[000:00:00;00] and also economically, because there is some trade in people, there is some support for the economy, and that is why they found this logistics warehouse, hit it, realizing that with the same they will bring a lot of suffering, i am not talking about the fact that they took six lives of our ukrainians, therefore, as we understand it, we call it, well , we call russia an enemy, but we should call them terrorists, first of all, thank you, oleg abramychev, deputy of the kharkiv city... council, was in touch with us , well, now i will speak to iryna koval and the news, iryna, we invite thank you, khrystyna, about the most important events, literally in a moment, the 15th in ukraine, news time on the espresso tv channel, in the studio of iryna koval, greetings to all viewers, let's start with the situation in the kherson region.

beryslavshchyna under the fire of the occupiers, the russians hit one of the villages of the community with four aerial bombs, as a result of which a 55-year-old man was injured , the wounded man was hospitalized with a mine and explosive injury , the enemy dropped explosives from a drone on boryslav, a woman was injured, she has a contusion, and wanted to tell you more about all the important events, but on the air of the tv channel, the kyiv security forum and the key topic of today's discussions, a brave side... in washington in 2024 , so let's watch it live, general david lud, i invite the stage, i know that ivanka is already here somewhere, please , and, as i could , please, ivanka, i invite ivan mulympushadze, the chairman of the verkhovna rada committee on integration into the european union, to the stage, and

of course arseniy. yaniuk, head of the kyiv security forum, prime minister of ukraine in 14-16 years. ladies and gentlemen, please please sit down, so we meet again in this beautiful room, which has already become traditional for the kyiv security forum, and this room is on one side of the metaphor. and on the other hand, this is a sign that we are safe and we will win and no one will harm our security, today we will discuss a topic that is directly related to national security, the presentation of a special document, the address of the atlantic council to the president

of the united states for support. of ukraine with special emphasis on preparation for the summit nato in washington next year in 2024 , that's what we're going to talk about today, and this is my pleasure to, and now it's my great pleasure to present this idea that was given to us by the athletic council, we 're going to present a memo. which is addressed to the president of the united states of america, the atlantic council and i am extremely pleased to present this document to the ukrainian audience, so john, i want to invite you to share your idea, regarding the idea behind this document. thank you, danyla, it is very nice to see many familiar faces here,

the genesis of this. of the document is related to the july nato summit in vilnius, the americans, many of whom paid attention to this summit , were disappointed by the results of the vinnytsia summit, we believed and still believe that nato could take a more decisive step towards ukraine's membership in the alliance, and we decided , that we will gather a group of experts, specialists of former high-ranking officials in order to consider the issue of what can be done to accelerate ukraine's accession to nato, through the washington summit, which will take place next year, so at the end of the year we

gathered a very respectable audience, two ambassadors. the usa is in nato, former secretaries of state, former heads of military structures in europe and conducted. three long discussions and as a result produced the documents that you now see in front of you, you can say that there are three main ideas, or messages, those damned russians, yes. the three main messages included in our memorial note to the president: first, that we have faced the most strategic challenge

in the face of the aggressive policy of the kremlin, and our support for ukraine is not philanthropy, addressed to our friend, but a smart investment in american interests, and we call on the president of the united states to speak decisively and unequivocally , regarding this threat, i want to give credit to the president for that, for his speech, last week, it was not really our merit, but he in this... clearly told the americans that if putin won in ukraine, and this will not happen, as long as america supports, america supports ukraine, he would attack

poland, the baltic states, and the cost of this aggression for nato and for america would be much higher than our aid to ukraine, from which we need decisive. steps towards ukraine's membership in nato, which must be made at the washington summit, but we also believe that it is very important for this to improve ukraine's prospects on the battlefield. the first part of the document is an introductory part, and the second concerns specifically what types of weapons, what military assistance ukraine needs, and the third part of our document is a nato proposal, and the former us ambassador to nato, mr. vershbaugh, will tell you more about this, and now i will provide mr. douglas's word is fierce. like just now

drawn by mr. herbst, this document includes two such ambitious recommendations for the summit, which will take place in nine months. the first major recommendation is that we... we have to give ukraine what it needs, what it needs to win the war, that's what i'm going to talk about, and then i'll give the floor to verzhbau, because the second part of this of the memorial note says that what must be done in order to ensure peace, that is, two parts: to win the war and to ensure peace, with regard to the victory in the war, then what we're proposing here is a different approach, a fresh, new approach to give ukraine ... the military capabilities that it needs, we're saying that there are qualitative requirements for the quality of weapons, and also quantitative requirements for

weapons, and time requirements, according to all these three criteria, so far we are not finalizing what is necessary for the conduct of military operations in ukraine. i would say that we have given ukraine enough not to lose this war, but not enough to win, and we believe that it is absolutely essential for us to change this dynamic and give ukraine the full extent of what it needs, we also disagree with the current approach, which we believe is too slow, too bureaucratic and incremental, which only moves step by step, and at each iteration of military aid, that aid comes too late, and i, accordingly, as a former military officer, can say that

