on hawaariu.com. caring people from the mental health program and their friends from unicef ​​have collected tips on how to help yourself and your child cope with stress. 1.1 i will continue the national telethon. at this time, we are working in the format of a night watch discussion platform. i am yevhen plinsky, my colleague is with me. iryna prokofieva, co-host, er, the topic of today's broadcast is energy close to winter, that's what we decided to call it, for almost a year we have been preparing for the fact that winter will come, now the first frosts are already spreading across ukraine, so in what state have we reached this winter, what about our energy, how did we restore it, are we ready for enemy missile attacks, and what is our energy potential in general... this year and

this winter we will talk with andrian prokup, an energy expert of the ukrainian institute of the future, welcome, thank you, welcome, good health , good evening, before we get into how we 've prepared for this winter, what we're coming in with, let me give you a little reminder of the destruction we've suffered under the time of last year's energy terror, officially. authorities say that no energy system in the world has experienced such destruction, and simply by facts, almost all thermal generation was disabled, half of the thermal power plants were disabled, 40% of nuclear generation was occupied, and 45% of the distribution network

are also out of order, the power distribution network is, well, our substations, the power transmission line, because of which our cities exist at all, there is light at all, these data are correct, in your opinion, this was the official position of the authorities, but maybe you know something bigger, is it really so? really only the only point is that it is not distribution, but trunk damage, basically half there, and lines and substations, and distribution networks also suffered losses, but very differently in different regions, of course, that they were mostly in in the regions close to the front line, how much artillery shelling there is, but in general the picture is really such that no country has suffered such blows, such a massive company, and no country has had such losses, and i think that few countries would be able to resist like us, as we managed to do it last year, but nevertheless, we have already come to the next heating season, it has begun, winter and frost are on the nose, the repair campaign that we wanted

to carry out for sure, whether it was successful, we managed to fix something, with which we enter this winter, in fact, we enter this winter with the minimum necessary, capacity balance, that is, we have, in fact , electricity generation capacities, together with capacities for import, that will be in that's all, that's all it is possible that there will be days when it will be a little less than needed, which means exactly that much or a little... less than the peak load during the periods of greatest demand, this will obviously be, well, usually for the month of february , that is, the trunk networks, they are also ready , in order to transfer winter volumes, and distribution, in fact, there are attacks every day, and these networks, that this is oblenergo , so that we understand, correctly, transmission is ukrenergo, system operation, distribution is oblenergo, and well, in principle, networks

suffer essentially every day as a result of these shelling in the regions near the front, and likewise, the generation facilities , that is, one of the heating stations, it has been shelled several times in the last five weeks, and there are losses, but it is simply located practically on the front line and somehow it is very difficult to protect it. oh, but if we talk about that, in case there is no shelling, then we will be able to enter almost without restrictions , of course, there are factors of unpredictability, there may be some emergency situations, because considering what the scale of losses was last year, it was difficult in six months to carry out a repair campaign perfectly, very little time, little resources, lack of equipment , lack of money in the company, and this can be called miracle number two, of the year 23, that is, miracle number one, it was... when we are basically in the month of february

last year there were no blackouts and the enemy was furious because their campaign basically failed, and the number two miracle is how our energy workers faithfully and quickly carried out repairs, in some cases repairs that should have lasted two or three weeks , continuously made and carried out in three days, you have already mentioned the blackouts that happened last year, ukrainians in big cities like kyiv have already forgotten what it is , yes, but last winter everyone learned the word blackout well, and talks about what a blackout is and how big those blackouts are light for a few hours, which were, is exactly a blackout, they were going on... well, very sharp, yes, is it already a blackout or not, is it a blackout when we are turned off and we will be without light for several days, let's sort it out and remind the audience that what is a blackout in general, what is its nature, why does it occur, and is there a difference for ours

