[000:00:00;00] 10-12 kilometers to the right of us, and now our focus is on the fact that one of the arteries of supply, equipment and personnel movement to avdiivka, this is it, 5-6 km deep from us, right in front of our lane, this artery passes, therefore, the maximum focus on defeating the enemy's equipment and fighting, fighting their rebs, and so on, because when they began to move equipment and personnel towards avdiyivka, a week ago, they very seriously reinforced their rebs and fired in our direction so that we could not let's put it this way, it's easy, without difficulties, to conduct development there, in principle, you conduct reconnaissance, that's why i say our focus on the artery of supplies, the equipment of our warehouse on the side of avdiivka, avdiivka is really close, i understand that you also receive news from there, they say about the fact that the russians have huge losses in these attempts to surround avdiivka, but not easily, probably also to our

defenders, well, for me. and a personal story, three days ago my brother-in-law was wounded under the avdiivka and he is now in the hospital in cherkasy, i wish him the speediest brave i know that he lost one of his brothers in that battle. and you know, unfortunately, even when they say that the enemy has very heavy losses and our boys are standing firm, it is true, the boys are standing firm, i communicate every day with my comrades from avdiivka and i can tell you that even though we are standing strong, unfortunately, there are also losses on our side, but what we can see, we have some positions from where we raise the diverging popalas and share streams precisely with the boys from avdiivka, because we you can say at least 10 kilometers, but we are also one of the flanks from where the enemy approaches them, and in the same vpla, i can 200% confirm what you say, the enemy suffered huge losses, the first three days, these were losses prostan, if i could demonstrate, i would

show you those records. with reconnaissance ppla, which i saw myself, sending three times, there personally what i saw, sending three times in order to seize the height there on the tericon 20-25 people, which our, which our guys just simply destroyed in the shit, well i do not know how you need not to spare your personnel and what you need to count on, that is, for the last two or three days, the density has dropped a little, and the number of assaults has dropped, this, i have information from the words of my comrades, the brigade standing there is defending our flank as well the density of shelling there and on us has dropped a little, but whether it is preparation for a new assault, or whether they have simply exhausted their human resources there, it is difficult for me to say today. well , this is, after all, a terekon, the one you are talking about now, as i understand the storming of this terekon i also read a lot about this, that elite parts were actually thrown there, and they were thrown just like meat, they were thrown just like meat, they rose up and stayed there, i can only

confirm your words, this is what we observe and we are for all our troubles and what i hear from the guys who, thank god, are alive , and are still holding the defense on avdiivka itself, that the equipment, that human lives have been destroyed there, well , it’s just not an unrealistic number, i’ll tell you this, there for a year and a half i'm in pixel, a little less than a year, i'm at the front, ee similar similar negligence, there negligence from the point of view of not appreciating one's personnel, i have not yet seen such examples, i have heard about them, but personally i have not yet seen that , just on the run there, i would say 20, 30 people left, they were destroyed, i only heard such from the comrades who were there and held the defense of bakhmut, when the wagnerites were also running there in droves, they were just being shot there from high-rise buildings, and i heard, but did not see, i say, that on avdiivka, that is, you know it, something similar to that, in i have two guesses as to why, why they are doing this, or they just want to create some kind of precedent for an offensive

to avdiivka, so that our, our command could not pull the troops to the directions where they broke through, where our guys, first of all , have the initiative, and secondly, they have positional successes there, the second, the second story, maybe it's just some kind of the product is being prepared for sale on the domestic information market there, so that once the sensational bakhmut was there, now there will be some sensational audio girl, but from what exists today, nothing successful, except for the morgues and hospitals that were clogged in donetsk, they did not get, well after all, one of of the dangers that our expert is talking about today is that the widow does not turn into, relatively speaking, a second bakhmud , as butusov, a well-known journalist , a military man who writes about that, a military man, more precisely, who writes about what don't sing songs about the avdiyivka fortress later, we need to take care of the defense now, look, i agree with him 200%, but let's distinguish a little bahmud

