we will see you tomorrow. good night from new york. neil: goldilocks. one out of 75,000 more last month good enough to show growths and wonder today in the stock buying bingeothing but this.

they have been focusingon something annoying and meddlesome. the latest news today reports the obama administration is indeed allowing the government to mind nine american tech giants likgoogle and facebk that ve more us data. only a dayfter we discovered discovered that millions of phone records from horizon it was appalling, but it did not put so much of a dent in august. but romney knowswhy. first, in n this friday exclusie with fox, a former republican presidential candidate with the likes of chris christie. >> it reads like the ballroom scene at star wars. how did you get them all at one pace and templates at one time.

>> i wanted to bring together people from both sides of the aisle. so we can her from them and as a group we can listen to them and say wh are the highest prioritiesnd ask ourselv, are we actully addressing the highest priorities or not. the answer turned out to be not a surprise. thepriorities are republicans are concerneabout, the democrats, they're not being addressed. instead, washington is being pulled in a lot of different directions and not doing what has to be donesoon ow did you get david axelrod to appar? >> t mayor of los angeles, the democrat asked them to come. they were gracus and willing to come.

they were warmly received even though we disagreed th seemingly on policy. the funny thing isat we are all americans. we don't care about the country. we get along o a psonal basis. we are looking for common ground and common visn for the future. >> debate ov. neil: to david axelrod mentions percolating scandals? it appears out ofcontrol. >> there are some that are disconcertg. the irs and was certainly one of -hose. there other ises are other issues that have en brought to the force of the nsa monitoring. the vaous dataexchanging exchange. being also raise questions and e not necessarily wrongdoing. we have to separate those and look into them. clearly the predent's abity to manage the government of the

united states and the trust that americans have for the government has been averted by the kinds of revelations that have come forward about the irs. >> these privacy trade-offs are relatively modest were his words. this is not big brother. what you think of tha? >> wl, congress will take a look. the president sayinthat no one is reading e-mails or listening in on phone calls. if that is the case, then it will pretty mu be attacked. ople will say, that is a violation of principles and we dot know exactly where that is. everything that is going on in washington, he has a responsibility to care for the safety and security of this country anour people.

the practice of gathering information, looking for trends, finding thingshat might suggest someone is going to attack this country is an important part of his presidential role. at the same time, he has the responsibility to abide by the nstitutton. and i hope he has been doing that. this is an area hat will be oked into like many others. areas that we do know that there haveeen major problems and bad decisions beg made. of course to ben bradlee, and i think frankly that subpoena of reporter records and phone calls is deserving of real concern. >> a lot of these are having data from a lot of internet coopanies like google and facebook and appl asking horizon to hand over the phone records. it actually came after april 16. at was soon after the boston terr attacks.

would you have advocated trying to get your hands on this type of information? >> well, i really can't respond to that. not without having all the information about what precisely and how it could be used. also with the constitutional requirements. but in a modern age where e peoe are planning attacks, using the communications vehicles that we have, includi the internet. to look for communication that suggests attacks or taking cred for things that happened in the past. that certainly is a reonsibility which the president and the government has to assume. you know, iam not going to just attack the president on this. and a lot of pple are going to be unhappy that i'm not willing attack him onhis. but i'm going to say for the safety of this country, it comes

first. the constitution has to be followed. i don't know that it was ot followed in this case. before i did into the power of this, i want to learnmore about how it was done and how it was used. >> dianne festein ys it doesn't really bother her one bit. harry reid centcom down when the media was jumping about whetr this was overreached. do you think that their response is justified that wasn't a big deal >> well, i tink personal communications are being watchcd by government ands concerning. particularly when they come on@ the heels of the revelations of the irs. some of the private information that is used for pitical purposes. there is a loss of trust in our government. there has been a breach of si have a right to be very concerned. i don't think you can dismiss

this. at the same time, you don't claim that there has been a breach of principles untilyou see what has been done. that is something that investigation will occur. if you will, l's not forget the prosecution ahead of t facts. let's get to the facts and see if there has been some kind of inappropriate thering of information. >> i mentioned harry reid. at a time when he stepped on the floor ofthe senate to say that he was very well aware it did raise thepossibility tat your tax return information or a part of it was leaked to him. what you think aout >> well, he obiously got this return and he actually laid out also what i paid in taxes over a

