neilall right, well the president must know, this irs thing, far more terrorizing. welcome, everyone. i' neil cavo. whenever your views on the president once again pushing th so-called terrorist camp down, try as the mighty can i shut of these scandals, especially the growing irs mess. word right now that lerner has been pu on administrative leave . more than benghazi inthe white house talking points to mor th the justice department's nipigon rerter more average americanrelate to ta targets than almost any other.

this is the irs, an entity for now that far more americans fear , so it is so and will forever be. no matter how the president might want tohange the narrativethat things more terrorizing, the reality is for most americans this irs thing right about now is far, far, fa more taxing. i write because rattled the president ver saw this one coming but was deliberately kep in the dark. toliz macdonald on why it is important to get tothe beginning of this scandal and get it right. therein lies that scenes r a watergate-likescandalin which all parties wrong did pretty much everything wrong. >> it could require specl prosecutors. we found to and democrats writing letters, pressuring the irs in 2012 and dating as fa back as 2010.

pressuring the irs commissioner to do something, stopping nonprofits fom engaging in a -- in anyolitical activity, and then it tipped over. neil: making a general statemen about the tea party type groups. revco's the ones that they waed to go after? >> here are the names. senator carl schumer. verypset. roboetter explaining th the irs is in passively.

neil: that congress was deep devolved.

en they wer nowhere to bee found when itll blew up. %-being tooggressive.hemor it sounds very much like that. where is this going? >> it is interesting because there wilbe many hearings a the irs commiionerpleased the fed than we movetoward being a more of formation of scandal after scandal after scandal. these hegs a important and are not a part of obstructing our system of government. they're very important as a par of our system of governing n the american people deserve answers an wt to know who is responsible and that our government is responding appropriately to all of this. congress is right to review 3 these things. it is st a matter of getting to the bottom of it. >> you know thosare some powerful democratic senators you mentioned, are they pushing for more hearings in the senate? >> they should be calledn before the hearing a special prosecutor should hold them

accountable for letters they sent to irs, urging irs act. they are not above the law. irs is not aenaturlure, not like a sewing machine, it is populated by houman beings, irs workers are getting cut, irs pay is getting cut, irs has been used as a political football, theyhould have said no congress, we're sending your letters right back to you but they didn't. il: hadle you would think someone at irs would say this not else call. >> that is in-- ethical. >> that is interesting, i have been thinking maybe there is something about working in irs that might attract a type of person that believes that big government is good thing.

we is to question how much money the people work a irs give to -- to. neil: i don't think that is a generally fair statent for irs workers, but iill say, when someone puts under pressure to do sometng thatou know is wrong, wre finring and targeting a gro to lizzy's point, you are ling your morals. and there is nothing wrong with the irs clarifying a body of law that governs different organizations. neil: but you better clarify it for all. >> enforce it. >> this is happening during an an election season. so that is why there nds to be a scial prosecutor. neil: a lot of committee hearings. >> the tea party said this is what happens with big government, and that the irony, they wereetting inves

investigated for those same issues they brought up. neil: coming t what did the president know, and when did he know it a damning defense for a president who once prized hself for being hands on, and now he is essentially hands off. glen hubbard on dangers of a president now playinn roll of popeye. what do you make of tha >> we have issues facing the country, these scandals distract us from the purpose issues, with the irs, areery tubling. you know, glen, where was this detachment, that president had with this management style he said he never had, he was very involved. in the details of the departments, and could name the names and all details, knew all of the dots and how they

nnected. then stuff hit t fan that was not the case, i'm not saying that every president should be on top of eve detail, but the job is to big, and the government is so big, that is possible, thiis what happens when it gets this big. >> truehat very large governments can be intrusive, but one thing irs scandal said we have a pblem if our big tax agen is tryg to discourage political competition, the country needs more ideas whether they come from the left, or right to compete for the attention of the american people, those those ideas is very bad. neil: what is it, it happens within agencies, but, whe there is a group think that says it is oy, in other words we're getting orders or commands from

