tical perspective, keep an eye out for our next updated predictions on the espresso channel. good evening, we are from ukraine, glory to ukraine, this is the verdict program, my name is serhii rudenko, i greet everyone and wish everyone good health. in the program. the ukrainian amphibious assault in crimea and the second destroyed russian triumph, two successful special operations in one night. gurmo made another landing on krim. crimea will be ukrainian or uninhabited. support for ukraine has become a stumbling block. for the first time in us history , the speaker of the house of representatives was fired. will it speed up? this is an allocation decision. for us. the fight against

corruption in ukraine is an excuse or a reason to limit american aid, elections in eu countries. why are pro-russian forces coming to power and how will this affect support for ukraine? we will talk about this and other things during the next hour with our guest, politician and diplomat pavlo klinkin. however, before starting a conversation with the minister of foreign affairs of ukraine. in 2014-2019, let's see how the fighters of the main intelligence directorate of the ministry of defense of ukraine today attacked the crimean peninsula.

gurmo made another landing in crimea, crimea will be ukrainian or ruthless, the same night the security service of ukraine hit the s-400 triumf air defense complex near bilgord. let me remind you that this system costs 1 billion 200 million dollars, this is the second triumph

destroyed by the ukrainian military, let's see how it was this night. friends, those who are currently watching us on youtube, please like this video and also take part in our vote, today we ask you if you need presidential elections and elections to the verkhovna rada during the war, two options for answers , yes no, or your option on...

please write in the comments under this video, we are in touch, as i said, a diplomat, a politician and the minister of foreign affairs of ukraine in 2014-2019, pavlo klimkin. mr. pavle, i congratulate you, glad to see you on our air, congratulations, mr. serhiy, greetings to all friends, as always glad to be with you. mr. paul, dramatic events unfolded tonight in our country, but this, this was a day in the uh, congress of the united states of america, kevin mccarthy was removed from the post of speaker of the lower house of the congress of the united states of america, the first time this has happened in 1013 years, the last time was in 1910, and strangely enough, he was removed from office on the initiative of a republican, since mccarthy is also a republican. and matt

gates initiated the resignation of his fellow party member, what can you say from the situation that arose in the united states congress. america, like what is happening now in the american congress, will influence ukraine, certainly the russian-ukrainian front, because we know that before that there was a congressional vote on the temporary budget for 45 days, from the congress of the united states of america, and mccarthy was accused of playing along with biden in this way, and biden, accordingly, playing along with ukraine. well the story is really unique and the 10th year that you mentioned, actually to draw parallels with 1910, it's almost impossible today, but the process wasn't over then, but now it's over, for the first time in american history, for many, it

kind of blows the brains, and this is really unheard of an unprecedented story, uh, you see the democrats all voted to resign and didn't give mccarthy a chance, and this is a completely deliberate political move, raising the stakes, they want to show that inside the republicans, there is no order, that there is a mess, and that this is a messy party that today starts such races, both presidential and not only presidential , and it is not so much about the personality of mccarthy, but about all republicans in general, there are many different groups, not only radicals, only medts which you

mentioned, there are a lot of them, they have their own nuances and fundamental disagreements, for us it is of course a problem, as they say, we have a problem, until the election of a new speaker, no laws will be voted on, if there was mccarthy, it would be possible to vote on our assistance by a separate law, and 100% of the votes for this were found, now we have to wait for the new speaker and the election process, we will see, but it can be quite and quite interesting, secondly, after that it will be necessary to move on... actually to the budget, since 45 days is very and it will end very quickly, the question is how we will be act tactically, will the aid to ukraine be included in the general budget, or will it be passed by a separate law, i am sure that

it will pass, i do not see any fundamental risks today that we will not receive it, we must be frank, we are equal, each subsequent ... a large aid package can be more complicated, more complicated in that among republicans, also democrats , but very briefly, but among republicans there are more and more opinions, and what is it for, what is the strategy, how is the aid used, is used this is the republican favorite...accountability, in fact the democrats had and have their calculation, they want to weaken the radical wing of the republicans, if they succeed , although it is a difficult strategy, risky with higher rates, it will actually