decade. i'd have paid millions and millions of dollars in taxes. there was never a year where i didn't pay a lot of money in taxes. i don't know wherehe source of data wise. neil: we talked about this, a major donor to your campaign. no fewer than three fewer audi. he lives on each and he had to pay $85,000. >> the idea of an agency that has ou most personal information they hve used that information to pursue a political agenda. that should be a very frightening thing to people on

both sides of the aisle. i know that it is. it is a negligent management that has allowed that to occur and it may be worse than negligence. we do not know who know knew about it and who directed it. but it is a violation of the american people will not soon forget. it has to end. in my view we have to put into place a special prosecutor to understand who knew what and ho that infmation was sed. we also need to put in place a structure which says that in the future, thee audits an these inquiries byhe irs and oter agencies carry out various kindd ofof aits. thesthings have to be viewed as a nonpartisan and nonpolitical basis and eure that these institution are n pursuing personal agen of one kind or another. neil: using this goes beyond? they were involved in targeting these conservative groups and

individuals. you think it is bigger than that? >> wel if you don't have any process in pla thatis overseeing what agents are doing, you are opening the door for people to misuse data for their own personal and poitical vendettas or for other vendettas. this is what people across ts country are afid of. big government becoming so large and so intrusive that no one could stop it from interfering in o lives andpunishing people thout being required to go into the public and emand that informaon on a legal basi how many people knew about thi and how fr up the ladder goes? we don't know. that is why we have to have a special prosecutor apnted to look at is to find out just who knew. we do know nowhat it was consvative efforts and those

groups that were arguing on your behalf. >> is infuriating. i have to tell you that it is not. >> i don't think there is evidence of enough wrongdoing of this stage. >> was he so preoccupied with

the conseatives are defending themselves and getting this irs off their backs? had a chilling effect to turn out voters were pursue this if the governmentis not trampling on o rights as citizens of this ountry.

>> many. >> but after hurricane sandy. i know that that is your view. >> i can't speak for the embers of my family. i have 21 grand kids. neil: the one i was talking about maybe your wife. well, i take responsibility for myself. i know what apns when there has been a natural disaster. you look for help from the federal government. you want other agencies to step in and provide help and ggvernor chriie did what he thought was best for the people of this state. i dot blame them for that at all. was helpful to me in my campaign every way possible. i consid him a good friend.

he has a great future. he has been a triptych governor. he's doing a great job in new jersey. neil: so you don't agree that he got a little bit too chummy with barack obama. >> well, i can tell you that the hurricane didn't come n the right time. that is not because of chris christie. that is because one of the advantages of incumbency is because when there is an event like that, you get to see the president in a fathey role in showing his sympathy for people who re harmed to have been victims of a storm and obviously, it gives a lite boost to the president effort and that includes how the system works in the nature of politics. i am not going to go back and try to revisit battered by the right thing for me to do is to lo forwardnd say how canhe things i carabt which helps put people back to work, getting america on track.

improving our health care system and gettg the cost down. how can i do those tngs from where i sit toda. neil: do you think that hurricane sandy, ford whatever severity -- included the presidents slide in the polls. looking at your first ost deba performance, they felt that your campaign sort of sat onthat. what do you think? >> well, we went after that first debate as hot and heavy as weould and kept pomoting that as well as we thought we could. i'm sure people come up with ideas things we might have done differently and that is

always the nature of monday morning quarterbacking. when you were in the middle of the game fighting hard yard by yard, yoare doing ur very best. i believe th my team was a supe team. i spoke th a leading demrat. i won't mention his name. this was a close race. the unemployment re dropped below 8% for the first time. just weeks before the election. the media celebrated tat. that made a difference. you are not going to spend your@ time saying what kinds of ents could haae happened differently. thepresident made mistakes in his campaign. no one runs a perfect campaign. the net result is that he won, i lost. you get over that, you learn from the experience. you move on.

