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ipso. the real front program with taras berezovets every saturday at 21:30 on espresso. oleg rybachuk, ex-vice prime minister for european integration, former head of viktor yushchenko's secretariat, co-founder of the chesno movement, glory to ukraine, mr. oleg, is glad to see and hear you. well, let's start ours a conversation, first of all, i would like to. of the big reshuffles, reshuffles, furniture in our government, some went for even more promotion, moving to the president's office, others, so to speak, lost, but it is not known what will happen to them, but the key story is that prime minister denys shmygal breathed a sigh of relief. what about our government? well, kudos to the heroes, nothing fundamentally changes with our government, here if you just do an elementary analysis, when the president... explained the need for all

this chaotic movement of beds in the government chamber, he said that we need new energy, we need dyna, people are tired, and we should theoretically expect the appearance of some new energetic such er officials, with a vision, with new strength, with new there er... with a new with enthusiasm, but all this is not happening, you and i are really analyzing which bed was moved from which corner to which corner, well, so to speak, some beds went up, becoming bunk beds, and the key story, we have a weakening of the office, strengthening, or are these specific decisions of the same andrii yermak, well, for example, there vice prime minister veryschuk moved to the office at the level of yermak's deputy or deputy. yes

, social issues, well, first of all, this is a real promotion for her, because it must be honestly said that she had a ministry there, which was filled with unknown things and did unknown things, she has a riotous energy there, that is what she does not lack, such is the energy and desire to become the minister of defense there, she has an education, she has past experience, and she never gets tired of demonstrating it. but actually something else that would be visible from the vantage point there ours, i don't think they know her at all there, our partners in the european union or our western partners, because she is not there, but there has been more fair, it's just that almost all observers note that when we previously analyzed personnel changes, what watched the media, aha, what kind of group is pushing this. this

person, whether it is akhmetov's group, whether it is from pinchuk, or it is from kolomoiskyi, they were looking for some political connections, now in fact all these groups have converged in one person of yermak, and when analyzing personnel changes, then just because of one last name, there is an argument that this person is either from the orbit of yermak, or is close to yermak, or this person is supported by yermak, so we have much more yermak, but... will this increase the energy of the government, i don’t think so, well because a banal question arises, a banal problem, for example, the president likes active, energetic people, professional, we had such people, kubrakov belonged to such people, there zaluzny belonged to such people, kudrytsky belonged to such people, professional, energetic with a vision , but for some reason these people disappeared. with

powerful olympus, because yerbak and tim did not like their energy, their desire for initiative there. this is balancing, if you are very energetic, you start to like the president very much, you have problems with irmak and irmak quietly whispers to remove these people from orbit, then our president is so emotional, he admires someone, and then he gets bored, then he does not like the person like, i paid attention to how he reacted at the last press conference when journalists asked about the kuleba initiative, as they said. from the point of view the creation of a new, new ministry for the people who went abroad, and what was the president's body language, he was very annoyed, he said, well, in general, this is my initiative, and it became clear to me that the issue has already been resolved for kuleba, he

seems to be both loyal and professional, some say that he took on such an easy job, traveled around the countries of the global south, that's how yermak sent him there, yermak took away from him... in fact, he had most of the powers of the international staff, yermak was in charge of delegations , yermak met with foreign ministers affairs, yermak was meeting with blinkin, but yermak got in there as elegantly as an elephant in a dish shop, and in fact kuleba had no options, he was simply pushed aside and no matter what he did, the claim was, well, what are you doing, well, president no longer attracted to you. and the fair, i think, hinted at the fact that kuleba is present in multimedia, and i would just pay attention to this press conference, it was very bright, it was visible how nervously zelensky reacted to the name of his diplomat, who served there faithfully and truly, in fact him tried not to contradict in anything and implemented

the will of the president, but when it is now accused that yarmak spoke and yerumak, kuleba did not fulfill the main task of the president to achieve... what is the main task of the president? do you remember back in the soviet era , there appeared the most terrible secret that could not be revealed, whether it was the secret of the soviet union or the secret of the bourgeois, neither was thrown into the information space, you must have seen that the president demanded from the minister of foreign affairs to obtain from western governments permission to use precision weapons. uh, on the territory of russia, and the minister was unable to do this, so please, why not entrust yermak then, he is already mega super here, but yermak is currently negotiating something in the states, the mission is simply impossible from the point of view people who

