[000:00:00;00] in an hourly format, starting at 8:00 p.m. and ending at 10:00 p.m., so i say goodbye until monday, goodbye, congratulations, on bbc news ukraine, jaffe rumerav is working in the studio in london, and today in the program we are talking about the departure of foreign citizens from the gaza strip across the border with egypt hundreds of foreigners have already left the gas sector through the rafah checkpoint on the border with egypt, but thousands of people are still waiting in line. the lists of those willing to leave gaza include citizens of ukraine. so now hundreds of people are on the border between gaza and egypt. they are all waiting

opportunities to leave safe place. the egyptian authorities allowed foreigners to leave, as well as dozens of seriously injured palestinians. they all have to leave through this rafah checkpoint. this is a checkpoint in the south of the gaza strip on the border with egypt. this is one of the three checkpoints with the gas sector. kerem shalom and rafah in the south, res in the north. all closed due to hamas attack on israel on october 7 since 2007, when hamas seized power in the gaza strip, egypt and israel have restricted movement through the rafah checkpoint. that is, before the attack on october 7, palestinians who wanted to pass through this checkpoint had to obtain a special permit several weeks before the trip, and either side, that is, egypt or the local palestinian authority, could refuse to cross the border, after the attack, the entire border with gas was closed, israel announced a total

blockade, and now, for the first time since the beginning of this war, people are being evacuated to egypt through rafah. the border was opened for seriously injured palestinians of foreign nationals. bbc correspondents saw how it happened. the border between gaza and egypt is a small space between war and peace, because no matter what lies ahead for these people, it is still better than what is left behind. this is a list of the names of the lucky ones, they were lucky enough to escape, but there, at home , their families were left under the bombing, mona has an australian passport, she tells the bbc camera crew about her pain of having to leave her own family. i'm not happy at all because i'm leaving half of me there, my brothers and sisters, my whole

family is still here, i want them all to live in... a safe place, the situation is terrible there, everything is very bad, many of those who cannot get to egypt are hiding in gas hospitals, they believe that they can be safe there, they bring the wounded here and wonder. patients ask me if they should go to the south, but the south has been shelled, the hospitals there are full, or whether... should they stay in the gas, they ask if they can stay here in the hospital, but there is no place for them here either, we don't know how to treat people, we feel sorry for them because we cannot provide them with any services, although the hospital is open. yazit abu nael suffers from epileptic seizures, which have worsened since the war. this is the third time his sister, talla

, is trying to ferry her brother across the border. every time i... i think it can't get any worse, it gets worse, it's like we're trying to survive, we're not sure if we're going to make it, but we 're trying our best to survive because i just don't want to die at 24 years, they waited all day, but in the evening talla wrote us a message that they did not manage to leave, and they returned in gas. i'm more i don't know what to do, we are left again without electricity, without food, without clean drinking or even technical water, my brother has run out of medicine, we are still here, and now it is night. and the very next morning they will try to leave again. us secretary of state anthony blinkon arrived in tel aviv today, this is not

his first visit. at the beginning of the war between israel and hamas, blinken called on israel to protect civilians in the gaza strip, while the israeli army is conducting combat operations there? we strongly support the assertion that israel not only has the right, but also the obligation to defend itself and do everything possible so that october 7 never happens again. at the same time, how israel does it matters, and it is vital that , when it comes to civilians caught in the crossfire of hamas, everything is done to protect them and to provide aid to those who so desperately need it and bear no responsibility . for what happened on october 7. and the us calls on israel to make humanitarian pauses so that civilians in the gas sector can receive help. israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu rejected this

possibility, he said, he would not agree to such a move until hamas released the hostages. hamas militants, according to israel , captured more than 200 people during the attack. blinkin once again emphasized that the connection. states are supporting israel in this war, more the bbc's washington correspondent, barbara plath usher. i have watched the american message change since the beginning of this crisis. at first, the us only strongly supported israel and its right to defend itself. however , later, when negotiations were held with the arabs partners, and as the gas crisis unfolded more and more, the us began to insist that civilians in the gas should be protected. and it is very important that exactly how israel conducts the offensive, that humanitarian aid must come, this is the main thing that blinken talked about in israel today, he especially emphasized the idea of ​​​​humanitarian pauses: the us supports

israel's refusal to cease fire, agreeing that this will allow hamas to regroup will play to hamas's advantage, but the us is talking about humanitarian pauses, the possibility of a short-term cease-fire so that it can help coming so that progress could be made on the hostages and so on. what we've heard from blinken, and also from prime minister netanyahu, is that it's difficult. netanyahu said there is no chance of a humanitarian pause unless the hostages are released. blinkin toned it down a bit, saying he heard serious questions about how humanitarian pauses and hostages are connected, how hamas can take advantage of it, and how to maximize aid delivery during such pauses. he also said it doesn't look like it. that it may happen in the near future, that it takes time and negotiations with various partners. i also listened to the un briefing, where the humanitarian representative said that life support in gas no longer works. he said we are not keeping up with

