greetings, friends, live on the espresso tv channel, the second part of the verdict program and today, like every friday, we have a journalism club, my name is serhiy rudenko, and for the next 45 minutes we will talk about the following. postponed presentation to ukrainians. promised to tell exactly what strategy for overcoming russian aggression zelensky presented to biden, when ukraine sees its victory plan? the issue is not on the agenda. the president's office denies preparations for next year's elections. how long can the state live? without rotation of those in power. atomic stick, kimchen. world dictators

are threatening the west with weapons of mass destruction, already in chorus. who can stop russia, iran and north korea from their nuclear madness? we will talk about all of this in the next 45 minutes, but let me remind you, friends, that in addition to the live broadcast on the espresso tv channel, we also work on youtube and facebook platforms. for those who are currently watching us there live, please subscribe to our pages. and take part in our survey today we ask you about the following: do you support the idea of ​​economic reservation from mobilization, because today there was information from the people's deputy of ukraine yaroslav zeleznyak that the conceptual decision on what such an economic reservation will be, and what do you think, do you support such a concept and the idea of ​​​​economic booking from mobilization, so everything is quite simple on youtube, right? two

options, if you have a separate opinion about this, please write in the comments below this video, we are interested to know your opinion. if you watch us on tv, pick up your smartphone or phone and vote on the numbers 0800 2011 381, yes no, 0800 211 382 - no, and all calls to these numbers are free, at the end of the program we will sum up the results of this vote. so, as i said. today we have a journalism club, i want to introduce the guests of today's studio, they are larisa voloshina, journalist and political psychologist, ms. larisa, i congratulate you, thank you for joining our broadcast, and yanina sokolova, journalist, tv presenter, public figure, blogger, author of a youtube channel, millionaire, or already more than a million subscribers, subscribe if you are not already subscribed, yanina, i also congratulate you, thank you for joining our broadcast. greetings, larisa, greetings sergiya. greetings to all viewers. well, larisa

yanivno, since we ask our viewers and tv viewers whether they think the idea of ​​economic harrowing against mobilization is appropriate. let's share our thoughts in the format of a blitz poll. what do you think about this? let's start with ioannina. please. it's a mixed story, in retrospect to the fact that you and i are faced with a large number of corruption schemes every day, and today is simply magical. the story at once with two corrupt men, corrupt women who made millions of dollars, now we already know that it is millions, not one and not two, millions of dollars for the fact that, well, we counted about 30 thousand people, these are just a few cases for today , and evaded mobilization with the money they paid to people who helped them with this medical fake. commission to evade

mobilization, so the question arises whether this money could go to the state, and it would be appropriate, but on the other hand, as a person who communicates with the military every day, patronizes the families of the military, takes care of them in the hospital, i understand that this a story of injustice, when an option arises, when people have money, that money avoids opportunity. chance of honor to defend the state, so this story is not unambiguous, i think that it is necessary to ask about it not from civilians, but from the military, and their opinion, i think, will be fair as an answer to this. thank you, yanina, larisa, i have a question for you, i know that your relatives are at the front and obviously you know their position, but i would like to know your personal position regarding the feasibility of economy booking? well, here's an attempt, here 's the situation. in the fact that, when we

talk about this whole situation, i very much agree with yanina that it is ambiguous, it is precisely about those who evade not only being registered. now we are not talking about people who are supposed to go directly to the front tomorrow, no, they did not register, they did not comply with the law and the constitution, but at the same time, in this law, as far as i understand, it is about the fact that it is necessary to confirm the salary, that is, these people work somewhere, receive a salary, show minimal or no salary and simply do not pay taxes, that is, they avoid everything in general, that what is the survival of the modern state. it is very unfortunate that we have to resort to such steps to force people to pay taxes and comply with the law during such a period. of course, this is a humiliation for the military, at the same time we have, that is, they understand that they are superfluous in this country, that

