herkul us. strictly on call and this company is poised to break out. >> i wish i hadordam and ben. in the meantime the cost of freedom continues. >> tax hikes and a key report showing t economy is growing slowly tan thouought. the bi reason why. tax hikes kicking in. and some at forbes say we need tax cuts to get our economy booming again. i am dave asbin. welcome to forbes on fox. we'll have steve fosh and rick and elizabeth and mike and bill baldwin. >> taxate cuts are always a good idea. reduce the price, risk taking and success and this is the way to get the economy moving and

does go things for the balance sheet. when people see prospects for growth they upthe value o assets. >> rick, this is the weakest recovery that we've had since world war ii. 2.3 million fewer people are working now than the ession. please don't blame it all on bush? >> i had forgotten about him. i have a vague memory. i would love to agree with steve. i don't like pay taxes anymore than the next person does. there was a in- dth study by the congressional research that s skwalch by the republicans who ordered it and tat survey shed that over the 40 years tting taxes. >> o no, it doesn't. >> yes, it does. >> y will get an argument. >> we have our study and you have yours. >> it was the national research

service. >> john, the growth was estimated 2.4 percent and the latest figure 1.8 percent and a emendous drop. how much did tax hikes play in that? >> they don't help. taxes are aice and a penalty placed. if you want more you reduce the levee. we should still reduce them because tax cuts enhance our liberty. >> that's one reason, don't tey bill, enhance productivity. >> my colleagues are proposing a phony taxcut. that means it is paid for not reducing t size of government but running government up on a credit card. phony tax cs stimulate nothing and have a psychological affect making businesses and consumers thinking we are going the way of greece and no hiring d no

spending. >> emac, there inothing phony about a tax cut. i don't know what a phony tax cut is. this is a tax cut. this is what we are recommending. >> of course, it would help. none other than john f. kennedy said it would help. u.s. news and world report were so astonished with the canadian tax cuts. they put on the cover. kennedy cut taxes and the jobless rate sunk to three percent and u saw rapid economic growth and saw it also in the reagan years. i say turn the u.s.in a tax haven like ireland and you will see the econom boom. we triedverything else and why not this. >> we have been printing money like crazy. the stock maet when they got the news of the economy slowing down they boom, ben bernanke would print more money and that is not helpg. >> no,it is not.

and that is why personal take home pay per capita is the same point as it was in 2011. false economy where the fed came in and botched the credit markets hasn't helped and what we musto first and remost, get rid of obama care. the surtax on invest sxment medical dwois tax and payroll tax for medicare, they hurt job investment and creion. >> the cost of borrowing goes down and the cost of doing business increased because of all of the new taxes and regulations, right? >> again, is the price on work when you pay on incometax. profits and proys for success and capittal gains andhen you lower theburden on those good things, you get more of them. the idea of targeting tax cuts that is soviet style central

planning. remove t barriers for the erican people andhey will pick up the ball and run with . >> we haven't mentioned obama care and there is a long list of taxes instituted and making a lot of people hold on to their ca, isn't it >> obama care raises the cost of investing for companies because profits will be reduced by the imposition. economic growth is simple. reduce the barriers to productivity and o other thing that we hav not tried. stabilize and strengthen the dollar that workings beautifully with tax cuts. i say we try it again. >> rick, flexible spending and not lowed to deduct as much as you used to. i have to tell you since i was paying more in that account, i am spending less and i bet there is a lot of people like me. >> you may be right. we are seeing a reduction in health care spending.

i told you bl baldwins really smart. >> (laughter) >> they go from them to smart. >> if you have to reach back to the early '60s and the kennedy years. >> do the math on reagan and on clinton. oh, come on, look at the democrats all over tax cut. i love how the democrats dismiss tax cuts and touting tax crits for oughtios or cash for clunkers and you can see the economy react. >> the biggest group hurt in l of this is the small business. they are t the biggest job creators. the big coopation can do fine tis not a problem. we are seeing more small businesses fail and they are the primary job creators. >> we have to talk about a problem here. is there any movement to cut

taxes across the board? will the president sign off on all of the additional taxes from obama care? >> no sadly, this money believes that th money you are allowed to keep is a loss to the government. it is what you make on line two, send it in. he will not push it. later this year, the house of representative led by the house ways and means mmittee, david kemp and others are coming up with a radical tax simification. >> he said you have to sta with tax cuts because you have to starve the beast. you focus in on spending they will find tricky way of spending. starve the beast by cutting taxes. >> i thi starve the beast was a reagan-n- era person. he said three ways that government damages business

spending and o way is reach in paychecks and take your money and the other is print money and third way bond. they are all bad. and swapping from one to th next doesn help any. >> bill has a view of the world. lower the prices and good work you get more and dynamic economy that overcomes a lotf stu pidity from washington both on the balance sheet. mortgage rates, jumping. we have someone here saying it is great news for your colby, f

your latest headlines go to fox news.com. big news, mortgage rates surging from 3.93 last year to five percent. that is a big jump. a t of folks believe it is bad newsor home sales and prices. emac, you say that is great news. >> it is great news for the housing marketemp really. itill get people up off their seats to look in the lower rate. pending home sal in may rocketed higher because people tried toook in the affordable

mortgages now. and that's what realtors said. >> mike, is it great news or bad. >> emacis right. thinink it is going to slow don e rate of the growth we saw in home prices because t economy itself is weak. incomes are n rising and gd was revised downward and people are not hired. that will decrease demand and only thing goosing home prices. >> you areaying it is dicativef a bad economy is not a good one, what do you think, steve? >> th federal reserve will get out of the credit markets and stop suppressing intere rate. lending standards are getting more reasonable. but like the old soviet unon. food was free but you couldn't get. it mortgage rates are easing up.

