pause and in literally 15 minutes we're back on air, don't switch, watch the bbc news, then we'll be back in the studio again. bbc news ukraine broadcasts. olha palomaryuk works in the studio, and in today's program we will talk about the fact that ukrainian society has been actively discussing in recent days whether there has actually been a split in the leadership of ukraine. the western media are already openly talking about the probable conflict between president zelenskyi and commander-in-chief zaluzhnyi, what do the experts say and are there reasons for concern? and in order to understand whether there really has been a split in the leadership of ukraine and whether it is a split, let's remember that it all started.

last week, the western press published two large materials at once. the first appeared in time magazine. the journalist of the american publication spoke with the president of ukraine volodymyr zelskyi and people from his entourage. they talked about the situation at the front and the prospects for the end of the war, problems with mobilization and corruption in ukraine, as well as the fatigue of the war in ukraine and the difficulties in obtaining the necessary help later, the british publication the economist published an article. and an interview with the commander-in-chief of the armed forces of ukraine valery zaluzhny. in it, he publicly voiced what had been talked about for a long time, the summer offensive had ended and turned into a positional trench struggle, and he named five priorities for ukraine's victory in the war. the president's office reacted rather harshly to the article, saying that zulzhny's statement about the stalemate in the war with russia facilitates the work of the aggressor and causes panic among the western allies. it was

quote. western media reacted to general zaluzhnyi's statement, the reaction to it in the president's office and changes in command. thus , the american edition of the new york times writes that all this indicates differences between the military and civilian leadership of ukraine in an already difficult time. well, it should be added here that rumors about tension between the president and the commander of the armed forces regarding strategy and command appointments have been circulating in kyiv for more than a year. but before, they did not spill into public disputes. well, i will add, about a week of difficult discussions in my address, the day before, volodymyr zelenskyi said that changes in ukraine will be made. this is not a stalemate, i emphasize it once again, we have already talked about it, it is not some kind of news. russia controls the skies, in offensive missions, that's clear, if we protect our military, we protect. boys, girls,

when they control the sky, no one wants to just throw away, as russia throws its people like meat. public discord in the top military and political leadership of ukraine will have such consequences. about this for let's talk for a minute with ukrainian expert mykhailo samus, first, the assessment of bbc columnist frank garner. in short, ukraine is in trouble, and there are several reasons for this. first, their counterattack stopped. the second is a public quarrel between president zelenskyi, his office and the commander of the armed forces. volodymyr zelenskyy says that this is not a stalemate, and valery zaluzhnyi, on the contrary, that it is a stalemate that benefits russia, not ukraine, because ukraine relies heavily on the united states and other western countries that supply weapons and technology, and if the supplier is not there, then there will be trouble. the official position of the ukrainian authorities is the belief that the country will be retaken. this is also evidenced by public opinion polls. two-

thirds of ukrainians believe that they will be able to return all territories captured by russia, including crimea. this is hardly realistic, during the entire time of this counteroffensive, which began back in june, the ukrainian military advanced 17 km. in the first nine months of this year , they returned 0.2% of the territory, this is very little, but there are reasons for this. ukraine did not receive everything it needed on time. weapons, none does not question the determination of the ukrainians, they fight hard and bravely and also suffer heavy losses, as do the russians, but in this case time is on russia's side, and what is happening in the gas sector is diverting the world's attention from ukraine, and potentially this can divide the us congress, because if you have to choose where to send money to israel or ukraine, then israel will be the priority. well, just now. notification of

the death of major gennady chistyakov's assistant valery zaluzhnyi. zaluzhny himself stated this on his telegram channel. in the message states that in one of the gifts that gennady chastyakovo. received his birthday, an unknown explosive device went off. zaludzhny called it a heavy loss for the armed forces of ukraine and for him personally and added that the reasons and circumstances will be established during the pre-trial investigation. and mykhailo samus, director of the independent platform new geopolitics research network, joins the broadcast. good evening. mykhailo, let's start with zaluzhny's article. so, which of you personally protected it for yourself? and what was possible was written in between lines, well, first there were three materials, it was an academic work, a large one, then there were essays, and then there was also an interview format , a publication, all of it from economics and all of it

