estimates 85-90% of russians support putin is it because they are afraid of him or maybe they are fascinated by his imperialist ideas or maybe they just don't care why why is it difficult to answer your question because it is difficult to understand what what people in authoritarian countries really think it's important to remember that you can't do a real poll in a country like russia or any dictatorship because people are afraid to say what they really believe they have no incentive to say what's on their mind and secondly, i got the impression that putin. his terrible barbaric invasion of your country enjoys considerable support . to be honest, i am not surprised, but deeply

disappointed. this is not just putin's war in ukraine - it is the russians' war in ukraine. we must admit that this is not a one-man war, that putin is not instigating everything in it, putin is not kidnapping your children, he is not raping your daughters and mothers, individual russians are doing it. i think it is very important to understand that it is the russians who are killing these crimes against humanity, and not only vladimir putin regarding your other question, it is definitely true that propaganda and repression work well, so there were some slave russians who protested at the beginning , now some of them are serving 25-year prison terms, for example, volodya karamurza

whom i know well, ilya yashin, they criticized the war and are now in prison, and this scares other russians away from protesting the idea , while i live in russia in the 90s, i would never have thought that they are capable of reviving stalinism, this is the result of a 20-year propaganda from putin's side, this is not deeply disappointing, but there is another segment of russian society that simply lowered its head, they do not support the war, but they are not against them, they do not just try to stay away, and these people instantly change their minds if they change

the condition. if putin says to end the war, it is interestingly said in an interview with a ukrainian channel that russians are unfortunately getting used to war used to the war and y they are used to supporting it and putin present putton of course we will win in a while putin will lose but those russians who are used to war will remain what do you think or can this will become a problem both for ukraine and for the western allies. yes, i think that this is a big problem. and that's why i think that the western world, the democratic world, should do much more to make them pay the price for supporting this war. i

work with andriy the president in a working group with of international sanctions that the western democratic world should increase sanctions so that people feel the war more directly, in particular it is said that too many components from the west are involved in the production of weapons in russia and this should stop too many russians who have not been sanctioned work for a company and a political party that support the war, therefore, the sanctions need to be expanded, it is too comfortable for russians to travel to supposedly enemy countries, this is the world , stop the 360 ​​billion dollars that were frozen in the russian central bank need to be handed over for the reconstruction of ukraine so that the russians feel the consequences of the war

they support so in my opinion this is the first step, then in the long term the defeat of putin's army in your country must take place, it is necessary for the people to finally reject their imperial ambitions in 1991 they failed to do so to do there is a big difference between germany in 1944 and russia in 1991 then boris yeltsin tried to put the communist party on trial but there was not enough support so they never had they never had remorse, they never realized the evil that soviet imperialism

carried . unfortunately, until putin loses this war inside russia, this process will not begin. what is putin most afraid of now? answers but i think that there are several important things that i would like to say about putin and his brevity that putin is a match who cannot be cornered , he needs space some say that he needs ukrainian land to end the war i don't agree with that at all. he is not as desperate as he is thought to be. several examples come to mind when he was pressured, but instead of escalating, he retreated . only then did the turkish president warn putin to stop sending

his planes to syria through turkish territory in the end. the language got tired of it and he shot down one of these planes but as a result he did nothing and he only saw i was in south africa it was brics that putin sent lavrov there and he himself spoke online shows that he is afraid of the un international criminal court, we do not see a comrade who defies the west, we see a coward who is afraid of the west, it should come to us that we should not be afraid of putin if we can boldly challenge him and eventually drive him away so what is the answer to your question, i think what he is most afraid of is losing crimea he is afraid of transferring the war in crimea to our country and not to his this is what he

is most afraid of because it would undermine the legitimacy of his war in russia and lead him to a deaf end kut amen the ability to get crimea became a threatening consequence for his regime another question about the chinese government because their attitude towards the russian war in ukraine at certain moments is very unclear and ambiguous of time what do you think why is this so? about a formal alliance, but about a partnership that

is primarily fueled by antagonism towards the united states of america , china's support for russia was moderate, all xinbin does not support war supported putin and russia at the un general assembly, and china was not among them , he abstains from military aid. he behaves very cautiously because he wants to avoid sanctions. little china has done for russia is surprising i give credit to your president and your diplomats for the smart diplomacy with china that

keeps it on track to win the event and condemn this war i think it will happen anyway maintaining chinese neutrality is a very worthy goal that ukrainian diplomacy managed to achieve, questions, i want to thank all americans and all european allies for the support we receive from you thanks to this help and support, our brave soldiers are fighting on the front lines and reclaiming our territories baz but we often hear calls from of the west about the need to sit down at the negotiating table with the russians table with russians and what does this mean ? the west is getting tired of the war in

ukraine, we need to find out what is included in the concept of protecting europe supports you much more than others . here in the usa, president biden and his administration are very supportive of your military efforts and they do not tell president zelensky to negotiate with the russians. forget that next year we have the presidential election of the president who will run against president biden will actively criticize the republicans

now there is donald trump hors is max who of course much less support the financial and military aid to ukraine than the president should. that is, you touched on a question that also worries me, what to do. and you, you are doing more than more weapons, better weapons and as soon as possible for the fastest way to end this war. i would say the same about sanctions , more sanctions, stronger sanctions and as soon as possible this is the way to victory where you can speed up the process of ending the war guarantees the prolongation of the war when i hear let's do more now to speed up the end of putin's barbaric invasion ukraine i sincerely

thank you mr. ambassador for finding time for us thank you for answers to my questions it was michael