club olga musafirova and yanina sokolova will be on our air, so wait for our broadcast, we start at 8 p.m., don't miss it, goodbye, three days of negotiations and a meeting with xi jinping, why did biden's adviser go to beijing, is there a warming of relations the usa and china and whether chinese support for moscow will decrease, we talk about it on the bbc, i'm inna kosynska. national security advisor to the us president , jake sullivan, has completed his visit to beijing. western media write that it was an attempt to ease tensions between the two countries. well and besides, another step to maintain contacts with china, which have been established relatively recently. xijin ping greeted sullivan at the house of people's assembly with a warm smile and a long handshake. and he said that china

is interested in stable relations with the usa. while both countries and sino -us relations are undergoing major changes, china's commitment to a stable, healthy, sustainable sino-us relationship remains unchanged. the principle of maintaining these relations, which is based on mutual respect, peaceful coexistence and mutually beneficial cooperation remains unchanged. a strong defense posture, sovereignty, taiwan and trade issues were topics discussed during the three-day talks, and another important topic was the preparation for a possible meeting between xi jinping and joe biden. details of when exactly their meeting may take place have not been disclosed, but it is known that the heads of state will call in the coming weeks.

ukraine was among the topics raised during the visit, and this is what sullivan answered when asked if they discussed how to stop the war we had the opportunity to exchange views on the war against ukraine during the last three days. we have not achieved any concrete diplomatic plan, largely because the us strictly adheres to a simple principle: nothing about ukraine without ukraine. ukraine. will decide how it wants to conduct diplomacy and negotiations. but what this meeting is about and why the representative of the united states came to china, right now bbc correspondent laura bicker from beijing is analyzing. two main points can be distinguished from this visit. first, it is that there will be a phone call between president xi and president biden in the coming weeks. this could set the stage for their final meeting. mr. sullivan during press conference, when i

asked him, said, "look, they have opportunities to meet, and it's very likely that it will happen, so this could be the last meeting between the leaders of the two superpowers before president biden leaves the white house. and it kind of establishes his legacy. i think he wants to be known as someone who tried to build alliances across asia and cooperate with china where possible diplomatically. the second moment of this trip, jake sullivan was the first assistant. biden, who met with a high-ranking general here in china. general zhang is a close aide to president xi. they met to talk about communication between the military. that's what's important, because in hot spots around the world, from the taiwan strait to the south china sea, the two armies are coming closer to each other, and what they're trying to do here is reduce the risk, find a way that they will be able to negotiate and avoid miscalculations and misunderstandings. so, i would say that there are two key ones. moments from these

three days of negotiations, and finally, i would note that the tone of these meetings has changed. 16 months ago , there was almost no communication between the united states and china after a chinese spy balloon flew over north america and was shot down there. we spoke about this incident with the us ambassador here in poquina and he said that after those events it was very difficult to arrange a meeting with any a chinese official. and so we see three days of negotiations, the tone of which appears to be almost conciliatory. it's clear that both sides have had heated words, but they manage to find ways to talk to each other. it is also worth mentioning that relations between the us and china have been strained for a long time. analysts feared the development of a new cold war. in particular through taiwan. china considers taiwan a breakaway province and wants it back, while the taiwanese want a separate state, a cornerstone of sino-us relations. the usa is

taiwan's most important friend and only ally. the results are quite disappointing. negotiations with the military gave at least a good result. he had a pli'. a meeting with zhangshaa, the vice chairman of china's central military commission, who is one of the very few senior military commanders who survived the recent purges, so this is a very important contact, and one of the proposals currently being discussed is to establish lines of communication at the military commander level between china and the united states. this is very, very important for the settlement of potential crisis situations, because we are dealing with a structural confrontation that will change on the other hand, and on the other hand, centers of escalation, such as the south china sea or the taiwan strait, and it is important for the future to properly regulate them. as for the future contact between xi and biden, they promise to organize

at least a telephone conversation before the elections in november. the chinese closely monitor what is happening in american politics. and the rather new idea that kamela harris can become the president of the united states has returned their interest to summit with joe biden, because although they are different people, the chinese perceive them as representatives of the same political camp, and would prefer to better understand what they should prepare for, should we expect any changes in politics, and what exactly? are they already less focused on the possible return of trump? speaking of things that are unlikely to change, the chinese asked the americans... to stop arming taiwan, it won't. the united states is committed to strengthening taiwan's defense capabilities. for their part, the americans want the chinese to stop to support russian aggression in ukraine. and i'm not sure that it will be like that. we have something