indirectly work in our favor, but i've always emphasized, and now i'm very...uh, so enthusiastic about saying that we critically need bipartisan support, we need both democrats and republicans, and it's not just about guns, it's not just about money, it's specifically about any votes regarding the security system for ukraine, whether it is bilateral guarantees, whether it is nato, that is why for us it is a critical story, and all that mess, and i would use exactly such a word and what is happening there, it is generally not in our favor, i don’t see any catastrophe here, but there are risks, we need to go through them , and in general, in the states, internal politics begins

not just to take foreign politics hostage, but to destroy it in many ways, i don’t see any there are still issues in foreign policy that have a bipartisan consensus, well, for sure china, it is very important for us to remain here as such an issue that has such a... bipartisan support, if you will, this is the number one task in the states. well, mr. pavle, the removal of mccarthy is, in principle, the third person in the state, after the president, the vice president of the united states of america, the position of the speaker of the house of representatives, nevertheless, a sufficiently influential position that allows you to rule america, that is, three people can rule... america, that is, three high-ranking officials, can this

story with mccarthy be considered a prologue to the presidential one, election campaign, which is actually already starting, you said that the democrats in this situation also played against bacarti, although it seemed to me that in this situation there are probably not two forces already in congress, but three, because there are republicans, there are democrats and there are... well, conditional trumpists, people who are more radical in the republican party against ukraine, and they also play an important role in voting, including in the discussion of future financial assistance to ukraine, it is clear that without american aid, at the level at which you and we received it during the last year and a half, it will obviously be very difficult for us, because the americans and their aid are a certain marker, well, in the world, except for the british, they are not a marker,

because great britain showed is far better off in its current situation than the united states of america, no wonder. but how will the election campaign affect the course of the russian-ukrainian war and the help that we are counting on from the united states of america, or in principle, over the course of year with some er, we will face obstacles, but they will be solved, because this issue is not only ukraine, i mean the war with the russian federation, they will be solved, i am sure of it, er, let's see, even school arithmetic, for a month we have recently received 2.7, 2.8 billion, this is military aid, and of course it is critical for us, it is obvious that we can hold on without american aid, but

to win without american aid, it is critically difficult to move forward, we need it , it is needed not only with weapons, it is needed in other ways as well, after all, it is also training, and logistics and many other things, the campaign will affect everything that is happening around us, it is very important that we do not allow such a spread of attitudes, i i wouldn't say anti-ukrainian, but none the less indifferent to ukraine, from this very narrow environment, i wouldn't call it classic trumpists, because there are trumpists in the congress among the republicans, who are quite consistent. stand for our help, but there are about 25 people, among them

here are six, well some say six, some say eight, those who are intransigent, and plus or minus 25, those who are very skeptical, but i hear voices among other congressmen who say, well, yes, but of course, but where is the strategy, and this strategy for the americans must be... still limited in time and resources, and it must be convincing to them, one that will convince them again that we are capable of success, and our success is important to them, remember afghanistan, what happened there, but nevertheless, the further the campaign will go, the more there will be an attempt to say, yes, of course, it is important for us there, we have sympathy for ukrainians, but nevertheless, what about our

emigration, what about crime, and what about those economic problems that are important to everyone, and on the one hand, it is easier to reach those who are in big cities , although this is also such a very, very creative and difficult story, but how to reach classic voters who live outside the boundaries of big cities, there on farms and so on, and here we have to build such a strategy of persuasion. efforts to reach engage our the community is there so that they speak right there and with those where needed, maybe somewhere in churches, maybe in schools, that is, there are just some means of social networks and artificial intelligence, they are

of course useful, but they will not work, we should do the same in the european union accession negotiations are starting there, and it is very important for us, against the background of such difficult, i would say phenomenally difficult negotiations, to maintain a positive emotion regarding ukraine, therefore for the entire election campaign and in general for maimon's perspective, in the end, although this not only requires human, intellectual, financial, resources, but still trying to reach americans, europeans , see what is happening in slovakia, there, and sometimes in other countries, this is not a trivial task at all, but we have no other way out.