they have been counted on, that is how it sounds in hakopi, this is very bad, bad talk, again, we see that at the same time the question is whether there will be economic demobilization, because many people who ... serve, had a legal salary higher than what they are now asking to show, and always paid taxes, and paid taxes, went to war, that is, they are responsible citizens. unfortunately, we still have to decide what to do with this legal nihilism that has been raging in our country for many decades, and because it does not happen that only citizens build the country, pay taxes, follow political processes, follow officials. prevented corruption, that is , they went to rallies, and others simply consumed their lives, because the reality is that now some citizens, this immoral majority, consume the lives of other responsible citizens, in fact, they directly consume the lives of other responsible citizens, it's simple, well, it's already shameful, thank you, larisa, serhiy, can i

say two words about this, please, i remember how four months ago a friend of mine, a soldier who was a prisoner... "azov was in captivity, the extraction procedures were delayed, he is in terrible condition, with 60% body burns, he was in captivity, rotting there in a donetsk hospital, after which he was exchanged, he rehabilitated as best he could and went to fight again, and then the fp drone hit the landing, where they defended our country, and he is in the hospital, he was transferred to kyiv, from the dnipro, i come to him, and he is a person with injuries. which, well, it seemed to him, would hardly give him the opportunity to move his arms, because everything was just crushed there, and i go into the intensive care unit, and he there is one lying there and says to me: mrs. yenina, you see how it is, this war is for the poor, those who cannot pay, evade, who

cannot take care of themselves in various cases of life and my family, this guy is pregnant the wife who will give birth here, they will not have the opportunity to do something in life, to move on and move the country forward, because we are simply poor, - he said, a guy from the kherson region, these were the first words he used met me met me in the intensive care unit, it is you, so that you understand the idea, clearly that this is not representative, yes, of some soldiers who sacrifice everything, being in hell more than once or twice, but go, fight and protect, well, those monsters that i just now drove to the ether. yes, all restaurants in kyiv are full of men with athletic physiques, where it is impossible to get into, and all of them, i suspect, are dodgers, is this fair? well, the actual question. you already mentioned, yanina, about this episode, or rather, about two episodes.

one of them happened in khmelnytskyi, where the state bureau of investigation today exposed the head of the khmelnytskyi regional center medical and social expertise of msek. and regional council deputy from the servant of the people party , tetiana krupa, and her son, oleksandr krupa, were illegally enriched. during the searches, they found almost 6 million dollars in cash in various currencies. law enforcement officers are investigating the case of illegal registration of disability for men who are trying to avoid military service. among the things that this lady and her son have and real estate in khmelny. to whom and abroad, accounts abroad, well, that is, sufficiently large sums circulated in this family, and here a completely logical question arises, larisa, in khmelnytskyi, which is small by standards,

a small city by european standards, no one knew who tetyana krupa was, and if she had such a huge turnover of money, then it is clear that many people... communicated with her, resolved these issues regarding disability , it is clear that the special services should also have seen this, because she kept a hotel there in khmelnytskyi, that is, she did not live on her salary, and it was visible. nine cars, well, that is, a very wealthy family, and apparently this family was somehow embedded in the system, which apparently operates in our country, and we are talking about billions of dollars, just billions of dollars, which are now circulating in this shadow business, the illegal business of defrauding conscripts from serving in the armed forces of ukraine, what is this episode talking about, have they stopped '. this whole system with which they were, in which they were incorporated, or is it just a case of

randomly taking someone randomly to show another woman was taken in kharkiv there, and she too, she solved the issue for 29 00 dollars too i provided some services there, regarding how to avoid mobilization, well, the fact is that all these things, we are talking about... that they are massive, and we have to understand that this is not the systemic corruption of yanukovych's time, where every official, or there is a pps officer outside, and we know that he has an order, how much he has to bring to the boss in the evening, the boss folds into a box, and the box folds into a suitcase and all this goes to the first office, no, we are talking about the fact that this situation led to that this morality, this is, you know, the moral degradation of society, it... that's why in this in this case, no one sees the problem

of taking part or committing a crime, because as we live for the last time, these are all such marauders, in fact, they are not even marauders, i don’t know, they are some kind of corpse eaters, that’s what we should call them , the country is dying, the country is fighting for its life, and these people are gnawing at it like a jackal, because there is an important point here, those who brought money to this madam from... according to our law, they are the same criminals, giving bribes and taking bribes, that's it bribery, we have the same crime, let's remember this one the situation, the scandal surrounding the attempt of one of the people's deputies to give a bribe to mr. nayen, andriy, andriy odarchyn, that is, a crime, each of those who brought money to the madam, the same crime as her, but look, if we look at the public publicity of all these things, everyone says: that the poor cherries and the bad state, and the corrupt,

