friday. excess redesign there is here to show us what is in fashion for summer hats. that's it for tonight on "the willis report."3 @%ank you for joining us. have a great night. ♪ >> and a very good evening, everybody. thank you so much for joining us. i'm lori rothman tonight in for lou dobbs. deals on the administration's attempt to dismiss an distraction the political scandals involving the white house are clearly not working. fox news is joining several other major media organizations in boycotting a series of off-the-record meetings with embattled attorney general eric holder, part of the attorney generals now failed efforts to make peace with the media who are outraged over the department of justice's heavy-handed seizure of journalists stone and e-mail records. meanwhile, a new poll suggests extending majority of americans are not ready to let the obama

administration off the hook for the irs scandal. according to surveys 76 percent of voters now think an independent special prosecutor should investigate the irs targeting of conservative groups. among many troubling revelations regarding the era scandal, public records show former irs chief visited the white house at least 159 times during the president's first term. his predecessor, by comparison, visited the bush white house just a handful of times. there are new reports that the irs official at the center of the scandal has a disturbing history of party conservatives, particularly when she headed enforcement at the federal election commission. back in the late 1990's she allegedly told the republican senate candidates in illinois, promise me you will never run for office again and we will drop this case. still has not been fired, despite pleading the fifth before congress.

and president obama is not weathering the storm unscathed either. recent polls have shown his job approval remains steady, but that is no longer the case. the new job approval is now under water with 45 percent of voters saying they approve of the job of the president is doing compared to 49% disapprove. that is the -- that is not the only bad news. just 49 percent now say the president is honest and trustworthy, a massive drop from the 58 percent that said he was back in september of 2011. so a growing number of news organizations outright refusing attorney general eric colors invitation to an off-the-record meeting, and that is why. saying those organizations are forfeiting their right to complain about the department of justice assault on the first amendment. for more now we turn to fox news correspondent san green for the report. >> fox news will not attend at the doj meeting is off the

record according to executive vice president of news michael clementi. same goes for cbs. they do not plan to put dissipate in the off the record meeting with attorney general eric holder. he would be willing to consider and on the record discussion. also taking a pass on any of the record opportunity to, nbc, cnn, the new york times, associated press, and the huffington post. there have been some takers. abc news will attend the meeting and press for the conversation to be put on the record. political editor in chief says i feel anyone, whether official ordinary reader should be able to have an unguarded conversation with someone in a position of accountability or news organization when there is good reason. communications director for the democratic national committee tweeted that media who refuse to me with the attorney general forfeit their right to gripe setting this response from the aclu, the suggestion that news

organizations somehow give up their right to object by not accepting the invitation is a problem. >> when you have lost the press, especially one that has been so supine and so supportive of this administration, they have bent over backwards to give them every break, then you're really, really in trouble which is where having this extraordinary attempt to kind of set the record straight on and off the record basis. >> meanwhile, the clock is ticking toward the wind a deadline for holder to reply to an extensive set of questions from the who republicans on the house committee who believes he may have misled them during his testimony. regardless of whether or how he answers, many on the left and righttthink it is time for president obama to ask for his resignation, including senate judiciary committee member crews >> absolutely, and the reason is this department of justice has demonstrated a willingness to disregard theelaw. >> also today james google --

three, too, want -- that happens all of us. he hasn't had a blooper. shannon green, fox news correspondent. lori: for more on the multiple white house scandals and the tumbling job approval numbers for the president, please a lot of former deputy assistant to president bush and fox is contributor rob blake and an assistant editor and columnist. many news organizations, including fox news will not attend because this is an off the record meeting. why isn't he letting journalists report on a meeting in a lack of transparency which is what the administration is trying to convince us up. >> well, that is a very good question. i think it should be televised. if he really wanted to make it clear that the system was going to change and they do with it for good reason there would have up a conversation. but it is going to be a question, obviously, of the news outlets asking him how he let this happen, how he ever would have approved the tactics.

