neil: forget where is waldo, where is ed? he is still a fugitive on the run, the view from a former fugitive who no longer circumstance john mack ave is -- mcavy is here. >> i am neil cavuto. i don't know if snowden plans to make youtube videos, if he does my next guest could give him a few tip, john mac john mcafee kw to make an impression. not bad for a guy who has been out of mcafee, and out of the loop. that was before murder in

belize, mcafee said authorities there were trying to pin on him. and a daring escape from that country that might make vladimir putin proud, because putin is doing his best to keep snowden from getting back to the u.s., and mcafee did all he could to get back to the u.s., from fleeing guatemalla. and throughout mcafee has insisted he is no murderer, where snowden insists he is no spy. that is where it ends. >> my name is john mcafee, i am the founder of the mcafee

an virus company, although i have had nothing to to with this company for 15 years, i still have volumes of mail asking how do i uninstill this software, i have no idea. i know what to do, believe me -- i've got the solution right he here. neil: top that snowden. the read on a man on the run from a man who stopped running but has not stopped talking about a company he founded that has all but turned on him, and a corrupt government he says has done going they could to try to destroy him, we have heard about

what john mcafee did from them, now we hear from john mcafee says he did. happy to you have. >> happy to be here. neil: video first, abou what mao you that. >> the press pinned a number of labels on me, they seemed to be sticking, why not lampoon them myself. >> was were the labels? >> well, a lot of things, number one, i surrounded myself with guns, surrounded myself with women. i was paranoid. i -- that paranoid rant that you took 3 or 4 seconds on. that i did bath salt, on the desk i had two boxes labeled with bath salts and snorts them with my full fairs toward the end, i enjoy making fun of myself as much as anything. neil: all right but you are not just anybody, before we get to

stuff happened in last year, let's talk about what you built, what you starred mcafee, antivirus power house, something you founded and created, now you put out a video, that inntructs people how to remove the program from computers, why did you do that? >> okay, one of the things that became apparent during the news blitz in december, january, and february, was that all internet stories that had comments allowed over half of them said things like, i wish they would hang this man for making such terrible sort o software, but ie not had anything to do with company for 15 year or qualtie of the software, i thought okay, let me tell you, i had nothing to do with it if you don't like it, here is how you uninstall it. neil: do you not like mcafee software today? >> i do not use any antivirus

sort of wear, neither mcafee or norton or anyone, i practice safe computing. neil: the company has gone a long way from the days you founded it. >> it did. i had the company, i owned 87% of the world market for antivirus sort of wear, everyone loved it it has changed. >> okay. in our heyday. the talk is you were worth north of $100 million maybe $200 million, was that true? what are you worth now? >> well, first of all, what are you worth now, sir? >> i think 28.48 that is about right. >> i think i am about the same. neil: really, so you, you -- lost a lot. >> no, i am not saying i lost it, i have not, i am saying it is my business, and not that question is rude, i would not call you rude, sir, but i tend not on afternoon ser -- answer those questions.

neil: that is fair, i guess i ask at risk of sounding rude, a lot of people, a lot of people called you tony stark character, the ironman character on which that ewell b!elaborate downey bs titan, playboy if you will, is that true? >> they called my that. they have called me the tony stark of the cyber world. whether it is true or not, i am just who i am. i live my life. i say what i want to say. to what i want to do. neil: so, when it comes to money issue, at the risk of pushing this too extremes, tony stark loses a fortune, getting it back, presumably the talk is you lost a fortune, got a lot back, coming your way back down with a book, movies, that -- could be features you, making you the subject, that seems look a guy

very much back in the game? >> i don't think that i ever really left the game, my game has changed. it no secret as a very young man, i was making money from selling drugs in mexico, thank god i am not doing that any more. i made a fortune lost a fortune more times than i can count, money is easy to make, sir, simplistthing in the world to make, keeping the money is always the problem. neil: very well put, keeping it is a problem. let's twitch to ed snowden if you don't mind, i want to talk about him. there is a lot of talk whether he is a hack or a hero, what do you think? >> depends on which perspective you want to look at mr. snowden, from my perspective, i think he revealed something we all knew. we're being spied on by our government, duh, who does not know that? simply that mr. snowed know says