in different, let's say, styles, somewhere more emotions, where there is more of an academic-scientific approach, in fact, as an analyst, i did not see phrases there that it is a stalemate. in fact, this is already the second, second such publication, i will not say one article, this is a publication, because a year ago, around this time, chaseral zaluzhnyi and co-authors already published an article in which you remember, he said how many tanks, artillery from partners and so on ukraine needs in order to turn the situation around, now this is a continuation of such a tradition, and what is the difference, but your columnist said that if the west does not help us , there will be trouble, and that ukraine bears the same losses as russia, i do not agree with this, because the losses of the russians are simply much greater, if we simply take it, there are so many osinters who collect information on video, then in recent weeks,

for example, among the russians, well, just by order more, and perhaps even more, losses in armored vehicles, especially what can be counted, which concerns, again, a stalemate or not a stalemate. situation, general zaluzhnyi says that the war is turning into a positional war, and with regard to the situation of the enemy, for example, i absolutely do not agree with this definition, because on the contrary, now the dynamics on the battlefield are reaching the highest level, the fact that there is no advance in russians, not ukrainians, zaluzhny also explains, because the ukrainian armed forces and the russians can fully see the battlefield, now such is the nature of hostilities, when drones and other means of intelligence can see everything in plain sight and it is very difficult to carry out these traditional operations, that is why general zaluzhnyi says that we need to look for a combination of new technologies that will be able to give us a breakthrough, but he does not say that it is a stalemate situation, and the russians do not say that it is a stalemate situation, they want, firstly,

to occupy the entire donbas, and secondly, they want to destroy ukraine, we can talk about a pro-occupation situation, so i think that in fact it is very the analysts have screwed up a lot here. general zaluzhnyi still had several main points in his article , about which he says that we need to do now, so that next year, the dynamics will be noticeable and, let's say, not to experts on the territory, because everyone says, but territories, in fact, now there was really a war to destroy each other, that is, if you look at the losses of the russians, they are simply off the charts, but on the other hand , territorial gains. ukrainians are small, let's see what will happen in another year, in the next year, when, after all, ukraine will succeed now to do homework and combine the technologies that we have, and still make the same technological one, mykhailo, thank you,

director of the independent platform new geopolitics research network, mykhailo samys was in direct contact with us, thank you for the analysis, well , in his article, which we are discussing today, the main thing... the commander of the armed forces of ukraine spoke among other things about air defense and that russia still has an advantage in the sky. so only during the last day, according to the air force, ukraine attacked with several types of missiles and attack drones, struck odesa, damaged port infrastructure and the building of the art museum, there are injured, and also condemned in unesco, because the building of the national art museum is an object of cultural heritage. the most massive since the beginning of the war. kherson was shelled last night. according to the ministry of internal affairs, russian forces launched 87 guided aerial bombs on the city. the footage released by the local authorities shows the extent of the damage to the kherson high-rise buildings. residents they say that they had to run away from home in the middle of the night. zhanna bespyachuk, my colleague from

kyiv joins zhanno's broadcast. except for president zelenskyi's reaction to the article in the weekly, from which bridge, which became the impetus for conversations, in general, assumptions about some frictional misunderstanding between the office of the president and the commander-in-chief of the armed forces. greetings ulya, you can single out at least two obvious points: first, this is, of course , the repeatedly mentioned article in time magazine, in which, among other things, with reference to anonymous sources, the author writes that, in fact, officials from the president's office can give orders to the ukrainian military, among other things, the ukrainian military allegedly received an order to return the city

of horlivka in donbas to the control of ukraine, and this is actually evidence that the clear dividing lines between the competence of the military and of politicians in ukraine may be violated, and the professionalism of the military, which is a decisive factor in the war, may not be in the first place, far from it, and politics may replace the actual military affairs as such, which during large-scale war is dangerous, the second point is the news that was discussed in ukraine during the last weekend, very actively, the dismissal of the commander , major general viktor horrenko, from his post, the commander of the special operations forces, this is a separate type of troops, formally for the law. indeed, he is appointed and dismissed by the president of ukraine at the request of the minister of defense, but this

is a procedure, and there is also military practice, there are the realities of war, where special operations forces coordinate their special and combat operations, actions in accordance with the main branches and types of troops, the armed forces of ukraine, which are commanded by valery zaluzhny, therefore in this sense the direct leader... the commander of the special operations forces is valery zalushny, and the coordination of the army and the special operations forces is decisive, therefore the fact that viktor khorrenk was released by the unknown valery zaluzhny, how could you find out, directly from the dismissed general himself, that this is another post for discussions about friction, about possible disputes, misunderstandings between the country's commanders and political leaders? jeanne, but still