power lines, the loss of power for a few hours, and this blackout that could knock out our power line there for a few days, that's basically what they call a blackout, it's a systemic...' i think we're going to go into in such technical terms, so i ask you to try to be as simple as possible, that is, it is a system failure, when the failure already speaks for itself, when we have outages, outage schedules, that is, it is planned and predicted, which means that this situation is already under control, that is, a blackout this is the situation uncontrolled, remember, in november, there was a time when kyiv was without power supply for three days, and here are the situations when we are scheduled for two hours, four hours at a time . enough, that's why it's a planned shutdown, and there are also emergency shutdowns, for example, right at the moment when some

kind of flight has arrived, so that there are shutdowns to prevent a system system accident, a blackout, if we talk about the prospects for blackout shutdowns for this year, i.e. in us here is the balance of factors that determines our prospects and opportunities this year, it is different than it was last year, that is , we have much less available capacity this winter than last year, let's say what you mean, under available capacities, i.e. installed and ready-to -operate power generation and transmission facilities, i.e. generation facilities are thermal power plants, thermal power plants, nuclear power plants, etc. hydroelectric, wind, solar, i 'll just remind you how it was last year, for example, we started shelling heavily from september 15, then there was a system accident in the kharkiv region, sumy region, dnipropetrovsk region, and

on october 10 we had such a massive attack, if i'm not mistaken, in 16 regions, and from october 11 we stopped export of electricity, the zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant, until the first numbers of september, it worked in energy ukraine, yes, that is, even without the zaporizhzhia nuclear power plant, we could export electricity, but when part of our facilities were already damaged, we stopped this export, that is, now we have, the number of powerful these facilities is exactly such to cover the maximum demand that we will have, if last winter, for example, yes, there is one power plant, it failed, but it can be replaced by another, now this situation is different, that is, we are in a worse situation in terms of capacity, and for the correct understanding, we have everything that is generated, everything that can generate electricity, everything works, well, that is, if there are five power units somewhere, then all these five power units are included in the system and they

are working, now if i'm not mistaken, one more the nuclear unit is under planned repair and it will be out there literally in a week from the repair, but sometimes they happen. emergency situations, the units are taken out for repair, but in fact yes, we really work to the maximum , sometimes we have electricity export at certain hours, we have electricity export, at a certain hour we import, in certain cases we have emergency assistance, when we have the sun shines, we have a lot of electricity , we don’t need so much in order not to turn off these stations, because they will still have to pay, so we give this electricity also for money, but we give but this is a very dangerous story, in my opinion, as for the winter, that everything works, everything that can work, everything works and god forbid, just because of something, something has to be taken out for repair, and then we have a deficit, then we sit without the world there will be capacity limitation schedules, that is, it is not yet a shutdown, when large consumers will have to come to them in

different ways, the schedule is that you need to reduce consumption during these hours, so factories work fewer hours, offices turn off the lights even earlier, this applies to factories, but they can tolerate severa. at night, as it was done last year, an infrastructure object, for example, water pumping stations, er, it can transfer the period of water accumulation to other hours, with less demand. and it can be done painlessly enough, but of course, if there are shellings and we have something flying out of energy, and we have a deficit and we cannot cover it with imports, then we are forced to commit to this step from the schedules, and what is our now the balance, nuclear energy, heat and hydro, we are used to peacetime, that we have stable production volumes of nuclear electricity, thermal and hydro, these are maneuvering capacities.

which there in peak times more and more go into the system, here after last winter, today , how has this balance changed, do we even have this maneuvering capacity that we can use there during peak hours, or will we screw it up during these peak hours consumers, what ira says, there businesses or the private residential sector, essentially, the generation structure is very similar to what we had before the invasion, because we lost and zaporizhzhia, zaporizhzhia os, we lost many thermal power plants, which are also in the occupied territory, and controlled territories were damaged, and we lost a lot of wind and solar energy, we have reduced capacities of hydroelectric power plants due to the indirect impact of the blasting of the kakhovskaya hpp, because kakhovskaya hess, the enemies cut it off from our power last october, but considering... the fact that the dam is destroyed, it directly affects the operation of the entire cascade, why not

