be a bumpy ride. that is my two cents more. that is it for tonight's "willis report." dvr the show if you can't catch us live. have a great night. ♪ lou: good evening, everybody, thank you for being with us. obama obama as senator and candidate often mocked the foreign policy of president george w. bush. but as president himself obama can not escape his mounting foreign policy follies and he and his administration and the american people are now bearing then embarrassing consequences. former egyptian president hosni mubarak, president obama helped force him from power more than two years ago. today he was ordered to be released from prison by an egyptian court. he is to be released within 48 hours. mubarak's release is another slap in the face for mr. obama.

it follows the ouster of the muslim brotherhood from power and mr. obama's president of choice, mohammed morsi. the violent and deadly clashes between the military-run government and muslim brotherhood and backed protesters to the wall and they are now responding. continuing with violence and all likelihood this friday, when morsi supporters reportedly will conduct what they call a day of martyrs. and no relief for president obama in syria either. assad opposition forces claiming more than a thousand civilians were killed in chemical gas attacks earlier today on the outskirts of damascus. the alleged attacks come exactly one year and one day after president obama famously warned assad that chemical weapons, the use of them, would be to cross a so-called red line and prompt u.s. involvement in the now 2 1/2 year-long struggle.

it's a conflict that has seen nearly 100,000 syrians killed. the white house predictably today, after repeated questions on red lines, from the white house press corps, confirmed they are relying on a united nations investigative team to provide answers before they act on those red line threats. >> what we think is most important for right now is there actually happens to be a united nations chemical weapons investigative team on the ground in in syria. they were just granted access to the country yes i believe. given the reports we've seen overnight what may or may not have taken place in syria, we think it is important for that investigative team, to be given access to that area. lou: president obama said our next guest to cairo to meet with egyptian president hosni mubarak at the height of the tahrir square uprising back in 2011. today he is stress stressing the

need to keep ties with egypt from further deteriorating and maintain a relationship with those responsible for its future. joining us now is frank wizner. frank held numerous diplomatic posts in a career that spans eight presidents, serving as former u.s. ambassador to egypt, india, zambia and the philippines. ambassador, good to see you here. >> thank you. lou: this is a, a frightful moment for the united states and for this administration. seems every initiative this president has taken in libya, in egypt, and towards syria, has been disasterous and in fact, not only not supporting the interests of the unitedtates, but making bad situations woefully worse. what do you think? >> well, lou, i think we have to be a little bit fair about it because -- lou: i want to be utterly fair about it but i want to be straightforward bit as well.

>> the middle east is going through a period of revolutionary transformation. since 2011 we have seen governments across the region fall. ethnicities turn on one another. religions turn on one another. there is only so much the outside world, any power can do. lou: then why would that outside power, premier among them the united states, not recognize the reality that you have just spoken? >> well, i'd like to think we have recognized it but trying to find a set of policies that's going to stick in turbulent seas like this w is really tough. that said the united states has a couple of objectives it has got to maintain. it needs toob be certain it's on the sign of peace in the region to protect the borders of israel. it needs to be on the side of democratico transformation. and even where that's rough and it has to be a long-term objective we stick with it. we need to be on the side of the

eventual economic recovery of the region if there is ever to be stability. these broad principles ought to guide our policy, those are wise principles but they seem subordinated to one that is a traditional first practice, first policy of the united states in diplomacy. that is to pursue the interests of the united states itself. >> of course. lou: democratic transition, in which you're dealing with authoritarian idealogical groups such as, the muslim brotherhood, we are encountering still al qaeda, a force that is throughout the region growing in power, which this president, to be fair, as you suggested, has, basically implied, has been on the run, for the past year, year-and-a-half in fact we find quite the opposite to be the case. why are we seeing so many confused, confounding statements and policies eminating from this

administration? we understand the complexities but why assert our policies if we can not in fact implement them and pursue good for our interests as well as those countries that have been loss, standing partners especially in the case of egypt? >> each oft the principles thati mentioned earlier are in the american national interests. what we want in the middle east is to make certain that the united states is, basic, interests in the fly of oil, security of israel, our privileged position in the region are protected that goes without saying. now where we are in egypt today is really impprtant. we're at a moment of inflection. a new government backed by the military has taken control. and i am absolutely of your view, lou, if i understood you correctly, the united states needs to support the restabilization of egypt and end