well, by the way, uh, biden is trying to reassure all his partners and allies, because yesterday he had a telephone conversation with, the leaders of the countries that are part of nato, and that are part of the conditional pool of the anti-putin coalition, and john kirby, the spokesman of the white house with of national security, assured that the president confirms the firm commitment of the united states of america to support ukraine. let's hear what kirby had to say. the president reaffirmed the united states' strong commitment to ukraine is in its defense for as long as it takes, just like all the other leaders who participated in the phone conversation. the leaders discussed efforts aimed at continuing to provide ukraine with ammunition and weapons systems necessary to defend its territory, as well as continuing to strengthen ukrainian air defenses, as it is preparing for new attacks on critical infrastructure facilities. definitely

now, but also definitely in the coming winter months. parallel to this, as the event unfolds in the congress of the united states of america, the president of mexico, andres manuel lopez abrador, stated that military aid to ukraine from the united states of america is irrational. he stepped up criticism of the military action, calling on washington to allocate more resources to aid latin american countries to ease migration. pressure, well, that's what you were talking about, that y there will always be people in the world who will criticize this great help that we will really receive from the united states of america, but we can remember how other world leaders are hindered by russia's war against ukraine, how they are trying to somehow solve all their affairs,

the mexican president, polish farmers, hungarian bankers, say that their otp bank is not a sponsor of terrorism, although it operates on the territory of the russian federation, are you watching, mr. pavle, how the world is trying, well, i would say, to devalue the victory of the ukrainian people in the fight against russia and to shift the emphasis from what is happening in our country on the russian-ukrainian front to some of their everyday problems, as the president of mexico once said, listen, why are you giving them so much money , give us more money and then everything will be fine in mexico and in general on the borders with the united states of america, devolve, probably not, that's, that's not what i see, but trying to disperse efforts, see what's there, what

's to the left, to the right, and even in international sense. everyone looks at the map of africa and thinks, will there not be a coup in some other country that is happening in latin america, where there are these immigration flows through central america and mexico, and then this is one of the most critical issues, for the republicans and for the democrats , finally, something is happening around china, in january there will be a presidential speech regarding taiwan, this is both psychologically and politically, what i see, what, today there is a real threat. not trying to help ukraine less, but still to disrupt efforts, there is an element and fatigue, there is also habituation, there is, as

in ukrainian society itself , there is nothing strange here, and that is why i say that to perceive the current level of aid, the current level of concentration on ukraine, as a certain distance, which will always be with us, it's not us... we can, we have to explain, and not only emotionally , because the time of emotions is gradually, gradually the idea of ​​speaking at the level of arguments, very difficult arguments and saying that ukraine is, this is their interest as well , ukraine as part of the event, a ukraine that assumes part of the risks, a ukraine that is predictable, a ukraine that is democratic, this is actually the success of the west, well, in the non-western world, advancing our interests,

as you well know, is very, very difficult, this world is not black and white, as it is for us, there is victory, betrayal, white, black, this world is his own, and you can certainly talk to many africans about what we are now... feeling, what sufferings, what trials we are going through, but they are in response you will be told about your own in recent decades, and this is also what which we must not forget, this is a serious story, and we have no guarantee that some other challenges that may arise there in the coming months will not also reflect the world's attention, it may be navapan. it could be a conflict in the pacific ocean, near there from asia, it could be something around the near