would and could and would, and have a vision to make some kind of career, to serve ukraine, this system, where you have to like zelensky, but enough to annoy... er, ermak, how are you supposed to take into account there are different moods, you have the fact that today the president likes you, and tomorrow you are tired of him, well it is definitely not no, not motivation and the impossibility of realizing oneself on the pecha hills, being a high-level state official, and why did it take so long, we understand that there are a number of people, well, from time to time one or another scandals surfaced, or from time to time time, no extraordinary activity was detected, but , so to speak, within reasonable limits, as you rightly noted, so as not to annoy the same ermak, well, accordingly, but right now we understand that maybe in the west they were waiting for that or other powerful frame signal, so a new team of technocrats will arrive, and

the technocrats will begin to communicate more actively, present excel sheets more actively, where everything will be spelled out, how we correctly mastered certain billions of dollars, so instead... we saw not exactly what we wanted in the west, with on the other hand, we understand that there was no such, i don’t know, public pressure or public discussions on the part of individual countries of the european union or the european commission as such, that is, as if, if signals were sent, they were sent wrapped in certain such pieces of paper, lollipops, well, the request was more internal, and it was felt again at the last press conference of the president, when they touched on it again... efficiency and some criteria for selecting or evaluating the activities of these all-powerful advisers to the president, in particular yermak and especially tatarov, it was clear that for the president this question, and it was obvious

that the press are already your fellow piranhas, they don't let go, they are constantly focusing on the environment, on the fact that something needs to be done, someone has to answer. and that's why it was necessary to demonstrate frivolous activity, because i'm 24 on independence day in august, i was at an international conference in chisinau, and i opened that conference. the president of moldova , maya sandu, i was deeply impressed by the professionalism and high level of understanding of the president of the country about what it means to be a member of the european union, the topic of the conference was precisely about ukraine, moldova and the western balkan countries and the problems and challenges that are present during the negotiations on gaining membership, and... you know, and it's just amazing, it's in such stark contrast to the way the process

of european integration is built in moldovans, moldova is definitely a leader in this process right now, we are not talking about the size of the country, but there are challenges, they have elections in the fall, there is a good chance that the president and his party will win these elections, i talked a lot with the head of the office of the president of moldova, well , it's just an amazing difference, but what i heard at... these conferences, the main thing for you and me is that the european commission is a big expansion, this next wave of expansion, it's about 10 countries, and the european commission has learned from the previous expansions and with previous mistakes and very clearly wrote out such requirements that cannot be bypassed, she just one high-ranking diplomat said one phrase that we have each... how many 36 chapters on joining the european union,

there are economic, energy, agricultural, but each negotiations will begin on each head, they will begin with institutional matters, with how the state functions, how institutions interact in accordance with european standards, and there will be no descent here, that is why the power formula that is currently being demonstrated zelenskyy, she has no chance, it’s just that we have... we will be forced to share powers, to do whatever it takes, it was just said very diplomatically that the greatest attention of the european union, which drew conclusions from the fact that it previously accepted, let’s say, bulgaria there and romania, which were not ready, and which for a long time demonstrated their inability to meet the criteria of the european union, there will be no such thing in this wave of expansion, well, look, i understand, but... on the other hand, if we would live to those still good times, when we get, well already real,

talks filled with concrete content, and when we will, for example, explain in brussels why we cannot, so to speak, replace this or that form of ours or this or that vision or our reception of this or that issue, on the other hand, you mentioned at the beginning of our conversation about this age-long permission that kuleba should have received. well, now sibiza will have to get it, and maybe our entire high political command will have to strain, in particular about permits from the americans, so history is much more difficult, because it is not bad . civilian objects in the cities and civilians are dying, and we understand that the united states

will not get away from this either, especially since joseph biden is finishing his last, so to speak, honeymoon months in the fall before the big replacement, will we be able to get certain permissions, for long-range strikes on the territory of the russian federation? it will most likely succeed, and there are already too many sources about it, we are just with you. we understand well how such decisions are made, remembering the beginning, javelins, tanks, planes, then missiles, long-range missiles, and we can predict, pretty sure that these permits will be, i can't say that they will completely solve our problem, but according to the absolutely hysterical reaction of russia, which is simply... it seems that in the event that the west allows the use of missiles

long-range action on the territory of russia, but that's all, that's all, then, that's all, and they 're just drooling on their talk shows, which means that the question, but on the other hand, it will again be deferred in time, i paid attention again to the speech of kirby, who explained by himself that he said that they no longer play such a big role, because they will not be able to destroy aviation, which is what ukraine is talking about, because the russians have already moved... its planes of the air base 300 and more kilometers away, this is a little strange logic, because well, give us missiles, we will figure out with them what they will be able to do, what they will not be able to do, the topic of crimea is still there, but in general, we need to pay attention to biden's remark that now for biden, for his administration, the biggest task, the most important thing is to make kamala