to violence and to see this government succeed and get on with its work. the news today out of cairo is beginning to get a little bit better but we'll be faced with more violence. we have to f have the grit to stick wit, see this new government through and make certain that we can work with it, not tear our ties to it. i will be the first to oppose anyone who says, the way to work with egypt is to break our economic or military assistance ties. lou: and yet, we are hearing precisely that from a number of prominent democrats. the white house disputing it. they convened again today. nothing was forthcoming on egypt.mi we are, looking at a, without question, a are ever a continued irbox it seems to be -- tinderboxxwith egypt. there inflection point at hand yet there is great confusion. does this president support general sisi.

does this general support the a secular military? does this general support the muslim brotherhood trying to cast some rhetoric around it as if it were, not simply a fundamentalist islamist or r organization but rather a, a club for democracy that just happens to reside in egypt? this is baffling. >> egypt has been a priority in the early 1970's when president nixon began brokering a deal between israel and egypt. we produced peace, that peace between the two countries is stuck. egypt has been a terrific it keeps its canals open.lf war. its skies clear. we supply our forces in afghanistan. thanks to our support that we've received from the egyptians.

we need a steady policy, not with one government or another but policy of cooperation and a policy that permits egypt's stability and economic development. stability can flow from consensus government and therefore the priority for democracy is a good one. lou: i couldn't agree with you more and i just want to add to that two points. one is, that it is certainly not constructive to have a number of republican, so-called prominent republican senators, at large calling for the end of aid and the breach of, with this secular military government it's a peculiar at best and a president who does not articulate or explain his policies. i hope you would agree with that. and the inflection point was two years ago when the president sided with forces he did not understand nor did i know and

threw away a 30-year ally in the form of president hosni mubarak. it's a difficult, it's a difficult thing to rely on the judgement of an administration who has done that and participated in throwing the egyptian country into chaos. why should we expect better this time? >> lou, there is much in what you say i can find agreement with but i do recall, and i was in cairo in 2011. lou: right. >> the spring of 2011. the egyptian people that asked hosni mubarak to step down. it wasn't barack obama. the egyptian people decided, he should step down then. they then made -- lou: if i may, he was not first. he followed that call with his own. >> let me end because the egyptian people have a strong voice. they also spoke about the rule of the muslim brothers and what kind of distortions of the commitment the muslim brothers

made to the development of democracy in egypt, brought millions of egyptians on the street, and therefore the army to try to sort this out and move egypt back into a sustainable position. lou: i would hope that john kerry would call you and get some can counsel on how to emulate your clarity. perhaps his boss as well. frank, thank you for being with us, mr. ambassador. >> thank you, sir. lou: appreciate it. president obama spent his summer vacation golfing. home land security committee chairman michael mccall showing other congressman why border security comes first. next. any last requests mr. baldwin? do you mind grabbing my phone and opening the capital one purchase eraser? i need to redeem some venture miles before my demise. okay. it's easy to erase any recent travel expense i nt.

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lou: my next guest recently led aborter patrol guided tour of the texas-mexico border

highlighting what he describes asg woefully inadequate resourcs and he has introduced a border security bill that requires operational control of our border with no less than a 90% apprehension rate onre the entie border with mexico over five years. the full house could vote on his measure shortly after the summer recess. joining us is congressman michael mccall, chairman of the house committee on homeland security. mr. chairman, good to have you with us. you took a number of congressman with you on that tour of the border. what are your thoughts and their reactions? >> well you know my thoughts are this ad hock approach we've used over the last couple decade, throwing money at the problem without a national strategy, without a plan, plugging holes up, we went to san diego. they have good fencing there. they have technology but they're getting around that with the boats. tucson has wonderful

