the atm machines. >> brenda: gary b? >> too far, too fast. i'm bearish on it. >> brenda: all right. and neil is up next. >> not everything is big in texas. you think that's really why president obama went to texas? i'm neil cavuto. fox on top of an over the top irony. president obama choosing the booming state of tex to pitch his new program to get aricans back to work. the same texas with no income tax, ttle red tape, lower unemployment rate than the national average. forget don't mess with texas. maybe the president should start doing things like texas. ben stein, charles payne, dagen mcdowell, adam. dagen? >> giddy-up! come on. the president -- >> i like ben stein to do just that, you know.

very good. >> the white house is taking the nation as a whole down a road toward europe, more regulation, significantly higher taxes, bigger entitlement programs. instead, we should be looking to texas as a mode no personal income tax. wouldn't we love that? but very low tax burden among the states, the six lowest tax burden in the nation. a very friendly regulatory environment, one of the smallest governments based on the number of residents of the state. and they're actively luring businesses into the state from other burdensome states. >> i think he's a pretty clever guy, the president. i think he knew all of the above. that's why he was there and that's why he was more or less trying to use the state, even though its policies are different from his own to say hey, i'm leading thi parade. >> you know what? the president is a brilliant guy, but i'm not sure -- i think he might have made a mistake. i don't give them that kind of credit, althought worked in the election, these republican-led pro-business

states, he won the rust belt and others. >> he lost texas. but there is a strategy to winning a state like texas. extraordinarily well, based on the texas model of pro business, in addition to the things that dagen talked about, what about the idea that hey, come to texas. come here, have a good time. relocate, bring your family, bring your dreams here. the american dream. the old american dream. self-reliance, pull yourself up by your boot straps. the president claims that never ppened inhis country. the question you asked at the beginning, there is a lot of irony involved. absolutely. >> ben stein? >> well, it's an interesting situation. texas is booming. let's remember texas has a lot of oil, lot of natural gas, has a tremendous number of hard work hispanic immigrants. it does have low tax, but also has much less safety welfare net than many other states. i tnk the main thing going on is political. a lot of people have written and i know it's true, that if texas were to flip democrat, there would be no more republican presidents for the foreseeable

future. i think mr. obama is trying to build up that as a credile threat. >> it's not such an unlikely possibility. i mean -- >> not at all. >> he could make a case for it. we forget that not too many decades ago the state used to be safely democrat. >> yes. >> adam, what do you think? >> well, i think that's an astute political point. >> was my pnt astute? just kidding. [ laughter ] >> neil, that is a given. come on. >> you may continue. >> thank you. if we're going to say should the united states be emulating texas, let's be real here. texas does not have a defense dement, does not have an army, although i'm sure they'd like to have one. they don't have to defend us in wars. they don't have to run a food and drug administration. >> let's compare apples to apples. other states. ben had a good example about other states with programs like california, the obligations are

greater. but the fact of the matter is, something governor perry is doing, something that state is doing is wooing a loft businesses. what is i >> and the president -- by the way, the president has been working hard on deregulation. i would not say he's been working hard on cutting taxes. i wouldn't fight that -- >> what has he been deregulating? >> he's been trying to -- he's been trying o streamline the regulatory system. >> oh, please. >> hope springs eternal, but come on, buddy. >> it's interesting that we're having this conversation in a week when we have had new data that the economy is doing very well and even that the budget deficit problem is getting less severe because of higher tax revenues to the federal government. i mean, the president is -- i'm not going to say he's taking a victory lap. but you're right, neil, it's good time to go to texas and say, hey, we're doing pretty well. >> by the way, it must say a lot

about our times, adam, if we are saying that now that we've gotten budget deficits under a illion dollars, yee-ha, to quote dagen. i don't know if we're there yet. >> we're going not right direction. >> exaly. >> no, but i said giddy-up, by the way. >> oh, i'm sorry. >> but i think that the -- >> i cover a part of country where they say do you want grew poupon with that. >> texas has been courting businesses, california to name one, governor per rear's trip to california. jobs have been created. it's not just agricultural job, not just oil and gas jobs. it's companies like facebook and apple, ebay as examples. >> but it is to ben's point a strong foundation to have, that wind at your back, energy. >> absolutely. but they've been ramping up. they've been ramping up oil and gas. >> and diversifying. charles? >> yeah. the president went to austin. i think that's deliberately.

that's a brain centered knowledge based economy that's growing rapidly. >> full of liberals. >> very liberal. >> it's the friendliest to him. >> very friendly to him down there. but listen, this should be a model r the united states. i just don't get it. forgetting about spending on defense and things like that, obviously -- >> you can't forget that. >> a pro growth economy, how to create job, how to create opportunities, renew dreams. >> the things are percolating. >> to use the term, very well, i almost fell out of my seat. we're doing very well? we created enough jobs last month that didn't even keep up with population growth! we're been celebrating mediocrity and calling it very well! >> yeah, adam, what do you think of taking notes because that's against the rules. when you said very well -- >> i was falling out of my chair. >> he actually did full out of his chair, he was so annoyed. but go ahead, adam, defend that pointless point.

