precipitation is not predicted, what will happen next, what will the beginning of august be like in general, will there be frosts, which we mentioned, of course, we will carefully monitor the development of the synoptic situation every day and carefully monitor the detailed weather forecasts on the espresso channel. good evening, we are from ukraine. exclusively on the air of our channel. congratulations, friends, the politclub program is on the air on the espresso tv channel. the most relevant topics of the week. nato member countries have huge arsenals, and russia is already on the verge of exhausting its resources, topics that cause resonance in our society. this is the question of trump's victory, what is it? analysis of the processes that change the country and each of us. what else can the russians do, are they able to use, let's say, the resources there. vitaliy

portnikov and the guests of the project read the entire text, accept my singer, thank you, it was difficult, but i was just interested, but it was absolutely not, help to understand the present and predict the future, offered the united states to conclude a bilateral security agreement with us , a project for those who care and think about the political club every sunday 20:00 for espresso. today in the program is the verdict with serhiy rudenko. sino-brazilian peace plan. consultations between the us and china regarding russian aggression in ukraine have reached an impasse . is it in vain that ukraine insists on the participation of representatives of russia? at the upcoming

global peace summit. untie the hands of the armed forces. the head of european diplomacy, joseph borel , calls for the abolition of restrictions on the use of western weapons by ukraine. will yermak's list of russian targets convince the biden administration? we need more patriots. minister of foreign affairs dmytro kuleba. reproached the western partners for the lack of haste in the supply of air defense systems, which could lead the nato allies to close the sky over the western regions of ukraine. glory to ukraine, this is the verdict program, my name is serhii rudenko, i congratulate everyone and wish everyone good health. for the next two hours, we will talk about ukraine, the world, the war, and our victory. in the first

part of our program, we will have a big foreign and domestic political evening with valery chaly, diplomat and politician. in the second part of our program with at 21:15 we will have a journalist club of yanina sokolova and olga musafirova. we will sum up the week's foreign policy and domestic policy results. let's talk about zelenskyi's one and a half hour press conference, which he held. this week and communication with journalists, how he communicated, what he talked about, about president zelenskyi's team, especially since this week marks exactly five years since the ukrainian parliament, which was elected in 2019, began work, in short, there will be many topics for conversation , then, before starting our big one today's conversation, i suggest you watch a video of the consequences of another missile terrorist... act of the russian federation

in kharkiv, unfortunately, at least six people died as a result of the attack on a residential high-rise in kharkiv, among them one child who was on the playground, 47 people were injured, for attack on civilians, the russians used a guided aerial bomb, let's see.

eternal memory to those who died at the hands of the russian occupiers, and death to the russian occupiers. friends, in addition to the tv broadcast, we also work on our platforms in youtube and on facebook, for those who are watching us live there now, please subscribe to our pages, take part in our survey, today we ask you this, are you satisfied with the communication? the president with society, the president of ukraine, it means, uh, if you watch us on youtube, put yes, no, vote, or leave your comment under this video, if you watch us on tv, pick up your smartphone and phone or phone and vote on 0800 211 381 if communication

the president is with you, with society you are satisfied, and no 0800 211 382, ​​i want to introduce... our first guest today is valery chaly, diplomat, politician, ambassador, extraordinary plenipotentiary ambassador of ukraine to the united states of america in 2015-19, chairman board of the ukrainian crisis media center, mr. valery, thank you for coming to our studio, i congratulate you, i congratulate you, glory to ukraine, glory to the heroes, well, first of all, let's talk about the victory plan, because this victory plan is already in the announcement of president zelenskyi. .. said that in september there will be of the united states of america at the un general assembly and will meet with the president of the united states of america, joseph biden, and this victory plan will also be presented to the two presidential candidates, trump and haris, and so far ukrainians know what

