decisions, is there are issue. neil: they can never let go. like chocolate. : hello, everybo. i am gerri willis. tonight on "the willis report." the white house rolls out a new strategy to deal with the disastrous rollout of obamacare. it is the obamacare czar. and will he delay the mandate forcing people to sign up or face hefty fines? >> it is possible he would announce he will delay the individual mandate. gerri: the car is in making that bold addiction is here tonight. and the market on a tear have stocks reach their peak or will the rally continue? we are watching out for you tonight on "the willis report."

♪ we will have all that and more coming up, but first our top story tonight. the white house ability to get the president's crowning achievement fixed facing one huge hurdle. we terrible mentioned skills of the president himself. with us now, author of "the amateur barack obama in the white house." thank you for joining us. $654 million. the exchange does not work. how would you grade the president on his management abilities? >> f, i would give him a flunking grade. he had three months to do this. gerri: he had more than three months to do this. he had years. the time has flown by and nothing has don happened. the website failed effort just 2000 people went on it the first day. think about it, it cannot even sustain his 42,000 people, but

they did not listen. tell us why. >> the most shocking thing i have learned from my reporting is inside the white house they are doing high-fives because they believe, they believe they have beaten the republicans back on defunding obamacare. that they are now riding high in washington, they are going to get cory booker elected, they are going to get bill as mayor of new york. they think everything is turning their way. what they call the glitch is unimportant. gerri: this so-called glitch, this small problem with the website is so much more than that. if you could see the people sending me e-mails, tweeting me how concerned they are. people who say they are so deeply concerned they are going to lose benefits. at the end of the day it will cost them out of their pocket.

in that little circle in washington, everything may be good, but out in the real world people are concerned. >> you are right about that, but the real problem is given all this concern outside washington, you would think the president would be banging on the desk saying fix this, we had my understanding is he said this is beneath my pay grade. i don't have to worry about it. it is going to get fixed. people will love obamacare. he is an kind of a bubble of hubris that he does not really get what is going on in this country. gerri: "a bubble of hubris." i watched him in the rose garden this week surrounding himself with people who said they could get coverage on the obamacare website. what i was listening for, what i never heard, what i was waiting for bated breath, the buck stops here. this is my responsibility to get this thing up and by gosh i will. i never heard that.

>> john f. kennedy said i was responsible, but obama does not do that. he never takes responsibility. it is always somebody else. gerri: joining us this conversation. we had a couple of issues with your sound. michael, welcome to the show. iyou run a very successful company. your share price beating out the market, which is doing pretty well itself it i want to know when you look at the rollout of obamacare, the exchanges, how do you grade the president on his management skills here to get this thing up and running? >> while i think it is a peer f. i think he has failed in every aspect of it. but that does not mean if somebody fails in a particular situation that he can't fix it. you have to admit the fact you have done things wrong and you can get it fixed. that is the job of the ceo, and he is the ceo so i think that is

the same as my jabber anybody's job who is running the business. you have to fix what is broken. the political situation behind obamacare is so difficult and so bad, it is very hard to fix and very hard to start. gerri: what is the management skill, what is the personal characteristic the president needs to fix this thing? what is the missing dna if it is in fact missing? that he requires to get around this problem? >> i think that is a very lax question. first and foremost you have to have experience at fixing things. i don't think this president has that kind of experience in his background. i don't know what he has fixed in his past. what you have to do is hire people who will fix things and have fixed things to support the characteristics that you don't

have. we hire people who are confident to fix the problems we can't fix, but we have to have the ability to recognize the problem. i don't believe that problem was ever recognized. gerri: i have got to go back to you. clearly the president was never a manager. he was a professor, everybody would have to agree. but i want to bring up something else that may be missing coming from vernon jordan. consultation is not in the dna of the obama administration. how does that missing link plan to what has happened this week? >> he also went on to say that when it comes to who controls access to the president, it is valerie who decides who gets on the air force one, who goes into the oval office. i called him in the bubble before, he is isolated.