senators and congressmen that we should look at these groups, and no one figures or connects or bothers to connection they are conservative groups, this is not very fair and balanced in this targeting, in fact it is beagling well. where -- it is being illegal what happened? >> we doot know a of the facts as it happened. there areome people who directed the targets of specific groups and will have to wait to get the facts it is important that the tax law be neutral. neil: but, some whistle-blowers, could have connected theots, but, someone must have said, did you noticee they are all conservativeve groups, and they-

those whistle-blowers, might come forward, for all i know, deals and arrangementsave bn made. >> we' neutrity. once we have a tax lawhat should apply equally to all people. the simpler the tax code whave the more efficient tax code we have the less chance we have of this kind of behavior. neil: you are right about that, glen hubbard thank you. >> min my pleasure. neil: tires of china hacng up, and ignoring our empty threats if they kee hacking us. we have a former ambassador, here to tl us, you keep hacking us, china, then we're going to hacu back.

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neil: china keeps hacking and we keep threatening and they keep hacking more. jon huntsman jr., governor, it comes down to fighting fire with fire, but how far, and howot do the flames get. >> nl, a pleasure to be with you, fe the facts, by doing nothing, which has been our mode for 20 years, he is what we pay as a nn, a problem each year roughly equal to level of trade to asian pacific rion, 300 ion. 300 mil300 billion. the lost intellect rally proper, you conclude to secret

sauce of our success to u. that for us in terms of level of injury is 300 billion per year, if china, india, russia and others had a level of respect for intellectlroperty like we have in u.s. we would he added 2.1 million more jobs to our workfce, we have a choice to make we could keep managing status kuo until china tries to get their act together. or we could build muscleround thiss a problem do something about it. neil: china -- saying weadock thiwe dothis coup too. that is a slippery slope isn't

it? >> better to create a regime, put out a report, a private commission with some best leaders, from national security, we spent a whole lear looki at this. there are ts things we all the toe doing -- ought to be doing, and making cyber thret hurt. that is access to u.s. market, compans behind it, rengthening itc337 border izure laws. so we can seize more aggressively. neil: but, we're alway on defense. because they own so much of o debt. >> japan -- a lot of countries do. neil: i agree, theres no ason to be on defense, when it can be said china needs us just as more but we don't play that

way. >> tis puts us in an offense of mode, whatoes chinana want ove next many years, last 20 years they wanted to export in largest market now they want to invest in u.s. market. we should have restricts against those companies have that have been behind or supporter of intellectual property theft. there are ways to do that aways with security and exchange commission to take companies that want to if public to use that as a cry teriasm there ould be a way to look the siveious review process today i restricted toational security concerns. to add ip theft. neil: they will never react to that unless we follow-up there are companies that feel, they get in their system, chinese, and steal stuff, and hack stuff, and cause mess. i talked with a high-tech ceo,

said, if head the tit-for-tat ability, he does, he said there is nothing i want over there nothing i need, there is no secret i want. because, everything they are get ey are copying there is no upside for me t hack back. >> getting in a t-for-tat scenario is a lose-lose longer term. you want to chaage behavior, change command and control which is a coordinated effort. state owned enterprises are able to work w with governmt. in getting information. is that ises behavior. neil: all that fails. it all fails, we fight fire with fire? >> well, listen go to read the report, and there is a cpter 14 hat really, is the fight fire with fire. neil: that is the chapter i was talking about, that is the one

that i like. that -- >> that is a great headle. a greatv program but in actual world. you have to -- >> very calm, thank you. you hold that out there. >> hole it ou hold leverage. neil: ts is where i thinkkyou could benefit from being italian like me. make that opening salvo and see wh happens. >> no comments on that, thank you. neil: l right. let's stay we're timing a day after this in ldon. the president annoues he wants to close this in guantanamo bay. thank you orville and wilbur... ...amelia... neil and buzz: for teaching us that you can't create the fute... by clinging to the past. and with that: you're history. instead of looking behind...