zavdiyivka for one reason, and avdiyivka hasn't quieted down since the 14th year no per day, maybe there were days when there was less clothing, but the avdiivska promka, famously known, is heard about and heard and known. all, since the 14th year, the fortifications of our boys in avdiivka are much larger, better quality, and the positions are much more protected and fortified than, for example, what our boys received and managed to do in bakhmuti, i do not take anything away, therefore what the enemy has, let's say it like it is, the enemy has no shortage of anti-aircraft missiles, the enemy has equipment, planes, art, they really melt concrete, but it's one thing to float concrete and knock our guys out of it, another the matter of entering bakhmut, he was actually trained there two to three months before the squalls and assaults began on him there, that’s why i say, avdiivka and bakhmut are slightly different substances, but there are all chances to turn into bakhmut there, not from the point of view of occupation

, and from the point of view of the destruction of the city, the way they messed it up there and throw it with artillery, i 200% agree with mr. botusov , unfortunately, the enemy has long had a tactic of simply wiping cities off the face of the earth, well, for you, as for the people who are standing nearby, and that is, audiophile is strategic, strategic it is important for us, for defense, and i will tell you, it was clear to me after bakhmut, because near bakhmut last year the enemy concentrated a very large group of troops, which, why they had plans to capture it by december 31, if you remember, you will remember bahmud, such a large group would not be able to spend the winter in the fields, in the villages, because our reconnaissance would have found them and the artillery would have simply wiped out and destroyed them, so it was very important for them, in order to maintain their offensive potential there, to enter the city, even if part of the city, it is clear that there is a place it is much easier to defend in the fields than in some villages, so why they tried so hard and rushed to capture bakhmut

, it was clear to me, after avdiivka, even taking into account what i am saying, i have been there for a year and a half in the pixel, a little less than a year on front, well, it’s hard for me to say, i don’t have enough experience or really no good reason to like avdiivka except... to check some kind of box for myself and report to my society that here is our avdiivka, i don’t see it, that is, to me it is not clear how avdiivka is important, and from what point sight, yes, avdiyivka is a kind of entrance gate to donetsk, but this entrance gate to donetsk, it has been burning since the 14th year, why now, well, i say, it is difficult for me, i can make assumptions, but to say there is 200% , something like that, it is very difficult for me, well, 20 km to the center of donetsk, tavdiyvka, everything, that is, it is, well, any gavbytsa reaches. i also ask about the successful mine attack of atacoms last day, that is, we have exact confirmation that they are already in service, we see that they are destroying helicopters, well primarily for helicopters, probably this will be applied, which have a limited

radius of action anyway and they will obviously have to move their helicopter bases to a further distance, for you , how relevant it is, it doesn’t matter at all, how inspiring an event it is, but that’s exactly what i wanted to tell you in the context of an inspiring event, you know, when questions are raised very strongly in society about, you know, what narratives are heating up, that the west is tired, that someone somewhere wants to cut us help and so on and so on, every story there two months ago or three months ago with the transfer of cluster munitions to us yesterday by the atakams, first, strategically and tactically, we understand that we can hit the airfield at a depth of 300 km there you must have read it, they themselves wrote yesterday that it was during the svo that it was not the biggest there, not the biggest impression, this is the first, second, from the point of view, it inspires every time and cassettes, and atakams, and planes there f16 to us, this signals, support signals and signals that

simply strike out all these theses that someone is tired of helping us, there is a position of the official representatives of the coalition states, which is helping there, and their position is that we will help ukraine for as long as possible... only it will be necessary, that's why i say, every, well, every position, what is happening with the zataks themselves, i mean, with the cassettes, through with the f16, it simply confirms and erases all kinds of gossip about the fact that someone there is tired, and you understand, the spirit of the fighters also falls a little, those who doesn't follow the information space very much, but you know, i heard a thesis there about that the west is going to cut aid, and the boys understand that little by little health is also running out. and the guys themselves, of course, it can't help but be upset there, that's why i say, they pay attention to it, and such signals, they are needed, and signals from the point of view of what we have, and signals from the point of view of hitting, because we know for sure that the enemy is not on their own land, and without logistics, if we are going to cut off the main arteries there and the like, like