that put a quantitative value it and given the means, some of the means of how the spying takes place, to that extent he is a hero in telling us we already knew, making us face the fact, u.s. government does not consider him a hero, vladimir putin, chinese government, i think they both consider him heroes. neil: he started the intent of getting this information with booz allen. and then selling it. yyu too worked at booza allen what do you make of it. >> i worked at booz allen from 1980 to 1982. i do not work for them to be a spy, they are a software management firm, the job is cushy and they pay you well. they are one of top 3 consulting

firms. so, itf the government wants high quality tech talent they go to one of those firms. great job, and i don't know whether snowden started at booz allen with intent of spying or not, i have no information on, that but that is a great company, and flew that relationship -- through that relationship he was able to get access to information that most of us cannot get access to. neil: he said that was his goal, his wordss to your point, what he did it good but intentions are to be decided ? >> any disclosure of any information is good. why should we be kept in the dark on anything, good lord we're all adults, i want to know what is happening in my world, otherwise i am in the dark, and bumping into things so are you and we all, to that's correct

tent, let's find out what the world is all about, what is our government doing? down you want to know, people? i do. so to that, i back him. i also back his balls, if i can say that on fox. fox. please. >> i am behind his courage, he as the courage to actually do something knowing its risks now on the run. having been on the run many times in my life, the first many times when i was in mex mix, mexico, and last in belize, i know how difficult and frightening that can be, the man is half mm age, if he were hire here, i think d give him good advice. neil: what would you tell him? >> stay in hong kong. bakalies, you can disappear in the back allies of hodge continental, chinese government has no interest in tracking him down, neither will they

cooperate with american agency. neil: you don't think that chinese would have interest in a lot of stuff he knows. >> they would, but, you know unlike the russians, i don't think that chinese would be very hank on him, maybe -- harsh on him, maybe they would detain him for a while, chinese is -- what is the word? they make good hosts, okay. and if you are a guest in their country, you can live fairly well. and i am not dissing america, and not trying to get the man illegal advice, i am saying that had it been me, i would have stays in hong kong. neil: now, before we go to break, one thing that come up with him, john is, that if he were a genuine whistle-blower, it was a move to not be a whistlwhistle-blower and do goot get out of the country do bad, there is a procedure for going to our higher ups or inspector

general, he immediately went to hong kong that means to some people who don't like him very much, he is a spy, and had spy intents, what do you say? >> well, you know, having dealt with differents, i think all governments are the same, they do not have much of a heart, sir. human beings have hearts, you can talk to a human, say, here is the situation i'm in what would you do, they would say, hey, i would run. you know, i am not in his shoes, sir, i can't justify or cast aspersions on his decisions, i know from my experience what bell izian government would want me to do is my death, i chose to go underground. neil::all right, if you can stick around, we'll get into, that about what did happen in bellize, and what led to like a james bond-like saga on his part to get out of bellize, after this.

neil: all right the saga that drew international attention, john mcafee. caught up in what belize government said was a murder, in which he was not necessarily a

suspect but he was clearly being fingered, a neighbor of john's whoever found dead. they say to this day, you were not the murderer but they sure made it look that way. >> the -- government at no point, charged me with murder. they questioned all of my neighbors, they wanted to question me. i had a running battle with the government since the day they stormed my property 6 months earlier with 42 armed soldiers, shot my dog, handcuffed my, kept me in the sun for 14 hours, and released me with no charges. neil: why did they do that at the time. this is before the murder. but why? >> well, i made a mistake of moving to a district in belize, the poorest. average salary is 5 or 6 dollars a day. i was -- his conspicuous wealth,

brand-new automobiles, large houses, a lot of money. neil: there are a lot of american expatriates with similar wealth? >> but they lived in san pedro, i was only one living in the jungles, i was approached by a local politician, suggestions if i donate $2 millioo i would get all kinds of benefits from government like land, and tax benefits, i had no businesses, i did not need land, i said no. a week later, my property was forstormed and that happened, a week after, they came back said have you reconsidered, i said no, i called u.s. press, and british press, i told my story that began a running war with the belizean government that ended with the date ofny my neighbor, they can hold you for

questioning for up to 60 days without charges, if they are not satisfied they can renew that for another 60 days and go on forever, i had no intention. neil: you knew this 52-year-old expatriate? they are saying there was a pattern of illega ill will betwu 2? >> i had spoken less than 50 words to that man in 5 years i lived there all of my neighbors were upset about by dogs, i had 11 dogs they all barked, i was upset with my dog. neil: who poisoned them. >> i have no idea, i thought the government did. they shot one of them before my eyes at the river, not to belittle the date of my

