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the program verdict by serhii rudenko, from monday to friday at 20:00, repeat at 12:10. welcome to the espresso channel, one war, different theaters of action , this assessment in the context of our war with the russian federation sounded against the background of the events that are currently unfolding around israel, but it is quite likely that this is not the last escalation and not the last war that will shake other countries of the world. such a conclusion

has already been made by a number of international analysts structures and to them, by the way, were added the statements of the head of the main intelligence department of the ministry of defense of ukraine, kyryl budanov, who stated that now we see several conflicts that at first glance seem regional, but they are all connected to each other and the same by those countries that are involved in these processes, so according to his objective, or rather subjective assessments, we are approaching a global war rather quickly. what do such conclusions or forecasts regarding a global or world war mean primarily for ukraine, and why? it is necessary to prepare for what will change and what priorities should be determined by ukraine itself and its partners in these conditions. we will talk about this with our leading experts in the next issue of our military program. my name is serhiy sgurets, i am the director

of the information and consulting company defense express, which, together with spresso channels, strives to cover the most relevant trends and events in the security and military environment. and now he joins us. anton mikhnenko, expert in security and defense technologies. mr. anton, i am glad welcome, see and hear on the air. greetings, mr. serhiy, glad to see you. first of all, i would like to ask you whether you personally agree with the conclusions of the same kirill budanov and other experts that we are already approaching a global or world war so rapidly, and then what points of tension may arise if, in addition to our war with will such other directions or sources of opposition appear in russia and where can they be? in principle, if we simply paint the current picture that we have now in the current situation, because we have a war in ukraine, the aggravation of the territory of israel, we have those,

we see the ambitions that china has today, in relation to taiwan, what is the relationship between the united states and china now, and in general. we see the situation that is happening in africa, which is the influx of refugees now from the side of africa, directly on the territory of europe, that is, in general, we see such a general picture that can give the impression that the world is really approaching a global war, let's say so, but however, i would be more optimistic, aggravation in one or another region of the world always happened, there was an escalation in israel, and the war also happened in israel not for the first time, it also happened in other regions of the world, but i would not dramatize and draw such concrete conclusions from the fact that there will be a global war. nevertheless, the signs that the aggravation of such a general security situation in the world definitely exist, there are certainly risks, and there are risks that could lead to such a serious, let's say, including a global war, but let's hope

, nevertheless, that this will not happen, and that will be enough tolerance and consideration of the politicians of the military and political leadership of the united states, china and other countries in order to prevent such a global war from happening . they are listening to moscow in one or another tension zone , but when we mention the situation in crimea there, remember, they captured crimea, then they start the 15th year, the enemies start hostilities in syria, they start a war in syria, which distracts attention world community, then this flow of refugees to europe is formed. which also forces the europeans to look at their internal problems, unexpectedly , which they have on their own turf, and then the question arises, do you see any, do you see any such unmasking signs that say that in fact russia is involved

to the situation there and around israel and in other regions of the world, some such markers that cannot be ignored, if frankly, then of course, ears are pricking, ears are pricking, i think they will meet it, they are in moscow, and if just again if you paid attention, pay attention to the situation in israel, then of course, pay attention to who benefits from it? who benefits from the aggravation of this situation, what is the reaction of the russian federation to the current moment in relation to the events in israel, or has the attention of the world community switched from ukraine, from ukraine to israel, if we simply find the answer to these questions, then we can see, indeed, now the world community will focus all its attention on israel, the world community has moved the issue of ukraine a little, in the world media in reuters, bbc, cnn, i constantly depict the current situation in the gas sector, the reaction of the russian federation, we see that they are basically undermining to

a greater and greater extent officially declaring that let the parties find a common language between israel and the palestinians so that there is no such confrontation , but unofficially we see how russian propagandists portray the situation in israel, how they portray israel itself in a negative light, and therefore we understand what moscow really is in this context. they distracted, they except that they diverted attention, they are trying to spread their own narratives at the expense of these events taking place in israel, its key narrative in the media space is that ukraine allegedly sells weapons on the territory of israel , and thus influence the position of the world community so that our partners are more scrupulous looked at ukraine in the context of the provision of weapons, perhaps even limited the provision of weapons, and these are again the steps of the russian federation towards... to drive a wedge in the relations between our western partners and ukraine, opportunities to get