what he called the progress of devastation. although he thanked for the help that came through intensive and difficult negotiations, he still said: it is not enough. as long as there are no humanitarian pauses, we will not be able to cope. representative oon has said this several times. as a result of israel's bombing of the gaza strip, thousands of people died, and more more became refugees. people live in difficult conditions without enough food, water and medicine. since the start of the war , hundreds of trucks with humanitarian aid have entered the sector, but the un warns that this is not enough to cover all the needs of the civilian population, who relied on humanitarian aid even before the war. the conditions under which palestinians currently live in the gaza strip are described below. in bombed-out areas, it seems like the end

of the world has come, a trauma shared by several generations. "daughter, daughter, the woman cries, children trapped in an ever-increasing war. the israelis say that they are targeting hamas militants, the killers of israeli citizens, they are close behind..." i was going to perform the afternoon prayer, this man tells us, and suddenly

a rocket fell on our house. these people have already learned what war is, but this has never happened in their lives. who will live and who will die is a matter of chance. these stories have reached us only because of the courage of a few. hello mahmoud, how are you? mahmoud basam, one of the journalists in gaza who covered this tragedy for the bbc, his the photo is daily testimony of people's agony, he says that despite what he saw, he tries to convey information about everything that is happening as objectively as possible, but sometimes he just stands in front of the camera and cries, and the only thing left for him is to remain silent , more than 1,400 people left their homes. the shelters, if they are lucky enough to find them, have minimal

facilities, access to the most necessary things is very limited, we have reached the point where you want to die under the rubble just to find peace, our lives are torture, we are three hours standing in line to use the toilet, can such a child wait for the toilet for three hours, can a child wait for bread, this? catastrophe. there are more and more such questions. in response, this war offers only pain. israeli troops have said they are on alert near the lebanese border in northern israel because of the risk of an attack by hezbollah, a group that is in the fire. western countries consider

it terrorist, and with which, by the way, israel already fought in 2006, and today the leader of the hezbollah group from an unknown location publicly spoke out and supported the actions of hamas on october 7, which resulted in the deaths of almost 1,500 israelis and hundreds of prisoners. leaders went astray in this conflict blamed the united states. bbc correspondent john donnison works on the israeli border. people here are undoubtedly worried and scared, there is tension here, the border is only 10 km from here, many towns and villages located close to the border have been evacuated. the israeli forces have accumulated many of their forces. in the last few hours we have heard a sound, similar to the exit of an artillery volley, from the side of israel hunted. but now none. we did not

see a response from the lebanese side. since the beginning of the gaza war, hezbollah's response has been relatively moderate. however, the violence that has taken place on this border in recent weeks has been perhaps the worst we have seen since the 2006 war between israel and lebanon. and it used to be enough to start another war. but hezbollah is a force much more powerful than hamas. they have approximately 150,000 missiles, and some of them are capable of reaching different parts of israel. hezbollah fighters are much better trained than hamas, many of them having fought in syria. prime minister benjamin netanyahu said today that if hezbollah tried to intervene in this war, it would be a big mistake, bigger than they can handle. of course, the people who live here in nagaria hope that

esbila will not take such a risk. and if you want to know more about the war between israel and hamas, read analytical materials on our website bbc.ua. for example, this text is about israeli politics. can prime minister netanyahu unite israel during war? and subscribe to our pages on social networks so as not to miss the most important news, we are on facebook, instagram and tiktok, on youtube, you can watch our episode if you missed it on the air. that's all for today, look for more stories on our bbc.ua website and on our social media pages, and we're back on the air on monday at 9 p.m.: tune

in. we continue the information broadcast on the espresso tv channel, vitaly is with you port. and these two hours we will talk about the most important events of this week, these days. let's start with a conversation with taras zhovtenko, an expert on international security of the democratic initiative foundation, congratulations, sir. taras, congratulations, good evening. well, let's start, if we talk about security, from these priorities that valery zaluzhny, the leader of the armed forces of ukraine, put forward in his essays and interviews for the economist publication, which of these priorities do you single out as the most