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>> there are 102 people on a hunger strike. >> let me speak. >> youre commander in chief. >> call on congress to let restricton on detainee transfers from gitmo. i have asked the department of defense to designate a site ii u. where we could hold military commissions. neil: that protester calls for president to close gitmo. the president not liking the interceptions. i heard rude say really? america's mayor. and a day after a terror attack in lonn. mayor, awkward? >> probably never a good time to announce that you will take all of tse terroristsut of gitmo, when nobody wants them, i

don't know where he is going to put them. ne: you would think after yesterday's development heould put it off. >> t wle idea there is no globalar we just had an attack in london, we have an attack in bost two guys, maybe more, who did it in the name o jihad in the name of islamic extremist terrorism. we have this attack at fort hood is is described as workplace violence, the guy was shooting out yelling allah akbar, this is like a serial killer, there are 30 cereal killings, and -- serial killings, and you prefuse to admit there is a connection. neil:ou do say the word terror, the president, you cite these incident the. glob terror war, what is - >> pretend theyre isolatedins

indents of people who just went wacky. neil: what is he saying? is he saying they are that. >> i hate to make the case for him, it is dangerous to america's national security. i think giving himhe benefit of the dou, he believes if you say islamic extremist terrorist, you encourae more. neil: let's see, you leave it t, how about global war on terror, and he says it is not. >> he is wrong, and the reality circumstancis, it does not matte says they are at war with us. if he said, it is a globa w on terror, wt difference would it make? >> hh would send t right signal to our bureaucracy, they wouldot be worried like they seem to be inhe unrun-up to

boston, no one can fure out why these brothers, or older brother, tamerlan tsarnv, was not identified as a terrorist. i believe reason is everyone that in bureaucracy is afraid to say, islamic extrest terrorists, they are afraid to misidentify. i also think today,as diveion day. i think this is classic, crisis nagement. political crisis management, create a new couldn't vsey, thcontroversy,because the otherg him, with benghazi, and irs, and ap/fox. neil: we call if fox/ap. >> either way, butar came out first. >> you are right. seems more aloof by bringing up gitmo, and to what end? >> he wants you and i tonht to discuss gitmo, instead of

discussing the wom yesterday who took the fifth amendment. neil: we led with that. >> a startling development. neil: like washington we can multitas >> i have legal adve for mrrosen, hehould sue federal government, that would lead to discovery, they violated his civil rights in a way outrage ausy putting him in there as an undicte coconspirator. >> why do they do i >> the first judge refused their requt to get rords, so they had to ratchet it u t make it appear he was committing a crime, and suggested he was a flight risk, how absd. >> he is wn you all go out to eat and pick up the tab. >> he got a heck of aawsuit, he should bridge it they

violated his civil rights, they liabled him, they defamed him. neil: he is part of a larger pan of wheth the obama administration dirtly, but tramplingn a lot of things. >> it is, there is a connection with what irs is doing, and justice department, they are doing his bidding, they are trying to please the king. ne: the king does not hav to say anything. >> he went overboard wita party. >> angry, nasty language, they are ract, and unpatriot. if you are in a bureaucracy and you want to advance yourself, you do what the t guy wants, that is what is going to her i don't know if we're going to find trek orders from white house to a one of these. neil: you think that whtle-blowers are out there making dealing? >> i think there could be more if it happened in irs, and --

>> i know that, but, as a top prosecutor, that ts is what -- getting these deals together. >> sheid tremendous damage by taking fth amendment now s raised reaty there is a possibility of criminality..@ neil: i am asking you, they need whistle-blowersr people in the know to come forward, d you think they are coming together? >> you he to have a special prosecutor, you will see it happeneal fast. people will get worried, they maybe buck will stop with me, and i'll get prosecuted. i think this will -- >> do you think we will? >> i we have to, it is getting way too koch kate complicated. she problem waived the her fifth amendment right to take a pass to answer questions thi is like someone on trialing

sayingi, i'm innocent, i didn'ttdo it, and refuse cros cross-examineit. >> it sounds pretty good. mayor giuliani. >> when we come back, dowights back today, but it follows a massive global sell-off, this is what happens when you threat don't take candy away, the kids get upset, these were traders, mu more dangerous, when kid are mad they cry, when these guys are mad, they bolt. bny mellon combines investment management & investmentserv, giving uunique insights which help us attract the industry's brightest minds who create powerful strategies for a country's investments which are used to build new schools