[ laughter ] >> we are undeniably moving in the right direction andhat is the important message. that's something that the president and we can be very excited about. >> all right. >> by the way, in texas, if you talk to people from west texas, they don't like obama one bit. he's fighti oil and s development, exploration. he's fighting tooth and nail through the epa. if texas is doing well, it's despite mr. obama. not because of him. >> absolutely. and i love you again. we should point out that we compare texas to the rest of the country. the peoe there think that sta is its own country. >> by the way, in austin, they think they're their own country, with texas. guys, thank you very much. we have a lot more comng up, including this, you think illegal immigration bill is sensitive? wait until you hear all the other stuff in that bill that has nothing to do with illegals here at the fox

news channel. >> neil: it looked like the immigration reform bill could be one for the record books. very thick books because with all the add ons and favors, this thing could make the 2,000 page health care law end up looking like a pamphlet. lots of stuff in there, like goodies f lawmakers in states with ski instructors, cruise ship workers, ranchers and farm hands, even irish immigrants, legal and otherwise. charles, lots of folks counting their lucky charms.

who is counting our tax dollars? >> you know, as it gets larger, the red flags need to come out, as they -- >> neil: they don't. >> i was shocked when i read it was over 800 pages. this is a reform that both parties agreed needs toe done and the more christmas ornaments, the more they talk about government controlling private industry and salaries, the more they claim it's going to bring down costs and other areas like social security, well, you know what? that doesn't happen with the health care bill. every time we see this, the rhetoric should be -- >> neil: what's interesting, by the way, i'm predicting it will be 5,000 pages. under and overill take it any way as wet through this may madness. but dagen, any bill that gets to be that omnibus and that's where we're heading, katy, bar the door. >> i don't have a problem with them adding because what youre talking about the may cutters

and irish immigrants, these are requests put in by various senators, republican and democrat, chuck schumer got more visas for irish immigrants, lindsey graham for meat cutters. >> neil: why was shuck humaner looking at the irish immigrants? >> because we are a city and a state of irish immigrants. >> neil: you don't think it's getting a little confusing? >> a little bit, but i'm not concerned about it at all. by the way, i am very pro-more swiss ski instructors coming to this country. >> neil: who isn't? [ laughter ] by the way, i do notice italian ships were left off this. there is time. >> neil: oh, there is time. adam, what do you make of all this? >> i agree with dagen. this is the messy way that we legislate. none of us o this program are legislators. sot looks obnoxious to us. and is. but the important thing is that we get this immigration bill done because it's good bipartisan policy that our country needs.

and we shouldn't expect this to be any different than the nonsense that goes on in washington all the time. if this is -- >> neil: i don't know, mbe we can raise the bar and not repeat the same nonsense. maybe we can keep it focused. >> i would love for us to do that. but if this is what it takes to, i don't know, buy the votes of some members of congress who shamefully ought to be supporting legislation in the first place and aren't, so be it. >> neil: all right. what do you make of that, ben? >> i think it's politics as usual. but politics as usual is a -- it's like making sausages, it's not something you wanto see up close and personal. >> neil: is this a slap at my people? >> no, not at all. [ laughter ] i probably eat a lot more sausage than you do. it's very -- with all due respect, why not let in these people we need? why not let in more ski instructors? i'm not sure why dagen wants more swiss ski instructors. as far as know she's a happily

married woman. >> neil: as far as we know. >> but i don't understand what the problem is, let in more meat cutters. almost all of us like meat. we all love the irish. who doesn't? >> neil: i don't mean toake light off it. you're saying what dagen is saying. i guess my point is, good intentions that you throw into a legislation, just like after boston, quite properly we wanted to review the whole visa process and senator marco rubio, dare i go name dropping, anyway, i had him on and he said, i'm open to going ahead and reviewing our vi processor college students and that's a -- you know that's a whole nother 500 pages right there. i think all well and good. and then protecting the irish coming in here, mea packers, everything else, ski instructors, whatever is going on there in your life is you business. i'm just saying it's now getting cumbersome and wielding and now getting to be like the health care law on steroids. >> i don't bieve it's unwielding to the point it

couldn't pass in bipartisan -- >> neil: no doubt it would pass. but then what are you left with? >> i would take this over what the house would not get done if they did a piecemeal fashion. by the way, swiss ski instructors, two words, eye candy. >> neil: okay. charles? >> i don't even know how to follow that. i will say, though, it feels like this is something everyone is saying is urgent, both sides want it. why make it more complicated? >> it's not that it's urgent. test that it's necessary. >> usually something that's necessary has a sense of urgency. but go ahead. >> if i may say so, the best thing that's happening here is that america is still a place where everybody wants to go. you don't see too many taxi drivers from new york wanting to move to tehran or cairo. they all want to come here. that's still the great story. >> neil: i agree. >> neil, if the messy health care legislation succeeded in