yesterday, the airfields, well, for us this is a very important story, important because it is easier for us to deal with them to fight, actually it's a normal reaction to get tired and i could ask myself if i'm getting tired, but because almost every day and 5 hours, 6 hours of straight itru, but i want to say that last week we talked about this topic with oleksandr yavchanka, a person who went to the front as a volunteer to fight in the davinci wolves and is now being treated after the third wound and he said a very simple phrase that only a person who is on the front line can say that i am tired, and i think that this there is an axiom that does not need proof, which is simply necessary for such as a motto for every ukrainian who is in this country now, mr. yevgeny, are you not tired, do you have enough strength?

listen, i'll tell you, fatigue is such a substance, if i start thinking about it today and spend an hour thinking about being tired, then tomorrow i'll have a bunch of thoughts, how to write off, or against communication, or another story , in relation to what you are saying, are you not tired, about four months ago, in addition to the position that i hold, which is the commander of the rifle division, i was also appointed as the spokesperson of the battalion, i would very well, i also often communicate with you, with your colleagues, and i thought about it not so long ago, you see, you say that in the front, of course, it is very difficult to argue with this, because i myself, i stand in for the duty, i do not i am on the front line there, 30 days a month, so i have a duty schedule, i stand in, i was on duty, i came back, there are guys who are there for 20 days, but what about you, what i am thinking about , you see, conducting broadcasts, taking input from the guys from the front, this is the same as when i share with you as much as possible live emotions, what happened yesterday, the day before yesterday, you get drunk on this energy, these emotions , i also don’t really imagine how

to digest it all and convert it into something else, in order to gain the strength to move on, because compared stories are not always positive, they not always optimistic, no matter how we would like to hear, of course we try to give information there as it is, well, objectively and reject there , you know, some little things that can upset an ordinary citizen who does not really understand the war there, but i say, to miss it is also because of myself, i very much understand if your reason is also there, but i want to say that i am very grateful to you and your colleagues for giving the opportunity to implement civil society in military matters, it is very important for us too, thank you, i just thank you, well, actually, i thank you, first of all, because if it wasn't for you, we wouldn't be able to do this in principle, and your work is the most important, thank you, mr. yevgeny, thank you, have a nice day , yevhen ivliv was with us, gentlemen, we will go for a short break, and i am honestly moved. and then serhiy zures will help us to sum up certain results, in particular

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799 uah, call . every saturday the political club helps to understand the processes taking place in ukraine and the world. vitaly portnikov, host of espresso and invited experts, based on facts, give their assessment and forecast of the development of events. if you want to understand how our today will affect our tomorrow, watch the saturday political club, every saturday, on espresso. greetings, this is svoboda live, on the radio. we have already come to the snake itself. the following shots may shock you. news from the scene. live kamikaze drone attacks. political analytics objectively and meaningfully. there is no political season. exclusive interviews, reports from the hottest points

of the front. freedom life frankly and impartially. you draw your own conclusions. well, gentlemen, let's go back, ladies and gentlemen, let's go back to our conversation, and now serhiy zgores is joining us, a military expert, the director of the defense express company, mr. serhiy, good morning to you, andriy, i congratulate you, i congratulate our audience, actually, mr. sergey , well, congratulations to everyone on the successful attack , yesterday's koms, and let's talk, is this a bit of a game changer, the fact that we already have atakoms, what exactly is this modification atacoms, where they will be used, how many of them there are, i know that you have probably already sorted out all these details, well, really, we finally waited for the delivery of these missiles to ukraine and their use, we see that