this absentee discussion entered the public space even before the appearance of the article in time magazine, so what does the change in the tone of this publication say about how ukraine's western allies assess the state of affairs at the front and in the ukrainian government? yes olya, we really see a fundamental change. this may be an indicator of the fact that a fundamentally qualitatively new stage is coming in the current war, which ukraine is waging as a war , a defense for itself, against external aggression, the need for a systematic struggle comes to the fore, that is, a period of exploits, exploits, and response to armed forces. .. aggression immediately passed. the time is coming when western partners expect from ukraine the

same systemic approach that would realistically take into account the interests of various states. it is also worth recognizing that part of the military and financial aid of the west from now on, for a certain period of time, we do not know how long it will last, will belong to israel, this is an essential factor and which ukraine needs to take into account, and in general, again, we can say , which for ukraine's western partners is such a sensitive moment, it is important to what extent the military will be able to to the political leaders of ukraine to maintain this same understanding, and we know that literally before our broadcast, in his daily address , president volodymyr zelenskyy called for an understanding to avoid political rivalries. zhanna, thank you, and that's all for today, more stories, search as always on our website,

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once again, good evening friends, we are working live, from now on the verdict will be two hours, it will start at 20:00 and end at 22:00, we are waiting for the inclusion of our three guests, today they will be three people's deputies, people's deputies of ukraine, these are mykola knyazhytskyi, roman kostenko and oleksiy kucherenko, however. before that we have to include dmytar didora, our colleague who is in sofiivska borshchehivka, this evening, it happened. the tragedy in the house of major gennady chastyakov, this is the assistant to the commander

-in-chief of the armed forces of ukraine, valery zaluzhny, today chastyakov celebrated his birthday, and one of the gifts contained an unknown explosive device, and, as the ministry of internal affairs says, this explosive device simply exploded in his hands , major chistyakova, dmitry, i congratulate you, please tell me what is happening now, i understand that you are near the house of major chassyakov, congratulations, serhiy, i congratulate our viewers, i am really close to the house, where the explosion happened, and, as the sources of the express of the national police of ukraine informed about 17:00 in the evening, an explosion occurred, according to the report, one person died, another was injured, among them was a child. so, then it became known that valery zaluzhny’s assistant, chestyakov, was killed, and now i am on the spot and a lot near

the house of the patrol police, currently journalists are not allowed to film and frame what is happening right next to the house, but there are also criminal investigators and the flight of the national the police of ukraine, and according to information from sources, nalista andriy tsaplienko knows that there was an explosion of three grenades, an explosion of three grenades, one of the three grenades that were given to the reader for his birthday exploded, and most likely these grenades were in the package, where they were, where the gift was, one of the gifts , this was also confirmed by his wife, nandiya chastyakovova, so far, as of now, i have this information , officially no one... comments on what happened, uh, here near the house, right on the spot, no one is commenting, the scribe, the ministry of internal affairs directly

reported that a criminal case has already been opened and the circumstances will be investigated this explosion, dmitry, it is still necessary to clarify that it was not grenades that were given, but gifts, and one of the gifts contained an unknown explosive device, well, at least this is what the commander-in-chief of the armed forces of ukraine valery zaluzhny writes, this evening he wrote: today under tragic circumstances on his birthday, my assistant and close friend, major gennadiy chastyakov, died in the family circle. an unknown explosive device went off in one of the gifts. gennady is survived by his wife and four children, my deepest condolences to the family. as general zaluzhnyi writes in his telegram, from the beginning of the full-scale invasion, gennady was a reliable shoulder for me. devoting his life to the armed forces of ukraine and the fight against russian aggression, the reasons and circumstances will be established during the pre-trial investigation , as far as i understand, dmitry, at this moment,

this is the maximum information you have, i want to add that periodically people leave the house, in particular, i noticed a girl, she appeared to me to be a minor, she was immediately surrounded by people, they hugged her, most likely the girl was in a very depressed mood, she was crying, but who she is, it is partially unknown at the moment , general zaluzhny wrote about the fact that chestyakov had four children, and according to previous information, the online edition of ukrainian pravda, a 13-year-old the major's son was apparently also injured. in the case of an explosion of an unknown object, of course we will follow this story, because uh, this is a tragic story, and it concerns the commander-in-chief of the armed forces