getting me people insured and if this messy legislation succeeds in reforming our terrible immigraon, illegal immigraon situation, then again, this is good news. >> adam, the operative word -- >> neil: adam, the to argue that the end justifies the means, no matter the price of the means is questionable. and by the way, this moving out to ski instructors, whatever your interesting, young lady, i would say it's a slippery slope. that's all i'm saying. [ laughter ] >> oh, no! >> neil: sorry, sorry. come on. in the meantime, first we mail them out to the tune of $50 billion. can you believe that? now general motors is spending a billion to create new jobs. only problem, not here in the united states. the gang is getting ready for anotr bailout bummer. that's coming up, top of the hour of the first, don't look now, but it looks like soaring @íllege tuition costs are

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ben? >> i make of it thathere is lot of kids in college getting high and partying and not learning anything and if your parents are paying a fortune for you to get high and partying not learning anything, you should be at work in the salt mines. but if kids auay go to college and work, then tuition turns out to be a bgain. it's entirely dependent on how much effort the student puts into it. but on the other hand, college expenses and salaries to professors who work very few hours a week are insane. >> neil: ben, thank you for keeping that strong for us. we appreciate it. adam, your thoughts on what ben just said? >> well, slightly different take on that, but i don't disagree with what ben said. i think this is a very healthy market corrective going on. everything you said in the lead in is accurate, neil. the costs have gotten out of whack and the product being delivered has not kept with the cost. and so some segment of the population has said, we don't need to go to college. you know what? they're right. not everyone needs to go to

college. >> neil: that's not that they're not going to college. they're seeking out cheaper colleges. >> right. this is the most important decision that any young person has to make, the cost-benefit analysis of should i go -- >> neil: iphone or samsung? >> should i go into debt to get a degree that won't get me a job that will enable me to pay back those loans in my lifetime? go to a in-state school. go to a cheaper college, particularly if you're going to party, like you're really stupid. what's dumber than taking money from your parents is borrowing the money and then being drunk for four years. >> neil: yeah. just because some of you can become a financial anchor, don't think lightning strikes twice! [ laughter ] charles, here is my issue with this whole thing. you know, the college created this themselves. they kept hike tuition because then they really kids were get -- realized kits were getting higher and higher loans.

and a the love people said, enough with this nonsense. >> well, a lot of people don't have a choice anymore. buts if interesting that colleges have gotten a free pass. for some reason, they're one of these favorite classes over the years. the rate tuition is hundreds of percents higher than inflation. >> neil: year in, year out. >> i kind of disgreeith what adam and other people who suggest, well, particularly people who have college degrees suggest everyone shouldn't go to college. people who own a home, the popular thing is to say everyone shoun't own a home. but to dagen's point, if you go out and take the loan, it's your loan. maybe you thought president obama said he was going to forgive it. it's your loan. the taxpayers aren't going to be on the hook for it. >> and charles, just to be clear, i don't disagree with you. i'm saying we shouldn't be guilting people into going to college or guilting people into owning a home if that's not what they want. >> neil: that wasn't the point. the point was that colleges have gotten their come uppance, right, dagen? >> absolutely. make a decision based on cost and what they get. but the govnment drove thisy cheap and easy

>> neil: dagen, thankou very much. all you you viewers who might have been ticked off by ben stein, those are his opinions and his only. next stop, dow 16,000 maybe. but what stocks are going to take a dip, after

all right. stocks ready to take it to 16,000 on the do charles, what do you have? >> love disney. it's going extraordinarily well in a very good economy. imagine when the economy gets great, adam. >> not news corp i guess?

disney is what you want? >> i note that it's already had a very nice run. that would concern me about getting in now. >> what are you getting in adam? >> exxonmobil. it has not been doing very well so it's inexpensive and pays a nice dividend. >> exxonmobil. ben, what do you make of that? >> always love xonmobil, but again, i'm not quite sure what our friend from northern california knows that the market doesn't know but god bless him. just buy. the dow is going to 16 tho,000,t buy the dow. >> i prefer to find stocks that are growing a little faster than the overall market but i'm encouraging everyone watching the show to be in the market. >> by the way, ben, i was thking of you. the great baron's columnist passed away, i think 87. what did you think? >> thebrave, fearless, creative, witty,bsolutely

never, ever taken in by wall street bs and the wall street wealth extrtraction machine, ner scared to take on the biggest, toughest guys on the block. when i was a for them, always had my back. a man that we'll never see again. >> outstanding. an american icon now made in china. general motors spending $1.3 billion to start produci cadillacs and new jobs in shanghai. this after getting $50 billion bailout bucks from u.s. taxpayers. gm saying it wants to stay competitive in china's growing luxury vehicle market, but critics say our bailout dollars were used to rev up american jobs, not jobs in china. so who's right? hi, everybody, welcome to "forbes on fox." let's go in focus with rich carlton, rick unger, elizabeth mcdonald. you're fired up about this. >> i am. what we'reta