why he made decisions to did. more of a public relations tour with the news shows. all these people and all these different news outlets investigating scandal coming out of the department of justice from their own investigations into their sibila operations, it is hard for them to go to these meetings, listen to the spin and have it be off the record. lori: de think this may backfire? what is the likelihood? wouldn't it be great if one of the organizations that has agreed to participate in this off the record meaning actually does report what went on? >> can you imagine? wasn't eric holder came up with this idea, by the way, it was the president of the united states who said that he would be doing this, the same president and promised to be the most open and transparent has not allowed because it was his idea, holder

to make an off the record conversation with the press. if. he is telling the press, and speak to you, but you cannot have anything attributable to land saying in a meeting. so anyone who participates in this meeting is really the tool of eric holder, made during the press more than the already has. lori: good anything productive, this? we get a new code of conduct? both sides doing their job? >> i think the attorney general is trying to change the conversation by encouraging senators gramm and schumer and others on a helluva pushing for a media shield law and trying to make the conversation, as i said, but the changes that they will make. it is unclear whether or not those changes will prevent anything or not -- prevent

anything from happening in the future like this, but we are still looking at whether someone who is being investigated for perjury and someone who person was involved and having a search warrant remain secret so that the subject would never be informed because they wanted a fishing expedition that would g3 on for years. it is still something he fills remorseful about, he says, but it begs the question of whether or not he can be the captain of all of the investigations into the scandal as head of the department. lori: would you comment on whether or not you think or how many other journalists phone records were grabbed? how many others? >> well, i mean, i have no idea how many others. i never in speaking to people in washington they're not as fond of the male as they work. they would really rather just talk, don't. lori: your thoughts on holder?

he has been through already a whole term, longer than most. >> well, he is certainly a drag on the president and will continue to be as long as he is in that spot. he will be able to resign on his own, but the public may have the last say on him because the president's popularity, the people's belief that the president is being truthful and credible with them is stumbling, and is stumbling fast. he needs to get rid of those people around him, as some in the white house is not tolerable itself, and clean house. it is not only at the justice department but other agencies, the irs specifically. they need to have a breath of fresh air blown into it if this president will have any hope and being effective in not being a lame duck senate and later. lori: you mentioned the irs, and since we're talking scandal, let's give it there. this news that the former commissioner, but militiamen, over 150 visits to the white house. what do you make of that? is just curious. to his men to the white house

that many times? >> this is something and a little bit about because i scheduled president's 43. i was in charge of his time. i will tell you, it is not unusual, it is incomprehensible that an executive department had would be at the white house three, four times in at ten year, over 118 times specifically during this time we're talking about, the targeting of political groups dominate is unheard of. the reason i believe it is happening or happened is because there is no paper trail. they're not using the phone or e-mail spirit their summit in the sky and giving them orders and doing something with the execution of orders he is getting from the white house. he is not coming for coffee. the first thing he remembers. lori: that's a great point. the irs has named a new chief risk officer, however, 76 percent want a special as -- irs prosecutor.

let you comment on this and other night you think it is a productive step to a thinning of the organization. >> it certainly is. they have taken someone, a professional from the general accounting office and it is sort of a watchdog group that investigates congress. they are professionals. i think that there will come in and do the right thing. it is certainly one step. i would not say it precludes the idea of a special outside prosecutor. someone has to get in there and really identify how the system was run and we're -- how far the culpability spread, whether justin at cincinnati officer of the way to the top leaders in washington and how something like that can get started and go on for so long. lori: well thank you both for weighing in on the top headlines of the day. >> thanks. >> thank you. lori: thanks again. well, there is another bring white house scandal. senate republicans are now calling for an investigation

into whether health and human services secretary broke any laws are vvolated ethics rules when she recently solicited privvte sector donations from nonprofit to enact obamacare. republicans say the fund-raising give the appearance of a conflict of interest and ome are concerned she is violating a federal law that says government employees cannot raise money from groups that they regulate. hhs denies sebelius did anything illegal, that is not stopping two house committees from investigating the matters as well. forget scandals, president obama's top priorities, raising campaign cash to return the speakership to nancy pelosi. we have that story. upside-down rallies, more economic news sending markets higher. delphi management president's got black explains wall street's in reverse logic next. ♪