he is surrounded by a lot of "yes" people. he doesn't have the kind of help and expertise that he needs. gerri: thank you. we appreciate your time, thank you. now i want to know what you think. when will obamacare get fixed? one month, six months, never? log on to gerriwillis.com and i will share the result at the end of tonight's show. when the obamacare website in a fix the white house has a solution, get a czar. tapping former acting opposite of manager to oversee the much needed repairs to obamacare website. here to weigh in, republican congressman from kansas. welcome back to the show, it is great to see you. is this e right guy to make the fixes? will he be the czar to fix this?

>> my understanding his background in his previous role in the administration was to prevent this kind of problems, but i think it is the ultimate arrogance somehow bringing in somebody new to run this massive new government program is going to change anything. i think most americans if they were thinking closely about this expect a debacle, the only surprise is the white house is surprised they cannot get this thing up and running. the real problem is folks in washington want to take over this entire health care system and run the whole thing. it is not going to work. gerri: i agree with you there. back in 2010 he was in charge of recommending fixes to it across what is the administration's entire everybody in washington. i guess it didn't work. >> he should have been on the ground floor building this enterprise, obviously this debacle will continue to fail,

but the president is looking for excuses. the one person to hold responsible after the president, that is kathleen sebelius. i look forward to her testimony next week in congress. gerri: we're all waited with bated breath for that testimony. i believe it was last week you said you thought it was likely the administration might delay the individual mandate. do you still believe that, do you think they have the door open on that? and if so, when might it have been? >> i don't know when it will happen, but they had to do something pretty quickly because millions of americans today wil not have health insurance. these are folks who are insured now, forced onto the exchange, it is not working and at the end of the day the president needs to delay this. make it much easier for the illustration. that is what kathleen sebelius would announce, delay the individual mandate for another year. gerri: here's what she had to

say. listen to this. >> are you taking responsibility for the website? do you think people should have to pay a fee for a website? gerri: in short she said nothing. the press with questions by a reporter, she did not respond. is she the person who should take the blame? >> she certainly should. i am looking for two words from her. i resign, and let's move on. at the end of the day, the president is responsible. it is driving up premiums for everybody. and & for men, 60% for women. this increase in cost for, and that is what i expect and what most americans expect of this debacle out of the white house. gerri: it occurs to me signing up should have been the easy part. their website, i know you use them, i use them for everything from amazon to pets.com, you name it.

people deliver stuff over the web every single day. that should have been easy part. after this with a tough start coming. that is getting people covered and making sure they pay what they are supposed to pay. if we cannot get the first easy step done, how are we going to do the hard stuff? >> trust us at the irs, the guys who are going to implement that. they could not do it in a way to protect their liberties. most folks are saying that is what we expected. it is hurting millions of americans who already have health insurance, there are millions waiting to sign up and they cannot get it done. the very folks who said trust us. they are looking for somebody to blame at the white house, but it belongs with the president himself and his secretary. gerri: congressman, thank you for coming on, hope to see you soon. >> thank you. gerri: first, fo more fallout fm

the government shutdown. you may have to wait an extra week or two to get the tax refund. the irs will delay the start of the filing season to give programmers time to update the agency's computers. the filing season has been set to start generate 21st and the new date be announced in december. april 15 deadline for filing tax returns will stay the same. i hate that. hurricanes, floods and other natural disasters can cause huge property damage. they can also put you at risk for identity theft. that and more coverage of obamacare as the judge weighs in on the futures involved in the irs and health care coming up. this is the quicksilver cash back card from capital one.