with which the parties can reproach each other and which will not change. and on the other hand, there is something that the parties are able to control in order to prevent bilateral escalation and the emergence of a new one. crises in the tropics. recently, we have seen some extremely aggressive actions by the chinese against the philippines in the south china sea, and the philippines is an ally of the united states and has a treaty with them. freedom of navigation is another item on the agenda: how far are american warships ships can approach china's territorial waters in the taiwan strait? these are the elements of negotiations that the parties can agree on, even when... this was columnist isabelle hilton's opinion on why sullivan's meeting with china's top military leadership is so important and why maintaining contact between the us -china military is shackled such attention

now. in general, the united states is already concerned about the relationship between china and russia. the leader of the people's republic of china, xi jinping , has met with putin several times since the beginning a full-scale invasion. was in moscow, and then putin in beijing. after western countries imposed sanctions against russia, beijing became a key supplier of cars, clothes, raw materials and other goods to russia. last year, the trade turnover of russia and china set a historical record and exceeded 240 billion dollars, which is 64% more than before the full-scale war. even now, the country continues to buy oil from russia, in particular, although it has recently reduced imports. siedin ping promised that china will always be good. partner of russia. so, the last one sometimes something has changed. as reported by the western media, russian companies are facing difficulties in trade with china. after another round of american sanctions , it has become difficult and sometimes impossible to make direct payments from china to russia. so it became

more expensive to trade due to the increase in the costs of making payments. but, returning to the visit of adviser biden to beijing, one of the main topics of the negotiations was trade. china is interested. to allow new trade warriors from the usa, and why this meeting has so much symbolism, explains yuka kobayaschi, cat expert and a lecturer in international politics at the school of oriental and african studies in london. let's listen. there is a lot of symbolism in this visit of jake sullivan to beijing. for the first time, the national security adviser has arrived in the chinese capital in the last 8 years since 2016. so the symbolism of why jake sullivan came there right now is significant, if you look at this visit in light of the presidential election in the united states, which will be held in a few months, it shows that the priority of the americans is the security relationship with china , given the tensions around the taiwan strait and the south china sea.

a very interesting trajectory can be followed in us-china relations from the trump administration to the biden administration. high hopes were placed on biden's presidency. on the equalization of relations between the us and china, and we observe a certain consistency in us policy towards china. i mean communication, early on in the negotiations, blinkin's visit to... china was actually canceled because of the balloon incident over us territory. therefore in communication between the us and china has been a major strain for the biden administration. smoothing ties with china was a constant challenge. this does not mean that there was no communication between them. for example, wang gee and jake salvan met five times last year. not only in china and the usa, but also within the group of 20 there were initiatives in this regard. between the two countries, but from the point of view of tension, we are seeing its growth

around the indo-pacific region, and not only that, if you look at the war in ukraine, you can see very close relations between china and russia, which creates a challenge for the united states, but it is not only about traditional military issues, such as developments in the gas sector, ukraine and the indo-pacific region. we also see trade and economic security on the agenda. and at the very end, han lin, director of the shanghai-based think tank irzha group, described the significance of sullivan's visit to china. national security adviser jake sullivan's visit to china is both historic and meaningful. if you look at last year's the meeting between presidents xi and biden in san francisco, then before and after this event we saw a constant flow of contacts between. the american and chinese sides, so sullivan's visit emphasizes how important

it is to talk, and his visit also paves a political way for further interaction between the lower-ranking institutions of both countries, so that they continue to interact with each other, because the problems of today are very complex and concern not only the united states and china , but also the rest of the world. it is already one thing that he is here in beijing, that he had a meeting with the deputy head of the central military commission, should be considered. as a great success, because it is necessary to maintain the continuity of communications in order to reduce the risk that any misunderstandings or distortions will lead to conflict. the problems in us-china relations are complex, they will not be solved simply or easily, but it is important to maintain dialogue and jointly seek ways of cooperation, say, in those areas that are less controversial, such as climate change or law enforcement cooperation. the differences between them... on a number of issues are striking, whether it is relations with russia or politics in the middle east, etc. take