♪ lori: talk about the markets, that is sure a lot of fun lately, especially if you're bullish. stocks finishing modestly higher despite some lackluster economic data, gaining 22 points. the s&p up six, the nasdaq gaining 24 points. volume on the big board, three and half billion shares trading hands. the market gains were limited after gdp was revised slightly lower ted to nab% in the first quarter. we also learned weekly's job to -- weekly jobless claims rose. and depending on sales rose three tenths of a percent missing expectations as well. it rising to the highest level in three years. precious matter to the precious metals, gold gaining $20 on the day, people back to gold. closing at 1412 per ounce.

crude oil gaininggas well selling at just under $94. the bond market, the yield on that ten year, just over 2%. so staying at elevated levels. my next guest says there are a lot of forces working against the economy right now, but he believes they are -- there is room for stocks to march higher. joining me now, scott black, president of delphi management. thank you. >> thank you for inviting me. lori: he noted, the stock market is absolutely ripping. the dow is up 17% year today. is this the fed is fuelled event or do you believe economic fundamentals support the levels of the stock-market? >> i think the corporate earnings support the level. if you use the s&p 500 as a proxy, it is approximately 15 times my estimate, and i am lower than the s&p numbers themselves. the s&p bottom ops at $112.

they are back above 10950. we have been a realist -- realistic and about $104 which i used at the round table, about 7% from last year. if you look at historic norms from the s&p 500 a post-world war two era, 16 is the median. this is certainly not the tech a bubble of 1999 or 2000. it is fairly priced. the one caveat i should make is that if you look at the russell 2000 for small-cap and 20500 as a madcap, it is fully valued at about 19 times this year's expected earnings. lori: his is the best way to determine valuations and whether or not stocks are overbought or oversold. curious about earnings. they think -- been coming end of the latest reporting season is companies to meet estimates and guidance was okay, but companies were still -- the top line revenue growth is not a lot of people like to see, 30 robust corporate growth.

>> you're absolutely right. lori: t think the market will catch up to that? >> sent us a short. that was only about one-half percent. the first quarter wws up about seven. if elected the economic data today, corporate profits in the united states the way the united states government measures it, to get inventory adjustments , we are down 44 billion for the quarter that just ended. i don't think valuations are sky high. what i do think has been happening is that money has flowed into consumer staples. many of those companies, procter and gamble, coca-cola, pepsi said 18 and 21 multiples with low single-digit topline growth. way overvalued. most of them have had a big run. there is no topline growth. basically pass in clips in these business -- businesses and it does not make sense. is the greater fool who is paying these types of multiples.

lori: does things that were so kind to so many of us and that we see interest rates rising, telecom utility. it is interesting that the cyclical names, companies that do better in a growing economic environment actually even cheaper than those names you were just talking about. >> but actually, the sector has done very poorly. it has been a laggard. we are talking about the power house companies. if you look at companies like cisco, oracle, back out the cash. these companies have all sorts of excess cash, they are still selling at nine, ten, when the market multiple, they generate huge amounts of free cash flow. they have strong franchises and getting absolutely no respect this year whatsoever. lori: let's talk a little bit about the fed. what is your take on the stock of tapering says the minutes were released from last week. we heard from bernanke. interest rates shot right up.

economic data. it was a little soft. the market took the bad news is good news. how will the market reacts to the next said the event through the balance of the year? >> the fed is that going to take away the punch bowl. bernanke has said we have to get the regular unemployment down to six and a half%. we are still less seven and a half. of course, the economy is barely above stall speed here at to exchange. ims today in its outlook downgraded u.s. growth for a full year to just under 2%. is unlikely that the fed will take its foot off the accelerator on quantitative easing. i am not so worried in the short term. lori: once it does, even if it is next zero the following year, the think that the markets will have a vault tell reaction? will it be disorderly at best? >> i absolutely degree, and if you look at the fed balance sheet, and a look before i came to see today, we had roughly