east, and it is very important for us that europe understands, the defense of ukraine, defense in every sense, and our european integration, our euro-atlantic integration, this is vitally important for europe, there is actually a very interesting trend in europe right now, they are beginning to understand that our membership in nato is more important for them than for the states, since no one can guarantee what will happen politically in the states, who will be the president, who will be the congress, we can already see it, and we can also see that just a commitment with military and financial aid are by no means guaranteed by anything , a new political... reality is coming, they are being destroyed or postponed, therefore guarantees are guarantees, obligations are obligations, this is a very, very serious

story, but not less, i repeat, support for the event for us, as we strive to become part of the event, it is absolutely critical, this is the number one issue, and not only at the level of politicians, businesses, journalists, it should be... support, people have, should keep this emotion in relation to ukraine and the understanding that defending ukraine is actually protect yourself, it can be explained differently to everyone, but here we should not rest our hands. against this background, mr. pavle, a statement was made by the head of the nato military committee , admiral rob bauer, who spoke at the warsaw security forum, he said that the western military is running out of ammunition for ukraine, he said that

nato countries are running out of stocks, that is why the military industry must increase the pace of production and must do it faster, the admiral said, and added that the bottom of the barrel is already visible, something similar with reference to unnamed officials of great britain, deyali telegraph also wrote yesterday. they talked about the fact that the british also have resources, but they are not infinite either. how, how can one explain this situation with the resources of nato member countries, including great britain with an endless bottom in the russian federation, because despite all the sanctions, despite the warnings from the western countries and despite all the restrictions, they... declare that in 2024 they will increase the production of weapons there by 30 or 40% and

moreover, everything that they threw into other spheres of the economy, they will now throw into the military-industrial complex, into what , in your opinion, the world should do in this situation, so that the pace of, i don’t know if it is correct to say, races, arms race, because we see, in principle, capacity building one side of the civilized world and the other side, well, conventional asia, russian asia. relatively speaking, uh, i, how to get out of this situation and how to balance this imbalance, which obviously arose because of the fact that russia was preparing for war with ukraine for 20 years, and the west was not preparing for such a war, such intensity of ukraine and russia . to create incentives for increasing military production both for us

and for ourselves. in the west, there is no political will and public support, even to cleanly transform the economy into a military one reiki, no one wants this, since it is unpopular, so it is necessary to create incentives and give prospective orders to companies that can and should produce faster and better, and here there are... several dimensions, well , of course, it is possible to produce better and faster patriots , but it takes time and real time, but why can't we get munitions production up there sooner, and now 19 months into the war, these are the questions western politicians and militaries need to ask themselves when they look in the mirror. it was

obvious that firepower was critical for this war, on the one hand, it is the first war of the 21st century with drones, software, other information sharing, but on the other hand, the last war of the 20th century with fire duels and so on, so it is much faster to produce, so you can, but what i i hear, there in that... europe, there are endless complex conversations about whether the habit of increasing production will not be perceived in russia, and most importantly in china, also as the beginning of an arms race, they think about the global world, and unfortunately, not only about us, and secondly, there is no political will

use other financial resources, and there is no need here... to transfer to military rails, you just need to say that there will be orders for the next few years, not for two or three, but at least for 8-10, that new weapons need to be produced, what needs to be done it's now, and it needs to be done in perspective, and the fact that 19 months of endless talk about it continues, and someone says that there is something, that... there is something, there is something, it's actually kind of completely sad and bad history, and actually you have to ask yourself why things like the production of munitions are not happening, the european union said that it would supply us with a million shells, production is difficult now, but nevertheless, they promise to dispute this in the first half of the 24th year.

i believe that if the measure is serious, in terms of what it has, if necessary, of course, to withstand any war, of any complexity, duration, with key players, well, not only russia, but also china, it has absolutely qualitatively change the approach to the ordering, development, production of weapons, it has not been done yet, this mental suf, it has not yet taken place in the west, and it is sad, i mentioned the sanctions that are being introduced against the russian federation, we are constantly talking about the sanctions that are being introduced against russia , the sanctions policy was quite active in the 22nd year, in the 23rd this sanctions policy is also continuing, and we see how it is now possible not ...