neighbor, it is a tragedy, but people are killed in belize all of the time, it is the murder capital of the world, look it up. neil: you were never accused of this, to this day they never accused you, a describe you as a person of interest. >> i am a person of interest. neil: you got out because why? >> well, after 6 1/2 months of fighting government, and constant harassment. weekly, i realized, i cannot live here any more, if they collect me for questioning, i will never get out of prison. so i refused to be collected. i went under groipd, an ground,e disguises, and lived in swamps, and travelled through belize for a month and a half until i made it to guatemala. neil: what kind of disguises did you use? >> i think my favorite is where i enhanced wrinkles on my face with eye liner.

i dye my hair -- i used corn son ostarch in my hair and beard, i carried a cane, and walked with a shuffle, it is easy to disguise yourself, if you distract attention from you, the way you walk, the things you carry, the way you stand. i had to eat, i had to buy food. get things, i had to go out in public, yet in a month and a half i was not one time detected. neil: you are such a recognizeable phase. you know, but here you are back in u.s. >> yes. neil: you left back to that darn money thing of mine, you left a lot of money on the table, and a lot of assets in belize, what do you do now in u.s.? >> i am working on a documentary feature ledge, film, a biography that is written by john yune who

is in prison, and has been in prison for 19 years, the george yun that the movie blow is based on, and working on a comic novel, i am keeping busy. neil: i read a lot of stuff you write, and e-mails that you pass along and have written to friends, you are a good writer, it does remind me of why even your critics call you a mad genius. i was glad to hear, last e-mail, jesus appeared on a fresh piece the toast. the verbal description are stan, you go on to mention analogies that are impact full but not really, not saying anything crrzy, it is -- against, it harkens back to, you, you are not a mad man, but i am beginning to think you like to

play a mad man, a brilliant mad man, are you? >> yoke, sir? that is -- joke, sir, that is what it amounts, to i like have fun without laughter, what is the point? really. life is -- >> that is a snide swinger, well, also, said, you know away you go after your critics wiih a humorous barb is a way to sort of disarm them, i am wondering whether that is a deliberate strategy ? >> of course it is. you know, i have critics. rather than get angry at them, let's make fun of them, let's make fun of them indirectly by making fun of me. the question is why nnt. what else am i to do? i am a slandered, and there are still news respects that call me the man -- there are still news reports that call me the man who murdered his neighbor, i am not charged with it.

neil: does this not justin fruit just fester you, and infurate you? >> no, absolutely not. neil: you are not vindictive. you don't' revenge on the people that rip you apart, or the company you founded their management dismissing you almost laughing at you. >> that is their problem. not mine, i live my life, i am content with myself, i know who i am, they don't, they have not talked to me in 15 years, what do they know? >> you are not -- you really created that -- a great company, you did and i remember at the time you did it, it was incredible. and it was way ahead of its time, what you were doing to address what you knew was going to be a viewer aus-filled -- virus-filled computer world, now you have these guys who came in after the fact, thinking that you know, they landed on third base, and they hit a triple. you hit the triple. >> i did. that is correct.

and they were riding the name. that does not make me mad, i left the company, and started a new life. you know what happened after that, other than fact that people top hang me because they soberiate me with the software -- they soberiate me wit associt software, if you are angry with someone, you are the sufferer not the person you are angry at unless you reach out and smack them, why should that make me angry. neil: one quick minute more, john mcafee.

neil: all right. back with the man, who was referred to as the charlie sheen of business, i don't know if that is good or bad, john mcafee you heard that analogy.

>> give between between charlie sheen and i can, i really think he is doing drugs. whereas, you know to my knowledge, i am not, i pretend to. neil: but you did once? >> absolutely. could ever carry.e drugs than neil: but not today. >> not today and not for 30-yearers on more, sir. >> really! here we are, here you are back in u.s. and you are back in public eye, you are not avoiding the public eye. you seem to answer a lot of questions, directly, not dancing around them, it begs this age old question, where ision mcafee going, you are in u.s., you got movie thing going to, book thing percolating, you are not shrinking into the woodwork. why not? >> well, you know, no one lets me shrink quietly into the woodwork. i did the video in self-defense,