$750 billion when the lehman debacle hit. we are now three and a half trillion and counting. renting a lot of money. at some point they will have to withdraw low that -- with strong liquidity, and when they do that i think it will be ferried deleterious for stock markets. you're getting stock markets in europe, the whole globe is printing money, whether it is the eurozone, united states, but while they are accommodative and p-e ratios are roughly the norm of 16 times earnings i don't think you have to worry about speculation in the u.s. equity markets. lori: you don't think this is a bubble? what is your target for the end of 2013. >> i am not a technician, but i do think that the market itself probably could, you know, go up another 6-10%. could have a 17, 17 and. i think that is realistic. lori: thank you. and of course for your time as well. scott black of delphi. >> thank you.

lori: end tonight with some great offers on the schedule. tomorrow, fox is contributor colonel ralph peters joins luke, tomorrow, to talk about his latest novel legendary defender of the first amendment will discuss his new book entitled a friend of the court. tuesday atom is here to discuss their shadowy history of the secret bank that runs the world. his book is a tower of babel. you won't want to miss it. up next, the brand new deadly virus that has the world health officials on high alert striking again planning three more victims. the latest next. and president obama's says he is done campaigning. what is he doing at fund-raisers ed henry has the full report. ♪ we went out and asked peopl a simpleuestion:

how old the oldest person you've known? gave peop a sticker and had them show us. we learnea lot of us have known someone who's lived well into their 90s. and that's a great thing. but even though we're living lger, one thing that hasn't changed much is the official retirement age. ♪ he question is how do you make sure you have the money you need to enjoy all of these years. ♪

♪ lori: and saudi arabia reporting three more people have died from

a deadly new respiratory virus at the world health organization says is a threat to the entire world. the news casualties bring the total worldwide death toll to 30. the sars-like virus known as the middle east respiratory virus was first identified in humans last september. since then more than half of those infected with mers have died. the secret service, meantime, says eight screening facility intercepted a letter addressed to president obama that may have been tainted with the deadly poison ricin. similar to to rise in tainted letters recently sent to michael blumberg and his group, mare's against illegal guns. mayor blumberg says the threatening letters will make him walk away from his efforts to impose control. president obama of blank teeseven avoiding a cloud of scandals of part -- surrounding his administration. back on the campaign trail raising money with nancy pelosi,

trying to avoid by winning back the majority in the house which will help pass his second term agenda. fox's chief white house correspondent ed henry has our support. >> reporter: while storm clouds are still forming around is attorney general eric holder, president obama was summoned chicago raising money for house democrats to try and help get nancy pelosi back in charge. >> outstanding leader, once again to be speaker, nancy pelosi in the house. we love nancy. >> reporter: the president's mission is not just jumping democrats take back the house in 2014 so they can pass his second term agenda. a democratic victory would also not speaker -- knocks speaker john boehner out of power and make sure his committee chairmen would no longer have gavels to investigate the string of controversies dominating congress's attention right now. >> a democratic house would cease to ask any inappropriate questions, whether it is the ira scandal, the events surrounding benghazi, or the issues

regarding the department of justice. >> reporter: and new poll shows those controversies are taking some toll on the president. his approval rating has dropped to 45 percent, loss of three points since may 1st. before the irs admitted targeting conservative groups. meanwhile, 76 percent said that special prosecutor should be named to investigate the irs situation. the white house is also on the fence over holders plan to congress that he had never been involved in any possible prosecution mobile -- prosecution of a reporter. just days ago it was revealed that the attorney general himself signed off on investigating james rosen. >> he was involved. >> involved in what. >> he signed off on a search warrant. >> you're not involved after signing the search warrant? >> reporter: the winnipeg poll also shows on benghazi the percentage of people that believe the administration deliberately miss that the

public increased to 46 percent this winter -- between december and may. of a the same time frame people believe the administration shared facts has dropped from 47 to 40%. asked today the president said to have aids is the is focused on his job. >> to permit to govern correctly, part of my task is to constantly and continually reach out to the other side to try to find common ground. >> of course controversy's call into question the president's ability to govern. a chief risk officer was named to restore integrity. lori: time will tell. the washington post fact checker today calling out secretary of state john kerry. twice this month he has planned and public speeches that the u.s. is not only meeting but exceeding greenhouse gas emissions goals set by the kiev