makes it possible to discharge water in large volumes and sufficient volumes, that is, there some things along the dnieper cascade were somewhat reduced, and in the summer, when a repair company was held there, and the nuclear and thermal units were actively being repaired, hydro was working at full capacity, and already when the atom began to be taken out of repair, the hydroelectric stations began to accumulate a little water, which they you. at the moment, that is , your question is whether we have enough, today is enough, er, what will be the situation in the event of possible mass attacks, it is difficult to predict but i said that we have such a weak point, it is less capacity, we have stronger points this year, i also remember that sometime in september in the marathon we talked with the ministry of energy, and they say that we actually have some volumes of electricity are contracted in advance abroad, which we can import in emergency cases and we did it in advance, they were somehow ordered there

and that it can be such a compensation tool under certain circumstances, how does it work and will it really work, because well, even there, mine is not unprofessional, mine is not professional understanding of the topic suggests that if it is a destroyed supply chain, then it does not matter whether you produce it or import it, you do not have, i do not know what the specific volumes of the company were, purchased there at the time on the forward market, but you must understand that in our the permitted import capacity is 1.2 gigawatts, that's the mains that can pass through, that's the maximum capacity of electricity that we can import at a certain time, at a certain hour, that's basically, although i don't think

that having 1.2, we import there for 1.2 hours in a certain hour, so these are not the volumes that can, if we talk about our consumption, the peak is expected there at the level of 16 to 17.5, 17.8 gw, then if there will be serious destruction, er, that is, it is only 10%. this is only a small part, it is possible that during the winter this permitted, permitted import capacity will be increased, whether it is 1.6 or 2 g, but nevertheless, it does not save us completely, although, last winter in january, well, it played an important role, yes, this is essential, essential, that is , if we had a shortage there on some days, some hours you give 4 g, then anyway... we could there to cover 30 and 40% at the expense of imports, and it felt much easier for there and for

household consumers, for the population and for utilities and for enterprises. next we want to talk about the protection of our energy system, for which we have been preparing for a whole year, but before that we will take a break for a few minutes and return to this important topic. chevrons approaching victory. step by step, they move from one danger to another, step by step, they free from invisible death our land, fields and forests, homes that have been visited by evil, without sappers here life will not return without the courage and

dedication of these people, we will not return home for your work and our safety, we thank the sappers of the state emergency service of ukraine. be who you want to be. you can be whoever you want. you can be whoever you want. you can be whoever you want. you can become whoever you want. everything that can work at night should work at night, heating the boiler, charging gadgets, warm floor and heater, terinated laundry in the washing machine, unload the power grid in the morning and evening,

use the simple rules of a warm country, let's beat the winter, together. 1.1 i will continue the national telethon, with you the night watch project. i'm yevhen plinsky, iryna prokofieva, with me, and we have a guest andrian prokip, an energy expert of the ukrainian future institute. congratulations once again. the topic of our program is energy. close to winter, we are talking about the state in which we approached it, how we prepared , what to expect, and we ended the previous part by saying that we wanted to talk further about the direct protection of energy facilities, what it is, what the lessons are we took from those shelling, because indeed, you mentioned that we hope for air defense, and even those attacks that were there, in particular on

kyiv in recent months, they show that, well, we shoot down what flies to kyiv, last winter, october , november we... we just remember how the rockets came to the kyiv tets , it all looked very terrible, now we seem to be shooting down, but we understand that in addition to the hopes for air defense, we implemented and implemented and continue to do something with direct protection , and generations and ways of transmission, what is it, how in general, which the concept of protection, given the events of last year, well, besides the fact that we have more. we are getting more and more air defense systems, every time there is news about additional defense systems, and here it should be noted that this is a boom in air defense supplies, it began after the attack on october 10 last year, i always told my european colleagues that if you had heeded this request earlier , then you would have less problems, because you had a shortage of electricity, we exported to you, but