the victory plan will be, what it is is not yet clear either, but judging by zelenskyi's rhetoric, this should still be a plan. not peace negotiations with the russian federation, a plan to force russia into peace. you know, we actually have a peace formula that, well a position that you can agree with, and if you add certain accents to it, it can be a winning plan. in fact, with such an ambitious statement, announcement, of course. if it really is about a general, obviously general, not about any details, the general approach is political, then first it would be necessary to talk about it in ukraine, it would be unnecessary for the president to go out, maybe to the parliament, with

a message, by the way, it would be possible to go out, it would be appropriate for the people, well , the president's message is announced in our parliament, it can be serious as part of the preparations. discussion on scenarios, and it is a constitutional duty, by the way, of the president, annually, of course, and this position is not reversed during war, the fact is that it has been ignored sometimes and not during war, so, well, let's say not during a large-scale invasion, but it would be appropriate, and it would be possible to talk about it first, because actually the plan of victory, if we talk, yes, without the people, without the parliament. without a wide range, without the military, what is the plan, it will be strange if we hear it somewhere from washington, that is, it will be very strange, but more will be worse, here is what is being declared now, i, how can i tell you, well, if

it is true that they are going to give this plan separately to joseph biden, the current president, kamela harris, as the vice presidential candidate to donald trump, well.. . it means, you know, not a plan, but such a general document, some theses, well, like a peace formula, yes, 10 positions, well, in principle, in principle, to convey it all, it is called a nonpaper, it is conveyed as your political position, and someone says, but how so, all three will be something one and the same, and one and the same the same should be the case, because they have already started to say, let's pass different things to them, something for trump . kamal harris for her, joseph biden, something else. in fact, i think that's why this story is happening now. we all understand that we understood somewhere, and the mood was such that something will happen in the fall . well, the elections in the united states,

november 5, putin is waiting for these elections, which in principle is partially true, they made november 5 a sacred date, although it is not, because the elections are on the 5th, and only on january 20. inauguration, and what's more, we are with you they said here that not only the name of the president is important, but also the configuration that will be in power in the usa, and in general, how calmly they will pass the election period, well, that's another thing. topic, so i think that this is all a continuation of the same story, this is exactly a diplomatic story, it is not a history of war, as if at the front, it is not a history of foreign policy and the establishment of peace or victory, this is diplomacy that deals with it, in the process of some positions to strengthen the negotiations, to create a platform somewhere, but this does not replace any peace summits, does not replace... i will pass on these letters, no they replace nothing, absolutely, but you can even send dozens of letters, if you have

a certain position, this is one story, if not, then no, so it can be, and there will be a visit of the president to new york for the un general assembly, as a rule, it is used it's for bilateral meetings, there may be a parallel visit to washington, if all this is prepared, i think it's fine, but... the only reason why we didn't discuss it with you earlier, yes, well, everyone was focused on the fall , as such a turning point, and we see after kursk, that even after the russian movements further on, in the donetsk region, everything is simply being postponed, diplomacy now, i will tell you honestly, it is not working very well, it is weapons that are working now, and all this diplomacy is being postponed for later, the best diplomat is now from... well, of course , well, you can say that, here i would, you know, these stamps, i would

not put them, here it is not in the sense that the best diplomat of the armed forces, the fact is that diplomacy appears when the weapons are already silent, and why here it is important, it is important that people understand and do not bet what he says, what is called a horse from behind, in front of behind, behind, what was happening, initially there were many efforts in bilateral relations between ukraine and russia to avoid war, primarily ukraine did it, compromises, starting with the black sea fleet base on the territory of ukraine, although it was difficult to decide immediately, but it was possible in the 10th it will be tougher there this year, if yanukovych was not the prime minister, the president already then, it is not a fact that this story is not... progressing, because president yushchenko has already raised the question of the withdrawal of the fleet, well, at least