this example, the united states in its notice of negotiations says that technology should not undermine the security of the united states, and it will continue restrictive actions in this direction, while trying not to harm investment and trade. if you look at it from the chinese side, they want the us to stop suppressing china in areas such as technology. economy and so on, so the difference between the parties is great, but the fact that they recognize the existence of this difference, and at the same time continue to work in those issues wherever possible is already a success, however small, so national security adviser jake sullivan wrapped up his three-day visit to china, the first visit by a us national security adviser to beijing in eight years, in what experts interpret as a warming. in relations between the united states and china. salevan held meetings with the chinese leader, the

foreign minister and other high-ranking officials. they discussed, in particular , russia's war against ukraine, although they did not reach concrete decisions on this issue. and they agreed on a phone call between the leaders countries, which will take place in the coming weeks. the chinese side noted that beijing is committed to stable relations with washington. so, subscribe to our pages in social networks so as not to miss... more important news , we are on facebook, instagram and tiktok, on youtube you can watch our news release if you suddenly missed it on the air, and we will see you tomorrow at 21 hours kyiv time and look for more stories on our website bbc.ua and on our pages in social networks. see you tomorrow, all the best.

viewers of the tv channel, we will broadcast there and get back to you. greetings to all viewers of the tv channel, we are starting our traditional thursday broadcast, we are working live. and i say to you, glory to ukraine , glory to the heroes, today we honor the memory of all defenders who died in the struggle for the independence of ukraine, these are all those who fight in the east of ukraine, this day was so memorable that it was introduced in 2019, it is important for us to remember the feat of every soldier who gave his life, those who are now giving their

health and those who continue to defend you and i, this is very important, we traditionally start the conversation with vitaly. we have already started it, we have already talked about some topics, you can watch it on our youtube channel says velikiy lviv, there will be a full version. mr. vitaly, there is more information about belarus, here is the information that the belarusian dictator oleksandr lukashenko continues to declare that he is withdrawing troops to the border with ukraine. of course, the ministry of foreign affairs of ukraine reported that according to the intelligence agencies of ukraine, and the armed forces of belarus under the guise of exercises are concentrating significant number personnel, weapons, military equipment. what can we expect from belarus? we return to this question every time, but here again, this is their collective operation that they do with the russian federation, as a country that helps them, we talk about it like that, because that is how it is, or so for now nothing in principle

threatens us from there, what do you think about it? i think that lukashenko... cannot refuse putin when putin demands that he concentrate belarusian troops on our border in order to draw ukrainian forces away from important for russia directions of battles, primarily from donetsk, kharkiv and kursk. but at the same time , we understand that lukashenko himself is not interested in his troops crossing the ukrainian border. because he understands that there may be a reaction from ukraine, because it is clear that the belarusian army is not the army that will, first of all, have an effective ability to defend itself in the event that the ukrainian army strikes in response, and it is not known whether the belarusian servicemen will want to fight at all with ukrainians, as you know, the mood in belarusian society is fundamentally different from that of russia, russian society supports president putin and the war, belarusian society does not support lukashenko and the war, this was also known

in 2020, when there was a massive uprising against the onion... which ended simply with the victory of the power structures, dictatorships, and because thousands of people are in prison there, and these people have, as you understand, relatives, friends who cannot sympathize with such an essentially occupation regime, so lukashenko did not can be sure of the strength of his regime if he starts a real war, and by the way, he cannot be sure that putin will protect him in this situation, because it is not known whether putin has the strength to fight on the belarusian side as well. donetsk, kharkiv, kherson, zaporizhzhya, kursk, even belarusian? as we understand, this is not what putin would like, so by and large it is necessary to scare us from the belarusian direction first, and not to attack from the belarusian direction, at least that's how it looks now. as are you wondering, what is putin's plan now, because we

talked a lot about the fact that this kurdish operation, well... it blew him away, let's just say, we didn't expect, didn't calculate, didn't calculate that ukrainian forces would go there, we see that our fighters continue to remain there and remain as long as our, operational headquarters, and our military leadership deem it necessary, and what russia can do now, of course, we saw monday’s shelling and understand that they are gathering missiles and trying to attack us like this in a way, well , shake it from all sides, what else? it may be that you are you watching now? i think that russia will continue its offensive in the donetsk direction until it is stopped there. it will continue to try to advance in the direction of kharkiv until it is stopped there, these are the two main directions. when it becomes clear to the russians that they can no longer achieve anything serious in