neil: neverthels, with all of thescandals between bengzi and the justice department and the irs and the large number of groups in all ofthis occurring as the health services department heads up and ushes for health care, if this would've come up last fall, different result? >> you know, there is no way that i can make that calculation. but i can tell you what made a difference. and that is, again, one of the advantages of the incumbents. but for me, a lo of people are really focused on these scandals, and they are. is irs thing is troubling. the big issue on benghazi is why was there not a rescue mission. and you might say that we have succeeded. these are real ssues and not

the same time, one of my biggest concerns is what is the president's ageda area. neil: mitt romney has some ver serious concerns about what is going on with china. why he says we need to stop letting china were all over it before it is too late. >> this is the time for real backbone on the part of our nation to come up against china and say that you have to play by the rules. and vo: traveling you definitely end up meeting a lot more people but a friend under water is something completely different i met a turtle friend today. avo: whatever you're looking fo expedia s more ways to help you find yours.

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neil: the dow jones industrial today. the federal reserve encouraged to keep doing its thing, which is why mitt romney said that he is not too impressed with this whole rally. governor, wha do you think of the market's reaction and ben bernanke providing all of the fuel for this. what you think? >> wel there is no question. one of the reasons that people are putting money into the stock market as they see that the federal reserve continues to have a monetary policy. money printing. quantitative easing. money is pouring into the stock market. this will not end well.

you cannot keep on, if you will, pouring more and more money as a tion and not having to payhe piper at some point. bonds are going to continue to be key. prices will up. you kno it's kind of disconcerting when you see the people who have stopped making a lot of money, even though you have lots of people, 7.5% of people that are unemploy when you consider the other people who have dropped out of the work fore. the stimulus and the moetary policy these are tough times. neil: so when you say that this

wi not end well. what do you mean? >> well, you cannot keep on borrowing more than you taken forever. you cannot keep on printing money and keeping interest rates near zerr ever. at some point that has to reverse. the people tat were loaning us the money say that am a little concerned about the risk and they want higher interest rates. as they start oing up will mean that they will see a lot of money going to p people around the world. right now we have spent about $250 billion a year o interest. as iterest rates return to a normal level, that number will go to $750 billi a year. that is more than we have spent on deense. a t of that will be going to places like china. we will be paying for their schools and research. they will be investing in their fure as we are paying off the sins of the past. this is not the management than anyone n their home would pursue.

instea you try to live within your means and invest in the future but you do not file and t money. neil: you mentioned the chinese were they recklessly and repeatedly withoutbandon have included everything to defense contractors. how would you and how do you think that this president should respond to . >> you know, i think that we have a indset the very poor countries try to get on its feet. but e reality is there has to

be conquences. neil: with theidea, what you think of that? >> the has to be consequence. clearly trade is one of the places where you have consequence. you cannot allow people to continue to abuse yourself without following international norms and lot without there being consequence. >> donald trump said and pardon my french, governor, scew them if they are going to, you know, treat us like this.

but in a decade or two, will so the only time we have for leverage to make sure that the practices that it exists between two nations that have interest, we want to s free tre and the rule of law. we have a lot in common in terms of interest and they are taking advantage of us right now. if we do not set those rules and make sure we are abiding by them, we are never goin to do it a decador so om now when they don't need us like they did today. this is the backbone and a part of our nation to come up against china if they didn't have to play by the rles. you cannot hack into our computers or there will be consequence. the kinds of trade relations and other relations that you have.

neil: would you ever run for president again? >> now. i took my chance. i ok my message to the american people and i was not successful. it is time for someone else to takeheir message to the people. >> well, i think what hh was sang is -- and i have said that all this all along, i didn't want to becomeresident for all of the benefits the office and the thrills of being president. i looked at it as an opportunity to serve.

i wanted the job because i wanted to help the people of america make sure that they and the next generations live in a country thats free and prosperous. neil: would ou ever want to be a treasury secretary in a future republican administration? >> i'm going back to the same int. i think that people who want a job wit governmt get their priorities wro. i don't think that the people -- if they feel at they can make a cntribion, they sometimes have to say yes to something that they want to do is. neil: your son isn't ruling out a political futu for himself.

