serhiy ludenko, verdict program, let's watch together. good evening, we are from ukraine. glory to ukraine, this is the verdict program. my name is serhiy rudenko, i greet everyone and wish everyone good health. for the next two hours, we will talk about ukraine, the world, and the war. about our victory. today in the program. all power ended up in one hand. what can the management of ukraine by a few people lead to, and is our state threatened by authoritarianism? mobilization in a new way, which of the men can be returned to the military register and called up in ukraine. reassignment putin how russia is preparing for the presidential elections. about this and other things. we are talking

for the next hour with our guests, political scientist volodymyr tsybulk, diplomat oleksandr khara and officer of the armed forces of ukraine, major ihor lapin. in the second part of our program, there will be a journalism club with the participation of olga len, maryna danylyuk yarmalayeva and natalia ishchenko. however, before we start our big conversation, let's watch a video of the consequences of the impact drones of the russian invaders hitting many people. floor in kyiv and in various buildings, which it happened on the night of december 22, let's see, i heard, not what i heard, but my house shook, i looked out the window, saw from the left side. smoke was coming from our house

, but i didn't see anything else, but the sound was very strong and the vibration, the main indicator started to get nervous, we hear a hum, an explosion, we look, the pieces fly, well, you can see it. the styrofoam that was scattered there was burning, falling, and when i heard that the drone was already near the window, i followed the child, just at that time there was an explosion, and i took her out into the corridor, it happened very close, and very loudly, all the pebbles flew through the windows, at first i thought that we would not have windows, but the windows survived, for a while. well, quite powerful, because

there was an explosion in the house, so the children were scared and we immediately went down to the basement, our children were already sitting in a safe place, because the air alarm sounded before that. friends, for those who are currently watching us on youtube and facebook , please like this video and also vote in our poll, today we ask you... on whether ukraine needs a government of national unity, yes, no, please vote on youtube by choosing the option either yes or no write your comments below this video if you are sitting in front of the tv pick up your phone and vote if you support the idea of ​​a government of national unity 0800 211 381 no 0800 211382, all calls to these numbers are free, call, at the end of the program we will match under... bags

of this vote. we have our first guest, political scientist volodymyr tsibulko. mr. volodymyr, i congratulate you and i am glad to see you on our air. congratulations, glory to ukraine. to the heroes glory. mr. volodymyr, a few days ago volodymyr zelenskyy stated that his team consists of five or six people, and actually everything in the state depends on these five or six people, even the air defense. how do you feel about this revelation of zelenskyi or not? it turns out that the life of the entire state depends on these five or six people, and the ukrainians are simply hostages of these five or six people, well, i didn't say five or six, five or six, well, probably somewhere like that, sometimes five, sometimes six, well, actually this question was just a gift of god for normal politics, because a normal politician in this situation said very pathetically: "the team

is the entire ukrainian people who oppose the aggressor. unfortunately, zelensky never understood the realities of the country, so his revelation about 5-6 managers is actually perceived as the revelation about the liquidation commission of the joint-stock company of ukraine, and nothing more, that is, such a concentration of power, the inability to redistribute responsibilities, in fact always leads to disasters, there was not yet a single system that was concentrated in powers and did not know how to delegate powers and... which at the same time would drag out , so to speak, its disappearance from the horizons of life for many decades, no, that is why zelensky's system, it was called, probably, well,

to live for two or three years, covid preserved it, we see, for example, if we look back at last year, the sociology of the beginning of the year, when there were still polls, gave zelensky a rating commensurate with the rating of petro poroshenko, his main opponent, and the rating of the servant of the people was several times lower than in the party european solidarity, but the war changed something, and it turned out that the war was not a mechanism for delegating authority to many, i understand that war always leads to the concentration of power, to such ... military leadership, but military leadership is the ability to redistribute, form a team and to redistribute responsibilities, unfortunately, zelensky redistributed responsibilities in such a way that the only sphere that functions

more or less and does not fail is the army, because the hands of politicians did not reach there, where those spheres go. to which the hands reached politicians, starting with energy and ending with transport infrastructure, not to mention local self-government, here everything is very clearly, so to speak, destroyed to the core. mr. volodymyr, simultaneously with what zelensky said about his team and the management system in general, a sociological survey of the kyiv international institute of sociology appeared. and this institute asked ukrainians about the following: if a government of national unity was formed, who in your opinion could occupy the position of prime minister, what the respondents say and what they testify about the survey that