technologies. all it does itlo presses them to other points. now the new point of entry now is texas. the rio grande vally, immigration flow is up 55%. without a national strategy and a plan, to dictate where we put those resources, we're just going to continue to throw money at the problem without a real solution. lou: and your proposal, this administration to be clear has rolled back 287-g, the cooperative legislation that, that authorized regulation, that authorizes cooperation between the immigration authorities, the border patrol. and, local law enforcement. this administration wants no part of it. your law, your bill would encourage, that cooperation. what has been the reaction? >> well, local law enforcement are a force multiplier. the ones on the border have a valuable role to play. the border sheriffs, endorse my bill. they suuport it because it

gives, this bill gives them a voice, a stakeholders, as to what the national strategy is going to be. and what the implementation plan is going to be. along with board of governors and coast guard and boarder patrol and national guard as well. it brings everyone together to create this national strategy we they ever had before. we never done this before. we never had a plan to implement it. we never had metrics to measure results. we have own $75 billion at the board other over the last decade with only a 44% success rate. that is abysmal. we can do better than that we also define operational control as a 90% apprehension rate which i believe is amechiefable within two years. i spent three days with the border patrol chief mike fisher and he agrees. we can get this thing done. lou, you and i talked about this issue for quite some time, ever since i got elected to congress. now is the moment i think we can

finally get this thing done. lou: as you know i endorsed whatever, to whomever may care i endorse the approach taken by the house of representatives, incremental previous, in which, your committee, congressman bob goodlatte, the chairman of the house judiciary, moving ahead with, the rules and regular order committee hearings on these issues which has been denied in the senate. and for crying out loud, senator chuck schumer has even endorsed now the incremental careful, deliberative, thoughtful, approach that you, and your fellow members of the leadership in the house have chosen. are you stunned by that? >> i am stunned. this comprehensive idea to throw together a bill in three days in the senate which is a misguided approach that throws almost $50 billion without any rhyme or reason totally arbitrary is a total waste of tangs payer

dollars. what we want to do is a fiscally responsible to have a strategy and a plan. you know what, gee, real novel concept as founding fathers envisioned, we go through the committee process. we have hearings. go through committees. and then piece by piece develop legislation thoughtfully in a smart way i think will finally resolve and provide solutions to a very difficult, complex issue. lou: congress comes back the 9th of september. so we look forward to your return and watching those hearings take place and legislation move throughin the congress, as was intended by our forbearers. congressman, always good to talk with you. up next, president obama welcomes the nfl's only undefeated team to the white house. took a while. we'll taak about that. in the chalk talk, we'll talk about why this president seems to like earning popularity points, more than, well, working on the second-term agenda, if it

is still in existence. no two people have the same financial goals. pnc investments works with you to understand yours and helps plan for your retirement. talk to a pnc investments financial advisor today. ♪ ...amelia... neil and buzz: for teaching us that you c't create the future... by clinging to the past. and with that: you're history.

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it may cause an unsafe dr in blood pressure. side effects include headache, flushing, upset stomach, and abnormal vision. tavoid long-term injury, seekmmediate medical help for an erection lasting more than four hours. stop taking viagra and call your doctor right away, if you experience a sudden decrease or loss in vision or hearing. this is the age of taking action. viagra. talk to your doctor. lou: the white house is doing its best this week to divert our attention to bright shiny

objects as best they can. not necessarily so effectively. they announced yesterday that first dog bo, has a little sister. portuguese water dog named zohn any. for some unknown reason he chose to honor the 1972 miami dolphins sat the white house. nfl's only team to win a super bowlin after going entire team undefeated that hasle never been celebrated by any president. that is taken care of now. it is done. why now? it is not the anniversary of their accomplishment. it is not regular football season yet. maybe our celebrity president just wants to meet as many celebrities as he can while he is still living in the nation's most coveted address. who is next t on the white house guest list? '96 chicago bulls? maybe find eight new york yankees. there is white house deputy press secretary, josh earnest.