>> i have terrific sons a daughters inlaw. the politics in the future. it is a ough road. we are going to have a tough ad with the media. if you're not willing to deal with that, don't get into the race. you know that, i understood it, i don't have harfeelings. i think it is harder on my sons and dauger in law and my wife to watch their dad than it is for me i wat my dad and, you know, it was harder on me than it was on him when i tched him in his campaign.

that is dissuades going to be. neil: governor, it is a pleasure. thank you ve much, sir. >> thank you, it is good to be with you today. neil: all right, would have, should have, coud have. with all of these scandals, nothing is getting done. and that will be harmful for this country whether republican or democrat with my friends, we'll almost anything. out for drinks, eats. i have very well fitting dentures. i like to eat a lot of fruits. love them all. the seal i get with the super poligrip free keeps the seeds from getting up underneath. even well-fitting dentures let in food particles. super poligrip is zinc free. with just a few dabs, it's clinically proven to seal out more food particles so you're more comfortable d confident while you eat. a lot of things going on in my life and the last thing i want tbe thinking out is my dentures. [ charlie ] try zinc free super poligrip. (announcer) at scottrade, our clto make their money do more.re

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neil: mitt romney to me that the president promised that unemployment will go down. it is ot going down. we have a former united states senator joining us now. andy, you were with the he had an eclectic ida. did they come to this conclusion that this was distracting?

>> it was really more about policy and politics. >> what happened? >> i got up on the stage and interviewed at john hickenlooper who is the governor of colorad and e two of us got along great. they talked about accountability, merit pay, tenure. things that you would not have thought about a republican speaking. we d address issues. but i think we have made some progress. neil: you and i have chatted about this before. one of the things i always

admired about your career is how you d try to find a middle ground. we have always aid that one de can't getall he or she wants. but that is the mood right now. senator wh these scanls developing, the enormous distractions, it is not asif washington can go ahead and multitas here. all scandal, all problems, nothing is going to get done >> it does wry me. we have a system that is dysfunctional with very little ggtting done. there's only so much attention to go around. they run the risk of sucking all the oxygen out of the ro and further our chance to address the things that mitt romney talked aboutnd that is how do we create this.

>> it does concern me thatthis would distract further from focusing on thbusiness at hand neil: arry reid said that we are making a big deal out of nothing. >> okay, witho one is reading your e-mails, no one is listening to your phone calls unless they get a judicial order a sometime. what they are dog is kping a record of all of that. so let's se say tha clark also someone and we are able to follow follow-up to try to identify the entire network.

so then we have to have that data so we can follow-up with them. but no one is listening in or following the e-mail of the ordinary americans. >> why did you have so many phone calls to dunkin' donuts, but that was another thing. asng you something that the governor talked about. without getting into who is to blame for this various scandal and invasions. i am paraphrasing here. it gets so big that this kind of stuff again, i am simplifying here, it iinevitable. you agree that? >> i aee that 100%. like when you run a coompany. core beliefs as the ceo trickle-down through the system. we have a government that is so big at you cannot run it directly.

the government should be good. president obamgave a speech at ohio state and penn state. right before all these scandals. it is that idea that government is good and big and big government is good in a kind of trickles down and eowers people in the bureaucracy to do things they ally shouldn't be dog. i think theirs scandal, in my opinion, is the worst of all of them and that really epitomizes what happenshen the government is out of control. >> i wonder whether that will be the scandal with e issue that resonates. so many people seehis thing growing as an inrusion and coming to light almost every other day. what do you think? >> i think it is the biggest issue. mitt romney was right to identify this as well. because everyone has to deal with the irs. they are gtting ut of the way in doing things they shouldn't be doing, what else are they

doing? the role that they will be playing in th health care law, that has to be coceing. so this is the biggest of all of the different scandals. one other thing, if the mitt romney who appeared on your stion had been the mitt romney running for president, i thought he was incredibly gracious and he was very good. i thought he did really well. >> you gave him every chance he one you know, igave him every opportunity to give him the petty small person that i i am, and he didn't take the bait. you gentlemen, you are an example of this environment which means you will never have a futuren washngton. [applause] the magdalen, thank you very much. >> thank you, neil. it is good to see you, senator. >> so how is it possible that