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gerri: is obamacare about to be hit with a major blow? allowing a lawsuit challenging the obamacare penalties to go forward. with more on this, business law attorney. thank you for joining us. this is a complicated case and

it turns on the legality of the subsidies. what is at issue here? >> what is at issue here is an issue that appears to be a little bit complicated but we will boil it down. the justice department suffered a huge defeat when a federal judge in the d.c. court in washington rejected the government's motion to dismiss a challenge by several individuals and employers alleging that the key regulation by the internal revenue service that is basically a funding switch may be illegal all the judge declined to apply an immediate injunction allowing the case that only to go forward but said it would be sped up, it would be expedited so not only is this case allowed to survive, but it will be finished by february 13. gerri: it turns on the law itself. apparently he says the exchange has to be set up by the state and as we know a lot of states did not want to do that and they relied on the federal government to do it for them.

these folks say what? the whole thing is illegal. >> that is right. you identified the exact hope the identit plaintiffs are digg. a subsidy hook to dragon individuals and employers through all of the states, although the statute, the affordable care act only provides for that subsidy trigger to go off for states in which it is a states developed and operated insurance exchange, so the irs is coming in applying a rule the plaintiffs say do not follow the statute because the statute does not say that. you could think of a three-dimensional grid of the united states. you can view two-thirds of the states which don't have state operated exchanges to drop out of obamacare, so it is a huge development. gerri: half the country has obamacare and the other half does not. here's what i don't understand.

this is just a federal judge, this isn't a supreme court. didn't the supreme court say obamacare is legal? >> yes. however that was an attack on a formal care act itself. this is a side attack of a regulation internal revenue service is trying to plug into the affordable care act engine that is basically the funding switch. if they can successfully do that, this could be a lethal attack on obamacare. it sounds a little bit dry at first, but when you look at the effect of it, this could be fun and explode obamacare. it is a really big development, a real setback for the justice department. gerri: re-surprise the judge would try to get an answer, was that a shocker to you? >> it is surprising and you look at it from a litigation standpoint, these cases usually take a year or two. in this case he said he was going to expedite this within a

four-month timeframe. i was also surprised by the critical nature of the ruling. the justice department tried to dismiss this, the judge literally called their argument silly and expedited the case. this is a big development turning on a dime. in the oklahoma district court, which is the same, but the d.c. court can take the lead. it could blow everything up within just a couple of months. gerri: are going to have to help keep an eye on it. thank you. during our last segment we spoke with republican congressman of kansas about health and human services secretary kathleen sebelius. the secretary originally refused to testify. she had a big party to go to. many of you said she should be fired for that, but that is not the only thing she does not want to talk about. the question she just will not

answer. number five, where is the backup plan? the white house promised contingency plans for the rollout did not go as planned but so far the only thing they have done is hired text here is to look at the problem. number four, this one really irk me. how many have enrolled? it will not have an answer. her silence implies they are far off from that goal. he wants to know the answer to that one. and number three, will the individual mandate be delayed? despite repeated calls, the white house remain in the bag on charges coming down the pike. number two is a question we post you tonight. when will it all be fixed? all they will say is they are working on it. that is not very comforting. and the number one question kathleen sebelius is not working on is this. what is actually wrong with healthcare.gov? data is being entered

incorrectly. the problems can no longer be blamed on heavy traffic so what is going on? nobody knows, nobody is saying. while they won't answer your questions, we continue to answer and we will do it again, this monday we will be doing another call in show at 6:00 p.m. eastern time and again at 9:00 so you can call, get home from work and pick up the phone. we will answer your questions and we will take your phone calls monday night 6:00 and 9:00 p.m. eastern time. our financial panel will weigh in on how you can benefit from what is going on on wall street. and we will answer the question how do you do that. important information safe. stay with us. at od, whatever business you're in, that's the business we're in.