important for us? actually, general zaluzhnyi concentrated on the most basic ones moments that are connected with the analysis of the current situation at the front, the fact that the situation has really turned a corner, taking into account the fact that the russians were able to adapt to the situation, looking at how the west somehow helps ukraine a teaspoon at a time, conveys to us new types of weapons, but these types of weapons are transferred too slowly and in too small quantities to have such a decisive effect on the battlefield, and in the end this is what gave the russians the opportunity to transform their approaches to tactics, to strategy. to what they do on the battlefield, well after all, to prepare as much as possible, in general, in their organizational and technological paradigm , for what weapons and in what quantity ukraine receives, that is, in fact, this is such a strategic, well, to a certain extent, loss of our

western allies, who, in the end, they obviously made, first of all, political calculations , with these supplies of weapons to ukraine, they... obviously, they tried to a certain extent to exert certain political pressure on the russian leadership, on possibly a certain part of the entourage or inner circle there, which surrounds the russian dictator, in order to make it clear to the russian leadership, both political and military, that the situation in the field will not get better for the russians and that the west is ultimately ready to stand with ukraine to the end, and perhaps in this way the west hoped to change certain approaches. .. before the russian leadership sees the war in ukraine, as it sees the situation on the battlefield in general, but instead the russian leadership behaved in such a hundred percent dictatorial way, they cleaned their information space, cleaned their

political space, and in the end prepared to tighten the belts of all russians enough to leave them with the only option to make a decent living, which is to go and die for putin in ukraine, and in the end thereby guaranteeing themselves the ability to continue this war for themselves, at least in the medium term , and actually general zaluzhnyi says that in order to get out of this situation, quite radical technological solutions are needed, that is , ukraine needs to get the job that was promised to us as quickly as possible, well, first of all we are talking about the f-16, at least the first batch of some six or eight units, which are capable of changing the situation in at least one direction, and of course, it is the long-range version of the atapak missiles of 300 km, and we perfectly understand. that behind washington's position on the supply of attackens missiles, the position of berlin and chancellor olaf scholz on the supply of 600 km taurus missiles is very close, and these are exactly the technological solutions that will actually allow, at least, to see a way out of this stalemate on the field battle and in the end

to prepare the armed forces of ukraine already for the spring-summer offensive campaign. and tell me, the russians have a corridor to get out of the stalemate, what can they do, here we see these five proposals from general zaluzhnyi, and imagine that someone is writing a memo to president putin, what he should list there , so that russia hopes for a breakthrough on the battlefield, but there, in fact, the russians may have two positions, one position will relate to military-technical issues, the other position will relate to such and more political-strategic issues, and what concerns political-strategic ones, let's start from the end of the list, in fact, it is the hope of the russian federation to use the maximum of its hybrid tools during the period, well , at least the first half of the 24th year, when

in fact we are expecting a very such a powerful shaft, national elections in our western european allies, some key ones, we are facing elections to the european parliament in the spring of 24, in the end we are facing a very not... simple presidential campaign in the united states of america, also in 24, the height of which, well, will obviously be at the end of spring and summer, and actually this hybrid toolkit is exactly the means by which the putin regime will try to us, well , let's say, make it so that these five points of merit and remained either not implemented at all, or their implementation was delayed just enough so that the russians could again adapt to those new realities on the battlefield, as they had already done. well , the second point is this military war, this is also the current russian command concerns, and in general, but traditionally , historically, the russians fought by pelting the enemy with hats, they never fought with they never relied on the quality of their own army and the quality of how this army

is armed, how it is trained and so on, that is, for the russians there was always an important number, and this number had to be, well, minimally working on the battlefield, but primitive enough so that it would not hurt to simply put hundreds, thousands of them into the ground, and that is precisely the potential of russia, it is still well enough serious, and russia in this mode, well, in medium low-tech mode, it is still capable of producing those weapons systems that it can use on the battlefield , and of course there will not be as many of these weapons as the russian commanders would like, but at least they will be enough for to maintain at a minimum the intensity of the operation to which the russian commanders are accustomed in general, so these two points , i think, could be key in such a russian counterposition to those initiatives on the theses voiced by general zaluzhnyi. in your opinion, is russia capable of mass mobilization, or

is it hardly realistic? ah, it is realistic, if the russian leadership manages to do the correct, correct information training of the population, but well , we have already seen in many examples, starting with prigozhin and ending with the incidents now in makhachkala, that on the one hand, indeed, the russian military apparatus, in such critical situations, he absolutely does not manage, does not manage anything in the country, and he completely loses control, but on the other hand, the correct composition of the information field on the part of the russian authorities, it allows these certain moments, if not to extinguish, then at least to direct them in the right direction, that is, if the russian population, which is 2/3 there, is just plasticine, with who can be molded into anything, today they can be told that prigozhin is the hero of bakhmut and the savior of the soviet union, and tomorrow they can be told that he is a criminal, a dowry of the family, and it will be perceived absolutely, as