that is, these military commissars and doctors, they are elected, no, they committed a criminal scheme together, each of them, as a result, it costs the lives of people who are on the front line third year, this is a crime not against some state, you, me, this is a crime against specific people who have been fighting the same people for three years. civilian people who still have a civilian profession are not released, everyone who was mobilized in the first days is still listed, you know, and you have such people on the channel, they are civilians, they are not professional soldiers, they do not have contracts, they have fulfilled the law on mobilization, and now they are dragging this law, being mobilized, because they found other excuses for themselves, schemes and everything else, committed a criminal scheme, well, a conspiracy actually against them, against their families, so we have to... talk about the fact that this whole system is criminal, and we have to understand that we have to fight against this condemnation,

that wai-wai-wai, how can you not, how can you not be ashamed, we have countries nearby that live in total mobilization , for example, the same israel, somehow there is such a mass in every village and city, it does not happen, we see countries in which, for example, non-payment of taxes is a federal crime, and it does not happen massively there either, so that you... at home, have the opportunity to pay for a reservation of 20 thousand and above, that is, they are not the last, they have to show the salary for such a tax, well, at least 1050, or even 100, they receive salaries, and it turns out that at the moment they receive this money, but it does not exist for the tax office, for the state, that is, they steal, that's it when we talk about corruption in our country, we should be aware of the scale, that the war, trials with... the country and part of the country collided, part of the citizens behave decently and responsibly, led to the fact that

a huge layer of people is simply huge, nothing anymore shy, and that's it massively, you can't deal with this by planting one aunt, we need to change the laws and finally make sure that the justice we are talking about, no, we should have comprehensive enforcement of the law, thank you, larisa, yanina , well... we see these examples, they are not isolated, we remember how two military commissars from boryspil and buchi were taken a million dollars each, they had an odesa military commissar there, i think that this... well it's the tip of the iceberg because the whole system, it's built in such a way that this big shadow business, it thrives in ukraine, eh, there are people who pay this money, there are people who go abroad, according to preliminary data, somewhere around 600 thousand conscripted men went abroad in different ways, but probably some of

them still used such services of psecs and various schemes there in order to leave. beyond the borders of ukraine, that is how in this situation and who should put an end to this total corruption, which is now being revealed during the mobilization, and it is clear, and it is obvious that zelensky sees it, and the minister of defense sees it, and commands the ground forces troops, which are managed by the tsk, that is, but we also have a big anti-corruption all this. the infrastructure that we have been so proud of since 2016, that it is the best infrastructure that exists on the european continent, and yet we see that it still does not work as it should work, why? impunity, impunity gives rise to further attempts to do this, after

the situation with the odesa warlord, this was probably the first large-scale wave of corruption that... swept from the sea and throughout ukraine, many communities, many representatives of civil society talked about it, we distributed the video, i saw it all over this gentleman, there was a riot, and there were still several units with smaller volumes of corruption schemes, but the system did not change. odarchenko, whom you mentioned today, when there was a precautionary measure, and he deposited the money. in order not to imprison him, the next day deputy odarchenko appeared in the walls of the verkhovna rada, whether this is a signal for other sections of society, including for msecs, for various other units that in particular deal with issues issuance of these fake documents to the petitioners, that

everything can be solved, it is clear that it is, was there a statement from the president, was there a statement... did the sbi investigate these crimes in such a way that others were afraid and did not do it? no. that gentleman who was lying on the video with money, by the way, it is a remarkable story that there are 500 thousand, friends, so that you understand, during the search, they remembered that they still had this money, and they threw it over the balcony in two bags , stuffed with money, 500 thousand euros, thrown over the balcony of khmelnytskyi and... this gentleman who is lying now on your screens, this is a co-inhabitant of this panikrupa, they do not feel any threat to their system of existence, to them as people, above all, when there will be this threat, and when the legislation that we have, in principle, everything is written quite correctly, but nothing