start the process, yes, then volodymyr griska went to moscow and spoke in the ukrainian language there, what needs to be brought out, that is, we, we made such compromises, and we have already reached a point where it was not us, again, but russia in the 14th year started a war against ukraine and then in the 22nd large-scale, this is already as a result. that all our diplomatic efforts did not lead to a solution, people for some reason expect that the war will be stopped by diplomatic efforts, on the contrary, diplomatic efforts have not ended, well, after the continuation of peace, war has started, so this is logic, this is what i meet a lot of people there are a lot of people who don't understand this, they think it's because you have to sit down peacefully. people, i just went to sumy oblast closer to the border there,

the conversations are almost the same, but after such bombs that you showed to kabi, of course people will say, well , it must be stopped, people are dying, it seems like everything is so clear, but the problem is that russia, she, she didn't listen to us before, and she will kill until the moment of surrender, so in conclusion, the peace summit, the second one, i... to be honest, could be successful, well, with the completion of the results, like the summit of the soft capitulation of ukraine, well, soft, i mean, where all the international partners will sit, we will pat you on the shoulder, we will still help you, maybe a year there and the money is still to be given, but this is your capitulation, this is definitely a peace summit in terms of how it was being prepared now and what events are happening at the front, this is a soft capitulation summit, now the formula or what you... it sounds, you see , a change of position, yeah, well

, let's see, because we get it, what is the victory plan, i say that it is the same deoccupation of territories as the peace formula, the same exchange for all our prisoners, the responsibility of invaders, occupiers, all the same positions, plus victory, and if victory, then no war to exhaustion, because the war on... cannot be victorious if it is waged only on your territory, if it is waged in kharkiv, sumy, kyiv, then it is not a victory if it is moscow. st. petersburg, moscow, so be it, then there will be talk of victory. we are, ours partners do not consider it so. by the way, why don't they ask questions now, our delegation there, you talk about a war of attrition, excuse me, and at the same time you say that it cannot be on the territory of russia, then what are you talking about? this is logic, just logic, what is your definition,

well, the people are ukrainians, they understand why in our territory, yes, now they have gone beyond this framework and started all over again. there are some chronic twitches, because escalation, escalation again, well, well, then you don't say that this is a war of attrition, so the plan for victory can be, only this can be, the entire supply of weapons must be concentrated, now, it must be, everything that is planned, relatively speaking, there for 3-4 years, must be in six months, then this is a plan for victory, well, and quite it is clear that our western...partners are now acting not even as a guarantor of ukraine's security, but as a guarantor of putin's security, because if they do not allow strikes on the territory of the russian federation, then they, he is in their custody, well absolutely, you must tell them about it directly, they are now guaranteeing the security of russia, they guarantee security now, well, not

putin's security, you can't say that because it's putin's regime, well, they're keeping ... putin's regime in this way, because they don't give ukr, well, they don't give opportunities or support sufficient, they give support, we must thank them so that it is clear that ukraine exists, but in their understanding ukraine exists, in what borders, with what internal mood, they do not care, ukraine exists, and this is in fact, not that they say that you have to thank and bow, sorry, it's them national interest when there is a barrier between them. nato, the eu and russia, that is, the barrier that we stand for, we guarantee, ukraine now guarantees the security of poland, slovakia, the baltic countries, hungary, romania, at least, i am not talking about germany, france, for obvious reasons, yes, they have additional levers, and ukraine now guarantees the security of these countries that are on the border, by the way, they honestly,

especially in the baltic countries, say this and thank you, because it is clear that the country is bigger. just walk through georgia like tanks in tbilisi came and did not know what to do about it, no one in the world, so i think that diplomacy should be conducted, but we have such a problem, we initially have such loud statements, we will discuss it with you for a couple of months, it is not known what something is being conveyed there, and i would not like the ukrainians to be faced with the fact that the victory plan... it turns out, well, i don’t want to continue the nuances there, yes, i think, according to the mood of president zelenskyi, no, i don’t think there is anything there there will be such a thing, well, they say conditionally, they say that we will be merged, no, this will not happen, on the contrary, i think that he will write exactly these positions there, an increase in sanctions, an increase in the provision of weapons, but as a result, it will be, well, unfortunately,