harris, the next president of the united states, and when making one or another decision, they ... will definitely take into account how it will affect the election, and understanding that trump from time to time begins to talk about dragging america into the third world war and intimidating there are average americans by this, it is obvious that the biden administration, when making a decision, will take into account this very factor, how trump can use it in order to knock down from the high flight kamala harris, who is real. is gaining momentum, gaining points, from the positive, even from the pocket, insider very reliable information that a very powerful group of internationalists is gathered around kamala haris, starting with phil, ending with others, who have a very principled position in relation

to russia, to putin, to authoritarian regimes, and this team is much stronger by an order of magnitude. well this is an important signal, well, a key story, so that in the next couple of months, so to speak, nothing additional happens, because we will not underestimate the enemy, yes, and no less important moment, so that for all our powerful, cool advisers, at one time, by the way, the national security advisers, next to this, god forgive donald trump, they were not weaklings either, and sometimes they also... used to be hawkish, but trump still decided, just like with biden , that is, the grandfather still decides, does not decide sullivan, the key stories in the key sections are brought by sullivan, and the grandfather says: well, i forgot the pen here, i won’t put a signature, and here is my main fear, that kamala harris in the current situation will not turn into , god forgive me, kamela obama, remember you know

, at one time the democrat, the outstanding obama, tried to resettle in the world, well, we know that it ended with huge losses for us, then the russians temporarily occupied the crimea, well, accordingly, the influence from the united states in the next couple of months, from what we expect from them? well, by the way, the best thing for us to do is to do what we do, to talk and fix issues. of long-range, accurate missiles, and i particularly drew attention to one article by a well-known western expert who says that if ukraine does not receive a guarantee of membership in nato, the only alternative for it will be the development of nuclear weapons, and in this article it is said that ukraine, compared to any

other country, is the closest to the ability to produce its own weapons, this and the presence of... its personnel, this is technology, this is also uranium reserves, and this was stated for the first time by serious international experts, i think that this is one of the factors that will, among other things, contribute to the faster induction of any team, any the american president, well, because if we are left without elections, as a result of russian aggression, we will be convinced that in reality the west and nato are not able to fulfill. our obligations to ukraine, we will increase the production of our own weapons, and most likely we can technically and realistically proceed with the production of our own nuclear weapons, reminding of israel, who said that israel does not have nuclear weapons, but if necessary, we will launch a corresponding nuclear strike on

the aggressors, elections, well, we cannot bypass this either word, an extraordinary uproar began, and uproar usually indicates that someone leaked information to someone through party channels, that this or that scenario is possible, on the other hand , we understand that elections cannot be held, the constitution, war and so on, but here it is hustle and bustle and activity testify , so to speak, to the fact that maybe in six months, when certain major global scenarios will change, and by the way , the deminitiative fund is not without the participation of the movement, honestly... they also conducted their social survey , and it turned out that ukrainians would like to see the military in certain political forces, for which they would vote for ukrainians. what about our elections, the things that cannot be held, but everyone is preparing for them, well, i have my own experience, well, that is, on my own skin

i feel this, because i had several invitations to, well, not parties yet, but among people who are embryos, political embryos, well, they are called differently, but it is definitely inspired by what political players feel and... is preparing the parliamentary parties are fully preparing for the elections, in particular our old-timers and european solidarity, and the motherland, and people's deputies are talking about it, they are looking for some possible combinations, but people are sure that somewhere in a year, perhaps, these elections will be reality, and therefore begin to prepare now, why are they so sure? well, because at every step we actually hear these conversations about the fact that the war should end with negotiations, that it is in the fall after the elections in

the american system that a new administration will come, sometime in the spring there will be real attempts to put the parties to negotiations and stop this bloody war. china, brazil, rush with... their peace plans, talk about the fact that there are already hundreds of countries supporting them, the essence of those plans too, let's stop shooting, stop the aggression and let's look for a compromise through peaceful means, peaceful negotiations, the politicians understand that if only in ukraine the heated phase of the war somehow subsides, even the term appeared not a truce, but a cooling of the war, it is the chinese, in my opinion, who have launched what is necessary do everything in order to cool down, because as soon as it cools down here... everything, it is clear that there will be a problem of elections in ukraine, and you talked about this, that the president and his office would very much like to do this now, realizing that