without this air defense, we were forced to stop exports and you had additional expenses and in particular, the help of such a plan for the repair of our energy system, that is, now we have more, significantly more air defense systems, this is the first, second, that the energy workers themselves have more experience in how to react, how to manage the energy system in moments of waiting for shelling, during the shelling itself, and how to restore the power supply as quickly as possible after the arrivals, that is, the companies were preparing, developing various scenarios of damage, under these scenarios, options for the rapid restoration of the power supply were developed, and besides all that, work was and is being carried out on the construction of systems of passive protection against drones and missiles, it is difficult to say now how effective it will be, some effect will be obvious,

yes, the most, i understand, the most effective will be eh, mm. for sure, what about these drone protection systems , yes, they are simpler, they are easier to build, well, look , when i was at the pedstation, the last time i was filming, it was precisely the energy workers themselves, all the people who work there, they and said that if a rocket hits a transformer, relatively speaking, well, it’s hopeless, if there is a direct hit, then it cannot be restored , it’s simply impossible to work with it , it’s scrap metal, it’s simply written off, but it’s the shaheds who wear the biggest shk to the substations, which is not surprising, because well, they have small fragments, they are harder to hit, harder to shoot down, especially if it flies there at night, conditionally. in other words, it is they who damage the equipment, as you know, for the protection of our substations, or maybe not only for the protection, maybe some kind of

reserve of that equipment was formed so that there would be no precedents, well, a missile flew in, there is no transformer, it took years, times, and hours of recovery in order for us to have it there, and last year they openly talked about it, when there were strikes, that we ran out very quickly of those accumulations of spare parts that were formed. in terms of stocks and indeed companies, not all of them, for sure, but the ones that i know, companies , have been working on the formation of a stock, and in some cases, this stock of spare parts equipment, it is significantly more than what they had on october 10 last year, we are now talking about private companies, private and state, that is , of course, the situation is not the same for all state companies, but the ukrenergo company behaved very responsibly there. well, this is a system and key company, in fact, various private companies have also prepared well

, and eh, well, this gives hope, especially since part of the equipment is kept abroad for security purposes, in order to reduce these threats, part of the equipment is still so complex, and where there is artificial production, some of it is still produced to order, here we are now we can name what kind of equipment is this, these are transformers, well, basically, we are talking about yes, high-voltage transformers , that is, in fact, last winter, the russians mostly hit transformers, distribution networks, supply lines, they did not hit, well, at least there was no ammunition there were hits in the boilers, in the turbines of the thermal generation there, in fact they equally hit the generation facilities and the substations, er, it's another matter what to restore, er, in fact, the difficulties of restoration are also here and there, just here they are one, there they are different,

if we are talking about thermal power plants, then we must understand that these are morally outdated, physically worn out power plants, and indeed there were hits in the engine rooms when they were destroyed, but the work on restoration continued and there are examples of successful restoration, even after such destruction. and yes, it is more difficult to find equipment for these old units because it is morally obsolete , on the other hand, for example, coal generation had problems with financing it, because western companies, western governments do not finance coal generation, that is, it was completely on the shoulders of companies and their resources, we are talking about ukrenergo, it was easier to attract funds and help there, but in many cases the equipment is artificial, which is not

stored in warehouses, it is made to order, and the terms of its production can be there for more than a year , that is, it was also a different delivery, do you remember all the footage when they were driving, i was driving a lot, almost, almost, and i remember the events there again last winter and even already in the spring, and it was like that, i don’t know if it’s a legend, a myth, or really the truth is that our energetic actually withstood this blow, thanks to the fact that, on the one hand, although it is outdated, it was built since soviet times, and it was built in this way, with some kind of calculation for a possible war, and this possibility of electricity flow, redirection and in general physically built there... these substations with a margin of safety, it allowed them to pass through, partially withstand these blows and that, for example, if we had an energy system like the one in europe, then