how can somebody earnest josh. anyway, talking about promoting the president's upcoming college bus tour. >> the bus tour is three days away, but i welcome your interest in this bus tour but because i think it is going to be, hopefully both fun and informative. lou: fun and informative. we are talking about president obama, right? the president sure is a fun guy. he enjoyed a nine-day vacation on martha's vineyard where he played six round of golf. that sounds like fun to me. but let's hope a few unattended matters don't spoil his mood as he returns to the oval office. first, egypt, does appear to be falling apart. he might think about that a bit. actually do something. syria, besides cut off aid, if he has which he denies so we don't know. but we'll learn more i'm sure in time.re and syria, where he wanted,

assad to get the heck out of there. the syrian mess is worsening. the death toll at more than 100,000. there are no prospects of any kind of negotiated peace. and no one's been held accountable of course in the benghazi scandal. the terrorist attack which four americans died more than 11 months ago. secretary of state john kerry says everything is boffo though. four state department officials have been paid on administrative leave, reassigned. of course unemployment. this is, i think his order, it is not ours because this would be my number one, unemployment. unemployment rates did rise in 28 states last month. we need to get this great, vibrant, free enterprise capitalist economy going. mr. president, you could provide some strong, positive leadership in that direction. , if you're of a mind to. if you care enough about those folks who have had to weather this horrible, horrible,

economic cycle. and fifth, welfare. cato institute informing us all, fun and informative facts as josh ernest said, federal welfare programs, state welfare programs combined, paying more than minimum wage jobs in 35 of our states. imagine that. and sixth, there are those scandals. the irs continues to stonewall investigators looking into their targeting of conservative groups. that scandal you remember, mr. president? and attorney general holder's tenure at justice department never ceases to outrage and to offend those who would like to see this nation represent once again the reality that we are a nation of laws. and wen wonder if this fun president of ours is in a sufficiently informative mood to at long last tell us what he was doing the night of the benghazi

attacks? what he is going to do about the irs? the justice department? et cetera. we can't wait to find out. we're going to find out how fun and informative mr. obama can be. up next, don't mess with texas. attorney general eric holder however doesn't get message. he is lost all of, nearly all of the cases that he brought against texas. his department of justice, i should say the obama department of justice, going after texas voter i.d. laws again. copd. if you've got it, you know how hard it can be to breathe and man, you know how that feels. copd includes emphysema and chronic bronchitis. spiriva is a once-daily inhaled copd maintenance treatment that helps open my obstructed airways for a full 24 hours. you know, spiriva helps me breathe easier. spiriva handihaler tiotropium bromide inhalation powder does not replace fast-acting inhalers for sudden symptoms.

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lou: a fascinates lou: fascinating interesting legal development. kansas and state of arizona yesterday filing lawsuits against the obama administration accusing the administration of preventing states from enforcing laws that require proof of citizenship when a person registers to vote in those two states. joining us now, the man who

filed the lawsuit, kansas secretary of state chris coback. chris, good to have you with us. this case, the attorney general makes it clear, he hates voter i.d. laws. what are your thoughts about prevailing? >>ut well, it is interesting. the, the holder justice department has gone on a war against the states. i mean it is not just texas. it is any states they can find a way to bring some legal action against, a state that has photo i.d. like we do in kansas, they take action n this lawsuit that we filed, we're suing the federal agency known as the election assistance commission and this lawsuit was actually invited by justice scalia -- scalia, when he wrote the intertribal council state. he stayed states do have the right toht require citizenship when the voters register and he said the way to do this is sue

the agency and make the agency sue the federal registration form. we'rein following the path and blueprint that justice scalia laid out for the states. lou: aclu already theftenned you with legal action. >> yeah. lou: saying documentary proof of citizenship law prevents thousands from registering to vote. how are you going to defend, if you must? >> well, there arguments have very little merit. they can't show that people are being prevented from registering to vote. in fact the so-called, thousands are just individuals who have started theed process of registering but haven't yet provided their proof the citizenship. they haven't shown anybody who is unable to give proof of citizenship.ho our law was drafted even if you lost your passport, we have free birth certificates in kansas for purpose. you can't get yourth birth certificate we still have a way to submit affidavits and get proof of sit shen ship to the state so you can register. their argument doesn't have any