this means that ukrainians are paying a price for this, for this very approach. and we call for an end to this approach and a more serious approach. to victory in the war, i can give a specific example, the document goes further, and it is even more ambitious and says that it is... time to stop naming protected territories in russia, and to open the possibility for ukrainians to strike at those places from which strikes on ukraine are coming, that is, ukraine should have enough weapons to strike at ukraine's naval bases, ground military bases, air bases , to strike at as

the strikes on ukraine are coming from there, it's absolutely a comparable approach to what the united states and our allies are currently pursuing , that's enough the major change in approach is what concerns the part of the document that deals with winning the war, and mr. werchbaugh will say about the second part that he mentioned earlier. thank you, kyiv security forum, for the opportunity to present our recommendations, i really hope that we will have additional debates in washington and with our allies on these issues. as my colleagues have already said, there are two main recommendations, douglas laid out arguments about the need to change the approach, make it non-incremental, provide everything necessary for ukraine to not just no... but won this war, but i will say about

all the other recommendations, which are related to the fact that ukraine is already on the path to membership in the alliance. all the participants of this process who signed the document may have certain disagreements, views, in the nuances, but they will all agree that the only reliable guarantee of security for ukraine is the future membership in nato, so we... start this process. vilnius was a missed opportunity. the right words were said there regarding the future of ukraine in nato. this is a somewhat simplistic view of membership, there are some the right steps were taken, let's say, the cancellation of traffic regulations, but this document is not much forward in comparison

with, say, the bucharest summit. we believe that the anniversary alliance is a good opportunity to concretely show and define ukraine's path to nato membership. of course, it will not happen in one day, but it is necessary to start this process. we are not saying that it will be easy for nato to do this, when in 1955 germany was accepted as a donor, part of its territory was occupied by the soviets. troops, that is, it will be the first time that the country will host a country that has a hostile neighbor and is in hostilities, and of course us policy is that we are not actively involved in this war, so we can go with the scenario that was

applied to what to sweden, negotiations, signing of protocols and accession, but the way things will develop at the time of the washington summit, it is unlikely that we will be able to follow this path for ukraine, so we must be prepared for another scenario that will take place against the background of the ongoing conflict , some suggest that the position has to be that the accession of ukraine can be possible only after. war, this may be a simple approach, but it will only stimulate russia to continue the conflict , to stretch it over time, it is all the same as giving russia a permanent right of veto on e, decisions regarding, therefore, our approach is different, we need to change this principle, we wanted b) for ukraine to start accession negotiations at the washington committee, and then this process would go

its own way with a country that has not liberated all of its territory from aggressors, and we would leave a specific invitation for final decision, and that would, and then later it would be possible to make a specific decision regarding the invitation of ukraine to nato, regarding the schedule for joining. it will remain open and it will depend on how things develop, there may be a scenario where russia still holds... some territories we can apply the fifth article only to those territories that are under the control of ukraine. these are various options that must be discussed with ukraine in the first place, in order to ensure

security in these territories, and preparation for accession negotiations, even before the invitation to membership, will allow us to resolve this issue together, some who ... have an orthodox approach to the documents might say that this is not quite what we have in mind when we started the process destabilization 30 years ago, but i would say that ukraine is a unique special case, and it requires a special approach, which we are proposing, let's start the process, show the russians that they cannot have a veto. e regarding ukraine's aspirations for nato membership and i hope that soon after of the washington summit, maybe we will start this process of ukraine going through this open, open door, thank you very

much, let me say that it was dynamic, to the point and short, and thank you very, very much... to all of you for presenting this document and for who shared their views and approaches with us. john told me that he would need 15 minutes to present the document, no more, and that was true. i think we all look forward to further discussion to delve deeper into this issue before i give the floor ivantsi, i want to say that there is no sadness. in that we highly value what the atlantic council is doing for ukraine, we highly value solidarity with our country in these most difficult, darkest times of our modern history, of course there are certain topics on which we argue, but that is absolutely normal, but

what is important is that you have presented a document today that can become a certain road map. or some such milestones on the way to the summit in washington and this is a very good example of addressing the president. i'm sure that the president of ukraine will also listen to what you have proposed, that is, it sounds like a very reasonable formula under the current circumstances. now i would like to give the floor to ivanna klimpush tsinsadze. ivanka, what do you think? why do you think it is important to start discussing the language of the next nato summit in washington now, why is it important to start these political preparations for the next summit in the united

states. thank you, danyla, i, a huge thank you to the kyiv security forum for initiating this discussion. for being invited to our atlantic colleagues, the council and for this kind invitation , let me begin with some personal feelings that i got from reading this address, i would like to begin by thanking the atlantic council for trying to put forward a much stronger agenda, than. the one we are dealing with today, and for us, many ukrainians, it is extremely pleasant, because all these years we have been trying to strengthen and speed up the support of our partners from the euro-atlantic area, and it is very important that

we see a certain reflection of some of these ideas that we're talking about taking place in this address, i'm talking about hearts and minds. for example, i use, let's say, the need to increase the quantity, quality and timing of the supply of weapons in almost every meeting, parliamentary, diplomatic, and this is very well reflected in your document, i am sure that the general will agree with me, that any military commander , when he plans. well, any military operation, must have all the necessary resources at hand, and this is very important, because our military team. there is not enough of this in this period of time, i.e., which does not allow for effective planning, counterattacks