is implemented, nothing is to blame, it is not carried out, the civil society is ours, it does... but for the authorities, it is just violence, what about me, you and i are sitting now on friday, for a few days, everyone will forget about it, there will be a precautionary measure, removed from duty, but believe me, another link will be found, this happens with almost all the subjects of our investigations, which concern, for example, tenders, sergey, all the subjects of our investigations regarding tenders, you will laugh, friends, they will win the tenders again. today i received a letter from the people to whom these owners owed money, you ca n’t call them otherwise, the owners of this monopoly on tenders in the kyiv region had contractors, today they wrote to me from the road alliance that these people are receiving tenders anew, and they have not settled yet for the previous ones, but simply disappeared somewhere. we we write, contact anti-corruption bodies,

zero. impunity in our country has reached the scale of immorality. which allows itself to do this to the state against the background of what is happening in ugledar, against the background of the fact that the commanders of various brigades, the famous brigades that hold the ugledars, end their lives by suicide, as it happened literally on october 2, just sur, impunity, this is my only answer, if there is a will for it at the top, it will not be done at the bottom, but yes, the will... or rather, as it is permission to there is theft, and believe me, these same people are not alone, you rightly remarked today, serhiy, this woman in khmelnytskyi, and next to her was this... chain of people, and i think that the road to kyiv proves what were on interest from all these schemes, i just

guarantee you, because they were all on interest, that's why they were interested, well, you dodger, our country is not homogeneous, and in every region there will be people who can pay 29 thousand to evade , the question is whether they will be allowed to do it or not, we will cook the poles. and their police force, which is brutal behaves with people who violate some minimum traffic rules there and pay 600 zlotys for it there for a minimum violation, it is impossible for them, it is impossible, not because they are angry, but because there is a law that should be obeyed, what with to do this, sergey, larisa, and our viewers, i cannot give you an answer, for this there must be a social contract and the marginalization of such characters, we have it... forgive me, friends, but we don't have it, we don't have it. thank you, yanina, i hope that sooner or later such an agreement will be public, and this issue will also be resolved. i would like to remind our

tv viewers that throughout our broadcast we will conduct a survey, we will ask you this and that, do you support the idea of ​​economic defense against mobilization? yes, no, if you are on youtube, then everything is quite simple, either yes or no, you can leave your own comment in the comments below this video. if you watch us. on tv pick up your smartphone or phone and vote 0800 211 381 if you support the idea of ​​economy booking no 0800 211 382 all calls to these numbers are free, vote, at the end of the program we will sum up the results of this vote. another topic is the delayed presentation of zelensky's victory plan. yarmak promised that he would show the ukrainians or tell the ukrainians about this victory plan that zelensky... presented in the united states of america, as the president himself said when talking to the new nato secretary mark rutte, one of the elements of

the victory plan is geopolitical determination. let's listen to what zelensky said. in particular, part of the plan is geopolitical determination, and i.e. decisions about ukraine's place in the european and global world. security architecture. moscow must receive a clear signal that guaranteed security for ukraine and all of europe is irreversible, as well as the independent right of every democratic nation in europe to determine its own future. well, this is zelensky's position. larisa, there is a lot of talk about the fact that the plan needs to be shown to ukrainians, not talked about. it is necessary to talk about the political part, not to talk about the specification of weapons, which is obvious in this regard, or maybe not, well, no one can to say for sure, what exactly is in this

plan, you understand what kind of plan zelenskyi has, and whether it will be the case that both zelenskyi and yarmak present this plan for victory, we will say and we guessed all about it, that we knew it, that there are several points, in principle, and the main point is that... ukraine must defeat russia. listen to me, this story, this discussion, when we see the plan, and where is the plan, it amuses me, to be honest, because i think it's just, you know, eh, the pr has caught up with us, because, well, obviously, we have already seen in fact, the foreign press wrote, by the way, also with such but not impressed, they say, western american officials looked, they were not impressed, and they directly stated these four points, here... obvious points that guarantees to ukraine, like nato, that is, well, logically, ukraine should receive weapons, and in other ways, it should be guaranteed the supply