merit. that doesn't stop the aclu, they threaten a state, threaten a city. we're not backing down. lou: you're not backing down. neither is the state of texas or other states that passed voter i.d. laws. are you coming together as a group in court? >> well, in this case in texas we'll certainly stand ready to assist texas in any way. we provided assistance when texas went up on their photo i.d. law the first time by giving them statistical evidence from kansas. the argument holder is trying to make is a ridiculous argument. he is claiming photo i.d. hurts people of one skin color than people of another skin color. the evidence doesn't prove that. the evidence comes out it affects all of us equally. surprise, surprise we can get a free drivers license or free state i.d. if we don't have a drivers license for purpose of voting. lou: attorney general greg abbott pointed out studies show

minority participation rates overut subsequent elections have risen at a rate and participation rates are higherra than that of white citizens which invalidates everything the obama justice department is saying. >> yeah. lou: when will we have a resolution? >> well, we're hopeful in the kansas and arizona lawsuit we're hopeful we can get at least some action out of the district court very quickly. we would like to have this, change made so weha can have our proof of citizenship laws fully ing effect without any loopholes best 2014 election. i don't know how quickly the lawsuit against texas will move but i'm pretty confident that the one in kansas and arizona should be able to move within the next six months. lou: and again, as chris cobach points out, the issue is whether or not states can move the eac to change the federal form which is a foundation of the decision. chris, great to see you. thank you very much. chris cove vac. remember when president

obama was the darling of the national liberal media? well, no more. speculation rising about a hillary clinton candidacy in sift system ed klein, author of the best-seller, the amateur, with the inside scoop next. whatever business you're in, that's the business we're in. with premium service like one of the best on-time delivery records and a low claims ratio, we do whater it takes to make your business our business. od. helping the wod keep promises.

lou: the republican national committee today made it clear that hillary clinton is in their cross-hairs. the rnc just release ad video asking whethere cnn and nbc will include coverage after clinton scandal and film productions about the former first lady? it alludes to hillary clinton's brother lobbying president clinton for presidential pardons, the fourth in a series of audios -- videos attacking clinton, perhaps. author of the best-selling book "the amateur", ed klein. what do you make of this? firstn of all this new hit job

presumably by the new york times ons the clinton foundation? >> it struck me as a shot across the bow because what they alluded to was perhaps some illegality. certainly ethical, questionable behavior on the part of the people running the foundation. ao cross currents of donors who are also part of tte foundation yet also involved in businesses that bill is involved, bill clinton is involved in. the whole thing reminds me of the clinton presidency, big ideas, we're going to save the world. chaos, messy,eth i canally questionable. lou: and lots of relationships of long-time clinton, you know, associates, staffers, friends, distributors, importantly. deficits in the foundation but all the while, as i read the article, i'm thinking to myself,

why is the "new york times" doing this? a shot across the bow certainly but also at the same time, perhaps to inoculate the clintons as she gets ready for 2016. what do you think? >> one of the things i find really puzzling why hillary would make her campaign headquarters at the clinton foundation here in manhattan? instead of separating herself from this very questionable operation that bill clinton has been running all this time, it seems to me she is handing her adversaries and enemies a cud gill to beater with. lou: republicans are getting ready for 2014 and they haven't declared victory 2014. haven't got a great big motto. they have up in their meeting in boston talking about making it happen. they don't define it. >>e what's it? lou: don't tell us how. they have a lot to explain and a

lot to, to energize their base which is precisely what it has been for the past two presidential elections. that is, 37% identifying themselves at republican, they got a lot to energize? >> they certainly do. the clintons meantime are actually piling up hundreds of millions of dollars in potential donors. they have got an organization in place. she will be very formidable candidate. lou: you may have just answered your question which is why in the world hang out at the clinton foundation. ed, thanks so much for being here. >> great to beac here. lou: appreciate it. up next, the new book, this town, reveal much of what we don't want to know about the washington establishment, exposing, well, a reality that is precisely what you probably think of washington. author mark leibovich, discussion of his runaway best-seller.