they say, for a clean coin, therefore at with the correct preparation of the population, with the correct preparation of the information field, mobilization in the russian federation is possible, the only thing is that it is necessary to create quite serious prerequisites for this, at least now, since the putin regime is already gradually entering its next so -called pre-election cycle, yes , at the moment they are not pedaling this problem at all, in the same place in general , about three weeks ago, the russian propagandists received a nazatnava manual, where they were forbidden to use the word mobilization at all, or even think it is on the air, but to talk about volunteers instead means about voluntary formation, unification and so on, and putin himself repeatedly emphasized this with his own people, his entourage, but it is obvious that after the presidential elections in russia, the situation will eventually change. .. the regime will look for those circumstances, those, well, let's say, scenery, in which the idea of ​​mass mobilization could be

adequately presented to the russian population, with minimal political risks for the stability of putin's regime itself. and you in general, you will understand why the consciousness of russian society is so amorphous, that you can replace one propaganda puzzle with another without any risk to the regime, and here i think there are several reasons, the first reason is that in fact... conditions of the russian population, it was formed during at least two decades of putin, yes, and it was formed by two key components, and the first key component is the degradation, well, in general, of the education system and the ability of russians to think critically, and the second component is this information pressing, informational, as they say, washing of cities, which in general, well, formed a completely different distorted picture of reality in the russian population, and even in everyday communication, russians feel it very well, when you start talking to them

about what is there, well, it's not always true, the tv says, that there is an objective reality, facts that can be checked and verified independently, and in response to some such similar arguments, you get a counterargument that while we all don't know the truth, we also have this no one ever knows the truth will say, in such conditions, if the population... taken for granted believes exactly this, then in principle , well, there is no problem in molding it into the forms that putin's regime needs, but this is the result of systematic work that was carried out on several directions, it is not only russian propaganda, it is also education, it is also the formation of certain certain worldviews at different stages, let’s say, of the socialization of a russian russian citizen, and at each of these stages what was laid down that then formed the next stage, and in the end, the vast majority of the russian population , it has reached such

a level, well, i'm not afraid to say so, animal perception of information without... absolutely even any rudiments of critical analysis or objective judgment about what they are told by propaganda, officials, after all, what they hear spacious thank you, mr. taras, taras zhovtenko, an expert on international security of the democratic initiative foundation , was on the air, now we will continue to talk about how reality is perceived in different countries of the world, about the international situation with our next guest, valery chaly, diplomat, former ambassador of ukraine to the united states of america, congratulations sir. i congratulate you, glory to ukraine, glory to the heroes, therefore, just a few hours before our visit , the tymes of appeared information that next monday or tuesday, the president of ukraine volodymyr zelensky is visiting israel , and this is quite interesting information, because we we remember that literally immediately after the hamas attack on israel, the president of ukraine spoke with the prime minister of israel

benjamin netanyahu, there was then information that that he proposed his trip to israel as a solidarity visit, well, then this trip did not take place, but now, as we can see, president zelensky was invited in jerusalem to visit israel at any convenient moment for him and, as you can see, he can go to near east, but what do you think this visit shows, right now, when it is happening? you know, for a very long time the position of ukraine was in the voting. let's say, on issues of settlement of the middle eastern conflicts, israel, palestine, somewhere from the soviet times remained tradition, there are always mediocre ones somewhere, but here is such a situation, when those who attacked ukraine and israel, they are coordinating with each other, russia, iran, and we, as it were, are in the same boat now, so we had to really

adjust our foreign policy positions. although, let's be honest, israel did not do this, during the russian large-scale aggression against ukraine, but ukraine is doing it, and i think it was the right gesture of president zelensky to look for such an opportunity, to support israel, i will draw your attention on recent voting in the un, if you take the vote on cuba, then in general only three countries will speak... in solidarity, these are the usa, israel, ukraine, and although ukraine won there during the vote, and the usa, israel voted precisely against, but this has already shown , that ukraine has now become very close to the position of israel, because the two countries are in a difficult situation of self-defense, so in principle, i think that it was perhaps prime minister netanyahu's mistake that he still

did not create the conditions, i know why not took place then the trip but he could have done more conditions for it to happen sooner, well if it happens now, it's the right gesture, and brave enough, you said you know why the trip didn't happen then, why? well, there were a lot of different factors, in particular, the visit of the americans , well, you understand that there are still certain priorities, after all, the visit of blinkin, the representative of the usa, is more important for uh, there was actually also the visit of the prime minister, the country that opened the corridor for evacuation, yes, but i understand that too, but still, ukraine is in many ways stood in a position of support and not so many world leaders immediately wanted to come, actually, so uh, time matters, but let's be honest, we had a difficult