ukraine received weapons and military equipment from its partners, and all of this just shows that the russian federation is listening, and it is not bad, about how they use drivers in israel, by the way, no, not only these examples of connected with the fact that they began to transfer the weapons that were captured in ukraine in order to create these media companies, to make it difficult to supply already european or american weapons, budanov, there were two more interesting fragments, he spoke about the fact that on the territory lebanon this sputnik radio station just started working, in arabic with such a russian narrative, and what, the second thing that really interested me there, is that on the 24th, september, the russian space apparatus there, which carries out radio reconnaissance, interception of satellites, satellites signals, was also moved to another orbit, just in case, the zone of israel fell into the zone of operation of this russian satellite, that is, in fact , we can say that they knew,

prepared and provided assistance not at all to israel, but to those countries that started well, these actions with the attack by hamas on israel, but, but i would like to ask whether we can expect risks for european countries now, because literally yesterday or the day before yesterday there was information about what exactly was going to be disturbed. and gas pipelines and cable networks between estonia and finland, that is, this is another example , which can also be said to have hardly happened without russian participation, your assessment of this case and what threats to europe may exist now from actions that russia can provoke among nato countries, interesting question, in fact, we just have to understand and everyone , and the partners also understand this, the russian federation is used to acting asymmetrically, if they fail to act head-on, fail

to achieve their own goals at the expense of there military capabilities, they cannot win on the battlefield, and we see that they cannot do this, they try to act asymmetrically, using various monetary opportunities, gas blackmail, we know very well how they used, if recently in the past, the creation of certain foci around the world, the aggravation of relations on... let's say the relations of the united states or european partners with other countries , in africa, in asia and so on, that is, they are trying to kindle this fire of danger, to create this global war, in order to the whole world is threatened, let's say, with such a global confrontation, and against the background of this confrontation, they are trying to find their own capabilities in order to achieve their own goals, this is a tactic, strategy, you can call it whatever you want, but these are the actions of the russian federation, which traditional, and i see that the europeans understand this very well, we understand this very well, and for what, and the key question,

what to prepare for in the future, of course, it is necessary for the europeans to monitor those opportunities and those, let's say, threads that still remain in europe's relations with the russian federation, in europe's relations with african countries, in europe's relations with asian regions, because where there were areas of interest, let's say, european countries in africa, we know the situation... in small by the way, a vivid example , there are dangerous moments that they will think, try to fan these fire positions, fire points around the world and thus distract the attention of the europeans, who believed that these regions were like, let's say, or in partnership relations, or were ready to develop in the future so that they look at the europeans in a different way, that is, the main task of the russian federation now is to destabilize the world, they are oriented towards this , we have to understand all this very well, i think that the europeans also understand and see this, and eyes

things that are happening on the border of finland, estonia, on the border of finland and the russian federation, they will continue to move, russia will try to provoke, take actions in order to divert attention at the global level, we see how they generally do in ukraine , if we simply analyze the front line, how ukraine opposes the russian federation, we know that we are advancing in the south, russia at one time tries to attack in the kupinsky direction, thus acting asymmetrically, yes she herself is trying to act in the south, also to divert our forces and means , that is, this is a typical russian federation way of acting in relations or in general in the conduct of hostilities, and we have to get used to it, mr. anton. said, predicted and desired actions on the part of european countries, then the question arises, what should be the strategy of the ukrainian side, because as we see, threats are growing, the possibility of scaling military conflicts is increasing, the focus of attention of our partners may be distracted, then the question arises, which

priorities in these conditions should be formed by ukraine in relations with its partners, and it is possible to resort to some measures of its own direction, which would not depend on what wishes or visions our partners will have there, well, by the way, you raised a very important question and a very relevant question , because to live constantly, let’s say, on a needle from our partners in the context of arming military equipment, we cannot be like this constantly , and the partners also perfectly understand that they have their own interests, their own opportunities, and they must also close their own needs, and therefore in ukraine it is very important and very relevant for ukraine, this is the development of the defense-industrial complex, separately. in general, the security and defense sector, if we just talk about the defense-industrial complex, then this is production and try to move as much as possible in the direction that we should be minimally dependent on partners for key models of military equipment, okay, we get like 16 there, but we must understand that service, repair, equipment, we can do in ukraine, if we are talking about

ammunition of different calibers, then of course again, a relevant and important issue is the creation of the entire line of ammunition that will be manufactured in ukraine. or in neighboring countries, or by creation, through the creation of separate enterprises or joint enterprises, or the creation of separate enterprises on the territory of ukraine, or outside its borders, we must equip our capabilities to the maximum, and this is very urgent, you see how the situation with israel is, when all the pundits started talking about how the united states would divert attention to israel, they wouldn't be able to to provide arms to both countries, and the united states officially had to make an official statement, to say that we are able to help both israel and ukraine, but nevertheless, the precedent itself is evidence that we should pay attention to this, we should prepare for that at any moment it may happen in such a way that the united states will have its own needs, and we understand what they may arise and how in which region of the world, and we should prepare for this yesterday, as they say, not no no tomorrow, not the day after tomorrow, already yesterday, it is good