all the news is about long-range missiles , but in any case, we understand that these are actually operational-tactical missiles. which have a maximum range of 300 km, that is, it is an operational-tactical level, and not a long-range one, as in particular with the same taurus missiles up to 500 km, but in any case we we understand that there is already the first use of these atakams quite successful, a significant amount of russian aviation equipment was destroyed in berdyansk, three atakams were used, we saw unique, i think it will already be a historical video, where... launches from several launch attacks on enemy the objects that valery zaluzhnyi made public, and what variations we are talking about now, indeed , this is the version, i interrupted you for a second,

the russians simply said that they fired six atakams at berdyansk and three of them were shot down by their anti-aircraft missile, and three reached and actually did damage, well, there are space e-e services that ensure the detection of strikes, so these space services just demonstrate that there were three strikes on berdyansk and actually there were three launches, because in particular, this is a ballistic missile, which is extremely difficult to destroy, because it gains the maximum height there and according to the same principle, a dagger - destroys the target with a blow from the air at a high speed, in fact there is nothing to shoot down those atacoms and they are, i think that in fact the popo system of the russians will now be under a double challenge, attack yourself first can attack, deployments of enemy pip systems, because they provide such

a significant dispersion of these submunitions over a large area, precisely these cluster munitions are used to destroy targets in open areas. it is precisely the pppo system that is in disarray, it is planes and helicopters at the airport, if we saw in berdyansk, it is manpower and so on, but still returning to the question, what we received, and there are several versions of this, at least there are 10 different versions since the 90's when these systems started being developed, the first versions they were precisely cassette-type, they have a warhead weighing somewhere under 600 kg and have a range of 165 km, that is, 160 km is not 300 km, but it is more than any other sample that is in the ukrainian army today. of such atakams in the tam39 version, this is the first version, were produced, if i am not mistaken

, 1700 pieces, of which 400 were used during the war in iraq, and the rest of the americans began to convert from a cluster warhead into a unitary warhead, so that in any in any case, we understand that the stocks of these missiles, that the versions that were given to us, and i can pour 500 plus there, but there are also other cluster attack guns in the more modern version of the m39a, which have a range of up to 300 km, which have a slightly less powerful warhead, but a longer range, so relatively speaking, these cluster attacks with a longer range were somewhere in the reserves of the american army, also under 500, so in fact we can understand that this first version is 160... it is somewhere around 500 plus and those 300 km range i think is also within 500,

but they also need certain finalization, so that in any case the stocks of these missiles are sufficient in the united states, the question is how many will be transferred there, and now we will look at the tactics of the russians, because first of all, they now have such a substantial challenge, first of all, they are under threat from all parts of the airfields that are used for strikes on our line of defense, in particular, it is with the use of helicopters, now they must be these, pull the helicopters back, change the logistics, because they have pulled everything back 100 km , all their compositions and such the other thing, now again is a challenge for rebasing, the search for a variant station, which the russians will undoubtedly do anyway, and in fact we will now have a certain period of time when russia would enter. because they will not know where such attacks can be used and the strike line is already under 150 km, and in

addition to the abrams with this range, i am still waiting for the delivery of attacks up to 300 km and the delivery of another model of these ground launch weapons small diameter bomb, that is , these bombs are launched from the same way from launch hymars at a distance of 150 km, i.e. that is, now we are actually talking about the fact that the americans, albeit belatedly , still fulfilled their obligations under political pressure there, and precisely at the moment when we will need these atakams very much, especially on the southern front. well, they're saying that there's only a few, literally, these attacks, so far, there's been some source and from washington that has said that, or that, well, that's the number that definitely matters, if we had 500 right now attacks conventionally speaking, it would, it would certainly, well, it would greatly change the situation, well, here we need to combine, conventionally speaking, the number of missiles, their range, the number