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lou: the new book, "this town." two parties and a funeral, suggest there are no longer democrats and republicans in washington. leavinges only wealthy folks who have an incestuous relationship with one another. i'm joined by the book's author, "new york times" magazine chief national correspondent mark leibovich. congratulations one the book is it. >> thanks. lou: four weeks. you're roaring. >> people seem to be liking it. i don't know how popular iw am inside d.c. maybe i will get run out of town. lou: we recommend his book. 24 town to you, highly. recommend you buy it. recommend you read it because it really reveals the folks that, that we all feared were down

there. >> it's become, in the words of tom coburn, a very conservative senator from oklahoma. lou:re yeah. >> a permanent feudal culture of hangers on of elected officials. of professional self-perpetuating careerist politician, media, usual suspects. these are the people who run your country or think they do. lou: who run the country. who are an important part of the process of governance itself. whether it be from the fourth estate. our chief white house correspondent, ed henry prominently featured. >> i don't think ed likes me these days. lou: he is sincere. >> i said as much. i will believe him. ed's a good guy. lou: he is a great guy. tammy haddad, i have known tammy almost 30 years. >> she is part of the furniture. lou: she has created, sse has created herself and created a role which you described so beautifully in the book.

>> she has made washington work for her. and there have been people like her for decades. they have been party hostesses or showee runners are whatever u want to call her. she has built a very successful business getting media companies to pay her a lot of money to do whatever it is she does for them. lou: tammy had dad, is a woman of immense intelligence and energy and, just a passion for all ty hat is politics and media and power. >> and she's -- lou: money doesn't hurt. >> money doesn't hurt. she is transparent. i have a bias towards transparency. people who are not afraid to say what they're in it for. they're having fun. at the core this is not a fun book. something at the core people in america are outraged. i want them entertained and read it and laugh and that is all good. i want to be outraged. farther out of washington you get the needer to sort of understand this is. lou: how can, such a contemptible group of people be

at the same time so compatible with one another and do so little for the rest of us? >> they, because the system rewards it. this is a system in which washington can work very well for washington. we have a city that was allegedly built on public service, right? this is a culture of self-service. it is democrats and republicans working together to basically milk this feudal culture, to become very successful and washington has become the wealthiest community in the united states by far. lou: there has been no recession in washington, d.c. >> no. lou: housing prices are through the roof.re >> absolutely. lou: and this administration, i, almosts every day, i ask why in the world don't we know what the president does? why don't we know his daily routine to the degree it is routine? why don't we understand from the president himself, why don't we have an articulation by this president of his vision, a

explanation of his policies? even context would be helpful. >> this administration was supposed to be different. this was the hope and change campaign. and i think one of the narrative arcs ofan this book has been the five-year period since he was nominated for the democratic nomination in 2008. as the president. look, washington changed him and his people. i don't know how sincere they were. maybe they were to a point but i don't think this is a partisan book in any way. there is, this is the ultimate pox on both your houses book because these are, this is a professional class. lou: houses, garages, neighbors. >> but, yes, but beyond that it is their part of the political class, right? this is a system that has been allowed to thrive by any number of factors. the growth of government. the flooding of money into washington. lou: this is the question that results. is there anything that can be done to change what is a cesspool by any definition? >> i hope so.

i, this is where, i sort of say, look i'm a journalist. i hold a mirror to a culture and hope it creates some outrage or something. i don't have the chapter at the end where i have my 10 bullet points how to make the capitol a better place. lou: good for you. almost always obligatory with an editor. >> i don't have a good editor i guess with all due respect. i have, look, outrage is great. i don't know if it exists anymore. people have been rightfully outraged. lou: this is a wonderful book to acquaint you what you should be outraged about. >> it is fun too. lou: and it is fun. definitely. "this town." we recommend you buy it straight away. loudobbs.com for links. up next, president obama continues to define reason. refusing to call egypt a coup. that's fine. it was overthrow. that real scandals are phony. he is saying that. does he really think that? two leading experts

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and a 30-tablet free trial. lou: if you ever wonder what those people in north korea thinking, a new report in the "wall street journal" goes a ways to answering it. "the wall street journal" report is that north korea is dealing with a serious crystal meth epidemic. researchers say at least 40 to 50% of adults in northern areas of the communist country are addicted to the drug. north korea, breaking bad. president obama trying to divert attention from a number of scandals, meeting today with a 192 miami dolphins. joining us to -- 1972, joining us to take a look at the president's mind and his refusal to take responsibility we're joined by psychologist dr. jeff gardere and psychotherapist julie haines. thank you for being withg us. >> pleasure. >> thank you.