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gerri: we have all hea

gerri: in the event of an emergency, we have plans to protect ourselves physically but what about your vital documents? they are vulnerable as well. here with me now personal-finance expert jordan goodman. you know, i think people don't realize this but there are situations where you are vulnerable, your documents are vulnerable. >> there is fires, floods, hurricanes, robbery. people don't remember. all of these things that can be a complete disaster in your financial life if these things are taken or destroyed.

gerri: people don't even think about this. some of this stuff you can get back, others you absolutely can't. where are the essential documents you have to have? >> estate planning. those kind of things. deeds, insurance policies, mortgage. marriage certificates, death certificates, all those kind of things. tax returns. back for seven years. gerri: pay them, keep track of them. gerri: why is it so important? >> it is a real mess, not only for you, but if you die, having your heirs, to put your life back together is a real pain.

you can scan them into your computer and store them remotely on the cloud. there are a dozen places where we can do this remotely. you can backup your computer remotely. keep them in a safe deposit box, your parents place. gerri: i have to tell you, i know some people who have done that. put it at mom and dads, it suffers the same problem. >> it is a backup. not the original. there is the everything binder. it has all of your papers all in one place. keep it at a safe deposit box or someplace else. you are not going to lose all of your papers. it is such a pain to put your life act together. not only for you, but the people who depend on you. in many cases people die.

just out running and died. now he has to put his whole life back together. not only good for the people who depend on you as well. gerri: appreciate it. coming up, another crazy upside down dan wall street as bad economic news has investors cheering. plus what all this means for you and your money coming up. when we made our commitment to the gulf, bp had two big goals:

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>> from our fox business studios in new york, here again is gerri willis. gerri: long-awaited september jobs report is finally out. after nearly three weeks delay, the government' is reporting lackluster results on the u.s. economy and it is a key piece of data impacting your investment.

the bad news the labor market turned out to be great news for stocks. the s&p 500 notching its fourth straight record close. the dow and the nasdaq in the green. joining me now for the very latest. managing partner for harris financial crew. dan shafer. and chief strategist at belle point management asset. doing double duty. great to have you here. so, jobless rate is at the lowest level in five years. is this good news? >> if you look internally, people are not employed and a lot of people are out of the work system so that comes down mathematically. it does not make sense. gerri: they are looking for work out there. do you? you would think it would be bad for ocks but the inverse is actually true. what is going on? >> the numbers today means the fed will not taper.

we are not likely to see it this year. gerri: what is going on here? >> really what is going to happen to average retail investors in the public through going to have a deal with the weaker dollar. we are not really going anywhere. if you think just because the market is going higher, it is not going higher in real terms because the currency is being devalued. we need a strong currency to make that a reality. gerri: shu shutdown not even reflected in this, tens of thousands of federal workers were out of work. what does the next employment report look like? >> i'm inviting us to be possibly even negative. the trickle down to the small companies in america affected by this were not getting paid.

gerri: absolutely true. what do you say? >> they were not good, they were able to mass. we will see more of that as the corder unfolds. gerri: you know, we were waiting and waiting for better earnings and also waiting for better employment numbers. when will we actually see hiring turn around and turn around in a convincing way? >> i am not sure it is going to. the technology is really replacing the jobs a lot of people would qualify for. in addition we are in a two speed economy who have jobs can keep an eye people who don't have them are having a hard time getting them. i'm not sure the job trend will channel upward anytime soon. the skills gap will be difficult for people and there is no cure for it.

the economy is going to do fine. that has nothing to do with it. that will not help the average person get a job, that is the point. we will be richer for those who can get a job. the middle class is going to be lower. gerri: you want to say something. >> we are not going to see the jobs pick up even if the economy recovers because a lot of it is structural. a couple of decades now. unless we see some changes in things like corporate tax structure, the money overseas is never coming back at will be used to build factories outside of this country. gerri: you are depressing the heck out of me. we cannot exist in a society that such a small number of people are productive and earnings. >> the problem is not just in the structure of the jobs, it is the way the country is run. with the debt out there and the bickering in washington and the