that within the framework of ramsteim, which was held recently, the question of strengthening ukraine's capacity was raised. precisely under this issue is hidden the aspect of strengthening defense and industrial capabilities, so that we can manufacture the left part of armed military equipment in ukraine to equip our defense forces. mr. anton, you have close contacts with various enterprises of our defense industry, you also have contacts with foreign companies that are already working on our market or trying to cooperate, which specific problems or areas require such special attention from our bodies. authorities, the ministry of defense, so that this short-term or long-term efficiency was the most productive, what prevents us from working even more efficiently than we have been working up to now? look, in fact, we have a key point, well, two, several key points, let's say this, is the defense industry, we know very well that in ukraine it is still divided into

private and state segments, if the private segment , in principle, it tries to develop independently, including by developing its own capabilities, both on its own... forces and in partnership with other countries, there are a number of private companies in ukraine that already have and agreements and memoranda regarding cooperation with partners abroad, this greatly strengthens the capabilities of our defense-industrial complex. the second point, the cooperation of the private sector, the defense sector in ukraine with foreign companies, again, the private sector is flexible enough, and it is able, in particular, to adapt to the repair of the military equipment that is supplied to us by our partners, the same, for example , radio-electronic intelligence equipment, radio-electronic warfare equipment, equipment, other military equipment, the same art artillery, rockets for the repair of this equipment - this can also be a key part, which should be directed to both the public and private sectors, of course, but the creation of conditions at the legislative level so that these enterprises effectively

worked, this is a very important moment, because with the private sector, it is easier for foreigners to find a common language, it is easier to develop, if we talk about the state segment, we have been talking about the reform of koroborprom for many years, its shareholding, yes, a certain process has begun, but again after all, it takes a long time. the public sector must be joint-stock, there must be a joint-stock company, we must allow the opportunity for our foreign partners to become, can buy a share of these joint-stock companies of the public segment, in order to appeared, appeared internal funds that could be invested in the development, production and in the development of the creation of new models of military equipment, that is, the process, if you simply sum up the process of updating the state defense sector. of the industrial complex, it is very relevant and still remains, and we have to bring it quickly enough, let's say at a time that satisfied our partners and was flexible enough for the state itself, because this is

a sufficiently large potential that is not fully used yet, regarding the creation of joint enterprises for the state segment, the same issue has been discussed many times so that our state enterprises have the opportunity to create joint ventures with foreign companies, again the process of shareholding here rests on one such key point . this is again the creation of a corporation, joint stock companies, and this has to be moved from the point where it 's happening now, it's happening but slowly, it needs to be accelerated, again, if you're talking about regulation, it is certainly precisely the creation of joint ventures with foreign partners, the creation of the most adaptive conditions for making investments, the protection of these investments, the verification of control over these investments so that they are directed directly to the creation of new models. military equipment, that is, there are certain problems, and i see that they are moving, but again , the movements should be much faster,

but i listened to you carefully, i had this question during the course of the question, we are talking about the mechanisms of a correct market economy, to which they are accustomed our foreign partners, and now we take our reality, combat operations, the need for armed forces , and the feeling that it is possible, on the contrary , a rigid management system in the format of... a military economy, which has not yet started in our country, could be more productive, these two reality, can they really be combined in ukraine, because one option is market, the other, let's say, rigid management, which is more effective in your opinion, where should we put the main emphasis now, a difficult question, you know, but nevertheless , i am more of a supporter of the market, i am more a supporter of the market, because the market dictates, and the market definitely, and now we are in conditions of war, and definitely, look, the private sector, i will give you a vivid example, some private sector enterprises that were engaged in one direction, now in these conditions are engaged in a completely different direction

and foreign partners are primarily in contact with them, conditionally speaking, there are m-113 armored personnel carriers, which the partners there handed over to us, there is a private sector that has already been adamant enough to repair and already foreigners, the same americans agree to that in this to provide the private sector with opportunities to develop, these private companies will continue to produce... these american machines , and what do we say about the state segment, the state segment is currently more focused on the repair and restoration of that military equipment, there is the ministry of defense of soviet production, which was modernized during the time of ukraine, but what to say about foreign samples, what to say about those samples that are supplied to us by private companies, here is another point, and so you raised an important , topical issue regarding that a rigid vertical is needed, but a rigid vertical in the conditions of war is needed ... in order for it to regulate the rules of the game and the rules of the game in the market and these rules of the game are observed by both the state and private segments, and a rigid vertical, okay, tomorrow