of protocol. that agreement aimed to lower emissions by 7 percent from 1990 to 2012. according to the latest data available u.s. greenhouse gas emissions in 2011 were actually seven and half percent higher than they were in 1990, not lowered. as a result some of the washington post is giving secretary john kerry three pinocchios. the attorney general's charm offensive backfired as major media organizations boycott is being with the press. the "a-team" tells us -- tells us if it is finally time for eric holder to go. do they or don't they? serious as they now have russian weapons systems. the u.s. says they don't. national-security experts analyze the deteriorating situation in syria next.

♪ lori: syrian dictator bashar al-assad making some shocking plans today regarding the russian support for his war effort. u.s. officials, however claimed that assad is simply lying. fox these national security correspondent jennifer griffin with our support. >> reporter: when asked by the3 hezbollah television interviewer whether russians had delivered a controversial arms shipments that the u.s. has described as a potential game changer, syrian president bashar al-assad hinted that a shipment of the s300 anti-aircraft missile system was on its way, and parts of it had already arrived. [speaking in native tongue] >> translator: agreement between us and the russians for a long time. they're committed to the agreement. agreed with russia, all will be implemented, and part of it has already been done. >> reporter: u.s. officials say he had been bluffing and they have been watching it

shipments closely. so far the u.s. and israel agree that the advanced as 300 surface-to-air missile system wassnot among the many arms that have already been delivered. israel threatened to take military action if the russians completed the missile shipment to syria. the mobile matron far reach of the s300 would make it difficult for the u.s. and its western allies to set up a no-fly zone. chairman of the joint chiefs general martin dempsey explained earlier this month that the pentagon concerns about this weapon. >> amelie word about is that assad will decide this and see as the system see is so far -- somehow safer and more prone to a miscalculation. again, an unfortunate decision. >> reporter: meanwhile assyria deeply divided opposition is calling for help from a town where they are battling assad forces to have reportedly been joined by lebanese hezbollah fighters. there was evidence that iranian byte is were on the ground in syria as well.

senator john mccain just returned to from an unannounced trip to syria in reeent days to meet with rebel forces and continues to a press the administration to get involved to remove assad. the visit was not without controversy. lebanese press reported he posed with two non militants allegedly wanted for kidnapping muslims, mccain's office put out an explanation tonight. if the individual photographed with senator mccain is, in fact, mahomet morris it is regrettable, but it would be ludicrous to suggest that the senator in any way condones the kidnapping of programs or has any communication with those responsible. lori: thank you. setting this up beautifully for our next segment for bashar al-assad in the same interview vowing that any future air strikes from israel will result in serious trekking back hard claiming he has warned other countries in the area that syria

will retaliate if attacked from the outside. what it means for any chance that future stability in the region, i am joined by former u.s. ambassador to the un and fox news contributor john bolton and fox news middle eastern terrorism analyst dr. walid phares. gentlemen, welcome. >> thank you. >> ambassador, with regard to these anti-aircraft missiles from russia to syria, the u.s. believes that is lying. you agree? >> well, i listened very carefully to the translation and that did not hear assad claim that anything had been delivered. he said that part of the russian contract had been performed, and that could well be training, training is critical. you can ship the hardware, the missiles, the radar, but unless the syrian army knows how to operate it, it is of o use to them. could be that training has been going on, and that is worrisome. lori: so it is not say rattling to say, hey, we have these anti-aircraft missiles and if

israel comes back again we are armed and ready to go, just warning to any outsiders and may get involved. >> i think this is very serious when russia says, as they have repeatedly, they are going to deliver these systems. it has both political and military consequences in the region and a very far reaching. lori: so bring you into the discussion, with these missiles, would it be a game changers' syria ultimately got their hands on them? >> it would certainly be in game changer, number one, because of the range and, number two, because of the united states and nato countermeasures that would have to be deployed. that would mean there have to use turkey, jordan, the presence of the sixth fleet in the mediterranean. all of this will be triggered by the fact that the assad regime will have these advanced weapons. as the ambassador said, i heard and read the speech in arabic. he did not say that he received a nymph. he was very vague. he said that these contracts are being implemented. the more important point here is that assad now accounts and the fact that the russians will be