petro poroshenko is in first place in this survey, well, now we see about the attitude to the creation of a government of national unity, and now we see... from the table 25.5% petro poroshenko, zaluzhny 13.8, tymoshenko - 9, 2, shmyhal - 4.9, razumkov - 4.6, honcharenko oleksiy - from those who have already decided, that is, who were able to answer, that is, this is sociology, what do you say about this, regarding the possibility, because it is clear, that the 24th year will be quite not... however, it is unlikely that we can leave the 24th year with five or six office managers the president of ukraine, and it is clear that in the conditions when the russian federation will attack ukraine even more,

political responsibility, great political responsibility and political unity are needed, including. well, let's start with the fact, serhiy, what is expected if zelensky himself... talks about the need for mobilization, and he avoids it, he still wants to wash his hands, he says: my military demands the mobilization of 500,000 people, the military demands, so you supreme commander, don't stand aside, this is not military, you are directly military the leader is the highest in a warring country, this is the first, the second is economic problems, there are still a number of challenges and... which the current team is not in a position to overcome, if it is ready to take responsibility for mobilization for everything else, then it is very commendable, only they will fail all this, i have the feeling that now

a scenario is being searched sporadically, because after march 31 , zelensky will not have many opportunities, that is , he will not be perceived by the bureaucracy itself as a legitimate leader, that is, well, the war, of course, preserved him, but only in imagination people, he will be, so to speak, a crooked duck under any circumstances, and that's exactly it... then all responsibility for all mistakes, for all not during the war, during kovid, will begin to be transferred to him, i want to remind you that only in in the 20th year, 20, then 100,000 ukrainians died from covids, 100,000 died from covids, this is simply a disaster, and it was an absolute failure of work to combat covids, not to mention the failed work to prepare for war, let’s remember... his pathetic statements, when all of us ukrainians are a wise nation and we will all go to barbecue in april,

well, to be honest, this is some kind of style that is connected with a parallel reality, and there was a lot of such parallel reality at the press conference, but when it comes to the government of national unity, then it seems to me that this is one of the traps that the government itself has set for itself, because... let's remember when there were parliamentary readings in transcarpathia, the so-called monet readings, a memorandum on the postponement of elections was already concluded there, as a rule, when they are postponed elections, then again on a new parliamentary coalition is coming to the surface, which signs a whole national program for the period between, well... the current and future elections and implements this program

due to the fact that it is now impossible for society to vote for some, well, postulate the programs of this or that party and delegate one or another party governing the country, but as time begins to pass further and further, and the behavior of the servants reminds me very much, frankly, of some such maneuver at the end, in order to try to keep everything as it is, but again, well, restyling, keeping completely this union from opzzh, undeclared, but restyling and somehow calling it a government of national unity, they have a minister, a voter, then they can at any turn pull out a map and say, look, isn't this unity , there is a voice , there is a servant, they still

need to include someone from opzzh in the government and call it a government of unity, it will be a parody of which, they very often resorted to such substitutions of concepts, and here i am, it seems to me that they are ready to change concepts again, to make yermak the prime minister, and stefanchuk... not the president, zelensky will be, well, the supreme deity and that's all, but how can they make ruslan stefanchuk the president, if there is a complete list of how to make the president, what he has 31 on march 24 , the term of his presidential powers comes to light, this does not mean anything yet, we can recall, for example, 2004 and 2000. when kuchma, in principle, before acquiring the powers of the new president, he was already the president, that is

, it did not happen that in his 31-year-old authority expired and that's all, it's just different here circumstances, but it is really possible to stay, only it will not in any way keep, so to speak, the state apparatus in a mobile state, it will start to crawl. to move around the party apartments, seeing that the servant of the people party no longer has any electoral prospects, and the other parties have not shown themselves, and here the spread will begin, that is, the functionality of the state apparatus will begin to fall, so i think they should, well, make such a feint in order to preserve the governance of the country, on the one hand, and on the other hand, there is a constant request for restoration , so to speak constitutionalism in the country, because the model

of the state cultivated by yarmak and zelenskyi to date does not suit everyone, starting with local self-government. well , concluding the event, because it is clear that the powers that andriy yarmak currently has, a person who was not elected, and no one gives him authority, except for the president of ukraine, well, they are separate in that respect. as they say, the tracks that they conduct, individual tracks, i would like to see written assignments, because it's even funnier that it all exists in oral form. and it means that the state apparatus is not working. mr. volodymyr, one more issue is quite important, and obviously attention should be paid to the communication between the authorities and society, that is, it is clear that before announcing the mobilization of 500,000 men, before changing the legislation on mobilization and