the donetsk and kharkiv directions, they will be able to transfer from there the forces that ... the group that will be created in the kurt region in order to knock it out from there ukrainian troops. at the same time, russia will use all possible measures to further destroy ukrainian infrastructure, to try to freeze ukraine, to try to depopulate ukrainian cities, to create a situation in which hundreds of thousands of new ukrainians will be forced to leave the borders of our country in order to survive in neighboring countries. because russia wants to gain over ukraine not only political and military. but also a demographic victory. the less population will remain in ukraine at the end of the war, even if russia does not will succeed in conquering the entire territory of ukraine, the better the position of the russian federation will be in the future. in the world, because in her russia this historical task is very important, to turn ukraine from such a political and, i would say, national competitor of russia,

into such a european dwarf that can even own a large territory, but is not capable of having a large population to live on this territory, that is, relatively speaking, russia now needs not only to fight with ukraine, but to turn it from germany into slovakia. this is also an important task that putin and his generals are engaged in when they fire. of our infrastructure, not only for our capitulation, but also for the reduction of the population, so that in the future ukraine could never be any competitor of russia, any example, any alternative, even for the former soviet republics, and for russia to finally establish itself in the post-soviet space, and maybe on the european one, as the obvious hegemon, and this is putin's wish, whether you will be able to implement them, i am not sure, but he will do everything possible to achieve this goal in the 20s, and maybe ... in the 30s of our century, i don't think he has enough strength and resources, i think he has already proven it unrealistic with the collapse

of blitzkrieg in 2022, he will still make a lot of mistakes in the following years of the russian-ukrainian war, but this is a dangerous, serious enemy to confront with which a long confrontation will take place, one must prepare and be aware of all the dangers that are associated with it. with putin himself, with the czech regime, as well as with the imperial sentiments of the majority the majority of citizens of the russian federation. thank you for these answers. vitaly portnikov, journalist, writer, tv presenter, publicist, political spectator was with us in this part of our program. then i go to the studio, where our guests are also there, both military and politicians, we will continue to talk about the same topics, develop this opinion, analyze what is happening. greetings, gentlemen, and ready to introduce to our audience who is with us today? volodymyr rutkovskyi,

nickname buddha, russian-ukrainian veteran war, ambassador of the rehabilitation center ambroken, i welcome you, not the first time in our studio, but glad to see you. oksana yuranets, with us, people's deputy of ukraine of the eighth convocation, former head of the permanent delegation of ukraine to the nato parliamentary assembly. vitaly smilka is with us. also a serviceman of the armed forces of ukraine, head of the ato union of horodochchyna. mykola knyazhytskyi is with us, people's deputy of ukraine from european solidarity, co-chairman of the group on inter-parliamentary relations with the republic of poland. yuriy podlisny is with us, the manager department of political sciences of the ukrainian catholic university. good evening. and andrii andreykiv, candidate of legal sciences, military-political expert, member of the aspen club of ukraine. vitaly portnikov and i have already started. to talk about what to expect from the russian federation now, as he sees how russia uses all opportunities to put pressure on us, and we

understand that this pressure is there, our military also talks about it, we talk about it quite frankly in public field, what they allow and what they consider necessary inform our servicemen, we will soon have a shutdown from the pokrovsk direction, there is information from the soldiers that it is difficult there now, how difficult it is. and we will definitely hear the details from there, so stay with us, also at the beginning of sportnikov's conversation, we touched on the topic of durov and the telegram, because we talked about it more than once in this studio of ours, and by the way, mr. knyazhytskyi often talked about that , that telegram is dangerous, you need to do something with it and pay attention to it, don't be there, here is now the story of durov, when he is in france, as a citizen france is detained, many suspicions related to his activities are put forward to him. the telegram will be tried, he has already been fined, well, the story here is that it is important for us that we, as a state, as ukrainians