uncertainty going on, i have mentioned this to you before, the interest rates will drop tremendously. we saw crude oil dropped below $100 per barrel. that is not good for our country. that is signaling. gerri: are we going into depression? >> i don't think going into depression. corporate health is pretty good. is it a great economy? no, it isn't. it is not negative. gerri: is that what passes for a good report card here? >> i want to take issue with oil prices, crude oil inventory or prices. i want crude oil prices to go down because energy prices generally are a tax in the american consumer. in addition there is a reason crude oil is going down. it has to do more with energy

production inside the united states. so there is a concept of an energy revolution going on. more of everything is going lower because deflation would show all asset prices, not just crude. gerri: first you. >> they be made, late 2015. gerri: what do you think? >> maybe sometime next year. we will get an inkling when we see the hearings for janet yellen. gerri: good point. what do you say? >> i think december. december timeframe is the time to start it because it has already indicated in some of their guidance want to be finished it by mid-next year. they will at least try to start that up in 2013. gerri: totally different views on this. i love it when people disagree. thank you for coming on. we will have you right back.

i look at the new cars that drive themselves. can they really happen? and more advice for you and your money. stay with us.

gerri: the physical fight in washington, what is moving the market for the remainder of the year? advice for your money. dan shafer of shafer asset management and david nelson, great to have you guys back as we make television history tonight. i have another employment question i can't help myself with these numbers. there was a survey done by the national association of business economics, they ask is obamacare hurting employment? one in five businesses says yes it is because they are hiring more part-time people. is this an issue in the economy? >> absolutely. the median income is 50,000,

$52,000. how are these people going to afford obamacare, force them to get the care? they don't have enough money to make ends meet now. the small businesses are feeling the same crunch we are forced to buy insurance. it'll doesn't the impact the bottom line. gerri: another number from the same survey, shifting to part time due to obamacare. 15% of firms say they are doing that. what is this going to mean this year, next year as we see more and more of this? people working fewer hours, what is the economic impact? >> what it does is drives the people who have up higher and down lower. basically driving a wedge in the middle class. that is what this is all about. in your example, offloading employees obamacare do better and employees are getting offloaded to do worse. in the virginia where part of the federal exchange, we did a

calibrator the other day and the range of premiums runs $295 up to $6000 per month. who can afford that? on the top of that deductibles and all of the coinsurance is the mac. even they can afford th a premi, they will not be able to afford to go to the doctor. even if they could sign up, they could not afford it. gerri: you guys are telling people how to run their portfolios and what to make of this market. typically much better than october. david, what are you telling people to do, what do you like right now? >> we have seen a big move starting about the middle of the summer. i think it is really good. full disclosure. we actually bought into it and said we sold too soon. i think it is good news because if emerging markets are doing

better, that is good globally and for multinational corporations because we have a lot of business overseas. >> i am buying interest-rate sensitive stocks for the yield, pulling back on the growth area and i would rather be more stable with trust than properties, not mortgages. gerri: i think it is happening all over again. we are seeing signs of that in the bond market. 30-year rally more than the 110-year. some of the news that is going to come out, it will shift even further. i am concerned about the future of the growth in this economy. the fed has been pumping and $85 billion per month and still cannot get this economy moving. it is not working and will not continue to work. gerri: what do you do with your money? should i be buying stocks, what

should i do? >> all of the people i talked to that i trust and respect their judgment, they believe there is a shift going on right now a lot of acid allocators are going to be. the five your numbers will look a lot better negative formants will drop off. saying i should have been in equities and they will shift. that shift of bonds and stocks will come, it will push the market higher because of the equity funds have done on fire. gerri: you think we're going to get duped by the numbers. i saw you reacting to that. >> you're bending down to pick up nickels in front of a steamroller. that comes from a lot of bright guys. i think a year from now you can

see interest rates 100 basis points higher. that will be devastating. >> if you look at the projections, the numbers of the companies, even on unemployment report that came out, they lost 7000 or so in the financial field. the restaurant business down seven or 8000. these are the staples of this country that hd it together. i just saw a report the prediction of wall street profits dramatically. in that industry starts to go to the wayside, everything else follows that. the economy follows wall street. gerri: i hate the fact that we follow wall street. we are at all-time highs. >> the same in 2007. you guys who have been shorting the bond market have not needed