the same reaction as now, practically, and one more point, now it’s not tre, here’s the usa, let ’s take it, you can cook differently , yes , the victory plan, you can of course talk about weapons, everything, and tell candidate trump there that you should play along with him, that he is a great leader, if, if he becomes president, he will solve everything, and you can now ask questions to your partners, but if you are the president , she or he, you come and... what tools do you have even so, they are solving the issues in the war with ukraine, there is only a toolkit to put pressure on ukraine, half of the finances, you remember, have not been provided from the package, conditionally provided only until january 20, and it will be decided, as i understand it, by the new president, joseph biden, the current president cannot use these funds,

further, not the entire package will be processed for weapons production, and most importantly, no one for some reason... everyone has stopped talking about it , i have the impression that it is not just an impression, i know it in the ministry legal affairs, in the president's office, they don't push ours at all now partners in america for next year’s toolkit, there are no lendleases, the law has expired, we tried there, at first we agreed, we don’t need a lendlease, we don’t need one, why don’t we need one, moreover, in the apparatus... the nsdc put out a whole explanation why we need one not needed moreover, the one who spoke about le russian agents. i obeyed it. i don't understand how it is, you have an instrument, it must be, there must be an intergovernmental

agreement, it must be prepared, everything must be done, then we will be in a few months, yes, before that, it is already before adoption, we have, madam ambassador markarova says, now we will punch through the land list, hooray, let's punch through, that's all, and then the democrats took it, removed it right into the procession, i know. it was openly filmed by the democrats, they could have filmed it without joseph biden, they couldn’t, now we don’t have the toolkit of lendlis, direct funding , where do you have an expectation that it will go better than last year, that when the elections are held , the vote in the parliament will go better, remember, they didn't give us our grochi, and we switched to the package, although no packages are needed, it was possible not to accept, it was simply necessary give money in the budget, that's all, they didn't do it, now and... everything will be so turbulent there that you even have to forget about it, but where is the package, who said the word package, lendlease, everyone is silent, the plan for victory, what a plan

victory, if you don't have tools, money and concrete actions in america, it would certainly be better to talk in private about the plan that this money would be given, the current administration there would have to report on the plan. victory, by the way, from the point of view of the usa, it is closed information, although this kind of information, as a rule, it is somewhere at least at some level, the congress works in contrast to the ukrainian parliament, the congress influences foreign policy, so some of this did not slip by, and we need to talk about it, about all these things it is necessary to speak, and if it ends only with beautiful slogans, then this is not the style we need now, by the way, there was information that president zelensky fired mykola oleschuk from the post of commander of the air force of the armed forces of ukraine. yesterday there was information that during the attack

of the russians on august 26 , the f-16 plane crashed with our pilot on board with oleksiy mesim, and today, yesterday, the topic of possible friendly fire on the f-16 was discussed, which was apparently the cause of this plane crash. although there are no official confirmations of this investigation yet, the investigation will be conducted , including with representatives of the united states of america, and olyschuk today responded to mariana bezuglii, because she posted on her facebook page her accusation against the command of the air forces of ukraine, well , we have the resignation of olyshchuk, obviously, obviously, i understand that the version that was published by mariana bezugla... probably it has a place, well, at least we will wait for the official conclusions, but the resignation of the commander of the air forces has already happened , here is

this episode with the f16 plane that entered the territory of ukraine there at the beginning of august, and something happened, we cannot say for sure with him now, there is no conclusion of the commission yet, whether it can somehow affect the attitude of our partners towards ukraine, that we gave them a plane they don't even know. what to do with them, whether there is a war, i would like to clarify, you say i came in, that is, those that are delivered, well, sell them, let’s not talk, so i don’t want to comment at all on this purely military side, it’s a war, and there even during the war, of course, there must be a debriefing so that there are no mistakes, but the way it is discussed, the war, there is... yes, that is, what is the use of it in the performance of the task, it is a pity, it is a pity that the pilot, well, died , this is the worst,