, will continue to do with the telegram, does it remain a platform for us to receive information, is it possible for us to use it somehow prohibit. president zelensky partially answered this question at the press conference, he said that he would be quite careful about limiting any resources at all, and his... answer in principles can be understood. we are currently broadcasting on the youtube channel, says velikiy lviv, and asked ukrainians whether they are ready to give up the telegram channel, how to use it to find out news, because it is not one platform, you can find out in many other ways. please vote and we will pay attention to it, at least we can discuss it. mr. knyazhytskyi, what do you think, what is your opinion about this, what to do about it? well, i introduced a bill to that effect. today we had a committee meeting, and, well unfortunately, it is customary in our country that if opposition deputies submit bills, they are not passed, that is why i submitted

the bill. about prohibiting the activities of the russian orthodox church, it was not passed for a very long time, then we agreed with our colleagues that we would take the governmental and main point of the draft law and add it, actually rewrite it, then it was passed, now we are doing the same with the law on the regulation of social networks, even non- social networks networks, and those networks that distribute information, this can apply not only to telegram, there are many of them networks, we know that elon musk bought the x platform, the former twitter, with the money of a company where russians work, for example, it can also be used against us, tiktok. which belongs to china is also used against ukraine, obviously there are certain european rules, that is, the state has the right to turn to this network and demand that anti-state things be removed from this network, as well as to inform who is its owner, founder, at the expense of which money they live, because it's a matter of national security if they don't do, the state has several mechanisms, one mechanism, the one proposed in my draft law, is to prohibit the use of telegram by all civil

servants, state bodies... and there, as well as those who transfer personal data. there is also a very important technological story here, due to the fact that since telegram's servers are located on the territory of russia, it is necessary to understand that this is not a business, yes, it is a large unprofitable company, subsidies for this company amount to 600 to 700 million dollars a year. does anyone give this money? they give russian oligarchs, ostensibly with the aim of returning this money to them if it goes to the stock exchange sometime in the future, but there are no such prerequisites. the problem is that... telegram, in addition to the fact that it is generally controlled only by the russian federation, because durovo himself was in the russian federation more than 50 times, 50-60 there are different data from the 14th year, and all of them are there now defend him, piskov defends him, the vice-speakers of the state duma defend him, everyone suddenly came to his defense, because on the one hand it is supposed to be freedom and will, but what is freedom and will, just imagine to himself that there is a driver who transports criminals and killers in his car. and then

rapists, and then some other swindlers who oppose society, he says: i don’t rob, i don’t rape, i don’t kill, that’s how i drive, that’s how i know that they are criminals and killers, that’s how i secretly kill them i drive my fast car, what will happen, obviously such a person will be an accomplice, and he will be charged with exactly the same thing, because the state tells the driver, drive where you want, drive whom you want, but if you see a crime, do not participate in the crime, but since there is no moderation in telegram, they do not do all this. is controlled by russia, then obviously there is a very big danger not only for us, because not only france has filed cases, several other european countries, belgium, in particular, several other european countries have also filed cases against durov, there are countries that deal with this outside of europe, for example, south korea, for example, india and many other countries, they are all worried about this, because the response to the public, to the public demand

should be: all these countries do not fight. russia, a we are at war with russia. what is the problem? in russia , telegram is used by 50% of the population. in ukraine, 80%. that is, it is actually a network created for ukraine. but our government, when it saw that it was so big, that so many people were using it, it transferred all its propaganda and political resources there. all these anonymous rascals who scold the opposition, praise the government, they are all there. and the authorities are interested in this site, why? because there are no restrictions. you can talk about anyone you don't like. write any lies and no one will even check it, and you can’t take it away from there, you can write an appeal on facebook or youtube, and they are regulated by our legislation, our media law, and telegram is not regulated, and you can’t take it away, and the russians they are using this weakness of our government, and they are pushing a huge amount of propaganda there, in addition, they are collecting information from every mobile phone where telegram is located, and telegram is not for nothing politically writing that they arrested the minister of communications of the russian army,

because the rockets are outside. through telegram, the russian military communicates through telegram, they are forbidden to do this, and when they capture ours, even if they delete telegram, and they are forced to do it, they are shown the downloads of the servers, because this information is stored on the servers, yes, i can explain for a long time technically how it happens, if in the signal you wrote to each other, then the information from one phone went to another, and there is no server between them, there is a server here, on which all this information is collected, even if you issued a telegram, it can still be used against you. in short, there are a lot of dangers, and i suggested even before all these scandals, it was a long time ago, actually quite a soft way, don't promote it, if government officials don't use it, you go to the bank, you take action and they do not offer you to communicate with telegram through a chat bot, but find another way, at least it will not be such a popularization of it, because i previously did not want us to ban it for the population, well, the parliament cannot do that, the national council can do that security, as it happened.