money. gerri: last word here. >> i still believe we have a long ways to go in this market. multinational is the way to play it. you'll get solid growth prospects from around the world. growth will not be in the united states, it will be as high in my view. gerri: you did a great job. thank you for coming on. still to come, my two cents more. and cars that drive themselves just a creation of science fiction, or will they soon become a reality? here with her protections coming up. this is the quicksilver cash back card from capital one. it's not the "juggle a bunch of rotating categories" card.

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gerri: driving out without using her hands may happen sooner than

gerri: look, no hands. soon enough you'll be able to purchase a car that drives itself. many companies already doing test runs offering features that inch closer and closer to the technology but are they ready to give up control? joining me now. lauren. i think this is a dopey idea. why should i let my car drive my car? >> if you look at some of the cidents statistics and the reason a lot of the reason is driver error. some of the driver and programs

out there, some of them teach them how to pass the test, don't teach them driving tips. because of that manufacturers ms have put in place things such as active cruise control, pedestrian cross traffic. looking at the active brake assist. body has been using this, infiniti, mercedes. we are also seeing it on something as reasonably priced as the ford fusion. they're getting very comfortable with that. it has lain tracking. it lacks a trik tracked the vehe in front of you. i have vectoring controls, maybe an offramp or an on-ramp. this will actually help keep you on track. the whole idea idea is to keep n the road. gerri: at the end of the day

what if the technology does not work, you still have to find a way to drive your car. we spent an entire two weeks reporting how the government can open up and obamacare exchange. what you are talking about is very complicated. >> there is a whole another disaster they are dealing with. i actually tested some of these systems six years ago in germany. we did car to car determination. that technology has been worked on for the last five or six years, going to put it in place for the vehicle. they have a plan with no facility until 2020. looking at other facilities that could experience myself, they have the brake assist driving

the car front of me, hit the brakes and i react quickly, it actually started breaking before i did. when you experience it in real life is totally impressive. they can tell you there is a problem, you need to slow down. gerri: what about hacking? an electronic system, somebody can get in there and hack that and screw it up and have accidents. >> we have discussed that in the past. because sometimes the bad guys are more crafty than the good gd guys. 100 microprocessors. all of the manufacturers have put in firewalls, separating some of the systems so you can't take over every aspect.

i know you showed how it worked. multiple computers and a disassembled . the biggest concern of autonomous cars is he still have to know how to drive, and number two, this is not going to come in until at least 2020. new technology and then you can get used to it. gerri: it is a car that drives itself. and autonomous car. i am with the majority out there. thank you so much for coming on. >> i would never get an autonomous car. i think the technology is fantastic and save lives. gerri: if you are long-distance truck driver, maybe that would make sense. always good to have you on the always good to have you on the show, thank

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♪ gerri: and finally, we talked about the auto industry developing cars that drive themselves. a technological marvel. if we can do that, why can't the government role of a health care exchange networks? i know what you're thinking, the answer is and that question, one technology developed by the private sector and the other by government. i know who i would put my money on. here is something else, the irs is the cop on the beat. did you know that the irs paid out more than $110 billion in tax rest of the past decade to people he should not have gotten them? that is right. the earned income tax credits that the supposed to help poor working families abused. i hope the past is not prologue. that is my "2 cents more." that is it for tonight on "the willis report." thank you for joining us. a great night, and we will see

you right back here tomorrow. ♪ lou: the white house admits obamacare is a mess and turns to a man with ties to bain, a firm that they vilified endlessly during last year's presidential campaign. i guess there are over it. i am lou dobbs. ♪ good evening, everybody. the failure of the obamacare rollout leading to the move by the white house that suggests a total loss of confidence in health and human services secretary kathleen sibelius. president obama tapped former omb deputy director and former been executive