plane, listen, what's the difference, a piece of iron, that could, that war, it's a consumable, that could, that su, that f wants the 35th, wants the 16th, a pilot, that's a pilot who passed, a famous pilot, experienced, and who passed training. what exactly is this, this is the biggest loss, he needs such a pilot to be in line, and people in the world are standing and offering, take one more plane, one more, but the pilot will not be returned, but as for the plane, well, anything could have happened, that is, i i remember the wars that were fought, and the information that is already open is, well, they were fought there in afghanistan, there was an operation in iraq somewhere was, then there was a friendly weight. and anything, well, it obviously happens, especially since all this happens once again in the war, the only question, of course, is that i am not a specialist.

i just have a question that is so general, well, again , it may be, honestly, it may be somewhat frivolous in terms of today’s who knows the situation, for what these or other means are used, but i think that if we keep f-16 planes somewhere there in western ukraine, and not be used for launching missiles, which can only be hung on such targets and on the territory. by the way, the netherlands stated that it is possible to do this, and if the netherlands stated, then they have already spoken with the americans, that is, they should be used to the maximum where the return from them is maximum, relatively speaking, yes, they also work effectively on missiles, i understand but well, for cruise missiles, but for cruise missiles, in principle, we can work with other means, except for

aviation, i... understand that not everything is enough, but if we lose planes in the process, in such a process, yes, that is, already it will not matter why, what reasons, or there friendly fire, are there technical reasons, or could it be that the pilot’s training is not enough, but we then, one more plane, everyone, well, they will talk about something, and if it will be already two, well, as you know, they say, one coincidence, two - it already remembers, the system already, if it is there three flies at 16, then no one will raise questions about it, so there is no need to supply ukraine, let's still finish this business there a deal for polish migs, well, in exchange for 35, by the way, last week after the statements of many the poles, that we will be able to give migs to the ukrainians only if the f-35s arrive, there was already a presentation of the first f-35 aircraft at

the factory, this is a good sign. well, they must be used for their intended purpose, even, even if they are lost, god forbid without the death of our military, then they will be shot back to where it is needed, the required number of times, that is, my position is this, not an expert, but simply a civil one , that one should not be afraid to take bold steps in war, and if bold steps... we order, what is called, then such the command will never set an example to the lower ones, everyone will try to avoid it, by the way, in the american system, i know it more deeply, among westerners, a report is written, even if a person has made, well, even such a mistake that borders on a crime, of course, when people die , yes, that is, he still writes a report, honestly,

if it’s all honest, there are... there are disciplinary proceedings, of course, but no criminal ones are opened against him, because, well, listen, that’s the same, if there is no motive , motivation to do it specifically, then you cannot be punished for it, i have a simple question, if the same commander alyashchuk, if it is for this, yes, for some situation, they lost an f16 plane, this is resonating now for the world and affects our situation there, then why are they not punished for the same? the mistakes of politicians, how many have already screwed up in key political positions, well, it's just a disaster, so why aren't they removed, but if this is the logic, yes, we have some strange, strange logic, so it seems to me that the armed forces need to be more careful, because you kill so much do you have any desire at all for the commanders to show off their uniforms, to take responsibility, and you put some people there with russian passports, a wife,

a daughter... in the csk club, and he, without any understanding of the uav, goes and leads the newly created direction, well, that’s in general, well, here are two events, yes, that’s why i don’t ho, i don’t know , you understand, you and i don't know this, if you want to explain your actions to the people, then let's honestly speak more openly, but is it possible to speak so openly in war, it will fall on the enemy, so is it possible to change the commanders there.. . it is necessary, even necessary, even during the war it can be seen quickly that you you can, it even happens that way, a person is good, well , he just does not respond in these conditions, and he may not respond in others, this is exactly the task, but not because of the fact that the lost f-16 or there is a leopard, no, and in general, i don't see any difference, when the weapons are already in the armed forces, whether they are american,

british, polish, which... they become ukrainian immediately, they become.