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d the dow, finis you would say no big deal. but what a wild ride. and i'm wonring that says something about boy, a prick elielie market. >> it does, first ben bernanke saying he is dialing baca bond buying, a remember, that manufacturing sector has been world's globalngine, global markets went down, japan down 7% that is like the dow dropping a thousand points, european markets, and what does.s. market do it yawned. so this says something about the psychology. neil: it didn't start yawning, i wonder if cooler heads prevailed or they sa he didn't say he was stopping this, they love to

massage it to a point where they say no ben will still have our back, i'm asking, what happens when he does have to have to stop? >> well tss the point,ou know, they didn't take it seriously. th should. and if they do, and when they do. these markets will go down. committee forconomy development has been complaining and warning about the deb situation, and about the economy, we do not have a healthy economy, we're growing at about 2%, we adding jobs at a small rate, not enough to keep up with population, that the total. rate, the participation rate is lowest it has been since carter years, this is not a healt situation, if you look at chinese manufacturing sector, this says, christmas isot going to be good, nobody is talking about this yet. but all manufacturing is happing now for holiday buying, then it will ship, watch shipment here later in summer and fall, they have to get to

ste, this is not a good siin for christmas which is you know, the consumer stor0% of our economy. neil: yeah but you know, i hear you, b iould say market has been climbing this wall of worry, and japan even with 70% hitoday, it is a market that was you know, in and out of 5 1/2 year highs, so, maybe we're -- too much. >> the nikkei w wasay up, our markets of way up, we do not have a healthy economy. and you cannot keep goi on the bubble spending forever. we're at 17.5 trillion in debt, where is that debt going? cha is buyingome,apan is buying some. it is going to the fed, if you don'have the fed taking debt fr one pocket to the other, where does it come from? one place, that and wll have to print money, when you print money, it will be nflationary,

i know chairman bernanke saide does not see signs of inflation well not today, but we have sewn allf seeds for it. we have to pay the pipe near neil: walmart said they roleu. taxes are eatings if business sales alive who knew buyers were moving further down retail chain, dollar tree is making a killing. the thk you orville and wilbur... ...amelia... neil a buzz: for teaching uthatou can't create the future... by clinging to the past. and with that: you're history. instead of l looking behind... delta is looki beyond. 80 thousand of us investing billions...

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welcome to the new buffalo. new york state is throwing out the old rule book to give your business a newdge, the edge y can only get in new york state. to grow our start your business, visit thenewny.com neil: j.lo apple killer? don't laugh, we heard jennifer lopezas opening a chain of cell phone stores,elling

rizon stuff. see if you still want to buy. we have dennis kneale and john. what do you think? >> i don't think so, i think wonderful idea, i like verizon th the yield everyone is trying to tap in to latino market. it is that big, that is why they have her and marc anthony as part owners of the miami dolphins, but, i think this is great for verizon but i don't think it moves the needle against apple. >> this is greatove on first glance, prey firs latino popula% growth. in last 5 years, and but, are we sure that latinos need much less want a phone store chain just for them? 75% of the latin group, has a smartphone, versus 63% for

americans overall. so there is no obstacles, and many features ty say are geared to latin families,ike a play space and stores for your kids, and that is in many stos that are not just appeali that to latinos, j.lo is famous for her booty licious derere, she could loss this body part on this busine. -eil: we will show that video again. in the meantime, issue 2, walmart, when it comes to cheap you are not all that. because whenimes are tough, shoppers are not going to you, they are going to a place cheaper, that could explain where dolla tree is so fire, and you are not. and rphauren a predicting buffo sales, and you are not, dens they is a retail version