providing an umbrella, meaning his area within syria will be provided with an anti-aircraft system, radar system, and the most concerning situation would be as was the case before, the russians will see in the teens of advisers to man the weapons. lori: but why would russia want to get involved in this way? does not threaten its already tenuous relationship with us, the u.s.? >> they have a lot of problems. communicating concerns. they don't to see a post assad regime that would be islamist and in alliance with those were fighting them in the chechnya area and pakistan. number two, they have basis. number three, they are the allies of the iranians. for all these reasons, they're not going to let go of assad that easily unless they're is a real deal, and that means sharing power between the opposition and assad. that is not what they would accept. that is not even what assadd3 would accept. lori: this is just a huge

necessary. going on for two years already and it really boils down to this vicious dictator who is murdering his own people for years at this point. we saw john mccain there in his surprise visit this weekend. what is the best course of action? >> i think the most important and for the u.s. perspective is making sure that serious chemical weapons don't get outside the country and fall into the hands of terrorists, it is very hard to see what the concrete u.s. interest that would justify more involvement in the internal struggle really is. there is nothing good you can say about that assad regime, and there is less and less good you can say about the opposition. this is much more than as syrian civil war. this is a struggle between the iranian and the arab states in the persian gulf. and i think the most likely outcome with russia all and in

support of assad, the fight will continue for some time. lori: do we have to be concerned abbut is real? had uc israel fearing terrell of this with syria? >> very worried that assad is bad enough on the border, but the regime of terrorists or a state that's completely false apart is any better. the focus remains on the principle, the existential threat that they face which is an iranian nuclear power. lori: given your expertise, i'm curious what you think the u.s. role should be in syria and what you think of the president's visit over the weekend and how you think the president has handled the situation. >> the short story is thamissedn missed the boat in 2011. we were deployed.3 we had the back of syria completely under control, jordan in the south, turkey in the north, the mediterranean. we wasted 2011 not doing much.

2012 without elections, and now we are in the middle of 2013. the difference is that the iranians, 38, are in communication with syria. as allegis said it is fighting inside syria. so the mission is much more difficult. what we need to do is to identify this syrian opposition, the secular elements and not be shy about it. when he met with some of the leaders, some of them were actually officers. we heard about the presence of others, so that is very telling as to how difficult it is to make a distinction between the military, the ngo, the liberals, and the islamist and moslem brotherhood. lori: complicated. but thank you. ambassador and dr. walid phares. >> thank you. >> thank you. lori: up next, attorney general eric holder media invite decline by the majority of the industry. the "a-team" tells us if this is the end of the line for the country's scandal steeped top

cop. next. ♪ ♪

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♪ lori: well, a new study found nonpartisan congressional budget office showing tax breaks will keep $12 trillion out of uncle sam's pockets over the next decade. democrats are seizing on the finding that 17 percent of that 12 trillion will benefit the richest 1 percent of households. republicans are saying this study confirms the need to reform our tax code. by the way, the biggest tax break is the nearly $250 billion that the federal government forfeits by not taxing employer sponsored health plans. joining me now, the "lou dobbs tonight" "a-team." gentlemen, welcome to all of you. i know you are not to talk about the ag in this whole dustup now was trying to make amends with

the media by holding an off-the-record meeting and have the immediate invited saying no thanks. it's off the record. >> my sympathies are with the guys who are not going to this meeting. it seems to me that when a source acid journalists for confidentiality is not something that the source imposes. it is an agreement that they reached. journalists take the confidential sources very seriously. if i give you confidentiality it means, in theory, that i am willing to go to jail if i am called to testify and give up you as a source. lori: journalists expect that from the ag. >> the question is, why should holder expected froo journalists? at think it shows enormous heads but after what he's done to our fox colleague and to the associated press to demand that journalists extend that sort of trust to him. it is really quite appalling. lori: you agree?