, air defense, and we see that this military support is coming to ukraine drop by drop, and these discussions are taking place in the ramstein format, very important political decisions are being made such like that was about the tank coalition, but for that. it took months for it to be implemented, i remember the beginning of april 22, it was the first trip of ukrainian parliamentarians to washington, and we had quite heated discussions in the pentagon whether it was a good idea or not to start training ukrainian pilots for the f16 and we said. you will be 16, it just takes time, let's start preparing now, so this is all extremely important for

us, for ukraine to win on the battlefield, and it is extremely important what you have done in this document in this address, the second important thing in this appeal, also, for which i appreciate her very highly, is that our friends in the end, they formulated that support will be needed for ukraine not only as much as it is needed , as much as it is needed for ukraine to win, moreover, as much as it is needed for russia to lose, and it is extremely important that we are all well understand what we are striving for and what should be the result of this defensive war that we are waging on our soil, and this brings me to the answers to your questions, danilo, why is it important right now to start

discussing the agenda and possible the results of the nato washington summit, this is actually your proposal regarding ways to improve and strengthen relations with ukraine. and i, like all ukrainians, of course, dream of something more, always , i will allow myself to make some provocative statements that can cause additional brainstorming here in this audience, because from my point of view, ukraine's membership in nato is one of things that can actually stop this war, end it, and so...' regarding the invitation,

a certain format of engagement that will put an end to the question of whether, which russia can to raise before our western partners, regarding the future prospects of ukrainian membership, i think this will allow us to look and find ways to do it, and it requires. unity in the alliance and we understand that at this particular moment we do not see this unity, regarding, i would say, fast movement, a short path, a clear definition of how to make this process so, but this is already obvious, and we see the american leadership at this particular moment, in terms of trying to create

that kind of cohesion around the ultimate the decision to invite ukraine to membership will be tuesday, and here we will become much more resourceful about finding ways to do it, maybe we will discuss the details a little later, but there are other possibilities, such as advancing and how to ensure ... time, regardless, correct me, if i misunderstood this appeal, regardless of how this conflict ends, whether it ends or not, because sandy very correctly pointed out, if we have ideas, that the future membership of ukraine in the ... depends on the end of this conflict, then this

will only push the russian federation to continue this conflict for decades, and that limits our ability to find ways to engage ukraine, and that's why it's definitely extremely important to put ideas out there, to present ideas, it's very important to get politicians, decision makers, ministers, government officials involved in this discussion, and i think it is extremely important, and what is important is that it is already being done now. for us to feature this analytical cohort, a cohort of policymakers who have experience and who support and understand the geopolitical the importance of ukraine's belonging to the world of good, in contrast to all evil, which has already formed, and

we must admit, is very actively functioning. thank you very much ivanka, i believe that this discussion and i believe that your document and this discussion start an important path to the washington summit, and now arseniy yatsenyuk, you were the person who signed in 2008, jointly, the letter to the secretary general nato with a request to provide ukraine with an action plan to prepare for nato membership, this was the beginning of a great process that led to the idea joining the alliance, what do you think about this formula, which is presented in the document presented by our friends, to start the admission process. thank you, danyla, 15 years ago we

appealed to nato member countries to support ukraine. after that, russia annexed crimea, attacked georgia, started a war in syria, and we have to draw conclusions, i would like to start with a sincere thank you to our friends from the athletic council, you are doing a terrible job, i would like to interpret. messages that were provided by our colleagues, explain them for the ukrainian audience, we are talking about whether ukraine will be a member of nato or not, so the atlantic council provides a clear path, this , this is a road map, this is not just words, a road map, how to make it happen,

period, we can discuss some technicalities, for some reason disagree, but i can tell you that this is not a matter of technical nuances, it is a matter of history, history must be made, and for this ukraine must become a member of the alliance, this is the only way to save the ukrainian state, protect the ukrainian people, and restore the world order . ambassador herbst, quoted president biden, i want to do the same, first of all, i want to give him credit as well for such a powerful speech that he gave to the american people, he absolutely openly and clearly said to the american people, look, this is the best

investment in the national the security of the united states, to help ukraine, it is true, and president biden said enough, with an open mind, in israel: we should not allow ourselves to be consumed by anger, and i would like to add that we should not be consumed by fear, fear of russia, and in your document i see that you have combined reality in this way, this is a really difficult issue, real politics with a real incentive of how to make ukraine become a cheron, an alliance, there is no other way out, no other option for ukraine, for the ukrainian people, and for the world community, the euro-atlantic , than to make ukraine a member of the alliance, and here the most difficult, indeed, the most difficult task will be to convince everyone in