betwee a revenue rock and a hard place. >> we always hear complains and worries about vanishingiddle class, very low end discounters like dollar stores do well, and high-end stores do well, but middle struggles, j.c. penneys, and sears,aybe walmart. but i tnk theyre the greatest retailer in the world, i would not bet against them. neil: maybe we could put up the j.lo video again, becse i am curious how she would react to this. is it weird that gap between rich and wlth has never been wider, then now walmart in mid tell is weird. >> we've seen this for some time, happening for a better part of a decade. neil: the j.lo thing or phenomen in retail? >> j.lo ffr me has been happening for more than a

decade, i am very m add marc anthony for marrying her. you are seeg poverty at record levels as far as numbers, and as dennis said our middle class has disappead, we're seeing it in retail, it can be coming that pronounced in america that poor are getting much poorer,nd more are moving into income levels. middle class just disappearin and family dollar, and ralph lauren is reason they are showing signs of the profits they have. neil: dennis? >> don't count walmart out. they have such huge base of sales,s, 400 billion. this company has done more good for low income shopper, and even wealthy love a good eal, and that bodes well for dollar storesnd walmart. >> dennis, walmart, according to a decide lowered food inflation by full percent, you are right

with what the have done. >> what if you don't l shopping at any of those price poin? lower, midding higher. >> then you go on-line on amazon. >> you are right about that. thank you. >> thank you very muc >> and thank you to job or low. j.lo for all y have done. neil: thank you. amazing, i don't know where we are going. i'll leave the segment with ts and think about what i am doing next, j.lo, dou think that pigs are flying, "new york times" says that the tea party is back, i'm so glad you called. thank you. we're not in london, are we? no. why? apparently my debit card is. what? i know don't worry, we have cancelled ur old card. great. thank you. for unusual activity, you could also set up free account alerts. okay. [ female announcer ] atells fargo we're working around the clock to help protect youmoney

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neil: the time is changing, no less then "new york timimes," ss

that tea party is chaing, he and tea arty on the same page, a fox first, what did you make of this. >> this is a siz schizophrenic moment for the "new york times." all of a sudden obama gang starts shooting crazy at everything in sight, and shoot at ap, shoot atap, shoot a me. now obama is bad, i'm good. i'm being oprosse by obama, therefore the enemy ofy enemy being my friend, tea partyust beood,his is a sizoid moment for liberal press, and difficult to keep up wit them, unless you are willing toial walw around in sociology of dim witted. the question is, are they, and

have they in their schizophrenic frenzy of pai pair nowa knowingt ama is after us too. teaarty fell after their high of 2010, some people pass that off as just presidential year, i don't thinkkthat was it i think that some of the leadship of tea party got too involved with themselves, and forgot their mission. >> a lot got involved in social ises and grayed theiressage, having said that, i wonder, this sounds perverse logic this scdal. whatever hell the tea party went through was best thing that happened to them. >> yes, there is nothing more unifying than a common enemy, everyone hating t irs anyway.

ne: careful, now, see i do not hate the irs, i know irs agents watch the show, i will let that come go. >> i don't. i don't either. neil: okay. >> you and i know that the good professional careerists in irs did not pull this bumbling stumbling. neil: you are right about that. >> you have to be crazy not to understand that. barack obama made his whole life's career in so far as he had one. out of being a activist for the left wing. he knows all of the dirty tricks, he knows how to deploy them. obama gang, gave directives to the irs, wll use these tools to persecu those whom we fear, turns out at that moment, they had fear of libal press, why they did, i don't know that. that is a bit i hav schizophrent

liberal people a hard to understand they have no foundation base of reference by which they ler ever live every f your life. ne: a chance forou to feel the love, you and "new york times" in sink. >> his my moment with "new york mes" in mid 80s, they embraced base closing, s surely, a lot of my friends doubted me. neil: all right, well, that was then this now is. you are a great egg n, dick army always good seeing you. >> thank you neil: well will be a long hot summer. i am n talking for you. i'm actually talking for t folk in tt house. alec, for this mission i upgradeyour srt phone. ♪ right. but the most important feature of alls... the capital one purchase erase