we make tanks under 50 tanks, everything is going forward, everyone is working, no one else cares, this is a completely different thing, it works differently in life, as they say, it seems to us that this is how the state knows that it needs 50 tanks, 100 bmp, 100 artillery systems, artillery systems, 300 rocket systems with fire reserves, this is the state defense order, okay go ahead. we work, this and that enterprise will perform, and why, perhaps one of these enterprises will perform better than another enterprise, the main thing for the state is to create conditions for this market to be regulated independently, the state has the rest finally adopt a normal program for the development of armed military equipment so that everyone in ukraine and abroad understands that, okay, in ukraine, even though it is fighting, in three years it wants to switch completely to leopard 2 tanks, okay, we want, we want in 5 years to come fully f16, well , we will go on a ride, who will repair which state defense order, from here the state must specifically, clearly say and control, so that it is followed and carried out for several

years to come, not two or three. steps for many more years, because this is an important moment from the point of view of control, in conditions of war, that is, in fact , we have to talk about the fact that despite the conditions of war, we have to introduce market mechanisms that will be understandable to europeans, if if we are talking about what we have to buy 1,000 new bmps, so we have announce a tender, determine the price parameters of this tender, invite potential partners, and then under normal market tender conditions to start creating our new component of our defense industry for the production of bmps, this is how it looks, if we don't do it, look, we just don't care we will come to this , we will come to this anyway, we have identified ourselves with the western community, the western community works and acts according to its own rules, which are defined there, and sooner or later, we are not there we struggled, argued, but sooner or later we will be forced to borrow the mechanisms that exist there, and sooner or later we will play

by these rules. they are transparent enough, but we can not say, let's say, an open tender, we can close, make this tender closed, but we just have to decide, okay, guys, we have the rules of the game, we accept these rules of the game, we act within the framework of these the rules of the game, we will try to adhere to them, but remember, we have a war, we will be tougher, more specific and are more demanding that all this be observed both by our partners and by us, and this is one point, another point is that transparency is important for our partners, because the russian federation, using its narratives, will constantly say that ukraine a corrupt country, everything is stolen there that ukraine resells, and the more we are transparent to our partners, the more i emphasize to our partners, it is not necessary to be transparent to the russian federation, there is no need to be at all, i say about our partners, the more we will inspire confidence in our partners, now we are

emotionally. we are in theirs, in their consciousness, we still have to practically prove that we are in their consciousness. mr. anton, thank you very much for your professional comments, i hope that these approaches are connected with a combination of market conditions and war conditions, after all, we will be balanced in the decisions of our authorities, i will remind our viewers that my interlocutor was anton mikhnenko, a military expert on security and technology issues. and then we will continue ours program after a short informational... pause and we will talk about what other conclusions we have to draw from the hostilities in israel, which are extremely useful for strengthening our defense and military potential, about this in a few minutes. the roof is a project about the feeling of home, about our roots, about identity. this child was building. behind us is my great-great-grandfather's house. what does old ukrainian architecture mean to us

today? good architecture is not necessarily made with the participation of an architect. churches, mills, houses, mazankas, from us depends on whether these spores will slowly fade into oblivion. the wooden church is a phenomenon, indeed, in the all-ukrainian village, it is still alive. will we still preserve our past? there is legislation, why does it not work? we have a democracy where people do what they want. ukrainian culture. about ukrainian folk. architecture, its features and ways of salvation in the documentary cycle from the roof project. on saturday at 11:15 at espresso. vasyl winter's big broadcast. my name is winter. two hours of airtime, two hours of your time, we will talk about the most important things. for two hours to learn about the war, serhiy ezgurets joins our broadcast, the military results of the day, and what

the world lives by. there, yuriy fizel will talk about the world for two hours to keep up with economic news, i will hand over the floor to oleksandr morchevka, he will talk about the economy during the war and sports news. evgeny pastukhov is ready to talk about sports. two hours in the company of favorite presenters. lina cheshenina is ready to talk about culture during the war. there are many presenters became like relatives. maybe the weather will at least give us some optimism, mrs. natalka didenko is ready to tell us. and also distinguished guests of the studio. we will have volodymyr ogryzko today. everything will be fine. events of the day in two hours. big broadcast of vasyl zima, a project for intelligent and caring people. espresso in the evening.