>> entirely. journalists have a job to do. when we tried to interfere with their philip -- ability to do their job, which is what he did. therefore he has some said ted have a meeting. lori: you don't agree with this guy? >> i think that is an absolute nonsense. journalists have every right to gripe. whether you're a democrat or republican, we have a responsibility to perfective to protect democracy. >> the guy from the dnc got it predicted wrong. if that journalists agreed to go off the record and there have no right to gripe. it would be bound by the confidentiality. lori: that is a good way to put it. >> are you kidding? everyone would be wired up like a christmas tree. you think eric holder will be wired? de of thing that journalists would? by the way,,attorney journals are alwaas the body dies for the president, always the human palos, robert kennedy, nixon, a

holder. eric holder needs to go. he needs to be sacked. he needs to be forced out now. lori: let's leave it there. we will come back with more of the "a-team" in a few minutes. stay with us. ♪ the boys used double miles from their cital one venture card to fly home for the big family reunion. you must be garth's father? hello. mher. mother! traveling is easy with the venture card because you can fly airline anytime. two words. double miles! this guy can act. wanna play dodge rock? oh, you guys! and with double miles you can actuay use, you never miss the fu beard gwi conte and go! ♪ win! what's in your waet? vo: ta friend under water is ent something completely different. i t a turtle friend today ,

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♪ lori: back with the "a-team," and getting a lot of buzz today. is this understanding that the acting, former acting commissioner of the irs visited the white house 150 times in the only reason he could remember why was for the easter egg roll. >> it was a faberge egg roll. it's all of the money. he'll probably take the fifth

black mop -- mobsters choking on their lobsters. taking the fifth amendment. take the fifth if you're guilty. lori: on paid leave, i.e. vacation. at the white house some many times and we know for sure there were conservative groups targeting tea party groups in ohio. why not just open up the coffers and let it all hang out? >> let me make one point about the fifth amendment. the supreme court held that a government employe you cannot be held for asserting his fifth amendment privilege and a legislative hearing. lori: but in the hearing -- >> well, yes, but it is too complicated to get into here. the bigger point of the irs is if the white house is involved with this, if the white house was directing this systematic persecution of its political enemies -- lori: huckabee think it was a defeat is there some many times? >> let me just finish. and i agree with you that is

suggested, then we have a corrupt administration. it is like watergate, a cancer on the presidency which could be cured by the president resigning are being impeached. if the irs did this on its own without direction from the white house then we have a much more serious problem. then we have a cancer on the federal government itself, on the administrative, the most fearsome institution of federal power aligning itself on its own with the party in power in what might have been an attempt to -teal the election. it might have been a successful attempt. lori: people were intimated before the scandal broke. how do you reform it? >> how the reform it? and not in the reform business. lori: to you agree with the magnitude of the scandal? we are not giving it the coverage it is due. >> what has been revealed so far is a great blotch on democracy. whether you're republican or democrat, you have to stop, take a breath and say, this is not what government should be doing to anyone regardless of their political beliefs. the attempt to make sure the

political beliefs are not permissible by punishing people and threatening them is an absolute outrage. lori: you have a compelling story about your own experience. we have about 30 seconds. would you share it. >> my daughter called me and said i am seeing a hezbollah flag in front of us. what do you think? do the best you can. come and save. lori: best terror. one more comment on a serious situation. >> let them both kill each other. it's none of our business. bring our boys and girls on and let's keep in right here. lori: thank you so much. thanks again. that's just about does it for us here on "lou dobbs tonight." i'm lori rothman sitting in tonight. it is back tomorrow with former obama's ss department attorney christian adams. bless you can see me right alongside my partner in crime, i like to call her, melissa frances each and every day right here onnthat fox business network on markets now at

1:00 p.m. eastern. i sure hope you will soon end. of course, thank you for joining us. lou, once again, is back tomorrow night. very good night, everybody, from new york. ♪ at od, whatever business u're in, that's the business we're in. with premium service like one of e best on-time delivery records and a low claims ratio,

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