no country with such equipment would survive , even like the european one, is it really so to some extent, this is so, because this power system was planned and mainly built in the soviet period, when the key criterion was not economy and economic efficiency, but indicators of reliability of work, and indeed we had a higher level of redundancy in this power system, this is one , on the other hand, we had a sufficiently high margin of safety due to the fact that our production volumes, well, electricity were significantly lower than the installed capacity, due to the fact that once before we produced and consumed more we consumed and produced less electricity. back in time, even before the war, and accordingly we are suffering from excess capacity, the second factor i mentioned was that after february 24 , 2022, consumption was additionally reduced, we

certainly lost there. in the occupied territories there are enough large capacities, yes, but the fact that we had, in addition to all that, excess capacities installed in the energy system, this also helped us get through this winter with such a result that already in february we lived without blackouts, and let's now since we moved partially to the economic component, this summer for the first time, it seems to me, in a very long time, maybe five years, they were raised. electricity tariffs for 1 hryvnia is an unpopular step for the government, and the grounding was precisely that this money goes to the restoration, energy, well, otherwise, it really helped to recover, and today’s see, well, today there were also messages from the ministry of energy, here with such letters, officially the tariffs will not be raised in the near future, i don't know, they saw it, well, it will become clear after the interview, the head of ukraine. which in the interview

said that it will be necessary to prepare for a revision of the tariff, well, the ministry, during the last year, after this increase, they said that if everything is fine, there will be no extraordinary losses in the part there, then we will not need to prepare for an increase, in fact, this thesis that the tariff increase was caused only by losses , it is not true, because in fact, the electricity tariff that we had, it did not cover, far from covering the cost of production, transmission, distribution and supply electricity. but, you yourself said that we simply inherited this energy complex from the soviet union , when ukrainians did not even think about the fact that electricity was worth something, we were used to spending a lot of electricity, not saving it, and paying little for it

pay, obviously, it also has, it has obvious risks, water, gas, electricity, yes , yes, all subsoil belong to the people, it must be looked at from another angle, because tens and tens of thousands of people work in energy companies, who also receive wages pay, who also go to stores and spend, and they also need an adequate salary, that is, we cannot where prices are rising, salaries are somehow rising, this does not happen at energy companies, and at the expense of what then to raise even salaries at energy companies , i am already silent about what is, there was also a devaluation of the currency, in our country a large component in energy is import, all nuclear fuel, it is imported ugh, it is a very expensive pleasure, very yes, but in this situation we have, that is, the key there were two donors of this low tariff, which was

companies, these are energoat and ughydroenergo, and it's trivial in energoatamu, the revenue has decreased due to the fact that the zaporizhzhya station has been lost, they earn less, accordingly, they can give less money in order to cover, uh, tariffs for transmission to distribution too are growing, and just remember how easily and quickly the decision to raise tariffs was made, er, and how much this has always been a big problem in ukraine, and this leads to how serious the problems were that the government so easily went to this step, and the ukrainians accepted it quite calmly, well, i think that it was, without alternative, well without alternative, on the one hand, a little higher feeling, the value of supply appeared, it increased, because they lived in the conditions of these blackouts, it is on the one hand, on the other hand, well, there was this message that it was necessary in order to recover, of course it played a certain role there, but it was not the only reason.

why did the government take this decision to increase the fixed price of electricity for the population, that is, you stand more in the position of the chairman here nkrr than the government? well, i am closer to the position of economically based logic, yes, i would not think about a market tariff for now, that is, i would think about a tariff that would cover all warehouses. on the one hand, and on the other hand, of course , it is necessary to normalize the system of subsidies, so that those who are financially unable to pay this bill for electricity or gas or heat, that he should pay only a certain part, of course, that this part will be be determined by those incomes that people have, because when, if the tariff, it is understated, then,

relatively speaking, understated, then: