hot. >> it's a momentum stock, buy it on the dip. >> that's it for forbes on fox. have a wonderful weekend. keep it right here, with continue with cashing i. >> saving taxpayers by making government workers an offer they can't refries. one state looking to buy out public employees if they retire early. the majority of states drowning in pension debt, is this how to cut cost and save taxpayer money? i'm tracy byrnes, welcome to cashing in. our crew this week, wayne rogers, jonathan hoenig and melissa, also christian dorsy. welcome. is buying out public workers the best way to save taxpayer sh? >> it's a greatay to do that. from the private sector we know it work all the public pension plans are

massively underfunded, based on 8% return and they're getting 4 or 5%, some less. calipers, mssvelily underfunded. it's good-bye u.s.a., hello greece if we're notareful. >> the conce is that we're going end up with fewer state workers. oh no, smaller government is better in my book so if we're going to save money and shrink government, it sounds like a home run. i hope they're doing enough. >> christian, you're worried we the government might lose out on valuablable employees. >> absolutely. it's not just about having smaller government, it's about having smart, efficient government. size is relative to value. if the buyouts succeed in losing talented employees, the short term bottom lining gain may be long term public sector pain in

terms of what services we taxpayers get. this is a tool. it can be used. i'm not saying you can't pursue buyouts but to think it's a magic bullet is wrong-headed. >> christian, you know more is not necessarily good. i mean washington, for example, d.c. increased their hiring in government job by 38,000 people in the last three years. by the way, he can't overcome the defic in hiring just by doing tag. >> you know that the federal employee roles are smaller than under president reagan so we have smaller govement. >> wait. >> the war on the president -- >> but let get down to -- jonathan, you said you might as well take the money now wile it's still there. >> private corporations do this all the time and workerss are better off because the pensions they count on are gone once the

you no what hits the fan and the company is insolvent. 100 largest pensions have $1 trillion in unfind the liability. take t deal and work long term for -- let's shrink the size and scope government an get back to the constitutional role then you'll never need a buyout and -- >> john, alabama governor offering this deal, basically offering healthcare payments or to take $15,000 in cash. it's not a ton of money. is it worth considering? >> of course it's worth considering because the deal might not be there. look, cities are spending 41% of their revenue coming from the state. they're not balancing their budget. the federal government has 40% of their budget they're borrowing from other countries. once you haveny tpe of austerity measures in place, you'll feel it at the local

level. take the money now because it may not be there later. to the state's point of view, you either pay them now or pay through unemployment. so it's a win-win for the states. >> chrisan, you can't deny our pension funds are broke. so get the people out while you can. maybe you don't have to pay them. >> it's one too. it may be useful in a lot of circumstances but again, i would like to remind everybody government employees provide valuable public services. it's not just aatter of items on a bance sheet. >> you're talking -- >> you want to make sure -- if i can finish, that you provide services in the most efficient way for taxpayers. if you end up buying out -- >> let him -- >> providing that benefit, then that's a problem. >> jonathan. >> nothing eficient about government spending, especially in areas which have no role. >> oh come on. >> oh come on? government has spentar past -- we're insolvent, especially in

areas like healthcare, education and science in which it has no constitutionalole. talk about needing valuable government employees, make them more valuable available. >> we have to get wayne in. he's eating his pen over here. >> don't eat your pen, wayne. >> but christian, you know there are cases -- these are facts. you can't -- you have to ghee argue with the facts. municipalities have privatized thr fire fire departments, or tr security departments, things like that and it's cheaper. don't tell me they'rdoing a tter job and they're doing it for less money. it's not true. >> melissa, you seem to have had a rotten experience at the dmv. >> i was sent fr one to another for six hours just to t platesenewed but that's another ax to grind. the post office needs who shed hundreds of thousands of employees, they're burdened with legacy costs, a lot of them

pension andealthcare related. they hit the -- it feels like a trillion but a billion dollars limit. they can't borrow more money and can't run it the way it is. it's a place they should spend less, let people retire and trim ere. this from a woman to supports the postffice. >> i love the post office. >> i'm surprised. >> they need to slim down like all the government,t needs to be smaller to work. spend less, fewer employees. >> let msay one other thing, if i'm a worker, i think i want this because i don't trust my government. they could be bro. could be in the streets like the greeks. give me the money and let me go home and work with it. >> johnathan. >> it's a great point. the sooner we atnd to these problems, the sooner we can fix them. we let them go forecades and they blow up like greece, spain or other collectivist stat. >> i'll come live down by you, right? >> come live with me in bermuda.

what melissa says about te post office is right, they need to lay off 200,000 people. this is going on in cities and states. christian, you don't want to get rid of talented workers but they don't have the money. san bernardino is laying off school crossing guards. a lot of money comes from pensions and the assumings, that 8.5%, nobody' maaking that. >> christian, could it -- couldn't you argue that people taking a buyout could prevt a bailout down the road? >> look, i'm not against buyouts in all circumstance. i just suggest it's not the magic to solving state fiscal woes. the reason pensions are underfunded is because of poor decisions.

to think i we pursue this pa where all of a sudden we're going to get government that's providing great cost effective servicis not necessarily true. >> wayne, last word. >> i've side it. i think the prf is in the pudding. wenow if you could privatize certain things -- joh makes a int. there are five cities in the state of california that he gone bust. you can't just keep making this up. this is a solution, a good solution for the workers, a good solution f the cities, a go solution for the taxpayer. >> i say we take the buyout and go live in bermud >> come join me. >> it's a one thing both presidential candidates agree on. moreovernment job training programs. who should pick up the tab? taxpayers or the companies looking to fill those positions? plus nearly half of the money states got in a housing rescue plan not going to rescue homeowners. why is someone

provide job training. >> we're going to make sure people have the skills to success. >> retrain workers for workers to get retrained. for thjobs that are out tre right now. >> fixing or our training programs for workers. >> what do you know, president obama and governor mitt romney actually agree on something. both say america needs more government job training programs. something private companies are cutting back on. johnathan, you say corporate america, not taxpayers should

train workers. >> i almost threw up in my mouth a little bit. the same government that failed at educating kids want to educate adults. forget for a moment the fact it's mentioned nowhere in the constitution -- companies for decades have done this from henry ford to wal-mart, which has an extensive program that helps a t of people. what governor romney should have said is government's role is a policeman, not a school marm. >> wayne, should the government train your workers in the bridal industry? maybe teach them to sew lace. >> we used t be a garment center in n york. it wen overseas by virtue of competition. as result you cannot find in the city of new york good pattern makers, people who take

a design and make it into a dress so you have to train them, educate them. but here's the problem, we have lost a generation of that. mothers don't give their daughter-- teach them to sew. >> or their sons. >> or their sons or design or anything. it's a good example. yes we need it and private industries should do the training. >> christian, it seems both the president and mitt romney think the government should pay for this kind of stuff. >> they probably agree it should be both government and private sector working together. put brass tax out there. other competitors around the world, do you think they don't invest in government job training for workers to make sure they compete in the industry tt dominate the economy? the short answer is of course. if we n't want to fall behind we need to do the same. government and private sector woworkers. juecause -- jonathan, most things we do today are not in

the constitution. the constitutional writersere not as purist about the constitution not adapting to the times as you are, my friend. >>ait. let me bringelissa into this. >> well. >> let me bring melissa in, hang on. melissa, we have kids in the school system n theory,heye going grow up and learn something. aren we sort of paying for it? >> we alrea pay for training. it's called high school an we're not doing a good job. when did we get away from vocational strange? i love learning arts and humanities but we have to trn kids to be able to go out and find a job. figure out what they're good at and what their career is going to be. we start in high school by training kids for the jobs of tomorrow. >> john, you work with high school kids all the time. what do you think? >> i'm learning how to sew right knew in bermuda. yeah, i work with high school --

>> that's not a joke, somebody's going to hear that and go out and learn. that's what america's all about. >> sewing in bermuda. the next industry. >> it's the next hot outsourced industry. i work with high school kids every day. i tell them you have to get a degree that matters. we're losing jobs in te united states not because of competitiveness but the peck engineers in china, they have the ability to get a workforce. we're losing that. we're having kids getting worthless liberal arts and political science degrees when they aren't trained to do anything. >> math and science and engineering. >> outsource over the next decade because we don't have people in techs. >> jonathan. >> pushing kids is forced. i'm against pushing anyone. that's not government's role. if there's a job it needs training for, le the company who has the job do the training.