of ukraine, and it is about war, and such a tragedy happened during the war, and of course, we cannot stand aside, of course we express our condolences to the relatives and friends of major chastyakov, it was dmytro didora, our correspondent, who works at the place near the house in sofiivska borshchagivka, where the house is located and where the family of major chastyakov, valery zaluzhny's assistant, lives, unfortunately today the major died, under rather mysterious circumstances, because he was celebrating the day, he was celebrating his birthday, he was brought a present, and the present contained an unknown explosive device. next, friends, people's deputies join our program mykola knyazhytskyi, member of the european solidarity faction of ukraine. mr. mykola,

i congratulate you, i congratulate you. colonel of the sbu people's deputy of ukraine from the holas party roman kostenko, mr. roman, i congratulate you, and people's deputy of ukraine from the batkivshchyna party, oleksiy kucherenko, mr. oleksiy, i am glad to see you on our airwaves, congratulations, good evening. maybe, maybe , mr. colonel, i am turning to you, maybe you know more about this tragedy that happened to chastyakov, because so far there is little information about what happened, but since this concerns the supreme leader, the commander of the armed forces of ukraine, so maybe you have more information than we do? well, first of all, i would like to join you in expressing my condolences, well, unfortunately, i don't have more information, all that happened recently, i also heard about it, in the media, and let's just say, i think that it is not often to call there now, to find out something, right now the investigators are working, there are already some photos. in

the mass media, so you can do your own analysis there, but of course i would like in order not to tell your assumptions over and over again, you need to wait for what the law enforcement and investigative bodies say officially and then draw conclusions. thank you, mr. major, actually, today we were going to talk about who and why wants to hold elections in 2024, a time of war, and literally, when our program was already being prepared for broadcast, we unexpectedly received an answer from president zelensky, what he thinks about elections 20-24, let's listen, finally the waves have to stop with any things that are divisive politically, we have to make up our minds that now is the time of defense, the time of battle, on which

the fate of the state depends. and people, and not the time of throw-ins, which only russia expects from ukraine, i believe that now is not the time for elections, and if it is necessary to put an end to this or that political dispute, and continue to work only in unity, then the state has structures, who are able to put the dots and give the society all the necessary answers so that there is no room for conflicts and someone else's game against ukraine. mr. mykola, over the past few months, i would say, the team has been testing volodymyr zelenskyi, society, what it thinks about whether or not early elections in 2024 are necessary, literally at the end of last week, the minister of foreign affairs, dmytro kuleba, said that he does not rule out that such elections can be held

in the spring of the 24th year. so who actually launched this idea of ​​elections during the war and why is zelsky now refuting it? well, you are absolutely right , but the quote sounded like ukraine is considering the possibility of holding elections in 2024, this was said by the minister of foreign affairs, it is not that someone spread some rumors, it is official the position of the state in the international arena. obviously, such a statement by the minister of foreign affairs caused discussions in society, therefore. that more than 80% of ukrainians are against holding elections during the war. i, for example, despite the fact that i work in the opposition and obviously would like a change of power , i perfectly understand that during the war, as volodymyr zelenskyi said now, we must demonstrate unity, and these elections, despite the fact that we there is a democracy, elections must be held on time, but during martial law, we hold them according to the law,

we cannot, and physically cannot hold them, because it will be... putin will shoot at the polling stations, the military will not be able to vote, the ukrainian temporary residents will not be able to vote, obviously the legitimacy of such elections will be greatly questioned, that is why this statement of the minister of legal affairs caused such indignation, these were not some additional rumors, and the position of the president now can only be welcomed, it is absolutely correct and fair, and it is good that he spoke clearly. mr. oleksiy, if with the elections verkhovna rada more or less. it is understandable, because the powers of the people's deputies of the next convocation come into effect when the powers of the current people 's deputies cease, and that is, until a new verkhovna rada is elected, the verkhovna rada will be in a legitimate field. when it comes to the president, according to article 103, regular elections of the president of ukraine are held on the last sunday of march of the fifth year of the term of office of the president of ukraine.