demobilization, before calling people who left go abroad to rush back and come to the armed forces, obviously there should be some kind of broad communication between the government and society, and not in the way that, well, let's say this, the president once a year goes to the annual press conference, and the impression is that he came out of his office somewhere or out of the bunker there and suddenly said, said something and left somewhere again, that is , is this communication, which is now between the authorities in the form of what ... daytime videos, which president zelensky is trying to articulate, and whether or not there is a need for broader communication with the people, we need to talk, because it is clear that next year will be decisive in the russian-ukrainian war, and this year, how will this year pass and what the results will be of the 24th year, depends, among other things, on how people are

will understand what, what, what is happening in the country, and if they will talk to them ... properly and i mean frankly, then the result may be completely different. mr. sergey, this is an absolutely essential point. the fact is that the detachments weaned people from perceiving the government as an accountable, controlled institution. that is, instead of honest, honest reports about organizations, well, about the work of the state apparatus, about the adoption of certain decisions, we are constantly pushed to the sidelines. well, this is, so to speak, a lyric, but this reporting well, the institutional reporting of the state apparatus, it is destroyed into rubbish , for example, the story from the ministry of defense, where, well , uah 33 billion disappeared, in the first months of the war, it is so, the society has never heard

the answer, who dispersed this money, who signed the payments and so on, but... every day, they put out the wards. in fact, why did the topic of the national government of national unity arise? because, if professional patriotic parties such as european solidarity enter such a government, it is european solidarity that has a lot of experience cooperation in the coalition. and it seems to me that european solidarity will be the force that will insist on signing a clear agreement. coalition agreement, where the program of this coalition's activities will be formed for the period when it is impossible to hold elections and change, well, the composition of the parliament, then changes, then the program is signed, and in a certain way it is a substitute for these democratic elections, and we

see what the coalition's program, program principles will be introduced by certain parties. then , in accordance with the program principles, they will be able to delegate people to the coalition government, but it seems to me that there is one problem in the current bankuyu, her surname is poroshenko, where the surname poroshenko is heard, it throws the government into some irrational model of behavior, despite the fact that poroshenko says very important things and does very useful things at all international playgrounds in... the authorities, without stopping, put sticks in the wheels not only for him personally, but for the entire european solidarity faction, but i would like the current authorities to listen to the experienced ones and adopt some rational ideas, well it seems that this is an emotional factor, psycho-emotional, and it very strongly blocks

any creation of a coalition of national unity. thank you, mr. volodymyr, it was volodymyr. political scientist, i wish you happy holidays and a new year, we will meet in 2024 on the air, each other, friends, we work live on the tv channel, as well as on our platforms on youtube and facebook, for those who are currently watching us live on youtube , please like this video, don't be stingy because your like will promote this content in youtube trends, besides, take participation in our voting. today we ask you about the following: does ukraine need a government of national unity? yes, no, please vote on youtube with two functions, or options, yes, no, choose, and you can write. comment under this video, and if you watch us on tv, pick up your smartphone and vote if you think ukraine needs a government of national unity? 0800-211-381, no,

0800-211-382, all calls to these numbers are free, we will sum up the results of this vote at the end of the program. then in we are in touch with a diplomat, expert on foreign and security policy of the center for defense strategies oleksandr khare. sir i congratulate you and thank you for being with us today , good evening, mr. serhiy, thank you for the invitation, first of all i congratulate you on the day of the diplomat, today is the day of the ukrainian diplomat, therefore my most sincere congratulations, thank you and of course to all colleagues who are abroad and in ukraine, they defend on, let's say, well, in peacetime, we say the first line of defense, because in fact, a lot depends on them and the impossibility, well, now of course international support and that. in order for us to survive and become a european state, let's talk about international support, starting with the visit to ukraine of the minister

of foreign affairs of poland in the new government, radoslaw sikorski, he arrived in kyiv, there is already information that he met with the president of ukraine volodymyr zelensky , you can see on twitter that he wrote about the fact that in the morning he was already in kyiv, and the president of ukraine. did not thank sikorsky for poland's support of ukraine in countering a full-scale russian invasion and providing shelter to ukrainian citizens who were fleeing hostilities, but despite the fact that sikorsky arrived in kyiv in a symbolic manner, and this is his first visit abroad after being appointed as the minister of foreign affairs of poland, information appears again that on ride there are about 4,000 trucks to ukraine, the blocking of the ukrainian-polish border again, you can explain how, with the right

diplomatic messages, this blocking of the only large western border, the only western window that exists in ukraine, where the polish authorities are responsible. for all this, but where are the sincere demands of the protesters who protest, come and cause billions of dollars in damage to ukraine, despite the fact that the polish government helps us, those people, those who moved to poland refugees, and and and in the same time, causing such damage in ukraine? well, first of all, of course, this is a very important visit, and you know, i would draw a parallel with the fact that the first... visit of the newly appointed foreign minister of the united kingdom, it was kyiv, not to some other capital, the same with sikorsky, what a great friend ukraine is, but also we