and so bl, good news on the housin front if>> it is bad news for housing prices and good news f senior citizens trying to live off the interest and good news for the economy. we'll be spared a housin binge anhang over. >> john, i am confused. cope it simple here? >> let's hope it is bad news for housing lest we forget we ran in serious economic trouble in 2007 and 8 when there was consumption in the housing and nothing to do with economic growth. people are putting it in businesses, we'll see the actual economy grow. housing is not economic input. it is consumption. >> john said it is bad nows for housing and that is a good thing. >> did i say that bill baldwen is a clever guy. le me take that back. >> see how fickle.

>> i think emachas it right. you want to get in the housing market and sittg around when rates couldt be lower, you get what you pay for. they better get in there now. it is only going to go one way. nemac, this begs the question. this is a short- term shot-in-the-arm. people will get in and banks will be reluctant to allow too much renegotiating of the mortgages. >> i hear what you are saying about the renegotiating with mortgages and again, we have that adow inventory and i think we have leeh way time to get rid of and people are going to refinance and i agree with john tamny. the federal reserve is tryinto deflate the bond bubble. it is hard to control the ten year yield and 30 year yield when you are trying to deflate the bond bubble. it is like having a balloon whip

around back wards. >> it is co to getting the credit markets working again. when you have a normal economy and stable dollar you have one and half million starts. housing would be heed with a normal credit market and people who understand. >> i have to go to john tamny. mostf their wealth is caught up inn people's homes. they want prices to go up and homeownership and you are a private sector and automatic religious about the priva sector. isn't it better to have ownership in what they live in? >> it makes them less mobile and we have to remember, housing is soaring in the known cents. >> wait, it makes them less flexible about moving arou. if you have a depend housing market it makes it easyy tore sell your property and move? >> it does. when housingis doing well i is

bad for the economy. it means less money is flowing for commercial ideas ts is not a free market in housing. it is a government driven market in housing. >> that is a relative term. >>et the government out. >> housing is doing well when people are earning more that is good. but when fed is printing money it is a bad thing. >> mike put it in context for us. >> and the government turning to the nfl to help the health care law and we will be sacked with higher medical bills. that isin the bottom of the hour. forget about happy hour at your bar. how about happy hour at the desk. more companies allowing workers to hit the bottle at work. is this a dangerous business an. >> t alcohol. a solution to all of life's

problems.

>> raise a glas at worko raise the bottom line? an increasing number of companies reported letting workers drink alcohol while on the cloc claimg it helps the workers get the creative juices flowing and causes them to stick around the office longer.

i wish my boss would believe that. we know the series mad men that is very popular that shows people drinking in the office and there was nothing wrong with it then andou say nothing wrong with it now. >> the good old days they hadt right. if it gets pele together especial after hours and at the office and bringing people together and you are getting ideas going and putting people on the same pag becoming friends. they are going to the b anyhow. >> the problem is in this age, one person d too much and then they will sue the company and you have huge lights there. you can'tine serve pizza now. the mayor of new york will hit you from that. >> john, the moment and idea of gettingsowed. would it be a good idea for the work place? >> to each business it is to ch their own. probly fosters a greater corporate cult xur peop are

talking about ideas as rick said. it is something to encourage. if people are happy at work. they are more productive. >> but if they are weaving down the hallway, are they productive? >> steve is right. paint a bull's eye with a sign that said sue me. it is a playground for tort lawyers and sexual harrassment cases, too. >> emac, would it help. time magazine. time magazine the night before they put the magazine to ped, they roll throug the aisles with liquor cart. >> it is delivered copy to their tables. they are boozing it up at noon. and i liked the job and delivering the copy. i like what rick unger said madmen and look at autoworkers

who got trouble boozing on the job. i wont want a drunk to put my car together. >> the fact is, rick, you have a doctor, would you want your doctor drinking before prapting. nobviously not. it was drinkin that put john ta mny and elizabeth all on the same page. nsteve, on thing you didn't talk about specifically. do you think that it would help or hurt the worker's ability. >> if you have to hav booze to get your mind going. do it after hours and do it in the bar where the bartender is liable. >> steve, you are a writer, you should kw better. >> clearly, i have to admit in my career, there are a coupleof times,lunches where wine was poured froel. i can't say i was more prodtive. >> i can't either and i have those lunchions to this day. but in general, its it a work

voirment. stove didn't hear that. >> steve, everything that happens here stays here. we have your word on that. >> absolutely. >> john, you are safe. >> coming up, the forbes listf poweul cebrities on line. most powerful celebrity stocks that you will only get right here, that i coming up next.

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