just because the labels attached to me were growing daily, sir, what i want to do require to retire peacefully like i thought i was doing when i went to belize, i am looking at around now for other placing to retire, i love america it is a grand country, i was raised hire, and iz love the country. neil: what do you think of president obama? >> you know -- well he is a good democrat. i think a relatively honest man, i don't know him personally. >> are you republican, democrat independent? >> what would you think? do you think i'm a democrat with my views on guns, and everything else. neil: i am a republican. -- i am a republican, but the -- i do want to retire, i do 79 to go to a place maybe vis vietnami can quietly slip away to

obscurity. not that i don't like america, i do, but i want to quietly move to a currency side where they are different. -- countryside, things are different, and unique, and i can stay interested, drift off into obscurity. neil: do you think that is what happened to this country, we are slipping a little bit. and maybe this whole snowden thing, that we talk brkd ill talked about, ill straights that best, what shaved td--illustrates, what happened o us. >> we are slipping, sir, the reasons in my mind are way too themerrous tnumerous for one hod take days it is evidence that the chinese technology is

advancing rapidly, we're going to lose, and russia, they are no slouches, and india, software technology, they are recruits indian staff and lets them live in india do their work. we're losing, we're are on a number of fronts, and it hurts me. it saddens me, i wish it were not happening. neil: john mcafee thank you very much. >> yes, sir. neil: john mcafee, he is not the first founder of the company to alienate the very company he founded, doesn't the head of men's warehouse know it or should i say former, when jeniougenerous becomess esen trt is a matter of time before the board says we're over it?

i can talk to someone who knows w i trade. becae i don't trade like everm with scottrade. me. awarded five-stars from smartmoney magazine.

neil: you have seen this crez youtubcrazyyoutube video, now t, do essence tricks like john mcafee, hurt or help a company. >> you know, there are a lot of people who have done this. ittcertainly helped the brand in a sense it gets into into news, it becomes disruptive in a sense, looking at steve jobs, there was a lot of turmoil there. neil: i don't think it was mcafee's intent do you. >> one can argue no, any

executive who disrupts what is normal behalf your, certainly is -- behavior draws attention good or bad. >> dave? >> out of the box thinkers are out of the box players, he reminds me of john mack john mam whole foods, he had an imagine e-mail friend, and called obamacare fascist. neil: who does not. >> overstock.com patrick burns another one away out of the box, if you are an inventive thinker, thinking of something brand-new like mcafee software or whole foods, or over stock, you have to be that person that does not think in the box. and like this guy you cannot be restrained. neil: in corporate world we do

prize independent thinking but we draw the line when it looks like it is getting crazy. >> america has been a country of entrepreneurs and innovation, looking at that level that comes out of united states verse anywhere else in the world, we exceed it by legions. neil: but we put a limit on, if the founder gets too quirky, then upsets once the corporate world is getting too corporatey, he goes? >> you know, we celebrate innovation, and early in these companies we need, that people are crazy, until all of a sudden they become eccentric when they are successful, it depends on how long it goes. companies typically stick with the founder and a lot of times, most founders grow with the company and evolve ask great ceos. but sometimes they can't. neil: the men's warehouse guy, i always hated those commercials.

>> he has a nice voice. >> mcafee mentioned we're as a nation now, becomes a sort of intolerant of eccentricity, people like him, that is to our detriment, he thinks it will lead no our down fall. because of political correctness and all other stuff, we're putting a lid on that eccentricity, and perhaps on innovation. neil: but there are limits. >> if there are, i am out of work. >> watching that interview, he said he will go off to vietnam hopefully to relax and have a nice life. neil: i would pick the poconos myself. >> there you go, but when is he

going to be back, clearly he enjoys some level of spotlight. >> steve, reminder that founders who start something don't like how it evolves, and if they have to leave they don't go happily. >> this case with john mcavy imcafeeis unique. i think we as a country need to figure out a way could continue to have balance we inspire the entrepreneurship, and behavior we require in corporations. >> i understand his depression about the way that america is going, he is right. we do need -- we should celebratitictic sense -- -- >> do you believe the drug thing for 30-years. >> it is tough to see him and think that. neil: you never know. you know the guys, drinking on

the jobs losing their job, now they may be before their time, businesses bringing the bar to their boardroom. who can show them how to build, but not rely on it. who can focus on making your legacyast for nerations to ce? that someone is a morgan stanley financial advisor. and we're ready to work for u. at od, whatever business you're in, that's the business we're in. with premium service like one of the best on-time delivery records and a low clms ratio, we do whatever it takes to make your business our siness.