it will be even more difficult in the future, but they are preparing for it political forces, we have many problems in this connection, the main problem is whether we realize that according to the structure of power that we have, because we already had the idea , there was a leak of information somewhere that the president's office sees ... the possibility of simultaneous presidential, parliamentary and local elections. in our constitution, it is written a little differently, right? well, but we understand, yes, that, well, some technical points can be adjusted there, not for the first time and not for the last, yes, but we understand that we would like, so to speak, a large-scale a process in order for the forces to be evenly dispersed, or even smeared, so to speak, among active citizens in the regions and so on, so that everything, so to speak, took place properly. smoothly with the corresponding result, i understand correctly, yes, yes, yes, people think about this, about this, but again,

sociology shows that more and more ukrainians understand that the president and his office use powers that are not inherent in them and that are not allowed by the constitution, that they are significantly take on more powers, and an increasing number of ukrainians understand this, but in i wonder again if ukrainians understand that if... we don't change the rules of the game, if we don't clearly limit the powers of the president in his office, then we have this, this continues, we will have the next president, the next ideas, because we are not talking now about the parliamentary one or the same one, because your inner feeling is so regular, well , it seems to me that the next one, because if there will be, if there will be, if it cools down or... the hot phase of the war will end and you will have to be responsible for the results of this war, then simply international experience shows that even such figures as churchill, in fact, having won

the war, could not win the elections after the war, people, citizens owe a great deal to the government that waged this war, and the government must take responsibility for all the miscalculations, for the lost lives, for the destruction, well, besides this... another thing, well , it will be very difficult for us to find any arguments for extending the mandate of the current structure of the government for peacetime, because we remember that during peacetime, president zelensky's rating dropped rapidly, he just played, used all his there personal abilities, talent, skill to inspire and push.

president zelenskyi's team does not support ukraine using so-called emotional diplomacy, in the conditions of the economy, in the conditions of routine routine work. there are no achievements and there are no capabilities, so i think it will be very, very difficult to try to convince ukrainians that we need to continue this structure there zelensky fair for the next presidential term, but not even in this question, what others will come if we if we don't change the rules of the game, then i don't want to be cassandra, but i clearly understand that they will inevitably appear. these are new friends, there are no balances, but here again i recall the conversation in kishenev, and i have great hopes with this that the european union will still very carefully monitor how the institutions will interact in ukraine, you mentioned the chinese- the brazilian plan, yes, but there is also the russian federation, there is putin, and we understand what this plan is, yes, that is, they are trying to take as many soldiers as they have enough, relatively speaking, roughly, that is, they are not demonstrate their readiness for something. what

do you think, how to deal with them, because unfortunately a lot depends on them, on their activity. if we are talking about the sino-brazilian plan for the so-called cooling of russian aggression, first of all. you have noticed everything very, very correctly, it is necessary to pay attention to such violent activity of putin now, there is azerbaijan, mongolia, the challenge to the international criminal court, they are also so stubborn. statements that russia is not ready and will not start negotiations, because ukraine seized a certain part of the kurdish region, it's so amazing to hear all this, but china and india and brazil, they are trying to make a platform where they say

all sides will be present and... where you can listen to any options for cooling the war in ukraine, and russia's presence there is also mandatory, but ukraine must also agree to this, it is clear to me that these, this activity must be taken very seriously, because before our eyes another international block is growing very quickly, which is already in terms of population, it is larger than the european union. together with america, a block of democratic countries, because the population of the global south is much larger in terms of population and and even with economic factors they are trying to compete, that is, this appearance of an alternative system of power, alternative approaches, an alternative block should encourage europeans and americans to significantly united actions and to demonstrate that these

countries are ready... to defend the democratic order that prevails in the world after the second world war world war here, russia will do everything possible to prevent this scenario from happening, to increase the bloc that turkey and azerbaijan want to join now, and this should be taken seriously. thank you, mr. oleg, for this honest conversation on the air of the tv channel , i want to remind our viewers that oleg rybachuk, former vice-prime minister for european integration, ex-head of president yushchenko's secretariat, co-founder of the chesno movement, worked for them now. thank you for this extremely important conversation. thank you. well, it's time for our program ran out, stay with the espresso tv channel. my colleagues will inform you about all the most important events of this day. watch out for yourself and your loved ones, do not ignore air alarm signals, with god. and see you on the air.

the news editor talks about the main thing for this hour, yana yavomelnyk, thank you for having president volodymyr zelenskyi meet with italian prime minister giorgia meloni. the leaders discussed the restoration and reconstruction of ukraine, in particular the energy system, as well as the implementation of the ukrainian peace formula. italy will also host the next conference on the restoration of ukraine, which will be held in 2000.