of launchers, and intelligence data, because conventionally speaking, when we are now actively using hymars, we we can see that we have already descended from the level of destruction of warehouses to the direct purpose of the hymars, the destruction of the most dangerous objects in the form of launch missiles, the saa enemy and so on, the purpose of the atakams in the format of these missiles is precisely aimed at striking first of all to airfields, to ammunition depots, to air defense systems , and i think that now, this combination, the intelligence of data, which must now be adapted to the new capabilities of the ukrainian army, will give an effect on the battlefield, and of course the question of quantity, washington or woornal wrote about a small number, well, a small number is difficult to assume, i think that

it is probably at least dozens, and now, as i understand it, they will be used quite sparingly, and this is an example of the use of the first launches of vaticams at the airfield in berdyansk shows, well, the whole thing is an absolutely correct choice, we understand what happened there , there were 20 helicopters concentrated at the airfield, according to preliminary data, about nine were destroyed or damaged . we understand that this will affect the situation on the same southern front in general, and the further selection of targets, given the limited number of attackers at the current stage, will be such a certain task: for our planners in the general staff, who think about this mission will perform quite successfully, eh, well, probably

for tactical aviation, such as there are su every 24 and so on. su-30, it, it won't be affected much by the presence of atakams, you think, but for helicopters it will definitely be affected, right? well, in fact, there is in particular such a tactical depth of placement of most airfields, base or jump airfields within 200 km of the front line, closer, a little further, that is, actually now, a certain part of russian airfields is under the influence of atakamsu with a range of 160 km. well, they fly to, in particular, and to dzhanka, where there is such a powerful russian hub, including the accumulation of helicopters and aircraft at airports in this city, so in any case we understand that of course it would be better if we received three-kilometer missiles, but now we also have more than what we had until

now, and not quite what we want to have. that is, if we receive with a range of 3-300 km, atacoms, then, in fact, this, this, this, this will significantly, this, this will significantly reduce the opportunities for then fall into the airfields where the attack aircraft, the enemy, front-line aircraft are stationed, this will actually significantly complicate the actions of the russians , because in addition to the fact that the aircraft seems to be able to have a long range, but in any case, if it rises from a distance of 500 km, 100 km from, the line of sight, this affects the fact that the time of the combat mission is significantly reduced, and we have time to detect these aircraft, so a complex of factors affects the fact that even the appearance of attack aircraft with a range of 160 km will significantly affect the behavior of the russians on line front, which we think we will see in the near future, but of course the factor of quantity always comes to the fore. well, what about

the taurus missiles, i understand that there is a reluctance, and also the reluctance of the german authorities to hand them over? well, this is a difficult question, we have come back to it more than once, we can already see that there are some polls in germany itself, which say that not all, not all germans support such a decision, i think that this is actually a mistake of germany itself. correctly convey the meaning of the transfer of these missiles to ukraine, because now ukraine is the first fork in the fight against the russian military threat, and i think that this process of pressure on the german government will be continued, especially since our minister of foreign affairs, kuliba, said that this issue is almost resolved, so i hope that precisely on the background of the supply of the atakams, there will be another attempt to convince our german partners to share the tauruses, although i will repeat that germany has recently

shown significant activity in transferring the air defense system to us, let me remind you of what they agreed and volunteered to transfer to us the patriot complex, this will be the third patriot complex, completely complete, with its own command post with its rails, eight launchers, 60 missiles, each of which has 10 million, that is, in fact, we are talking about the fact that from the point of view of air defense, germany has invested invests powerfully enough in our help. well, we hope that, by the way, the parliamentary elections in poland will change the situation a little, maybe i personally think that an even friendlier, let 's say, for us government will come to power in the future, donald tusk, and maybe they will share more of their stocks with us there, i would like to hope for that, because poland has been very actively arming itself successfully in recent years. mr. serhiy, thank you very much for this morning's conversation, serhiy zurets was with us, a military expert, director of the defense express company, we talked about yesterday's successful attack by atakams, and

now it's actually time to traditionally remember with a moment of silence all those who died in ukraine's struggle for independence . let's honor the memory of ukrainian soldiers and peaceful citizens of ukraine with a moment of silence