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neil: talk about a biz blitz that could not be more timely or more apply named, our first blitz getting blitzes, more companies are offering beer for workers, saying it loosens them up and opens them up for working hours, they are happier, my worry, fellow blitzers, is they better not be airline mechanics. >> it really depends on what they do. i support this, as long as it is appropriate, you know, coming from wall street, we are a different culture, not a big deal to have a couple martinis at lunchtime. it is not smart, i would not want my airplane mechanic to do, that but if you are in a business, where you work long hours, and high stress, it is a

good idea at end of the workday to have place to unwind, if your company provides the alcohol, and food, it is fine. >> dave? >> i think it is everything we're talking about today has a interesting dichotomy between control and freedom, the workplace, u the ultimate contrl place, these are creative or knowledge industries, if you are a knowledge worker, you get is more freedom, it is okay to have a by, enjoy yourself with your colleagues. i don't think it as good if you or other end of knowledge curb. it say good time to be alive. neil: i think you are being a prude, i am drunk now. paula deen, might want to drink soar want to drink to celebrate her cookbook sales that are now soaring, true.

dean's cookbook up more than 1300% on amazon, the whole n word controversy of herses notwithstanding, dave? >> well, in a sense, with this freedom verse control thing, if you are in mainstream and you are kind of -- you having to be answerable to everybody, you have to be very careful what you say, you are a creature of mainstream media, you can't say what you want, but in a world that starts in a search box, there is a market for traditional southern values, if you call that, passing no judgment on them, if people can kind paula deen, they can, that market manifests itself. >> well i know she rather you know take back all that happened, and lower the book sales, paula deen has a big battle, back to what we've been talking that die col me, you

know -- dichotomy, frankly, i do not like hypocrisy, that whole thing, paula deen just told the truth, i would rather have someone tell the truth than span someone lie to me, we do not know the context she used it. neil: she has been hung out to dry. and netflix started something, original programming gone beyond pay movie services. dave, starts else discovery ? >> same idea. here is the old fashion thing, was cable company tells what you you can watch, you and only buy things in this big stack, and @%e wonders of internet deliver us freedom of choice. here is the interesting question for mr.00 risk wh hendrix what d discovery. why condition i just buy the programs from the -- can't i just buy the program from

program producers, be careful what you wish for. neil: jarrett? >> yeah to that point, cable providers will become just they control contend, now contend creators, and discovery has their own sea of producers that make great content. but companies like akamai that -- i am sorry that supply bandwidth will win, like the discovery will win. i think this is a smart move for discovery, i think world is going to individualizalla cart s like apple and huel hulu that ie -ay of the world. discovery is on cutting edge. neil: as long as they keep one news channel we should be okay. >> thank you very much. you tax, you pay, you keep taxing, you stop growing issue the 25 we got -- proof, we got

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neil: well we were not imaging it we know it as slow as we thought, government, proving that economy barely growing last quarter at all, 1.8%, tax hikes taking hold, and raising -- rising interest rates all taking a chunk out of consumer spend, joe? woe. are you shocked? >> i think, somewhat predictable, there has been a false sense of okay uphoria. the economy has been subsidized for years now, it is not sustainable, you are now seeing it break down a little bit. neil: the fed threatening to take oxygen away, what do you make of that? >> i think that bernanke did the

right thing, saying it will slowdown, he is being measured relative to the timing if the economy continues the way it is right now, you will have quantitative easing lasting longer than he suggestions but that is better than a shock. neil: you are a long time veteran of the market, do you find it surprising that capitalist bastion from which your dna runs, now hungers for numbers that will not get too strong for fear of cutting those apapron strings? >> if given a choice, they will take higher growth and consequences with it. neil: not this market. >> this market does not know any better, it has been subsidized for 4 years. neil: would a quick hit help in longer term, get yourself off of

fed tetecheet and move. >> you have to have fundamentals for this to move. neil: it is not there. >> corporate earnings look responsible, they are borrowing onning money for next to month, that is a false sense of euphoria. neil: john mcafee we had him on earlier, what do you think of him. >> you have a innovative creative founder. neil: do you think he is nuts. >> you are eccentric most of them are. the point is, once you commercialize an enterprise, and have shareholders and governance, you have to apply a different discipline, many

founders do not have that discipline. neil: visionaries don't fit? >> to some degree, many if not most don't, then have you that dilemma, how do you keep that creativity and motivation going, because founder believes more often than not are a great manager. neil: that founder saids, that company i created is no more, it is different. >> when you lose control, when you are not the one individual controlling the company, and shares, i do believe this laps, you don't like the evolution of the company. in many case, i think that dichotomy is just because you are a very good innovative creetor scientist does not make you a good manager, different disciplines. neil: joe thank you very much. >> my pleasure. neil: well here is a good news about this whole revelation on this whole gdp u, no one is