of weapons, of other types, of a different nomenclature, more modern, also logically, and obviously, the third point was still there, they talked about that it is necessary to economically inject into the economy and everything else, well, obviously, sanctions, the strengthening of sanctions against russia and russia, that means. these her partners, that is, everything is clear, all these four points were written, but first of all, the americans were not impressed by it for some reason, i want to understand, and what they expected to see in what, what is called the victory plan, what we write there, so , we left in combat gaps and moscow in three days, and we don’t need anything, he is praying for us, well, that is, what are they, what will impress them, that is, obvious things that ukraine constantly talks about, by the way, not receives, because we... in fact, when these 50 countries were shown to us, they gave us security guarantees, about nothing at all, even they were not ratified by the parliaments, some strange things were heard there, if moscow

attacks you next time... then we will give you 3 billion, well, thank you, of course, well, we have a problem now, that is, it is obvious that we need real guarantees, which korea has, the south, which israel has, better, which west germany had, of course, sanctions need to be strengthened, all this is obvious, that is, zelensky is coming to meet with biden, who goes to the meeting with the candidates who will come, one of them will definitely be the president, talks about all the same points that ukraine has been constantly voicing since the first days. not only the president, and zaluzhnyi wrote in his famous article about this very thing, weapons of a different nomenclature, we all talk about it, well, he says it, but for some reason it was called pathetically, a plan for victory, some secret breakthrough, and now half the world and most importantly, ukraine is sitting, waiting, it will end, that's the problem, all this pathos ends in disappointment, although in principle the points are not bad, and obviously

we need to... think about how we can get guarantees, how we can get better weapons, with whom to conclude, that is, we have to discuss it, instead we call it all, well we are loved there big construction, big theft, they get into a beautiful pose, give out some slogans, and then it ends with a bang, i'm the one who worries about this, which will end not only with the disappointment of society, but also with a bang, because when you present it so pathetically, obviously people are watching.. . logic, each point is logically correct, but says: well, well, that's not a plan, that's not a win -win plan, and then you just might not get what you're asking for. well, it is obvious that zelenskyi and yarmak were not showing a map of hostilities, there, how, how, who will move, and this will lead to a plan, or to victory. it is clear that the main concept of the victory plan is the defeat of russia. i understand that this is a plan to defeat russia, they don't

talk about it, but well... it's quite obvious, yanina, that you expect victory from this plan, or do you also think that it is, well, a well-wrapped plot , which is now is taking place, the liberation of the territory of ukraine, the attempt to liberate the territory of ukraine, that this is an attempt to push the west to make a decision that ukraine will be, well, to the invitation of western countries to nato. that this is an exit there to the borders of 1991, well, such general things, political coercion of russia, yes, advisers who recently became almost the only speakers of various plans of zelensky called this plan, in fact, we talked about it on our youtube, well, what is known, and mostly the western press somehow in a way highlights all kinds of different. negotiations,

starting with johnson, trump, there is zelensky johnson, then bild announced that this proposed peace plan contains nato issues and contains an option where ukraine allegedly enters the conditional phase of minsk, where some part of the front is frozen, and there we will to see, as they say in odessa in the office of the odessa military committee. i really don't have any hopes for these peace plans, i generally think that the peace summit and all these meetings are another opportunity to communicate in a wide circle of our partners, and the united states, and european countries, european leaders who are gathering in switzerland or anywhere to communicate, that is, we demonstrate in this way through the media, albeit at great expense and effort, that we are ready for peaceful...

talks, but on our terms, which do not change given the rhetoric we hear. in this peace plan, serhiy, what we know, economically, it concerns increasing investments, zelenskyi, ukraine, through his mouth, and this peace plan, encourages the west to invest in military production on the territory of ukraine. then the story is related to diplomatic pressure on russia, a separate page. they say it is necessary to work with countries of neutral status, zelenskyi announced that it is fair to say that russia is responsible for this war, and we should communicate with those who have not yet fully understood who the russian federation actually is, and definitely permission to strike deep territory of russia with western weapons, in particular long-range weapons of the united states of america, all this in this peaceful plan, nothing...