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neil: they say memorial weekend is unofficiastart of summer. the whiteouse is feeling hot and bothered already. with all of stuff with enghazi, and internal revenue svice, and ap, the white house might feel it is giving stued, it is filledith a long summer with a lot of hearings about this stuff, where is itoing? >> nixon is looking so good ght now, i think tt nixon family is so thrilled. that was child a play next to this, this is three, 3 sikes you are out. neil: wherever ricrd nixon is now. he is just saying, touche. real, right. what do you tnk? >> any pitical scandal neil there are t elents, first is

substance alleged in all three cases tha is overriding concern, they areerious. there is always other side, public resonance, what are people thinking about this, in this 64 score the proof is in lling, this week cnn had a poll out shows tt majority of americans consider them to be quote very iortant. the washington st had a poll that shows americans give high marks to congressional republics, on their handling -- >> that same poll also had president's approval rating up. >> that bridge bridges plea to s -- that brings me to fox news poll. >> you digress. it surprising it has not been dramatic. >> guy is way too serious. >> he is a smart guy.

my only point is, they regisr in the polls but not hitting the president, big time, yet. >> there is a ryan, bo reason, f these will stick around for a while, the irs, the one that should be sticking around is ap and fox situation those -- that is one that really uets me, this is not okay. the irs will stick around because nobody likes the irs, you haveeard word benghazi in about two weeks now, there i a reason, benghazi is not stickin with the president. irs will not get to the president. this is my suspicion, you don't ow for sure until you see it wind out. which i why i was not thrilled with the last guest. telling us that obama was behind it, he does not know it. i am not sayin he wasn't. >> i don't thinke he any evidence of that. you shod notot --

>> back to guy's point, these issues do resonate wit americans, a just, i think it is a matter of time before they do. >> i agree, i think it is going to get worse and worse, this is going to be one ofhe worst times in presidentialistory. i am saying way worse than watergate. >> really? >> cover-up and people are targeting the irs. >> i think multiple scandals going on, any one could drag on. >> a name with mulple scandals, his name was clion. >> this is different. neil: mainstream media is not going t jump on h. >> let's talk about his polls. neil: carul. let brie in guy. your argument is. what these scandals more questioning, the more we unearth and findd and maybe whtle-blowers come forward then it has drip, trip effect

we saw with the beginning of watergate hearings. >> well whole pmise of segment is, is this a lon hot summer for white house. i'm not saying that polls show right now this is hugely damaging to president obama himself. we're seeing a little bit of the sle. but people are taking them seriously, and there is a finding in fox news poll, that was 68% of americans, that is a huge majority believe that the federal government is out of control. >> yes. >> that is a status in people's guts, t gernment is o of hand. these scandal play into this general prevailing set, that is a problem. neil: good point. >> if you are a republican, this should have been argument you were making fromay one u know what you can say, proof

positive that government is too big for anyone to manage. jo: it gets so bighat it is rit for abuses. >> and that is what is going on. people lying. >> i don't think so. >> you don't even know. you don't even know. john: does it pass the smell testhere? >> some things do not and some things do. certain elements are troubling, but the way that i have seen congress go about this, miitake. john: we don't know. >> we can say it that the way @%ey have done about the investigation is a mistake and you know what else we casay, the weight of the white house t ndicions team has gone about their part of he job is really bad. neil: heres something top worry about, that, their best defense is saying that there were out of the loop. >> qaeda they getway with it? >> iompetence and ignorance is

there best defense, as you say, because that is different than deceit and malice, but it still looks pretty darn bad. il: thatdon. that will do it. we will see you tomorrow. ♪ john: what do you know about gasoline? zero oil companies? >> wait too much. john:ii am told at the mall wil lp. >> a new hero is rising. saving our future. john: it does increase smiling. >> you can add miles. john: a lot of myths.our show t. ♪ >> and now john stosse. [applause]