must always remember that there are national interests of every state and they protect them, well, by and large sikorsky himself said today that between friends can have disagreements in secondary or economic terms, and that is precisely why, in order to solve them, he came not alone, but with the ministers who are in... actually responsible for these fields, it was very interesting to read the statements of the minister of rural affairs of the economy, which says that we have solve the problem of oversaturation of ukrainian agricultural products in europe in general and ukraine in particular, so we see that this government will also defend its interests quite pragmatically, but of course there will be no such politicization as we saw in the last one. the period of the previous government, let's see how sincerely, let's say, they are ready to make certain concessions, although by and large all these problems that we have with poland now, well

, first and foremost, they are due to the fact that the russian federation carried out its aggression against us, and continues its aggression against us, previously blocked the counters, and that is precisely why we had to redirect the flow of our goods through poland and other countries. and of course the fact that ukraine is acting within the framework of those agreements and the agreement on a comprehensive deep free trade area, as well as those additional agreements that were reached between ukraine and european partners after the large-scale invasion, so let's see how it will fit in with what they want from us poles enter the general framework with the eu, and those agreements that exist, and what they want, let's say, in addition to this. viktor rorban, the trojan horse of the european union, stated that the ukrainian community is not ready for ukraine's accession to the european

union, in an interview with uhorsky tv channel. of the hungarian tv channel novosti tv, he stated that, well, you don't have to be a scientist to understand that this decision will bring a lot of harm. let's hear what orbán said. you don't need to be a scientist to understand what the decision to start negotiations on ukraine's accession to the eu will bring a lot of damage we are not prepared. we do not know the current numerical indicators. we are talking about the country on whose territory they stand. russian soldiers, we will accept them too, what territory are we talking about, what population size, mr. oleksandr, orban always tries to manipulate, because it is clear what the number of ukrainians is, he knows what territory is recognized by the world, and this territory is within that territory, which was acquired by ukraine after the restoration of independence in 1991. year, taking into account

what happened on the 14th-15th in brussels, it is meant how orbán went out somewhere to drink coffee and this decision was made there without him, orbán continues to be a problem for the european union, is he still trying to rehabilitate himself in front of vladimir putin, because what happened on the 14th in brussels happened exactly the same the day when volodymyr highly praised orban and fico. well, first of all, it should be said , you know, as pajana said that either padishah or ishak will die, then of course, when ukraine is ready to join the european union, such a person will already be on the political map of hungary or there will definitely be no europe, and by the way, the same sikorsky said that he wants to see ukraine a member of the european union by the end of this decade, that is, in principle, according to such optimistic forecasts

, we have six years to... fully approach the european standards, and of course to end this war with victory. the fact that , let's say, he made certain concessions, taking into account the pressure that was exerted, and on the other hand, bribery, the unbooking of certain, let's say, funds that the european union will provide to hungary, this is one story, because all know that the europeans, european integration is a long process, but blocking it until... i can now, which we need in order not to lose in this war and, on the contrary, to have a positive result, this, i think, is more important, let's say so , putin received from his junior partner or a person who is trying to be under the nato security umbrella, and in those favorable economic conditions, i mean , let's say, serve as putin's ambassador in the interior and undermine the foundations. union, but even

so it is a problem, and of course that's it the possibility of how to solve this problem is being considered, either to deprive the right to vote, this is in european legislation , or in a more strategic perspective to change the mechanisms by which decisions are made in the european union, that is, this is the orbán factor, he has already fined the europeans and the rest of the europeans, rethink decision-making mechanisms, well, it is clear that now at stake... 50 billion euros, which the european union should allocate, or vote for the allocation of the european union in the ukrainian state, and once again , orban is standing in the way of these 50 billion euros, this is, in your opinion, banal political, political jealousy and financial jealousy, because it is clear that hungary, despite what they say, well, what is there, what is ukraine,

what is it ? goes to the european union with its problems, but hungary poses more problems for the european union, because it is a small country, it does not have a developed agriculture, as in ukraine, and it is, in principle, not even commensurate territories, disproportionate sizes and disproportionate economies, and it is clear that without the money that the european union is currently promising and is going to provide to ukraine, in... in principle, well, it might have lived in a completely different way, and we are talking about the fact that you are taking hungary from the same basket from which ukraine is also given, right? well, in principle, yes, of course, that the move is one, and it can be cut into different pieces, and, of course, that in the future we will have certain frictions both with poland and with other countries that have...