lou: let's start with, let's start with, what is this president thinking? what is going on? he has a contradiction over a major issue that is aid to egypt. >> yeah.nt lou: you with one of the leading democratic senators. he is being called out on. >> yeah. lou: he has got scandals everywhere. the economy, he seems to be completely out of touch with it. what's happening? >> well it is simply the lame duck syndrome. he is almost home free, if he can get through this presidency without a major scandal and as you know, many people have been reporting that there will be a scandal. something will happen between himself and other members the white house. he is saying, look, let me just go ahead and take care of the business here. let me get through this term. lou: justst hiking nor reality. let me do what i want. >> look, we know, we know as the president, as presidents before him, it really is trying to get through unscathed and protecting the legacy. that is what every lame duck president tries to do. lou: julie, you can't argue with

that. thatat is what every lame duck intends to do. give us some insight, what is motivating, well is anything motivating him. the man is not exactly gaining the reputation for being the hardest working president in american history. >> that is for sure. but, lou, let me tell you, it is human nature to avoid responsibility for difficult situations and pass the buck and i think,t he is trying to just get out, you know, avoid taking that responsibility and that is human nature but not very responsible. lou: welln i mean you got to think responsibility is the essence of anthony weiner and elliot spitzer because they are seeking to serve the people again. julie, give us a little insight into their minds and their hearts? because they obviously care about us deeply? >> yeah. you know, i think people go where they're comfortable and,

in a fight of the sex scandal -- lou: well they both apparently, anthony weiner apparently more comfortable alone than with but. >> but, they're comfortable in the public eye, in the political scene and so it is not surprising that they're going to go back where they're comfortable. where they can get the attention and the praise. and you know, if they get reelected, doesn't that mean a scandal is behindel them and thy can move forward? >> and i agree with that because i think a lot of what's going on clinically with these individuals especially spitzer and weiner is they're getting a chance for a do-over. before they really screwed it up. now they have an opportunity to try to save their reputations, go back and do it the right way, protect the legacy as you saw with weiner he is is still not able to do that because of is impulse controlno issues. lou: impulse control issues, i haven't heard it put that quite

that way. >> that is analystic, julie, right. >> sounds like. lou: a problem with photography. >> right, a, absolutely. lou: i have to say, i've seen something i had not sign before. three new york newspapers coming out and saying this weekend, denouncing eliot spitzer for being a cheat and a liar. >> oh, yeah. lou: the "new york daily news" for the prostitution scandal. for turning in a dismal performance as governor. rat lo. he was also unsuccessful as attorney genuining none of his prosecutions. and beingo interested only in feeding his insatiable ego. julie, do you think that will have any influence and are you amazed that three newspapers, the new york, well, two of them at least, the "new york daily news" and "new york times", were boostings" spitzer every step of the way as ag as governor? what'sst happening? >> you know, i've got to think that there's a part of us that

is, kind of wants redemption, wants somebody to rise above their mediocrity or their poor choices. i don't understand, why some these folks are still in the public eye but, you know, i wonder, what does that say about us as americans? lou: you don't have to wonder. when you look at what we're reading, what we're watching, who we have become as a people, i mean we have retreated to the lowest common denominator in this country as a society. weom don't have an aspirational set of leaders in this country. >> well, and i think what's going on, people are very disgusted by the fact that spitzer with his history, yes, i have to look at it as a shrink he does have some very severe emotional issues he has actually begun to work on and tried to become a better person. i've spoken to him, not in therapy but have met him in hallways and talked to him about it but the important thing here is, people look at spitzer and

look at scott stringer who has done all the right things. who is a moral guy and they feel that it is an injustice that spitzer is winning. lou: jeff gardere, thank you very much, doctor. julie hanks, thank you, doctor. thanks for being with us. good night from new york. of all my interviews with bill gates, the one you're abou% to see is most controversial because he says a lot of the good we do as a country is threatened by paralyzed washington that will do no good for this country. the primary target, foreign aid. the other target, people who want to block it. hoe of republicans who criticized this the equivalent of good money after bad. today, gates firing back.