>> oh, jonathan. >> no. >> oh what? >> wait. he doesn't have to be the government. >> it's up to parents. >> i work with kids every day. >> let me get wayne in here. >> when they don't have a focus, all you do is tell the kids, look, if you don't cre about what you're going to do, get a degree in science and math. that's advising a kid. that's what parent does. if the parent is not there. exactly. exactly. >> wait. wayne. >> what a parent does. >> i have to throw to wayne because who is paying for this? i understand what everyone's saying, government or corporate america. >> this is not a throwbackut a traditional thing. somebody apprenticed for a job. >> and government had zero to do with it. >> that should go on today in industry and be paid for by the employers. if i have ten people i have jobs for, i haveorkers who can train those people

that's putting brass tax out there. we don't have to make 'em. >> we can sew right here in the united states. darn it. all right, coming up. >> good luck with that. >> call it a housing rescue switcharoo. lawmakers spending money from a mortgage bailout to rescue mogages and someone here says that's great. huh? find out why.

>> turns out half of the money

states gofrom the mortgage ttlement with the banks not going to rescue homeowners, it's bailing out state budgets. melissa you say it could be a better use of money? >> bear with me. i'm going to turn into the punching bag but the only thing to solve the housing crisis is time, foreclosures, more jobs and the economy gettg btter. there's no program the government can set up to ma the housing crisis better. why not let them use the money to pay off the dumb stuff they committed to. don't encourage government to get bigger creating programs who he homeowners. this is a better use of the money. it's not what it was meant for but it's damages so they have the right to do it. it's a better use of the money. >> the money was supposed to go to homeowners and it's not. only a bilon of the 2.5 go to the homeowners. >> right. i have to say i agree with

melissa. even if it went to the homeowners, it wouldn't solve the crisis. it's shady going for a different purpose. in our culture, the notion is it's public money. wherever it goes to help the greater good is great. theft is theft, alwaysmmoral and destructive. >> it's not theft, there's wiggle room. john, these people were hoping to get something bk. >> yeah, but you can categorize it however you want. the money was to go to meowners. if you think let's do something better, that's what the money was supposed to go to. the lotteries in the southern states, they said we'll help the education system. they put it in the general fund. same in the 1960's. if you see a dime on the floor, a politician is going to take it and use it for whatever he nts. to me, that's wrong. i don't care if it's legal, it's wrong.

>> wayne, you have a smile on your face. >> i don't know why you expect anything else. they're going to take the money anytime and use it for anything they want. public be dammed. it's our fault because we elect them. they take the money and do what they want. >> christian, does it prove it was bad to begin with? >> no it was to deal with fraud in the mortgage industry that affect homeowners. i have to agree with john and many others who said look, homeowners were supposed to receive some benefit from this. the suit was brought on their behalf to win an award based on their behalf and not to use money to assist them is absolutely immoral. 's irresponsible. while i understand some money should go to general funds because the housing collapse affected everybody, the majority of in a money should be for foreclosure assistance and

homeowner relief. >> it was a bank job, a robbery of money from banks. the whole thing is ridiculous. >> hopefully we see the end of this disaster soon. christian, dorsey, we love having you on. thanks for joining us. >> gd job, trace y thank you. >> coming up, someing both presidential candidates agree on, cutting corporate taxes to bring jobs back to america. all energy development comes with some risk,

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get rid of them all together. companies don't pay tas, customers do. people, that's you. the government doesn't need your money. >> amen. john, what you got? >> while you wait to see who emerges as the tallest midget, invest in safe stocks like bermuda does. >> wayne? >> i like the biotech sector. look at a etf called fbt. >> johnathan? >> i know i sound like a casandra when it comes to higher interest rates. they said the same about gold in 2002dsvs goes up with interesting rates. inflation is cong, manipulation of interest rates. this is one to