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neil: apparently even pottery company said that they really didn't know that they were getting spied on. the national security county officials under clinton and george w. bbush. lee is 20 now. what worries me e most. if mark zuckerberg is posting that h was unaware of thisand it was happening, then shouldn't that be concerning? >> it is complex in. i have no problem with the u.s. government analyzing e-mails and protocol, telephone calls between people in yemen and afghanistan. i'm actually supportive of that. what is a bit unusual is the extent to which the tech companies in the united states ew about this government activity. neil: if they didn't know that, if they are clueess, the

government seems to have gotten far more than these gu were aware of. >> there is an issue with. >> in other words there is technical information about how they colllected this. >> internet is like a highway system and there is a possibility that the government was watching what was happening on the highway. if the government was watching what was happening, that possibly there was a tech company that would not have knowabout that. neil: would say ttat ubeknnst to them at some point the government went ahead and got the information they wanted and came back and asked for it. if that were the case. >> is happening outside the united states and directing citizens, i don't think that any non-us nationals have any expectations. >> these are the vehicles in the

united states for which it was done. >> we don't know enough to s that. >> but if it were? >> there is an issue about the government accessing the property and the servers of u.s. technology companies in the united states. i personally like tonow more about that. but this is a perfect understanding. >> that is going on abroad and the government is doing that but they are still doing it in this way and the entities don't know anythingabout it, they have gonene ahead and just raided the house. it depends on how this is being done.

>> i'm happy they are helping out. >> when they are happy abo it, ey take an inch in the mile at the same time. >> you know, we all have to be talkingabout privacy and protectingur national security. >> that is the intention of these -secity. >> that is the inttion f these programs are it that is true. when we come back, is part of it is just a response to the government. we went out and asked people a simple question: how old is the oldest person you've known? we gave people a sticker and had them show us. we learned a lot of us have known someone ho's lived well into their 90s. and that's great thing. but even though we're living longer, one thing that hasn't changed much is the official retirement age. ♪ the question how dyou make sure you have the money you need to enjoyll of these years. ♪

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neil: this may be nothing more than the government getting out of control and a few bad eggs would he think of that, let's? >> she touched on the entral sphere. the irs people who worked under reagan. many will say thaa this isn't a problem. watch out what they are doing it to you. because that is so with easy we are in a whole new world and that is what i think struck a

chor. neil: in case of this, you are a well-known and respte lberal >> maybe there is something to it. it is too big for even you. >> no doubt we would have had we have those results with president obama. >> aren't you going to want to do this as well to track this down? >> absolutely he would. >> i jt find it jane marks -- and i do think liberalsere

complaining today about repuicans going overreach. >> obviously this is something thataseen there. the irs has a hundred thousand employees. there are a lot of good employees. >> it is the quality of the town and people managing this.

here it is, mr. axelrod. obama said the same thing. the government is too big. that is the same complaints that the tea party has been making. >> when i see the dismissal of this, i have to say wait a second, when you talk to people who ran the irs and they say watch ou you a not on the same team, they have seen it happen, it is so still busy to rua big government and feel powerful at that. i was just going to say te people running the irs, per se. it is quality people. government is going to continue to grow. the economy grows, the population grows.

>> and isne of the things that i have. if we know pt of this growing problem is the birt then wouldn't you think twi about signing this to the irs when i mes to health care? >> potential. >> you know, i think that people are bleeding their fear into their fearf government spying from the corporate spying. >> exactly. for me personally, i am more concerned withonsumer privacy with th iris. >> google, gmail, you do a search on any medical disease. when you apply for health

insurance than they assume that you have this with a prr-existing condition. >> theompany can't find you for this. they can't basicay, you know, some people after you o are giving you a hard time. i hear what you are saying. neil: should the government be worried about liz macdonald? 's. [laughter] we have already seen cases where the irs takes over health care. >> i am not afraid. i wanttyou to know that i do ink that therere quality people.

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>>. >> tom: we have a lot to cover on this show. obamacare is going to cost a lot more than thought but i want to start with the economy. are cities and counties recovering financially are the promises they made going to raise your taxes? i'm going to ask a woman that called the wall street meltdown meredith whitney right here and right now. >> tom: thanks for joining us. here at the top of the stack. in october of 2007 meredith whitney was if the tiors point out the big banks were in trouble. she was right.