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neil: an immigration bill with billions in spending with a promise down the road that the make you for it in savings. the problem is spending behind it. and no one seems to ever get a handle on any of it, joining katie, scotty and richard. your fear is we dig a deeper hole? >> absolutely. any time we see these come out of washington d.c., when they are bills more than a thousand pages long, we see the price tag, being huge, with promise of spending cuts later, but problem with the "gang of 8" legislation, that got voted on in senate is this reducing legal immigration by 25%, on top of costing us money now they are

not taking into, account 75% of illegal immigration not being fixed. and local law enforcement and healthcare system. neil: scotty? >> well, real simple. and republicans are caving on this issue, basically, because they don't have the guts to stand up and do what is right. they believe just like democrats that they can sit there and buy votes, same policy that democrats have been doing for dec/8, and all of a sudden -- decades then republicans think by appealing to demographics they will get votes to republican side, they need to check that. neil: you know, there a commonality to this, richard, that. is to sell what looks like a price pricey program, for whatee merits, notion that its savings out strip those costs, that the pitch i heard on the healthcare bill be that came law, and now the same i am hearing on this immigration reform bill. >> going to immigration strictly

it is plausible it will save money in long-term. neil: plausible that i'll be thin like you in long-term. >> fox has been giving you beer on the break. >> it is, but i digress. >> reporter: >> we're doing immigration reform on behalf of ourselves we want these people who are already contributing to economy to do so in a way that is above ground, and legit, so, they are already paying taxes in terms of sale taxes but what about payroll taxes, and what about all of these other contributions these people are factoring in these people are being congress in this bill, that is why -- >> that is where you get savings from, kate that's is where a lot get the savings from but i remember, the added experience of more coming into healthcare system, and paying into it was going to dwarf whatever added expenses we have covering older

continentals lea -- codgers like with preexisting conditions, that has not turned out to be the kate, that is what makes me -- the case, that is what makes me lear sfwle wit leary. >> with the health care bill as well, so is this immigration bill. and as we go along with the quote savings and spending of this, we'll find out there is a@ lot of things in the bill, because a lot of people have read it, it will cost us a lot of money, we found through theout there are pork projects that put into this bill, we'll find out about a lot more i'm sure. so president has said when congress pushing through the large thousand plus page bills there is more in there that costs money than saves. neil: scotty, stepping back from this particular measure, is that prepensety so want to keep spending.

there snow appetite -- there is no appetite, at least happy saying no one is tax talking tax hikes for the time but no one is talking about getting spending under control. >> we're about to approach $17 trillion in debt, and i don't think anyone in congress realizes that number. and because in my household, when we start actual over spending we have no money left, and we run-up credit cards we cut things, and about what happening with this congress they are cutting things like financial tuition assistance to our soldiers our military, they are cutting programs that advance america, and putting in programs -- programs -- >> you argue we make too many of these tough spending conditions that hurt too. >> we could make more tough decisions, heritage foundation did a study that said immigrants would cost our health care system that has been discredit

discredited. neil: i guess bigger point, are you surprised in this environment, with a slowing economy now, some blame on tax hikes this no desire to just address our underlying ales, but i think we do slowdown, that is blow to government, that no one wants to unblow. >> we have to do this wisely,. neil: we're are not doing is at all. >> we have do it wisely, proper public spending cuts, by the way one public job -- if -- -- >> i disagree on that. >> private sector pays for that april job. >> you say illegals don't have any sort of mishap on our economy, look at our education system, and healthcare, reason that obamacare has come into action mainly because we have r,'s filled with people that do

not pay for their er visits. neil: we're not reining in spending at all that is the problem. see you. tomorrow night. report." rri: hello, everyone. tonight on "the willis report." another scandal as one oñ the country's biggest charities they gave millions in taxpayer dollars. and praised by presint obama. also, workers fight back against excessive retirement fees. will more employers push to lor those feeds? and be just to avoid e summer. we are watching out for you nighon "the willis report." ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